Conspiracy on religion?

Uh oh, did I start an argument? hehe...No but honestly, I've heard a lot about this, and this is definitely branched off from other threads on religion but I wanted to hear it from everyone myself. I for one have been raised Roman Catholic and told to believe this, believe that and if I don't, you will not be accepted in heaven. And if you sin and do anything God doesn't like you will go to hell where you will burn and be in pain and agony beyond your imagination...but God loves you...This may sound familiar to some of you, because George Carlin said this in one of his stand-up's.
A lot of people have said a lot of religions have been misinterpreted over the years, but all have the same general principle. Love one another, be a descent human being, and you will have an amazing afterlife. This is obviously a great way to basically scare everyone into being good people. So heres the deal, if there is no such thing as God, but you are religious and live by whatever your God's teachings are, then you will live a good life. If there is a God, then you will abide by his teachings, live a good life, and go to heaven where you will live in his presence for eternity. Now, both have same principles but different outcomes. It doesn't really matter to most people. People generally are descent individuals, but spirituality will give them that extra boost in hopes that they make it into heaven. It's definitely a touchy subject, and I don't want anyone to think I am bashing anyone's religion. My question is, do you think God and his teachings were made up to better man-kind regardless of our motive for doing so?

[edit on 11-6-2008 by Black Ops]

Well if their plan was for religion to help and better mankind, it really turned around on them. Religion has started wars and killed lots of people.
Look at the salem witch trials, or the crusades.

To me I still think some religions were made up to more easily control people and make the higher ups in religion much richer.

This truly is a rather touchy subject, and I am not sure whether or not I should post my opinion. I too am Roman Catholic, and I have thought for a little bit that religion was just put there to keep you from sinning. I have also thought for quite a bit that there is no real "form" of god or heaven, and it is all in our mind. For example, when you die, I have always believed you just dream that you are in heaven, but are not physically there. The many killings over religion is most definitely tragic and bad, but our pursuit to live a sin-free and righteous life if also rewarding in the end. We are meant to love one another, and religion helps us get there.

There are so many diffrent types of heaven out there how do you know that your Roman Catholic heaven is the the correct one? What's not to say that Valhalla is the correct heaven?

Exactly. A lot of people think their religion is the right one. Therein lyes the problem. How can we all believe in a "God", but still have differences on subtle semantics? Such as where you go when you get to heaven, if you even go to heaven, or whatever the case may be. Furthermore, I read a book not too long ago. 23 minutes in hell I think it was called. Basically it was a guy who died and went to hell for 23 minutes, obviously, and was saying how horrific it was. Then all of a sudden, Jesus Christ lifted him in the heavens and showed him that if you didn't believe in him, then you would be cast down to hell as he was sent back to life to spread this message. Then theres the guy who almost died in a plane crash, and went to heaven to realize that if you repent your sins before you die, you will go to heaven. So basically you could be a homicidal maniac and kill innocents by the hundreds but as long as you ask God for forgiveness you will go to heaven? It doesn't make any sense to me. Also who is even to say what the right religion is? The truth is, there is no "right" religion per say. It's whatever gives you a reason to be a good person and able to cope with the ignorance in society while helping those in need. As was stated earlier, this is a great way to spread the word of being courteous and what not, but similarly, wars have been fought over religion so it's almost a double-edged sword. A shame really.

Originally posted by Black Ops
Uh oh, did I start an argument? hehe...No but honestly, I've heard a lot about this, and this is definitely branched off from other threads on religion but I wanted to hear it from everyone myself. I for one have been raised Roman Catholic and told to believe this, believe that and if I don't, you will not be accepted in heaven. And if you sin and do anything God doesn't like you will go to hell where you will burn and be in pain and agony beyond your imagination...but God loves you...This may sound familiar to some of you, because George Carlin said this in one of his stand-up's.
A lot of people have said a lot of religions have been misinterpreted over the years, but all have the same general principle. Love one another, be a descent human being, and you will have an amazing afterlife. This is obviously a great way to basically scare everyone into being good people. So heres the deal, if there is no such thing as God, but you are religious and live by whatever your God's teachings are, then you will live a good life. If there is a God, then you will abide by his teachings, live a good life, and go to heaven where you will live in his presence for eternity. Now, both have same principles but different outcomes. It doesn't really matter to most people. People generally are descent individuals, but spirituality will give them that extra boost in hopes that they make it into heaven. It's definitely a touchy subject, and I don't want anyone to think I am bashing anyone's religion. My question is, do you think God and his teachings were made up to better man-kind regardless of our motive for doing so?

[edit on 11-6-2008 by Black Ops]

I first read this and thought you meant the things you said in the first paragraph and then I noticed you were saying that's what Catholics say.

I have to wholly disagree with you about religions teaching to love one another and be decent. There's a dichotomy between religious eschatological theology: idealism and realism. The realism of, Christianity, is God encourages rape, murder, slavery, and human sacrifice ( evilbible.com ) while the idealism of Christianity is that it's a loving, good religion. People can be loving and good. Religions which have clergy which teach people to love, yet when you open the Bible and actually read it ( evilbible.com ) you find messages of murder, intolerance, hated, and injustice.

Psychologically, sociologically, and historically speaking, the motivation for the formation of religious beliefs, be it shamanistic or contemporary, wasn't a conspiracy to control people, but simply a way for primitive man to understand what was around him.

I am not religious and I don't need religion to make me be a good person. I for one do not want to live after I die. Who wants to endure eternity? What a boring, sad existence. I for one want to finally rest.

If all of what you guys believe is true, and there is no "right" religion since they are all made up, I am just wondering how the Bible came to be. I am not saying anything is right or wrong, but I am wondering what YOU guys believe about the Bible. Was it created by the men of the same bloodline who have kept in power ever since the dawn of man? This is a much touchy subject as I have mentioned before, but these are things that we need to think about.


Mod Note: You Have An Urgent U2U- Click Here.

[edit on 12-6-2008 by Gemwolf]

Totalitarian, I understand what you are saying about the stipulations in the bible that people fail to notice. I don't think God actually intended to encourage death and destruction yet he knows our potential as human beings. What we can accomplish as a race. Whether it be for good or bad. But in the end, it's the little voice inside our heads telling us the difference between right and wrong. I personally don't think someone needs religion, as stated earlier by other posters, to persuade their thoughts. To much of my chagrin, I've realized that people can be evil even when under the direction of God. I just feel that it's all up to the individual in the end.

It seems to me that religion and magic originated in the struggles between emergent consciousness and the promptings of instinct in early humans. I describe the process, along with its cause and its outcomes, in this post on a thread started by Masqua on the roots of religion.

Basically, instinctive drives came to be conceptualized as powerful entities that could threaten peace of mind, or sanity, or even life, if they were not acknowledged and placated. These 'projections' of the instincts became spirits, gods and demons. So yes, its purpose was originally to help people keep themselves under control.

The elaborate edifice of religion grew out of these roots.

It's not so much a conspiracy as an evolutionary development.

Well is that the basis of all religion or just the background of how/why it was started?

reply to post by Black Ops

I believe it is the basis of all religion. Did you get a look at the linked post?

In addition to personalizing his own unconscious drives, early man also personalized the abstract forces of nature, the things that caused changes in the world around him (sometimes beneficial to him, at other times detrimental or frustrating to his plans) as invisible, independent entities. The process he used to placate and deal with them was the one he learnt from his efforts to placate and deal with the unconscious. Of course, the process doesn't work so well on the external physical world, but what it probably did was help explain to people why bad things happen - 'the gods are angry' - and that probably helped calm them and was thus conducive to their survival.

Organized religion then evolved from those beginnings over the millennia.

At some point, the usefulness of religious belief as an instrument of social and political control would have become apparent to some. From that point onward, religious organizations would have been directed specifically towards this end.

The Buddha understood this process and tried to avert it. He failed. Lao-Tzu saw it, succeeded in averting it, and as a result Taoism isn't a big world religion today (at least not in its original form).

Jesus was a dupe; he got crucified, while his sayings became raw material for the controllers. The religion founded in his name has become huge, strangling parasite sucking at the throats of billions.

Mohammed was smart; he abandoned his mystical beginnings to become one of the controllers.

Judaism is pretty primitive for a world religion; it harks back to the old days of sacrifice and bargains with the personifications of the id and nature. That's why it's on its way out.

[edit on 12-6-2008 by Astyanax]