Obama's Birth Certificate Confirmed VALID!

I still do not understand over zealous support. THe obaminators are no different then the bush lovers.

For that matter it does not matter if you worship Al gore, Hillary Clinton, or Ronald Regan... Too much loyalty to anyone is dangerous.

Sure you love hillary just tell me you understand her role in waco. Sure you loe obama just show me the bureaucrat that signed or stamped his certificate of birth Sure you love bush just tell me how the mission was accomplished....

Don't be a robot. Do not accept something just because another bureaucrat says so without notarizing their own words. Bureaucracy is a heck of a thing but on thing you can rely on it for is triple redundancy and mountains of endless paper work and verification.... Something Obamas' document is missing... the mark of the bureaucrat.

Look at your documents, look at your neighbors documents look at our american Bureaucracy... YOu know what it is and how it works.... but on his document it is not present.



[edit on 10/18/2007 by titorite]

There are still people yelling that he's ineligible to be President. I spend most of my driving time now listening to tech and financial podcasts on my ipod. Today, I ran out and didn't get to restock it until I got to work. During my drive to the office this morning, I turned on talk radio. Quinn & Rose had a caller call on explaining to them why Obama isn't a natural born citizen.. He was using the same "two citizens as parents & she didn't live here long enough" argument. The same one that was debunked here a week and a half ago. Now, this guy probably just read it or heard it somewhere and thinks it's true so he's spreading it around. I really wish the general population took the time to figure out what's going on and hash it out with the oppositition as happens here. Unfortunately, probably 80% of the population believes everything they're told and forms opinions based on this information. I'm starting to think that the thread that popped up a few days ago regarding requiring a test for people to vote isn't a bad idea. As it stands now, the uninformed masses are making all of the decisions. I guess we're just lucky that the uninformed masses are, for the most part, evenly split between the parties.

Wow, that was a ramble. Sorry folks.

Originally posted by jamie83
And no, the relentless "attacks" are not even attacks. They're people voicing their dislike for Obama and his policies for the most part.

Come on Jamie, it's not that simple.

I see you made sure to add "for the most part" but I think there is a difference between expressing dislike, even if there is not much to base it on but gut-feeling, and making alarmist fear based claims.

I don't necessarily like Obama and i absolutely don't feel the excitement I see in others, but I am not claiming he will institute Sharia law, pay blacks for slavery, is secretly a Muslim extremist, or is not a real American because he photoshopped his birth certificate.

That to me is fear based absurdity.

I'm only 34, but I am too old for that type of self-indulgence. I can't make stuff up about someone I just "don't like" to make myself feel good. I wouldn't do that to Bush or McCain either. At this point in my life I really want to look at issues. It is very critical we do this. I don't care about your subjective fears as they are irrelevant since they have no basis of foundation in the real world. People are BUILDING the reasons around the fear they feel because they want it to be proven as valid as Obama's birth certificate.

Even if I vote for Obama and he ends up screwing this place even worse than Bush...I would know that I voted for him based on my interpretation of the information available at the time.

My brother voted for Bush TWICE.

To me there is no excuse for that if he is a proven failure and it is strictly partisan reasoning. Admittedly I know little of Obama and more of McCain but again I am not sold on McCain not being another Bush.

Maybe I am asking too much of others though.
Just stop making up things and put out something tangible, please?

Is that asking too much?

- Lee

Originally posted by BlueTriangleI'm starting to think that the thread that popped up a few days ago regarding requiring a test for people to vote isn't a bad idea. As it stands now, the uninformed masses are making all of the decisions.

I was thinking this exact thing today. I am 100% in favor of some sort of test for people to take to be eligible to vote. If they have a test to be a citizen, why not?

I actually was talking to a guy at the McDonald's on the N. Side who thought Obama was already POTUS and Hillary (he thought) was VP. He wasn't sure if it was Hillary or John Edwards who was VP. This same guy liked Obama but said he thought Obama would favor "sand-n####" more than Bush would have if he would have won this election. He said he already voted for President a few weeks ago.

Originally posted by lee anomaor is not a real American because he photoshopped his birth certificate.

That to me is fear based absurdity.

Well since thread is about his CoB I'll address this.

First, you're on a conspiracy site. Stop over at the 9/11 forum and see that 90% of the threads there are FAR MORE um.... interesting in terms of questioning what authority figures tell them is true. I.e., if people can seriously argue that no planes really hit the WTCs even though thousands witnessed exactly that, then questioning whether Barry O. photoshopped his CoB isn't really that big of a deal.

Second, this IS a conspiracy site whose motto is deny ignorance. It's against the grain of everything this site stands for to simply blindly accept what some politician claims is true. Obama claiming his CoB printed in 2007 is real is the exact type of fodder that makes this site popular.

Third, there are still enough strange things about the CoB to make people wonder if it WAS photoshopped. Just look at the image I posted here. How do you explain the size of this image??



I honestly don't get how this image has such a large area of background above the certificate. Where did this come from???

Interestingly, this image is EXACTLY proportioned to an 8 1/2 x 11 size.

So does this mean the certificate was printed on 8 1/2 x 11 paper and the Obama campaign cropped the first release in an attempt to fool people into thinking it was a real "birth certificate"?

I think this is exactly what they did considering they claimed it was his original birth certificate on their smear site.

So what's the truth here? That's all people want to know. What's the truth? Obama already misled people on his site by claiming this was his "birth certificate" when it's not. All people want is a straight answer.

Originally posted by jamie83
I actually was talking to a guy at the McDonald's on the N. Side who thought Obama was already POTUS and Hillary (he thought) was VP. He wasn't sure if it was Hillary or John Edwards who was VP. This same guy liked Obama but said he thought Obama would favor "sand-n####" more than Bush would have if he would have won this election. He said he already voted for President a few weeks ago.

...

You sure it was a McDonalds and not an opium den?
Where do you buy your Big Mac?

Whoever you were having a conversation with was "touched" not uninformed.
I suggest you cook at home.

- Lee

Originally posted by lee anoma

You sure it was a McDonalds and not an opium den?
Where do you buy your Big Mac?

Whoever you were having a conversation with was "touched" not uninformed.
I suggest you cook at home.

- Lee

Sad to say, but this gentleman wasn't atypical. Well, maybe a little bit atypical. He was an older gentleman who probably thinks we faked the Apollo landings too.

Oh wait... that's a different forum here.

More weirdness about Obama's CoB...

From the original story on the Kos where the jpg of the CoB was first released:

In any case, here is Obama's birth certificate. Click on it for a bigger version. Note, I have trimmed the edges of the scan, so before someone tries to inevitably "debunk" this based on the dimensions of a Hawaiian birth certificate, that should be noted.

So why in the world did the scan on the Kos need to have the "edges" trimmed?

The scan on the Kos had dimensions of 806 x 787. The scan on the site mentioned in this thread, the Tampa news site, has a scan that's 300 x 388. So the Kos scan didn't have the edges trimmed at all. It had the top cut off. Here's the Kos scan. The right side is cropped because it doesn't fit on ATS. The important thing to look at is how the top is cut, not the edges:

Source on Kos




And here's the most recent scan from the Tampa newspaper:




Why are they so different???

Originally posted by jamie83
First, you're on a conspiracy site.

I have been here since 2006 I am well aware of where I am.
Are YOU aware of the fact that not every forum lends itself to ones personal conspiracy theories?

Try posting one in Breaking News.

Stop over at the 9/11 forum and see that 90% of the threads there are FAR MORE um.... interesting in terms of questioning what authority figures tell them is true.

I've been there a few times.
Clearly I have noticed something you haven't.

You see...what I find funny is that you are trying to school me on what each forum contains. You do this under the erroneous assumption that any conspiracy theory thread can be placed anywhere.

PLEASE TAKE NOTE:

The 9/11 forum you mentioned that contains wild theories is entitled: 9/11 Conspiracies Discussion Forum.

It is designated for conspiracy theories regarding 9/11.

People and Politics, and Decision 2008 have no such designation. Click BOARD and you will see where such forums are housed and how there are certain categories under the CONSPIRACY section and others that are NOT in this section.

You do understand this correct?
There is a reason for that.

You are not posting in the Political Conspiracy Theories forum. I expected a politics forum to be about actual politics or at the very least your own feelings regarding the current candidates. If I wanted your fear based assumptions and accusations regarding the candidates I would search for them in Skunkworks.

Some have ended up there but not all.
Your argument here shows your lack of understanding how this site is designed.

There is a place for everything and I don't think you should create threads that amount to personal unsubstantiated conspiracy theories and wild claims in a forum based on politics. I think if you have no evidence for what you are claiming and it is simply your opinion then it should go into Skunkworks.

My 2 cents.

Second, this IS a conspiracy site whose motto is deny ignorance.

As was done with the birth certificate and fraudulent claim of Obama being a Muslim.
I say bravo, as neither has merit.

Actually it is not JUST a conspiracy site.
There are categories for things that aren't conspiracies.

Third, there are still enough strange things about the CoB to make people wonder if it WAS photoshopped. Just look at the image I posted here. How do you explain the size of this image??

As of right now the State of Hawaii disagrees with you.
I don't need to see your image again.

You are merely expressing your reluctance to let it go, and accept the facts.
It's your call, though.

You have a right to claim the earth is flat, or the universe rests on a tortoise shell.

I won't stop you.

Just don't try and pass it off as fact without proper proof.
That or be big enough to admit you are wrong.

- Lee

Originally posted by lee anoma
As of right now the State of Hawaii disagrees with you.
I don't need to see your image again.

It's more like you don't WANT to see the image again. You'd rather accept the director of communications statement that the certificate is "real" even though she simply looked at a scanned and photoshopped jpeg that was emailed to her, and would have no way of verifying its authenticity.

You are merely expressing your reluctance to let it go, and accept the facts.
It's your call, though.

What facts? I am stating the facts. It's the people like you who extrapolate the communications director's quote in a newspaper into saying the state of Hawaii authenticated the CoB.

Just don't try and pass it off as fact without proper proof.
That or be big enough to admit you are wrong.

I cannot be wrong because I didn't conclude anything about the CoB. I stated the facts surrounding it. So far I have no seen three different jpegs that all claimed to be the scan of the original CoB.

The scan on Obama's site is 585 x 575.

The scan on Kos is 400 x 390 and is admittedly edited on the "edges".

The scan from the Tampa paper is an amazing 300 x 388, which is EXACTLY the same proportion as an 8 1/2 x 11 sheet of paper.

Obama's web site intentionally misleads people into believing they have a scan of the actual "birth certificate." Here it is:



Now that we see the newspaper emailed an image that was 8 1/2 x 11, and we can only presume they got it from the Obama camp since they claim that Hawaii wouldn't send it to them, it has been PROVEN that the Obama campaign cropped the original image to give it the appearance of being a "birth certificate".

And it also looks like the Kos was aware of this and tried to pre-empt "debunkers" by wrongly stating that the edges were cut, not the top.

So until you can explain why there are three different size images, and how the Tampa paper got the original 8 1/2 x 11 version, there seems to be even MORE amiss than ever regarding this entire story.

Originally posted by jamie83
So until you can explain why there are three different size images, and how the Tampa paper got the original 8 1/2 x 11 version, there seems to be even MORE amiss than ever regarding this entire story.

How about YOU explain why the state of Hawaii would lie about it being a real, valid state birth certificate?



I've always wondered this... if someone is going to fake something huge... why not make sure it's 100% accurate in size and looks 100% real? You would think if Obama in fact faked the certificate they would make it look 100% believable instead of making what looks like a bad, copy that isn't in the right proportions. Just because this looks fake doesn't mean it IS fake... especially since it's proven by the Hawaii government that it's real.

And how do they know it's real since it's a JPEG that someone emailed them? Maybe because they have the original on copy and they can (and did) verify the original against the JPEG one that is floating around the internet. I have a feeling that even if this thing did look how you want it to look... you'd still think it's fake. I mean... Hawaii has verified it as real and yet you still say it's fake. That's like telling yourself fire is cold... you're just lying to yourself at this point.

Originally posted by jamie83
It's more like you don't WANT to see the image again. You'd rather accept the director of communications statement that the certificate is "real" even though she simply looked at a scanned and photoshopped jpeg that was emailed to her, and would have no way of verifying its authenticity.

The irony of your own statement fails you.

Just what exactly do you think YOU'RE doing with the jpeg?
You think somehow you are qualified to arrive at such a dramatic interpretation of this jpeg and no one else is entitled to making a more practical one?

Do you have Obama's birth printed birth certificate or a jepg as well?

I'm sorry but I will take the Hawaiian Department of Health's conclusion over yours, no matter how many times you post this jpeg.

You've posted it on numerous occasions. I've seen it enough.

I cannot be wrong because I didn't conclude anything about the CoB.

You started a thread stating you discovered that Obama's birth certificate is fake, and never objectively look at the situation but instead held the dogmatic view that this discovery was absolutely accurate and rejected any opinion that stated otherwise (like now)... but you made no conclusions? You say you cannot be wrong yet why can't you accept that an employee of the State of Hawaii that works in a field that would be familiar with such certificates says you are?



You have no idea what objectivity is.
You're not even open to the rational notion that your theory could be wrong.

I think I should let this go right now.
I see no place for me to go in this discussion when reality itself is rejected.

- Lee

Did she happen to explain why there was no "stamp" or "registrar name" on the document, when other Hawaii Birth Certificates have both?

Funny, not even a week ago she told the Israeli Insider IT WAS NOT VALID.

I guess the Obama camp may have reversed this one too, just like with Larry Synclair. He needs that private funding to buy people off afterall.

If she did say it was valid (after first saying it was not), I hope she and her bank accounts are investigated and she is found out to have been blackmailed and/or paid off.

If I were the GOP, i'd be on her like White on Rice and make sure she wasn't bribed.

This could be good.

Bottom line, Obama has yet to submit an authentic non-photoshopped version of his CoB and give it to the State Dept. for verification. The State Dept. has not received anything, just a the crude online faked version, the one we are seeing.

Originally posted by grover
...are going to lose and lose bad this year unless they can scare people.

They certainly can't run on the issues, after 8 years of bush minor and the neo-con take over they are intellectually and morally bankrupt.
...

You still think the republicons and demoncrats are different parties?

How quaint!

Having worked for years as a scanner-operator and Photoshop expert, I can't stay out of this farce any longer.

Making something look like a real scan is not hard. You make a real scan. Duh.

You create the document as a high resolution document. Then you print it on whatever quality paper an original would have been printed on. If you want stamps or signatures or whatever on the back to strike trough, you print it onto the back.

Now you scan your print and hey presto, you have a fully authentic looking image without any weird digital artifacts to give it away as a fake.

Does anyone think that a presidential campaign is run by amateurs? Believe me if they made a fake, you would never be able to spot it.

Yes I know. I'm wasting my time. The people clinging on to this stuff is not after truth but rather some sort of hope.

Sad really.

Originally posted by jamie83
And no, the relentless "attacks" are not even attacks. They're people voicing their dislike for Obama and his policies for the most part. Nothing at all obscene about that.

You are right. The Democrats are giving as good as they get. But somehow, they have got it into their heads that it is okay for them to make attacks, but when Republicans do the same, it's somehow beyond-the-pale.

However...

Originally posted by jamie83
You forgot to say the attacks are all by racists too.

Just as hysterical Obama supporters are using incidents of real-racism to shield their candidate from any valid criticism, real racists are using that same hysteria to cover racists attacks.

And make no mistake about it, certain members obsession with his birth-certificate is born of racist and bigoted fantasies. Without any proof what-so-ever, they have come to believe that his birth-certificate will say his birth-name was Barry, or his real middle name is Mohammed, or that his birth religion will say Muslim, or that he was born in Kenya. Until they see a birth-certificate that tells them what they want to hear (again, having come to believe this without any evidence) they will not accept anything to the contrary. They will decry it as a fake, ignore legal evidence and policy, they will point to articles that have twisted the words of officials confirming the authenticity, or claim that official was bribed. Because, in their racist and bigoted fantasies, they believe any of those factors would disqualify one from being president. Even if he was born in Kenya, even if he was born a Muslim, he is still eligible to be President -- but the bigots and racists want to make things a person has no choice over an issue in the campaign.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

"You have shown a Certificate of Live Birth --not a birth certificate," one e-mailed. "There is a difference. Look at state laws regarding the completion of both forms."

This is from your link. Its not a birth Cerifacte. It a Certificate of Live Birth

Originally posted by lonewolf37

This is from your link. Its not a birth Cerifacte. It a Certificate of Live Birth

According to Ms. Okobu: "...a certificate of live birth is a birth certificate in the state of Hawaii."

"You have shown a Certificate of Live Birth — not a birth certificate," one e-mailed. "There is a difference. Look at state laws regarding the completion of both forms."

As it states here there is obviously a difference between the two documents.

"It's a valid Hawaii state birth certificate," spokesman Janice Okubo said after we e-mailed her our copy.

Try to get a passport by E-mailing your birthcertificate in. Or doing any other business transaction with an electronic copy of a birth certificate. It's not going to happen becasue anyone can recreate a document electronically. I'm actually surprised a state spokeperson would make a statement like that based on an electronic document.

Okubo said a copy of the birth certificate was requested this month, but she wouldn't specify by whom. But as we know from our attempts to get one in April, Hawaii law states that only family members can access such records.

It was stated that a copy was requested but it does not say that they were able to prduce and supply a copy of an actual birth certificate.

If this is such a big issue and if he really wants to put it to rest then why doesn't he just show up at a rally with an official copy of the birth certificate and some one to validate it's authenticity.





[edit on 27-6-2008 by lonewolf37]

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
lloyd, jetxnet, jamie, Helloooo!
Can we finally put this to rest now.
Thanks BH you S&Fed

Why you've chose to invoke my name in this thread eludes me. I had originally decided to remain silent on the matter, but since you opened the door for me to comment..

First of all, I have no problem with Barack Obam being a black man. My problem stems from his lack of experience, his indecisiveness, and his questionable judgement. All these things when put together, make him a rather poor choice for President. The last thing we as a people need, is a leader that can't make up his mind.

I couldn't care less about his birth certificate. It's apparent he has something to hide. Whatever it is, was most likely discovered during the passport files break-ins a few months back. We'll just have to wait and see what it is.

I'm not worried about him winning the election either, as I know his time is short. The Republican party and the MSM have actively conspired to hold back on any real personal attacks until he offically received the Democratic nomination. Soon it will be open season on him in the media, and all the truly damaging information will be forthcoming. Anyone with a little commonsense can see that he can't bear scrutiny. There's way too many skeletons in his closet for that.

Root and cheer for him if you like, but your next president will be John McCain. I don't like McCain, but as someone else so cryptically said: "Better the Devil you know"..