To non believers in GOD. What in the world do you believe in? and why?

Originally posted by SR
What exactly is it your straddling the fence in regards to?

Are you on the fence in regards to the Theory of Evolution? If so you’re extremely intellectually lazy.

Are you on the fence in regards to the truthfulness of the God of the Bible? If so then you’re also very intellectually lazy or dishonest.

Are you on the fence in regards to the existence of any general God, creator force or similar? Then I’d say you’re an Agnostic Atheist and intellectually honest.

If you don’t have faith in any religion then you’re an atheist. Atheism is not a belief system, it is absence of belief.

I don't categorize myself, I don't call myself Agnostic, or Atheist. I simply don't know the answer to the Questions "How did we get here?" "Why are we here?" I'm on the fence, because I believe that there COULD be a God, and there COULD NOT be a God. I believe it is POSSIBLE for anything to be. I don't know the answers, so why should I pretend to? I won't make a choice to believe in something, because I don't feel that I have enough information to believe.

Christianity offers me a Belief - Based on Faith. Faith which I don't have. I don't have enough confidence in Faith, to believe there IS a Creator. I believe there COULD BE a Creator. And there is a possibility that we are alone in this great big universe.


Science offers me a Theory - A theory, based on what COULD Be. I refuse to base my belief system on what Could be. We very well COULD have evolved, I don't know, I wasn't around that long ago. We also, COULD NOT have evolved. Afterall, Darwin's theory, is just a Theory.

I don't feel the need to Believe in any one thing at this point in time. I'm waiting for one side to give me a more compelling argument than the other. How is that wrong? Its right for me. I don't feel comfortable enough making a decision to base my beliefs on one extreme or the other. Based on the information provided from Christiany, and Science, I can't make a deicision, because I don't feel that I have enough information, personally. Everyone requires different levels of information to believe in things, maybe I require too much. Or maybe, I'm just trying to be rational instead of jumping and picking a side, which is how I would feel, if I decided to pour my Beliefs into one bucket and call it So. Instead, I read, I listen, I watch, I think.

I don't BELIEVE in any one thing. I'm not a Christian and I'm not a Scientist. I am a person, in this great big world, looking up at the sky and reading the text books. I'm thinking of the different possibilites, and therefore that is what I believe. I believe, in the possibility of things being true. That is what is right for me, personally.

Originally posted by Guided

I have a few friends that are gay. They do not CHOSE to be that way. They are born that way. (From what I know). Just like I am born the way I am. I can't change that. I feel we are all sinners. Gay, not gay. It doesn't matter. As long as you have GOD and repent your sins, whatever they may be to you. In private or not. GOD is there for you.

Now your question. Same sex couples to adopt children. As long as it is loving and healthy for the child(main thing). That is fine. Children brought up with hetrosexual parents are worse off if it is an unloving, violent situation. So as long as love and GOD is there.

Same sex marriage. Ok, I will be honest. Just say that everyone in the world was gay. That would be the end of the human race on our part. Would it not? Like I said, you can't change how you are born. Any of us. So to present a marriage in the eyes of GOD (I am assuming) would be to admitting "no fault". Don't get me wrong, I don't even agree with marriage now a days. It means NOTHING. Some people get married in the "eyes of GOD" and divorce the next hour. So I don't agree with mariiage at all unless it is forever. I guess there are some people who can still do that. Mostly the older generation.

If this makes sense. GOD is the most important thing to remember here and you will never be steered wrong. No matter what.

Ok, always the bridesmaid, never the bride, late again, as ever...

* How do you know they didn't choose?

* Are you saying you were born a beleiver? If so, I was born unable to walk, like most kids, I LEARNT to walk, as most people (?) do to read, write, etc... surely the application of learning and conditioning applies to many processes that humans go through throughout life?

* If everyone in the world was gay, we would still have the ability to reproduce as a species. We learnt it, via science.

I don't mean to heckle you here, I think you have a good viewpoint on things such as gay marriage and your attitude to "happiness". However, I think your idea that god is intrinsic to anything is flawed. I was raised by my mother in a happy loving environment with no pushing (or pulling) to the church or religion; my grandmother was very keen on me to be of faith and I love my gran and just never bothered with religion. I have faith in myself, my family and friends, for everyone else I have hope.

reply to post by bmiasma


Convert to atheism. If you truly feel that you only need to believe in yourself and no one else, then you wouldn't feel the need to search for a belief in a collective consciousness or a universal interconnectedness. You are searching, and I am sure you will find the right path - there is nothing to believe in except for science.
Believing in science and science only does not exclude one from the ability to spread love, kindness and compassion in the community and to make the world a better place. This is an attribute of traditional religions that exists in most atheists as well. Many people forget this and feel that atheists don't care about anyone else. Some people feel that atheists live their lives carelessly since they don't have to worry about being judged by God.
Atheists are better people with truer hearts than those who subscribe to any other belief system, because their moral compass is not guided by the fear of a judgmental creator - it is guided by the will and desire to do right solely for the sake of doing right.

Originally posted by AveIMil

Originally posted by Herman
A single mother is raising her son. We'll call him Henry. One day, when her son is 6 years old, he asks her where his father is. His mother tells him "Well, your father is in a very far away place." "Can I talk to him?" the son asks. "Well, you can write him letters. Somebody wrote his address down for me a long time ago, and if you want, you can write to him, but he will not be able to write back."…

Yeah, riiiightt. This father character is an utter ass[hole]. I know you’re trying to make the analogy that the father is God, yet even if that was the case, God would still be a smock!

If I was the son I would surely write a letter to my supposed rich father at a fairly early age:

“Hey daddy, I just wanted to let you know that I think you’re a coward. Although mom likes to keep up her appearances and make it seem like everything’s ok, I know she cries at night. Hey dad, F off and never return, neither of us wanted your riches, we just wanted a normal father and husband. Go to hell, ass[hole].”

HaaHaa. That was f-ing funny and so much more realistic. Normal people do not maintain loyalties with someone who supposedly exists, but does not return communication with them for years and years. People need to stop putting god on a pedestal just because he supposedly forced us to be alive. If he was a human walking the earth and he behaved the way "father" behaved in this story, he would be seen as such an unbelievable a-hole.
Honestly, I believe that if I met god (not that I believe in him, but if I met someone with the same personality of the christian god that is portrayed in the bible) I would spit in his f-ing face.

reply to post by Herman


Sorry dude, that Henry is a bad lad, he was probably listening to Whitesnake and knew a guy that knew a guy that once had a next door neighbour who once smoked one and his sister was "rumoured" to have been loose. That Henry is a bad guy and encouraged his neighbours to be bad people and not to mow their lawns - because Henry was a lazy b-std and only mowed his once a fortnight and lo' the neighbours did think "fudge it, I shalt mow my lawn as and when I choose. ...and I shalt ignore the social indoctrination of doing what mine neighbours shalt and lo' the time I shalt not spend mowing my lawn, I will spend ploughing my field or my wife". Behold, Henry was one day not tending to his lawn and was smotten by a snake with one eye, a snake with a demon for a head and a lion for a body and five goats for legs and it was an abomination and the abomination spake and it sayeth "WTF??? Henry, yu been smoking some goodnes and thou not shareth it? Good for you, dude, but turn your stereo up, for thou is listening to Black Sabbath and they fairly rock".

And thus endeth some drunken bored ranting that may or may not make some sense, but... my lack of sense is purely an inspired parallel to anyone bored enough to, err... well, be bored enough to prosetlyise on the values of unicorsn or something...

yeah, nice

Originally posted by jokei

Ok, always the bridesmaid, never the bride, late again, as ever...

* How do you know they didn't choose?

* Are you saying you were born a beleiver? If so, I was born unable to walk, like most kids, I LEARNT to walk, as most people (?) do to read, write, etc... surely the application of learning and conditioning applies to many processes that humans go through throughout life?

* If everyone in the world was gay, we would still have the ability to reproduce as a species. We learnt it, via science.

I don't mean to heckle you here, I think you have a good viewpoint on things such as gay marriage and your attitude to "happiness". However, I think your idea that god is intrinsic to anything is flawed. I was raised by my mother in a happy loving environment with no pushing (or pulling) to the church or religion; my grandmother was very keen on me to be of faith and I love my gran and just never bothered with religion. I have faith in myself, my family and friends, for everyone else I have hope.

I don't think gay people chose to be that way. I can't speak for that but, I didn't chose to be the way I am. It just is!

I wasn't "literally" born a believer. It was in me though. For reasons that are totally unexplainable. Long story. I think everyone has the holy spirit in them. It is whether you call upon it or not.

You may be part right with that last one. Reproduction would find a way Unfortunately, I think it would be more "screwed up" then it is now. Meaning reproduction in science labs. Thinks go terribly wrong there in the long run.

You say you have faith in yourself and everyone else you have hope. Which is great! Who do you think gave you that faith? Who do you think gave you that hope? Some people don't even have that. You are blessed without even knowing it! Thanks for your post

Originally posted by 842amFrom

HaaHaa. That was f-ing funny and so much more realistic. Normal people do not maintain loyalties with someone who supposedly exists, but does not return communication with them for years and years. People need to stop putting god on a pedestal just because he supposedly forced us to be alive. If he was a human walking the earth and he behaved the way "father" behaved in this story, he would be seen as such an unbelievable a-hole.
Honestly, I believe that if I met god (not that I believe in him, but if I met someone with the same personality of the christian god that is portrayed in the bible) I would spit in his f-ing face.

Hi 842amFrom! I am not sure if you read much. There is one book you should read. Just to say that you have read it. That book is The Bible. You don't have to believe anything. All you have to do is read it.

Originally posted by Guided

Hi 842amFrom! I am not sure if you read much. There is one book you should read. Just to say that you have read it. That book is The Bible. You don't have to believe anything. All you have to do is read it.

There is one book you should read. Just to say that you have read it. That book is The Book of Mormon. You don't have to believe anything. All you have to do is read it.

Originally posted by Annee
[have to do is read it.

There is one book you should read. Just to say that you have read it. That book is The Book of Mormon. You don't have to believe anything. All you have to do is read it.

Hi Annee. I have no problem with reading that book. I will read it first, then make my own conclusion. I really only know bits and pieces of The Book of Mormon. They sound like they have good beliefs. Like I said I don't enough about it.

reply to post by Guided


You said that you didn't think gay people chose to be that way (ie, gay), that seems to imply they are "born" that way, could you please clarify your thoughts on this?

So, you're saying you were born with "belief" in you, you "found it", long story - go on explain the, I've got the time to read it.

"You may be part right with that last one. Reproduction would find a way Unfortunately, I think it would be more "screwed up" then it is now. Meaning reproduction in science labs. Thinks go terribly wrong there in the long run. " - quote from you... It wouldn't have to be reproduction in science labs, or cloning, it could be a quite simple case of artificial insemination, ie sperm donorship, which has been going on for years and is a very simple process, with not much medical/scientific tinkering, if anything, the process will get a lot easier and more advanced, I doubt if it would go terribly wrong at all - seriously.

I gave me faith in myself, I learnt to read, I have faith I can read a book, I learnt to drive... etc.

I have no need for god in my life, it is only an inconvenience on many fronts.

Originally posted by Guided

Originally posted by Annee
[have to do is read it.

There is one book you should read. Just to say that you have read it. That book is The Book of Mormon. You don't have to believe anything. All you have to do is read it.

Hi Annee. I have no problem with reading that book. I will read it first, then make my own conclusion. I really only know bits and pieces of The Book of Mormon. They sound like they have good beliefs. Like I said I don't enough about it.

Great - you never know what kind of response you're gonna get from that question. Just like you never know what kind of response you're gonna get from asking people to read the bible. Just thought I'd see if you are as open as you want others to be. Mormon's are Christian - Jesus is their only savior - they study the bible. The book of Mormon is like if someone found more ancient scripts with additional information. It does NOT replace the bible. It is an interesting read - keep an open mind.

Originally posted by Annee
[]

Great - you never know what kind of response you're gonna get from that question. Just like you never know what kind of response you're gonna get from asking people to read the bible. Just thought I'd see if you are as open as you want others to be. Mormon's are Christian - Jesus is their only savior - they study the bible. The book of Mormon is like if someone found more ancient scripts with additional information. It does NOT replace the bible. It is an interesting read - keep an open mind.

Thanks Annee!

Originally posted by jokei
reply to post by Guided

 

You said that you didn't think gay people chose to be that way (ie, gay), that seems to imply they are "born" that way, could you please clarify your thoughts on this?

So, you're saying you were born with "belief" in you, you "found it", long story - go on explain the, I've got the time to read it.

"You may be part right with that last one. Reproduction would find a way Unfortunately, I think it would be more "screwed up" then it is now. Meaning reproduction in science labs. Thinks go terribly wrong there in the long run. " - quote from you... It wouldn't have to be reproduction in science labs, or cloning, it could be a quite simple case of artificial insemination, ie sperm donorship, which has been going on for years and is a very simple process, with not much medical/scientific tinkering, if anything, the process will get a lot easier and more advanced, I doubt if it would go terribly wrong at all - seriously.

I gave me faith in myself, I learnt to read, I have faith I can read a book, I learnt to drive... etc.

I have no need for god in my life, it is only an inconvenience on many fronts.

People who are gay. That is just my opinion. I don't know. I am not gay. So I really can't comment any more on that. That's not fair.

According to the bible. Everyone is born with the holy spirit. Whether you chose to "unleash" it or not is up to you. If you do, there is nothing comparable. GOD has been in my life since day one. Why? I can't really answer that. Totally my own doings. I have never read the bible until the last year. It has affected me in such a way knowing GOD's word. Just read one chapter in the bible Revealtions. It doesn't take long. Everything that is happening in our world today. Which is heartbreakening, saddening just awful. War, famine, weather, government...I could on and on. You already know. All that is taking place now is in Revelations. Every exact thing. So whether you believe or not. Is, in the end, totally up to you. I guess I have trouble understanding. Why the fight? Does that make you "weaker" to believe in that. I really don't understand. That could be way off.

Artficial insemination. I really don't agree with that. For the child's sake. Never knowing who their mother/father is. Their roots. That would kill me. I know a few people who are adopted. Wonderful parent (some not). Always, question their heritage. Their blood. Just an opinion.
Thanks for your post!

Originally posted by Guided

Originally posted by 842amFrom

HaaHaa. That was f-ing funny and so much more realistic. Normal people do not maintain loyalties with someone who supposedly exists, but does not return communication with them for years and years. People need to stop putting god on a pedestal just because he supposedly forced us to be alive. If he was a human walking the earth and he behaved the way "father" behaved in this story, he would be seen as such an unbelievable a-hole.
Honestly, I believe that if I met god (not that I believe in him, but if I met someone with the same personality of the christian god that is portrayed in the bible) I would spit in his f-ing face.

Hi 842amFrom! I am not sure if you read much. There is one book you should read. Just to say that you have read it. That book is The Bible. You don't have to believe anything. All you have to do is read it.

Hi Guided,
I have actually read the entire Bible. I was a "born again" Christian for 20 years of my life. I would never make a statement like I did if it wasn't backed by knowledge of the religion that I was bashing. I have no knowledge of Islam or Hinduism, so I would never say anything bad about those religions. However, having been raised Christian and having a comprehensive knowledge of the Bible and of the doctrines of the Christian church, I feel that I have a special privilege to get to bash Christianity.
Also, if you want to get people interested in what you have to say about Christianity, please do not insult them. Some people may find it insulting to have someone say to them "I'm not sure if you read much". It's just a turn off. People tune out once they've been insulted. They might also feel that if members of the Christian church just want to mock their literacy level (which I myself take pride in and particulary hate to have mocked), why would I flock to become a member?
Not sure who you feel you're being "Guided" by, but Jesus does not guide his followers to mock those that they feel are of lesser value or intellect.
Thanks for opening up this interesting discussion, though! I love religious topics. They always get people fired up.

Hi 842AMFrom! You totally misinterpreted what I said. When I said, "I don't know if you read much". I was totally referring to the fact that maybe (like myself) you don't have the time or possibly the interest. That is all I meant by that. It is taking me forever to read the bible. I want to I just don't have the time. I, in no way meant that in anyother way. I apologize if I offended you. I would never do that. Please accept my apology. I am glad to know that you did read it and formed your totally own opinion.