Undecideds, the disgruntled, Libertarians and Independents...

I sympathize much with those who think it will never matter. I don't really think what I do is ever going to make a difference. But I would say try getting involved, you might enjoy it. Think of it as a hobby at first. What happens is people on the outside start to see you as someone involved in politics, even if all you are doing is going to a few meetings and really not doing anything at all.

People start to listen to you on politics, you have more real conversations about it, for some reason they think you have the "inside scoop" even though most of us here know that nobody on the low levels would have it, the mainstream don't think that way. It gives you more credibility, and more chances to talk about what you really think, but that's not the point really. The point is people start to listen a little better with you. Really it's just something else to do that you might like.

reply to post by Novise


Personally Im not hanging around saying "It doesnt matter and I dont give a ****". But the energy and time and money invested is certainly not into one of those parties.

People tell us that by not voting we are supporting this and that. Not so.

reply to post by Skyfloating


Yes you're exactly right on that point, too much TIME raising cash...too much time mudslinging, it's ridiculous...

I have a question for any Canadians out there, I doubt there are any reading THIS thread but just in case....

I heard you all have a system where there is a set limit on how long the candidates can campaign, I think it was exactly 3 months before the election, they can campaign, and everyone starts with the same amount of cash....

If I have heard wrong, this is an IDEAL win win situation for rehabbing OUR system even if it's not true, this is absolutely ridiculous that the "campaign" begins now 2 YEARS before a presidential election, I loveeeeee this idea for the U.S.!!!

Think about that, you could set a limit on 10 million, 50 million apiece or whatever, and they can ONLY start the ads, the campaigning 3 months before the election ...HEAVEN.

reply to post by Skyfloating


I hear you...I am almost to that point where you and so many others are...my personality is such though that I hate to give up even when I think it's hopeless, simply because I am a problem-solving type, but yes, on the main level I know it's pointless, I just can't stop myself simply because it's such a mess right now.

It would almost be impossible to rehab the "system" at this point without energizing more then half the population into some sort of "never-going-to-happen" coalition. But I can always dream

I'm with you. Not getting involved makes it even easier for the high ups in the parties to manipulate and operate Top-Down. At the Republican convention in my state all everybody wanted to do was get it over with. There is nothing those at the top would rather have than people who's only motivation is leaving early...

But yeah, by not voting and by not getting involved we do make it easier on the PTB. I don't blame the problem on people who don't vote. They are a step above those who fall for the lies we are sold, but above that I prefer an informed voter, voting their concience (even if they disagree with me).

When you look at the disenchanted and those who don't vote, as a protest vote... I just wonder how they look at our founding fathers. They told us it was our duty to be involved. I know there are conspiracies surrounding our founding fathers. They weren't perfect. I mean even Jefferson was racist with the 3/5 rule.

I am a fan of our founders overall, and they said it was nothing less than our duty to be involved. So I wonder if the badly disenchanted don't trust the founders as well, which wouldn't be farfetched to me, they could have had their own agenda obviously.

reply to post by LateApexer313


Rehab and Reform, R&R are things us "independents" could become active for.

And one major step forwards would, as you´ve recognized, limiting the election times. In doing so they wouldnt have so much time to sling dirt everywhere but would have to get their agenda and issues together asap.