Why Obama.....WHY?!

Please forgive me if I don't reply to all of your posts, but I have read them all. I have many more people disagreeing with me than I thought I would. And a couple of the posts here don't even deserve a response.

FF, you make a good argument in regards to the freedom of religion practice. That I can see could actually become a debate.

As far as several of the other posts, I still don't think you quite understand what I'm trying to convey. Thank you sos37 for that post, that does explain what I'm trying to get across pretty well, and I think that will also serve as a good response to many of the posts on here.

It is extremely disrespectful and wrong to protest this. I think it's sickening. Should there be boundaries? I think FF has a good point about this, being as a funeral could be considered a religious ceremony. In that aspect, there do have to be SOME kind of boundary so that the protesters don't protest in the crowd of mourning and infringe the mourner's rights, but I think if we start putting 'next to' in the same category, we are starting to go downhill.

Here's a cool video I thought demonstrated this pretty well that someone U2Ued me with:

Go to 6.40 to start watching it for what I'm saying.

I might be a bit old fashion but a funeral ain't the place for a political protest. A funeral is a memorial for a human being regardless of what they may have been in life. The protest should be kept in the proper place.
The ban wouldn't stop anyone from their freedoms, it would just point the protest toward a rightful source. Remember the soldier died for freedom. Protest make the decease look like murderers. Soldier was only part of the life that needs to be honored. Anti-war protest may include the soldier but I think the family ought to be left to believe even that part of the life was a good thing.

So you think shoulder's funerals should be imposed upon by insanel religious nuts like that Shirley woman???

It's not like he said "No more free speech".


I'm not a Obama supporter at all, nor Mccain, nor Clinton- Ron Paul is still in the race whether he's polluted all over the media like the other three candidates or not.

Obama seems like the next best because Clinton and McCain are just horrible...but even then I'd barely say its him. There's nothing he has to offer nor anything he's speaking about that is really concrete and will help this country. I think people are voting for him now because it seems like everyone is. This race is about race vs. sex...its ridiculous that thats how people are voting. The amount of dumb people in the country outweigh the people who have a clue whats going on.

Ask yourself this

You're at a funeral of a family member or a friend who died in Iraq. Hell, maybe you just happen to be in the area of one. You see a group of people shouting things like "They deserved to die" and holding up signs that read "God Hates XXXX".

What would you do?

Would you seriously just stand there and let them do it? Sure, you can argue that it's their right to do so, but the people who are being attacked also have the right to defend themselves and voice their feelings.

You can sit here and say it's wrong for them to be banned from protesting funerals because you've never had it happen to you. If it were to ever happen to your family or a close friend, it will be a whole different story then.

They have no business protesting the funerals of soldiers. They're only doing it to spread their HATE.

I've seen these people protest around where I live. They were targeting children. Trying to use CHILDREN to spread their HATE. These people are sick and I don't see how anyone could say these are people of God. They're far from it.

It's distasteful to protest at an funeral... The soldier is dead, his family is grieving... It's beyond anyone's control. Hopefully there won't be any more wars when Obama is in office.

Originally posted by star in a jar
Hopefully there won't be any more wars when Obama is in office.

*SIGH* I don't understand why people put Obama on such a high pedestal. If that's not what you were getting at in your post, then this won't apply to you, Star. Electing Obama to office WILL NOT put an end to the current wars, WILL NOT prevent wars from starting, WILL NOT lower gas prices, WILL NOT fix the economy (unless he plans on raising taxes through the roof), WILL NOT fix health care, WILL NOT secure our borders!!!

In fact there is every reason to believe that there WILL be another war in the next few years, and no matter who is in office they will have to handle it.

It's going to be Iran. The leader over there believes he was BORN to destroy Israel. He believes it's his calling from God. No matter how many times you sit down to talk with someone like that you aren't going to change their mind unless you convince them YOU are God almighty.

They do not just protest the funerals of soldiers. They have also organized protests at the funerals of murder victims (victims of serial rapists/murders etc...that have no political significance whatsoever).

I just pulled up their (Westboro Baptist Church) website. Sheesh. It must be seen to be believed. It is pretty well designed, which makes it even more bizarre.

www.godhatesfags.com...

I also feel that rights are being taken away, they should have the right to protest any funeral they want! Equally, I should have the right to recipricate. There is a word to describe the right for everyone to do as they please...it's called anarchy. Those big mouthed funeral crashers wouldnt like the "free-for-all" atmosphere if they were on the recieveing end. There is a time and place for everything, a funeral is not either a time or place for loud mouth jackasses!

To answer the question of the O.P.'s comment of "WHY, OBAMA???"

A.) Barack Obama is a liberal. He's like all other liberals. He will say, do, and contradict anything that the "majority" of the people in his immediate area want to hear. Dont take this as a "bash liberals" because it isnt. It is pointing out facts that you cannot deny.

Want proof?

1.) Barack Obama denies any racial prejudice about Rev. Wright when the story about Wrights bigotry and hate speech in the house of the Lord reaches the airwaves.
2.) After a HUGE outcry against Wrights speech (mainly from white people....fittingly) Obama changes course and comes out with his now infamous speech about race, which, if you actually listen to it, is nothing more than youtube rhetoric for a superior black skinned race. In his speech, Barack Obama REFUTES his original comments about Rev. Wright, and this time says I can no more deny Rev Wright than i could my own grandmother. Both of these people have racial frustrations and must express themselves duefully
a.) This would have been an acceptable FIRST answer, but ultimately just refutes his previous answer. Can't call me a liar there, can ya?

3.) After the media starts covering the point i made in part 2a.) Obama comes out and flatout rebukes Rev Wright and kicks him off his political campaign. (What he should have done in the first place) Then, Obama and his black panthers go after Republicans with the race card, and say that McCain should too denounce Pastor Hagee.
a.) McCain made the denouncement with no flip-flopping involved, possibly because he seen what an ass barack obama made of himself by being a stealthy wolf full of lies and deceit and then getting caught.


Barack Obama has one Agenda: Eliminate "white people". I am not saying he wishes to do so through genocide, but i AM saying he wishes to do away with White Culture. White Culture, in the majority, is not racist or angry. Most white people go to work, do their jobs, come home and watch TV. Only lashing out against peoples of other races when they are condemed as racists with no merit and no platform for the hypocrites to stand on.


Want my advice for the presidental campaign this Nov?
Do a write-in vote for President George Bush Sr. or do a write in vote for President Abraham Lincon. Because the 3 choices that the media wants you to vote for are all complete wastes of time, money, and effort.

Obama - Liar. Deceitful. Racist. Flipflopper
Clinton - Liar. Deceitful. Racist. Flipflopper (iraq war). coward.
McCain - Radical Militant. Liar. Deceitful. Flipflopper. Coward


They all share multiple things in common, but not a singel one of them shares out interests in common.

Originally posted by Sonya610
They do not just protest the funerals of soldiers. They have also organized protests at the funerals of murder victims (victims of serial rapists/murders etc...that have no political significance whatsoever).

I just pulled up their (Westboro Baptist Church) website. Sheesh. It must be seen to be believed. It is pretty well designed, which makes it even more bizarre.

www.godhatesfags.com...

I'm not going to visit the site now, but look through their image section. The first time I looked through it, most of their images of people holding signs were of children. A lot of the kids looked no older than 8. It had images of parents holding babies wearing shirts that said the same as their signs. They most likely have changed it all around since then though.

They're sick people. These kids aren't old enough to understand what they're doing and saying. The parents/"church" are forcing this on them. These "people" make me sick.

[edit on 27-5-2008 by nightmare_david]

The best thing that could happen to these protestors is; if one of them died (crosses fingers) then we should be able to show up at their funeral with signs "god killed you for being a disgusting piece of sh-t", hate speech and downright deplorable behavior.

I can guarantee you they would be crying about their rights to a private ceremony. Obama and tthe rest of us are right. There is a time and place for protesting, and a funeral is not it.

reply to post by ybab hsur

Excuse me!! I understand that McCain is a neo-con but he is far from a coward. Thank you!!

reply to post by grover


I have conservative poltical views, which means I would normally vote Republican. However John McCain represents more of the same, and he has shown he is not shy about chipping away at our rights in the name of The Country.

I was going to vote for Obama, regardless of his gun comments. However I just can't get away from this prejudice thing. I DO believe he shares the views of his pastor, and that bothers me. I am a white man living in rural america, and I would have no problem voting in a black President. I was almost there with Obama. But HE has no voting record to speak of. Does he have a real stance, or is he just maneuvering like all the rest? He sure changes his stance in a heartbeat.

As for Hillary, uhhhhhh.....no.

I am going to write in Ron Paul's name if I have to. I will not vote for any of the above, and that is a cryin shame.

So what is a guy to do?

I'm surprised there's anyone left today who still believes politicians work for US.

They don't.


Their job is to lie to you to keep the masses pacified and confused while the real rulers of this world work cleverly to disguise the fact that they are taking increasing levels of power and control over everything in our lives.

It astonishes me that anyone today would find themselves disappointed in the behavior of the political candidate they are hanging their hat on.

These people are pre-chosen as our options by the powers-that-be to give us the illusion that we have choice.

We don't.


The agenda goes through no matter who we vote for, so long as we refuse to recognize the obvious fact that politicians don't run this world... money does.




[edit on 27-5-2008 by ianr5741]

reply to post by Coopdog
Write in Duncan Hunter.

It always worries me when I'm in the majority. It's just not right!

That said, I have to side with what seems to be the majority of this thread. I appreciate the OP's concern for our freedoms of speech and assembly, and even share them to a degree. That said, no 'right' is absolute. Even in the name of political protest, my freedom of speech can only be exercised up to a certain line (defined by laws concerning slander and libel). My right to the free exercise of my religion doesn't extend to human sacrifice. My right to 'keep and bear' is trumped by my employer's demand that no employees carry weapons in the workplace. I could go on, but you get the idea.

The ban of protests at soldiers' funerals isn't so much a curtailment of a right (much as it might seem like one) as a balancing of the rights of multiple parties (the real function of law, when you get down to basics). Party A has a right to protest. Party B has a right to mourn or grieve for their fallen family member (soldier or civilian). If Party A interferes with Party B (or vice-versa), the law has to step in and referee. Since funerals are pretty much fixed in place, the only logical solution is to ask (or, if necessary, compel) the protesters to move away.

Assuming his ban would work like some already in place, it's worth noting that they aren't being forbidden to speak their piece...just not *here*. They can go a mile or so down the road and scream, wave signs, and act like escapees from Bedlam to their heart's content...they just can't do so at the graveside.

This is just one more example of what one of my professors called "Newton's Law of Rights"..."For every Right, there is an equal and balancing Responsibility". If you exercise your right to speak, you have the responsibility to do so in as polite and eloquent a way as possible. If you exercise your right to keep and bear arms, you have a responsibility to handle your weapon with regard for the safety of bystanders...again, you get the idea.

Holy smokes, I can be long-winded.

I'm surprised there aren't more Nader supporters. So many people seem unhappy with Clinton and Obama and Nader seems to be behind what so many Americans want; single-payer health care, return of the constitution, end of the war, end of corporate control of the government, etc.

What I don't like about Obama is that he seems to be going right on a lot of issues. He used to be considered pro-Palestinian but after pressure from the Israeli lobby has backed off considerably. A year ago he supported ending the embargo on Cuba but now says he'll only meet with Castro under some unlikely conditions like Castro agreeing to meet with Cuban exiles. He's certainly a lot more pro-war than he used to be as well, talking about attacking Pakistan if need be. And what happened to his plan for universal health care? He now favours a plan happily supported by the insurance and drug companies. What is the "change" he talks about, exactly?

As for prohibiting protests next to funerals, has someone actually done something so cruel? I'd be in favour of that as well. There are other laws as well prohibiting protests in certain places.

Greg


[edit on 27-5-2008 by ghofer]

reply to post by bigbert81

You won't find many people more rights oriented/liberal than me. And, 20 years ago I may have agreed with you. But, after dealing with the pro-life issue in the 90's (I'm pro-choice and defended clinics), I came to some conclusions. I am totally for protesting and am still dismayed as to why people aren't rioting in the streets in this country. However, I think it's wrong (maybe shouldn't be illegal) to protest against individuals- people should only protest against institutions, businessees, organizations, etc. If people have a problem with an individual, they should attempt to talk to that individual. They should not interfere with their personal right to privacy. Pro-life protesters should protest the legal system and other large institutions- not interfere with an individuals right to privacy. With regards to funerals- protesting them is sick and misguided. They have a right to privacy that trumps your right to protest. I could go on.............

reply to post by bigbert81


I watched the video..point made. I do understand what you are saying but also understand why Obama would have thrown this possibilty at us. Pandering...maybe, but I took it as a sign of his respect for those that had sacrificed so much. I doubt however that it would go anywhere other than to bring about a public discussion. It is possible that bannishing the Phelps family would not be needed. I recall the protection given by college students during Mathew Sheppards funeral.

Ok,I did my best to read all posts before replying,but was getting really antsy.
First off,I do not endorse Obama,nor do I even like him.And although he is probably just saying that to get support from people who agree,I have to applaud him for saying it.
I will add to the list of sayings that "free speech" would not get you out of. "I have a bomb" "I'm going to kill you"...or try this,in front of government officials say something that slightly implies that you may do harm to the president.See how your free speech argument helps you there.
If they have the right to protest at a funeral,then the family should have the right to kick their asses,which is exactly what would happen at my family members funeral.I have sevedral close friends who have served in Iraq & Afghanistan and some that are still serving.It would be a slap in their face if something happened to one of them and we allowed protesters to do that.I would take whatever charge given and take it to trial.
I am very much behind Ron Paul and his fight to protect the constitution but think that protesting at a funeral should at the very least get you cited for disturbing the peace.It is sick and very disrespectful.
And that goes for any funeral...soldier,homosexual,murderer,rapist.You might be attacking the deceased,but in most cases the family is inoccent and trying to lay to rest a loved one.Funerals should be deemed sacred.