Did Mars Phoenix pop a spring, lose a screw or what?

reply to post by sos37


It's quite possible but if it is a spring, it's a pretty shoddy one! LOL!

I know what you mean about the open end but I've also found shells on the beach that have been chipped that resemble exactly what we see in the photo.

It could be a multitude of things I guess - so what don't NASA just come out and say - "ohh it's just a spring?" That would be too easy huh!

This is conditioning. And is a little more honesty from NASA than we're used to.. We'll be seeing a lot more mundane anomalies now. many more.
The truth is, mars is polluted with life and life history. It has a longer history of events than earth. Sounds nuts, I concede, but time will tell. It (the "spring/screw") could be technology or biological. neither would suprise me.

they have quality cameras on Phoenix, but it's harder to smudge Hi-Res images and not look like you're smudging them, so we'll have to be content with this crap for now...


edited to fix this: "conditioning. And a lis ittle more honesty from NASA than we're"

[edit on 3-6-2008 by djerwulfe]

It should be quite obvious to everyone by now just what it we are looking at.

One of the Explosive Bolts used to hold and then release the arm has discharged itself into the ground as the lander was preparing to do it's thing.

Everyone knows exploding bolts are on spaceships.... and landers...


Who am I kidding. . . it's a *SNIP* martian seashell!

Mod Noteon't evade the censors:

www.abovetopsecret.com...




[edit on 3-6-2008 by NGC2736]

Look closely, the ground that it recedes into is punctured. EG: It fell into it and is sticking out of the impact hole. Obviously debris from the heat shield disconnection system or the releasing system for the arm. Or hell someone that popped off!

But it is no Martian seal shell.

reply to post by Foxe


Most likely. Simplest explanation is usually correct. Besides, martian life wouldn't require the same types of structural supports that terrestrial fauna does. CaCO3 isn't the martian mode. Martian marine fauna would likely be hundreds of meters long and appear like an anomalous bit of terrain, anyway.
Also, it's (Mars) an irradiated dust ball that couldn't possibly support life as we know it... Such as the ferrous-respiring microbes 3 miles below the terrestrial crust or the crypto-endolith/lichen communities in Antarctica or bacters that remain viable for 1000 years when nutrient-deprived or any other incredibly hostile environments/conditions on earth. No way anything could live on mars, right?

Does anyone here work for a fastener company? I do. I can tell you that for the furniture industry we supply Screws (of all types) with Scotchgrip. This product allows the screw to be inserted, but never to be released (It can with variants - but in general - NOT!)

NOW, I ask myself, why would NASA use Sub-Standard Fasteners, on this project, when Furniture companies DON'T!!! Doesn't make any sense does it?? My belief is that this IS NOT a Fastener of ANY type! NASA would be CRAZY to accept fasteners of Sub-Standard quality for this mission....

By the Way...The Automotive industry is SO STRICT, we won't deal with them....SO, WHO does NASA get their Fasteners from??

If that was a screw on the surface....NASA blundered BIG TIME! But from my observation, IT IS NOT a screw! No way in hell!

Head, Drive, Type, Size, Length, Finish, etc etc.... It ain't a screw! That would be visible and identifiable.

reply to post by TortoiseKweek


If it's not a fastener or screw, what's your take on what it could actually be as opposed to what it is not? Also, with weight being a major issue in the fabrication of all hardware they send to Mars, I can't understand how they would have disposable parts. If they could function without them, why include them in the first place. "Hey we don't really need the screw for things to function but we'll add the extra weight anyway". ? LOL!

If it popped off some jettisoned part during descent, It's kind of unusual (and unlikely) that it would end up in exactly the same place as the lander once it touched down.

I still think the said object appears to have organic qualities - but it could be anything

IRM

It seems clear to me that this is debris from the lander itself. As much as I would like it to be something more, I just don't think it is.

The first step of unstowing the arm, expected to occur this afternoon, involves moving the scoop towards the arm with the wrist joint, which will release a spring-loaded pin that kept the arm restrained during Phoenix's August launch and Sunday landing, Goldstein said.

A lot of people seem to be accepting this as the answer (not that it isn't). If you actually read it though, it says it will release a spring-loaded pin - not shoot pins and springs off. To me, releasing a spring-loaded pin means simply adjusting something that will cause the tension of the spring to release and thereby move the pin --- like a pez dispenser maybe (it was the only example I could think of that I believed everybody would understand).

Regardless of whether it's a spring from the landing procedure, a martian tube worm that's living off the subsurface water, or rebarb from the 15670 BC Martian Olympic Stadium.. don't you imagine after 6 years of planning and development and over $386 million you might want to just take a little closer look? Perhaps to confirm that it didn't come from the shutter of the better camera we all hope they have... (maybe that's why all the pictures suck). I'm just thinking it would be nice if they acknowledged it and confirmed what it was before making another sand castle.

edit to add: Here's a spring loaded pin... no parts shooting off here.

video.google.com...


edit again to add: Nasa should add a button in the image galleries... like a "Hey NASA, WTF is that?" button.
[edit on 4-6-2008 by memoir]

[edit on 4-6-2008 by memoir]

Originally posted by memoir

Here's a spring loaded pin... no parts shooting off here.

video.google.com...


Nasa should add a button in the image galleries... like a "Hey NASA, WTF is that?" button.

I don't understand what that video has to do with a spring loaded pin. The guy's pressing a pin out with a tool operated by a wrench. Spring loaded suggests that the spring provides the power not a wrench.

This did get me thinking about the spring. I doubt that NASA would risk having the spring loose. If it were used to push a pin to unlock something then I would think that a loose spring trying to follow the pin out might get caught between the two separate parts. That just doesn't sound like something NASA would do. When you're goin to Mars take as few risks as possible.

I LOVE the idea of the (Hey NASA what's that?) button.

Only problem would be that all we'd get back are answers like. rock, that's a rock, that's another rock. Oh, that. It's a rock. Yea the shiny thing. It's a rock. What's that MOVING. Just a ROCK. Musta got caught in one of those pesky sand storms.

After all, ROCKS are all that's on Mars. Just ask NASA.

This might give an idea of one of the springs used for these types of exploration. This was from the heat shield that protected Opportunity. It seems to look a little bigger than what we see in the Phoenix Lander photos ... but food for thought my friends ...

reply to post by bigboyjed


I hate to break it to you but this idea is completely wrong due to the fact that this is completely unexplored territory. I would have to go with the idea that it is a spring until there is more evidence.

Wow Child of Light that certainly confirms my suspicions of how a spring would react to falling on the ground seems these are laying totally on the surface thanks a million.

LBJ Mariner 4 reference 1965 : Lyndon B. Johnson
Lyndon B. Johnson
391 - Remarks Upon Viewing New Mariner 4 Pictures From Mars.
July 29th, 1965 www.presidency.ucsb.edu... (excerpt) Dr. Webb, Dr. Pickering, Dr. Leighton, Members of Congress, distinguished guests:

Unaccustomed as I am to welcoming men from Mars, I am very happy to see you gentlemen here this morning. As a member of the generation that Orson Welles scared out of its wits, I must confess that I am a little bit relieved that your photographs didn't show more signs of life out there.

I think I speak for every American when I tell you how very proud and how impressed, how grateful we are for what you and all the many members of your team have accomplished on the Mariner 4 mission.

The flight of Mariner 4 will long stand as one of the really great advances in man's unending quest to extend the horizons of human knowledge. In the history books of tomorrow, unlike the headlines of today, the project's name may be lost but the names of the men of vision, men of imagination and faith who made this enterprise such a historic success are going to be honored in the world for many generations to come.

Proof NASA can provide a nice hirez picture of a landing pad. Hmmmm maybe they could get a better picture of the Spring, Fossil, Screw, Shell, or thingie mabob under the lander that we are so interested in seeing.


phoenix.lpl.arizona.edu...

openfuelresource.com...

reply to post by djerwulfe


Wow that's a pretty bold statement to step up and say considering you have no proof whatsoever that NASA is holding anything back from the public. Zero, none nada. I suggest before you make statements like what you just did, you at least provide some shred of anything to make your case look a little valid.

How about a little better picture... really a pretty simple thing just as easy for them as you pulling out your trusty digital camera pointing and clicking... seems they would rather ignore the fact and dodge the pic. but i guess you would rather be polishing there brass for them huh? polish away I don't care if its a spring or a alien booger its an anomaly and it should be addressed.

openfuelresource.com...

I see a tube! Definetly a tube. And that to me means NASA is bull#ting us. I wonder what they ARE doing with their money, when their not making models.

I don't care where those pictures came from, that looks more fake than a giant glow-in-the-dark dinosaur under london.

reply to post by child of light


Thanks for posting that Op pic. I did not design the heat shield in 1987,just the tether,airbags & rover. The cattle-sized skull in the background is much bigger than those 2 springs. It sits completely on the surface,not sunk into the ground,so probably relatively fresh.It's not half -burried.It has large eye holes and is symetrical.I have to state the obvious because people have difficulty seeing what I point out. A large skull larger that your own head should stick out,considering the color and flatness of the dark background like a sea bed. Do not assume that everyone can see what is obvious. Just attempt to show fossils and signs of very large previous life.While nasa claims to be looking for signs of life on Mars,it wasn't nasa that pointed out the foot high fossil.No,a 50year old guy on a home pc showed it,and probably not the first one to see it. Still people can't see it,I guarantee you.They'll discredit an obvious find.That's one out of a hundred or so posts that most motivated people who say they are interested in finding life on Mars,and not lying,should be able to see.If you see that,then go look again at 100 of my posts and find MORE. Don't be complacent,be proactive. I bend over backwards to show life on Mars because I know I'm right. It's a public service to design a rover.It's a public service to circumvent the nasa non-disclosure JAIL and FINES for their employees.Think about that one.You disclose,you lose your job.