an epistle to the revelationists

it always amazes me how far xtians [no I won't call you christians, you are hypocrites, and money handlers and criminals. we know what Jeshua bin Joseph did to those punks... ] go not to think.

You accuse people of evil influence when your entire life is run by a book by questionable authors compiled by romans hundreds of years ago, works by a myriad of great and also foul men.

it is a book.

you cling to it because society does not question you doing so.

if I say the only way is through me, and have 12 guys write twelve stories of how wicked cool I am, and get myself arrested and fake my death, wait a thousand years.... there will be millions of people like you who will beleive the whole thing.

this is what is happening with L Ron Hubbard right now. he was a drug addict, all the way to his death.
he was a criminal and a litigous curmudgeon.

He invented narconon, while downing amphetamines and barbiturates and rum, with a crew of 13-16 year old girls lighting his cigarettes and wiping his butt.

why? he was in it for the money. when he wasn't getting as much in as he thought he should, he squeezed the members and pushed for recruitment, and raised the price of his 'techs'

when enough people got to the 'final level', he just 'discovered' another one and wrote up a new tech while blazing on speed.

why do people fall for it?

Hard sell techniques, and of course, a grain of usefulness. in fact, even William Seward Burroughs thought that the original Dianetics was very useful.

see, it's after they hook you that they charge you more and more for increasingly useless stuff.

in OT3 you essentially ouija board YOURSELF to exorcise your demons... woops! I mean body thetans.

but back to xtianity.

you are following to the letter a text that has been translated hundreds of years ago for the third time by a group of people whose livelihood depends on fleecing you, and to fleece you, they must own you.

to own you they convince you that there is an invisible man, who lives in the sky and watches everything you do, every day of your life, and makes lists of things he will punish you to eternal damnation for if you do them... but he loves you.

(propitiations to George Carlin go here)

how exactly do you know that demons have no bodies?

because the bible says so.

why is adultery wrong?

because the bible says so

Neophobia begotten by control.

if you are a man of intelligence, why would you suppose a supreme being would be so concerned with what you think of him?

if a supreme being is so merciful, why is there a way to mess up, unless he WANTS you to mess up?

oh, but he LOVES you, so we have to reconcile that by picking a prominent angel called Satan, who seems to be pretty tight with the Big Guy (see Job)
and we'll make him Angra Mainyu, that is, the Evil God, god's twin, so that way we can blame all the bad stuff on him.


What is wrong?
What is right?

there are only relatives to an intelligent man, there are things that aid survival and things that aid death.

safe/danger. survival/non-survival.

so what is not safe is Evil.

what is safe is Good.

an intelligent man is a practical man. if something is found to be helpful to him, he will adopt it, label it good. if he finds something to be harmful, that he labels bad.

this is for reference.

final point:

why do you assume an angel is a physical being? an angel or even god is beyond you, so they would not be confined to a body, as you are.

maybe a discorporate being would be like a man, not evil or good, just trying to survive.. well, maybe they eat our emotions, our beliefs.

do you call the wolf evil for eating the rabbit?
perhaps the carrot can forgive the rabbit for eating it.

this is intelligence.

everything has to eat.

I discovered this thread because my new avatar was Lam, which I chose because he so resembles a grey.

I searched the site, found the thread, and wished to opine.

I repost the response here because it fits here as a thread better, and because I am fairly certain bigwhammy will get the response removed or censored because he thinks I'm 'trolling' and 'Off Topic'.

^UPDATE^ he's calmed down now. we are then cool.

[edit on 5-7-2008 by MegaTherion]

[edit on 5-7-2008 by MegaTherion]

OK carry on... we can just agree to disagree on a few things then. I think you are a little aggressive in your criticisms sorry but you sound just like the atheists. Perhaps you might consider why you come across like that.



[edit on 7/5/2008 by Bigwhammy]

reply to post by Bigwhammy


Yea Im going to have to agree with you on that one BW, MegaTherion your coming across as forcing you ideas... which is funny cos many athiests sit there and say that all the christians out there do that.

-fm

It is no longer PC to hate blacks, hispanics and gays. It is, however, very PC to hate Christians. If ya gotta hate some group, go for the Christians. They are the new group everyone loves to hate.

I am against hate of any people. However, I reserve my right to be intolerant of any person's actions that I deem inappropriate. That is the difference. I hate no one. I am intolerant of actions, not people.

I find it amusing that those who scream the loudest for tolerance seem to be the most intolerant.

It's obvious you have some sort of beef with Christians. Okay.

But why did you choose to post your rant in the metaphysics forum, as opposed to say, the conspiracies in religion forum? That might be a more appropriate place for your rant.

As far as your post goes, I suggest you take a deep breath, cool down a bit and not worry one way or another about the Christians. Besides, aggression is a bummer and best suited for one of the political boards!

reply to post by MegaTherion


Since you claimed to be a Christian on the other thread, it is almost as if this rant is a case of self loathing. I hear such rants all the time from Anti-Christians so it is surprising to see this coming from a claimed Christian.

you cling to it because society does not question you doing so.

I disagree with that. The Bible and Christianity are ripped to shreds all over the world on a daily basis, including America and including ATS. Society not only questions it these days but they also mock it, seek to destroy it, lie about it, and in some parts of the world, will kill you for it. I don't know too many people who became a Christian because it was easy.

reply to post by MegaTherion


Ahh Bless!

you are scared you are not in control of you and your destiny aren't you?

you want to be special and how wonderful "energy trips" you want it on your terms and your way. to be one with the universe.

sorry but do you not see the control of conformity in your post?

good luck with that but you should seek Jesus and then you will know what it is like to be a part of something out of this world

as for an intelligent man being practical, is this you and therefore this is your definition?

why do you ask about Angels what would you know of them? Have you met something?

david

reply to post by MegaTherion

you are following to the letter a text that has been translated hundreds of years ago for the third time by a group of people whose livelihood depends on fleecing you, and to fleece you, they must own you.

Things like this happen in a relatively open and controlled way.
For example, the old testament was written in Hebrew.
The Greeks wanted to read it, so they hired a group of Jews to translate it.
The Romans wanted to read the Bible so they got scholars to translate the Greek into Latin.
The English wanted to read it so they turned to Erasmus, who translated the Bible from Latin versions into a more scientific version of Latin.
All of this happened in a transparent fashion and was not the result of a dark conspiracy to destroy God's word.
The real conspiracy was in the church keeping the Bible out of the hands of the People.
Why go to the trouble of making a FAKE Bible, when the only ones who ever saw a Bible were already initiated into a form of priesthood?
The great REVELATION came when the Bible was put in the hands of the people, in a form that they could understand.
So, I could consider myself a revelationist because God has revealed Himself to me, through the Bible.
If there is some better way to revelation, let me know.
Men can only associate with angels in a limited way, and only when they take on Human form.
So, a book has to be the main vehicle for long time learning.

reply to post by Bigwhammy


I love my granddad too.

that doesn't mean I believe and obey everything he says.

My grandma called black people coloreds. I love her and respect her wisdom too. but I don't call black people coloreds.


this is the same for Jesus.

I am writing in an aggressive style because in the other thread you and others were calling other belief systems evil.

God is all powerful. He sends representatives to all peoples, in the forms they will understand and recognize.

the Vaishnavas of India recognize Jesus of Nazareth as an avatar of God.

they also recognize Buddha [an atheist], because he taught people to be good.

It's about God, not the Representative of God.

do not worship the finger pointing to God, worship GOD.

If you follow a path to God, and another follows a different path to God, if they both end up with God, then what is the difference?

reply to post by jmdewey60


I find nothing wrong with your statement.

I'm just saying it was edited, in an open way, and compiled according to subconscious and conscious purposes of the priestly class.

we may thank the people of Gutenberg for their lovely gift, the printing press, forerunner of our newest tool, the intarwubs.

reply to post by drevill


Angels are everywhere. you just have to look for them.

We are all one with the universe, all the time. There is no separation.

I do not fear. what happens in life is Chaos, is God's will, I just try my best.

we are all part of God. I don't need to seek Jesus if he is right here in my heart.

reply to post by AshleyD


you misunderstand.

I mean xtians, not Christians.

xtians go to Megachurches, and pay Joel Osteen for his motivational speaking.

Christians pray in their closet, as Jesus said.

Did you know most other countries think we are joking when we mention Creationism and the MegaChurch?

this is because their churches are empty.

xtians obsess over the 'passion' and the suffering of christ.

Christians rejoice of the resurrection and celebrate the works of christ.

It's not easy being xtian? you must live on the coast in a big city, because the first question anyone asks you when you move to a new town in the rest of the country is 'do you have a church-home yet?'

it's very easy to proclaim xtianity! you just have to pay Pat Robertson.

reply to post by MegaTherion


Thanks for clarifying. I don't like those types of 'Christians' either. No, I live in a very small town in Texas and am a personal-relationship-with-God Christian.

However, even after your explanation I must say parts of your rant still has me puzzled, mainly your criticism of the Bible.

reply to post by darkelf


I never said I hated anybody.

I criticized aggressively.

I criticize myself aggressively.

this is not loathing or self loathing, it is an Assessment of Action.

a person who does not question himself or his beliefs, and thinks as a consequence that he can do no wrong, ends up a sociopath like hitler, or Bush who can order the deaths of millions and still believe they are pure as the driven snow.

Originally posted by MegaTherion
reply to post by Bigwhammy

 

I love my granddad too.
that doesn't mean I believe and obey everything he says.
My grandma called black people coloreds. I love her and respect her wisdom too. but I don't call black people coloreds.
this is the same for Jesus.

I am writing in an aggressive style because in the other thread you and others were calling other belief systems evil.
God is all powerful. He sends representatives to all peoples, in the forms they will understand and recognize.
the Vaishnavas of India recognize Jesus of Nazareth as an avatar of God.
they also recognize Buddha [an atheist], because he taught people to be good.
It's about God, not the Representative of God.
do not worship the finger pointing to God, worship GOD.
If you follow a path to God, and another follows a different path to God, if they both end up with God, then what is the difference?

You put Jesus and your grandfather on the same level? You might want to examine what the word Christian means. That doesn't fit.

You seem to think there is no deceiver at work in the world. You are misinformed. I strongly believe and the Bible says those other religions are counterfeits. Tolerance is highly overrated - it is the politically correct secular religion. Tolerance of evil begets more evil.

Yes undo and I took a stand against the teachings of a Satanist in that thread. Do you deny Aleister Crowley was of the devil? You are gullible at the very best if you do. The satan worshiper dude tried to paint me in a corner by bringing up other religions to avoid his satanism. Ohh I'm so intolerant... waaaaaaaa! It was just a trick to take the focus of his satanism and you fell for it. But all religions are not true. That is a satanic deception as well. Tolerance of lies is the same as lying.

Jesus said there was one path to God:
"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me" (John 14:6)

Buddha Mohamed Krishna all of those dudes have GRAVES.

NEWFLASH: Jesus doesn't. Because....

HE WAS GOD in the flesh. He rose from the dead and ascended into heaven.

That's what Christians believe.



[edit on 7/6/2008 by Bigwhammy]

reply to post by Bigwhammy


strangely, all the other religions say the same thing, only one way.

they must all be wrong, and there is no true religion.

if the mormons say that mormonism is the only way and all others are false

and the buddhists say theirs is the only way and all others are false

and the muslims say theirs is the only way and all others are false

and the pentacostals and the baptists and the catholics and the methodists say theirs is the only way and all others are false

then all of us go to hell.

the answer is they are all valid.

if Jesus is your path to god, good, go that way.

if Satan leads him to god, good, he should go that way.

I don't beleive Jesus is, was, or will be god, he was god's SON. as am I. as are you and everyone else.

you said yourself that satan led you into a foul path and Jesus saved you. if it weren't for Satan, you would not know Christ.

Satan works for God. deal with it.

"Judge Not, Lest Ye Be Judged"

reply to post by MegaTherion

I don't beleive Jesus is, was, or will be god, he was god's SON. as am I. as are you and everyone else.

Jesus Christ is the Image of God. Just like the Book of Revelation talks about the Beast and the Image of the Beast. The Beast gives its authority to its Image and God gives His authority to His Image.
Jesus is God's Son in the same sort of way that God was Solomon's Father.
The word, Christ means something and it is one anointed to be King.
So, we are adopted sons, through Jesus, into the Kingdom of God and His anointed.

reply to post by jmdewey60

you got it.

I didn't say Jesus was not SPECIAL

thank you for expanding on the 'Logos' aspect.

So you've made a judgement?

When it comes to xtians versus Christians your way is the better way?

Are you absolutely positive?

Always remember when you judge, you yourself are in danger of being judged.

Let me ask you something. Have you ever did a study, on how the first disciples came to be the first disciples? If you have extra time it's really quite fascinating to read the various versions. The first three pretty well jive with each other but it's the fourth version, that of John's which is in my opinion the correct version and it's different.

Does it make a difference that the versions are different? Not really. But because we know that the first three books of the NT were written by close associates of Peter it's sort of funny to realize how the stories were handed down from Peter, to Paul, to Luke & Mark. I won't say much about the book of Matthew, only because he is listed as around the seventh on all the lists.

Andrew & Peter were brothers and John (the beloved disciple) & James (the Sons of Thunder) were brothers.

Andrew and John were disciples of John the Baptist and after John pointed out who Jesus was, they both left John (the Baptist) and started following behind Jesus. Jesus turns around and asks them 'What do you want?' They ask him 'Where are you staying?' and Jesus says very simply 'Come and you will see.'

Andrew and John go and tell their brothers they have found the Messiah. So technically, these first four heard about Jesus and then decided to follow him. It's not like they had an epiphany. Had they not heard from the Baptizer who Jesus was, they wouldn't have known.

Now consider Philip. Only John's version mentions how he became one of the first disciples. Jesus walks up to him and says "Follow me."

Philip in turn goes and tells his buddy Nathanael......

And then there's Matthew. All accounts are the same. Christ sees him sitting at the tax collector's booth, walks up to him and says "Follow me."

Five men heard of Christ by word of mouth but only two did he seek out.

In the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter how they became the first seven diciples or in what order they were called because we know how important each and every one of them are.

The only reason, I took the time to attempt to show you this was because you may not be giving xtians a fair shake.

Now, what do you think? Do you feel Philip and Matthew are more special than the other five because Christ hand picked them? Of course you don't.

Some people hear about Jesus and choose to go to a place where they can learn more. This doens't make these people bad. Maybe they don't have time to sit down and do an in depth study of scripture like you or me. They are all loved very much.

So why does it matter to you if people pray in their closet or in a gathering of some sort? It really shouldn't. And how in the world could you know that they don't do both?

Jane Doe is a single parent and works two jobs. She believes in God and that Jesus is his only begotten son but she really hasn't done an in depth study of the word and when she prays, she babbles like a pagan and does it right in front of her kids. The only time she even hears the word is on TBN late at night and only watches Joel Osteen because his message is uplifting.

Should we condemn her?

Jane Doe will probably never have the time to study the Bible in depth, so let's not condemn her.

"Blessed are the poor in spirit for theirs is the kingdom of heaven."