BREAKING: Prophet Yahweh TRIES TO TWIST Challenge to Summon UFOs For ATS and FAILS

Originally posted by Scramjet76
The question is, who is actually going to take time out of their busy schedule to meet a crackpot out in a desert??

Maybe a bigger question is whether a crackpot is someone that you want to meet up with, alone, out on the desert to begin with…

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
I don't think that any of the UFO videos I have seen on ATS meet all those parameters. So am I to dismiss them outright?

I don't know the history ATS and its members have with this man, but surely there's a reasonable way to document the experiment without a hollywood budget.

I hardly see a Hollywood budget being mentioned here. If anything that I listed would be expensive, it would be travel and accommodations. Flight tracking software only requires a laptop and a connection to the internet. A portable weather station can be had for several hundred dollars. Most people already own a cell phone. Its free to contract ATC, and set something up with them, if you can get them to agree to do it. Launching balloons themselves requires renting a tank of helium and buying a few balloons. Heck you can hire a local aerial photographer to be in the area ready to attempt to intercept, and take photos from an aircraft for a few hundred dollars.

As to why we should demand this level of proof in this instance, its because we can. He claims to be able to call them at will, so we have the opportunity to collect this level of documentation. Under those conditions, why should we require less?

I think with the level of expertise of the members on this board that we can put this to rest. If we can't then I guess we have either failed and are incompetent or he is real.

reply to post by defcon5


Yeah I was thinking about that too...

ATS might need a security team for Operation Desert Summon.

I would just like to say that i'll volunteer for any help if need be. *raises hand*

reply to post by defcon5


Might I suggest, before doing a big expensive test, which I suspect Springer may not be too glad to do - do a cheap preliminary test first. See if Prophet is willing to simply come out, meet with Springer, and call down a UFO for him. If he succeeds with that, then maybe proceed with some more elaborate, expensive and time-consuming testing....

reply to post by defcon5


Of course not. Like I said I'm not an expert. But I have seen extraordinary work here done by members investigating videos. Work that must have taken hours, analyzing individual frames and pixels on blurry videos. And they are given the benefit of the doubt until debunked.
I thought maybe I was missing something with this guy because a lot of posts in this thread seem to indicate that they wouldn't give him a chance to prove himself under any conditions, controlled or otherwise.
I promise I have no vested interest, I'm just trying to understand the dynamics of what is a new culture to me.

Oh great...what if a UFO just happens to actually appear, Springer et all will start believing in this guy and possibly devote all of the site to The Great UFO Summoner Prophet Yahweh.

Might I suggest, before doing a big expensive test, which I suspect Springer may not be too glad to do - do a cheap preliminary test first. See if Prophet is willing to simply come out, meet with Springer, and call down a UFO for him. If he succeeds with that, then maybe proceed with some more elaborate, expensive and time-consuming testing....

Ok so now thing comes to negotiations let me tell you guys some thing tonight and i dnt know why i am telling you all of you at ATS "Possibilities are in infinity its depend on you how much you like to explore".So i request you before dismissing some one let him come to you when you made a call.What ever happen it come in front all of us. Its better for every one to wait & watch

Have ATS control this event by every means made possible by there connections and I bet it would be interesting.

1.Let them contact influential people that they know.
2.Choose and indiscriminate location.
3.Find out any or all weather conditions for that location.
4.Make sure its a location not settled by man.
5.Treat him like a second class citizen until proven otherwise.

Originally posted by menguard

Have ATS control this event by every means made possible by there connections and I bet it would be interesting.

1.Let them contact influential people that they know.
2.Choose and indiscriminate location.
3.Find out any or all weather conditions for that location.
4.Make sure its a location not settled by man.
5.Treat him like a second class citizen until proven otherwise.

6.A live webcast would be nice

What if it does not matter to this so called prophet whether he fails or not? If my reasoning is correct, outcome does not matter as next prophecy will include ATS not accepting him, thus once again "proving" him right.

In another words he is just using ATS for personal goals and/or gains.

It might be quite a problem because what we are talking about here is in fact religion, and I would personally run away from such as fast as I can because UFO's mixed with religious ideas are extremely dangerous.

If he is proven a hoax and even some people here think otherwise, it will happen that they will instantly start to actually take seriously what this guy is saying about our religions, especially his.

If however he is proven genuine, I would have to think quite a lot of things all over again. It would be quite a job to totally ignore this guy's religious ideas and extract mere facts from his ramblings. Ignoring of religious ideas has not a single time proven to actually happen when we talk about masses, that's main reason why I would not want this guy to even take the test.

Now what happens in each and every single outcome is that:

He is granted the test:

1. He fails the test.
- some kind of prophecy will afterwards explain that this did have to happen because of whatever. Some peope think otherwise and start listening to him. This can be used for his personal gain.

2. he succeeds.
- he instantly gains 10k followers, permanent or temporary. Ufology will be filled with religion for decades to come. This is obviously a personal gain, and propably the only result that can resolve into something good.

He is not granted the test:

- Conspiracy would be that we do not want to get proof and that we in reality want to ignore reality when given a chance to know it. Some will, again, follow his ideas and start to listen to him.

These things might just as well happen because this guy is not an idiot, I would recommed quite carefull consideration before any decision.

[edit on 16/6/08 by rawsom]

If springer denys this challenge I will have no choice other than to think of him as denying the truth.

Imagine if your all wrong and he can do as he says?

And if he cant, then atleast we tryed making another step twords TRUTH.

Wich is what ats is all about am i right?

reply to post by rawsom


I disagree that if he passes the test, that people would start believing his religious ideas.

His religious ideas should be completely left out of this; it's simply a test to see if he is really in telepathic communication with beings as he claims.

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
reply to post by defcon5

 

Might I suggest, before doing a big expensive test, which I suspect Springer may not be too glad to do

- do a cheap preliminary test first. See if Prophet is willing to simply come out, meet with Springer, and call down a UFO for him.

That will not work, as once PY is allowed to say that he won the challenge, he will post it as a victory and never allow it to be repeated under more stringent conditions. it’s the way that this man thinks. Anything that will give him a boost, he will do, if it might be potentially harmful he will cover it up or make excuses for why it does not happen. This is why the LV thing never happened, his idea was to get a lot of big media coverage, which would give him a lot of exposure (good or bad) and open him up to a huge market of new believers. It was a win situation for him no matter if the UFO’s showed or not, as long as the press did. When the press did not show, he came up with excuses why the event did not occur. The event would most likely not have occurred either way, his idea was to send his message out to those with “itching ears”, and gain support.

Moreover, we see that in this very thread. Those who wish to believe are fighting despite his already having been hacked apart once, because they wish to believe. They do not want to use critical thinking, or scientific process to really examine this mans claims, they simply want to believe. Just look at how the stars on this thread are ending up, it’s certainly not due to better writing on one side or the other, its simply the believes flagging each other to give their side credibility. Any mention of lack of belief, or putting this to a real test, is being disputed or ignored.

That in itself makes me worry about some folks objectivity in performing any type of testing.

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
reply to post by rawsom

 

I disagree that if he passes the test, that people would start believing his religious ideas.

His religious ideas should be completely left out of this; it's simply a test to see if he is really in telepathic communication with beings as he claims.

Should but won't. I wouldn't care much about what he is saying in name of religion, but there would be a ton of people who would. I have nothing against good deeds, peace and that sort of thing but these things tend to get our of hand quite easily. It always happens, every single time.

I can of course solve this problem of mine so that I just ignore all the people who listen to religious aspects, it is not a problem. Problems are elswhere..

reply to post by defcon5


So what you are saying that any interaction with ATS, whether he succeeds or not is going to give him legitimacy. So basically he is agreeing to do this to get street cred?

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
reply to post by defcon5

 

So what you are saying that any interaction with ATS, whether he succeeds or not is going to give him legitimacy. So basically he is agreeing to do this to get street cred?

(You didn't reply to me, but..)

Yes, that is an exact way these sort of people work and gain audience. They have figured out how to say things so that no matter what the outcome of their PR stun (of their own choosing), they will win. Its called a win-win situation.

Originally posted by defcon5
Moreover, we see that in this very thread. Those who wish to believe are fighting despite his already having been hacked apart once, because they wish to believe. They do not want to use critical thinking, or scientific process to really examine this mans claims, they simply want to believe. Just look at how the stars on this thread are ending up, it’s certainly not due to better writing on one side or the other, its simply the believes flagging each other to give their side credibility. Any mention of lack of belief, or putting this to a real test, is being disputed or ignored.

I don't see it that way at all. It's not about "wanting to believe", "lack of critical thinking" etc.

In the If you could ask Prophet Yahweh a question thread, the most popular question by far was elevatedone's question, if Prophet could summon UFOs for the ATS owners.

I simply took the extra step of going and communicating with Prophet and posing the question to him directly!

Now that Prophet has accepted the challenge and thrown down the gauntlet, there's no way ATS can back out of this without losing face!!

Originally posted by rawsom

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
reply to post by defcon5

 

So what you are saying that any interaction with ATS, whether he succeeds or not is going to give him legitimacy. So basically he is agreeing to do this to get street cred?

(You didn't reply to me, but..)

Yes, that is an exact way these sort of people work and gain audience. They have figured out how to say things so that no matter what the outcome of their PR stun (of their own choosing), they will win. Its called a win-win situation.

It is a dangerous game he is playing. Not so much for us but for his own safety. The kind of people who would take him as a religious figure, tend to get pretty pissed when they are let down. It will either get really ugly or really funny.