This just shows the ignorance of the American people

Originally posted by THENEO
No offense but the idea of a drug is a substance imbibed, that causes one to have altered reality. Cigarettes do this mildly in the best of cases. Alcohol is different but it is a depressant and relaxant and that may be part of the reason that it is seen differently by the establishment.

I personally am not against weed but I know that many people would let it control their lives much like alcohol does for many people.

Most arguments stem from drugs being addictive...tobacco (nicotine) is physically addictive, and much harder to "quit" than weed, as it has already been proven that marijuana is not physically addictive..it is the same as someone who really likes pizza and eats it all the time, psychologically "addicted" to it, and has detrimental effects as well.

Well there is always one good question to ask in these cases:

where does it end? what is too much violence?
what is too much freedom?
when does one take too much mind altering substances?

I agree that the goal of life is to allow people to make their own decisions so that they can grow. That is the idea as I see it.

A lot of the people that fight the hardest for drug legalization are those that I believe are the least able to control their usage of the substances.

Well, I don't know about Detroit, but it certainly isn't very bad here.

Originally posted by THENEO

what is too much freedom?

i just picked that one out because it is definatly different form the others in that there is not such thing freedom is freedom and it explains itself. The others come along with the penalties of those who broke the rules. Freedom may not be rationed

Bush seems to be doing a good job making sure we don't get too much freedom...

Originally posted by EliteXizer
Bush seems to be doing a good job making sure we don't get too much freedom...

always a good sign for what in store in the future. if you wanna see a good shot at bushs' "freedoms" you should read this man: www.adambragg.com...

Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid
uh... do you have even the slightest idea of how bad the drug problem in america's school is today? i live in detroit, and went to school in detroit. there's almost no escaping it. somehow i managed though.

You can't judge the entire country off one school. If you could, it still wouldn't justify the forced testing of every student in public schools, or most of the other B.S. they plan on doing. It especially doesn't justify giving up basic rights to the powers of government.

It shouldn't be any suprise that drugs are a part of society or found within the young generations either. Today's answer for everything is medication. Prozac is being given to kids like candy from every doctor from coast to coast. 'Legal' drugs in one form or another are the answer to everything in today's world, from 7 to 70, whatever is needed to solve a problem comes from one pill or another.

Not a bad site you got there.

Originally posted by samfashow

Originally posted by THENEO

what is too much freedom?

i just picked that one out because it is definatly different form the others in that there is not such thing freedom is freedom and it explains itself. The others come along with the penalties of those who broke the rules. Freedom may not be rationed

good question actually. what is too much freedom? depends on who you talk to I guess. I think it is when it threatens the very fabric of the social order. I also think that to a degree the majority have to win out over most of the minorities.

Too much freedom would obviously be when it hurts other people or causes a LOT of trouble... so much so it hurts the country.

However, we do not have near enough freedom to do this.

I must only say: "Thank God...ehhh, I mean my parents for letting me be born in Holland."

[Edited on 1-3-2004 by Hoaks]

The common reason for less freedoms, according to our government, is a need for increased national security...basically you have to have a good balance between freedom/happiness, and the security of the people. For me, drug legalization seems to fall into the same category as gun control (or similar), where the people who abuse these will always obtain them illegally to begin with, so why keep responsible users away because of a few people who screw up...I guess our society is just to the point where we have to have built-in stupidity clauses for everything, keeping dumb people from making their own mistakes. I think it goes much deeper than just a drug problem.

Originally posted by EliteXizer
Too much freedom would obviously be when it hurts other people or causes a LOT of trouble... so much so it hurts the country.

However, we do not have near enough freedom to do this.

I have to agree but the people who abuse their freedom and harm of other's freedom would be punished therefor creating a free society.

thanx, it is a good site the guy is running for office in my area

I don't even get why anyone likes drugs.

They aren't THAT good. All the harm they do to you just doesn't seem worth it to me...

But eh. Teenagers do lots of stupid things.

IMHO

To say that all the individuals of a particular region are idiots is in itself ignorant. I would agree that approx. 95% of Americans are idiots, but I also think that 95% of all humans are idiots. People don't really think anymore because they do not see the need too (push the button, change the station). Of all the people that I have ever known, I could honestly say that only a handful did not display some sort of moronisy (sp?) more often then not. It, of course, also depends on what you call an idiot. The accumulation of knowledge is not a shield against stupidity; that's just stockpiling facts. Wisdom is what is needed to use that knowledge creatively and in new ways; that is what I believe is the division line for those considered above and beyond.

Originally posted by EliteXizer
Look at this poll... the American people are displaying their true stupidity here. They are okay with freedoms and rights being taken away by Bush.
pub.alxnet.com...

This is a poll my newspaper is holding (www.cnjonline.com). Look at the results.
Keep in mind I proxy voted about 5 votes for "No".

What a bunch of dumbasses.

So true.

1) Correct, the whole country should not be judged based on one school.

2) Correct, many schools both rural and urban have major drug and violence problems.

3) Parental consent should be required and encouraged before doing any sort of drug testing.

4) If you blame drug testing issues and other problems in school on Bush you are either not old enough to have a good knowledge of the problem or you're too caught up in "other issues" to be giving this it's due attention.

Let me elaborate on point 4. I think we all have to admit that schools in America are at a disgraceful level. Teachers walk into schools in some cities fearing for their lives because there are 12 year olds... yes 12 year old kids bringing guns and knives into school. Now, if I was a teacher would I tell a 12 year old that he's getting an F in my class knowing that he has a gun? Hell no.

The fact that some schools have had to install metal detectors is sad and scary. The fact that some schools and school districts have had to resort to testing elementary and high school students for drugs is also sad and scary. None of this should be necessary.

See, those of you who are complaining about violations of rights in conducting searches are missing the point. Your problems are not important. What's important is the following question: Why is this necessary???

There should not be drugs, and guns, and gang activities going on in school. We have a country with a fairly unstable economy and employment levels that could be better. School is supposed to be the place where PARENTS WANT THEIR KIDS TO GO to get ahead of the competition and make a good life. I don't know about you but my parents' goal was always for me to be able to do what I wanted to do, and do it well. School is supposed to be where you get the tools to do that. Instead we have parents complaining that the school took away their 15 year old's 9mm and crack pipe in an "illegal search".

If parents and "activists" stopped being petty and understood the war zone schools are turning into, and understood what schools are SUPPOSED to be, I don't think any of this would be a problem.


By the way, to the starter of the post, I don't think this shows the "ignorance of the american people" and I think that by taking an issue that is as deep and troubling as this and stating it in that sense you are not giving it the thought that it deserves. Try to view this from the standpoint of someone other than a kid yelling "those bastards went through my locker", because the fact remains drugs are illegal in this country and especially should not be brought into a place of learning. Try to view this from the standpoint of people who might understand a little better than you the importance of kids getting an education instead of practicing to be in the next MTV video about shooting cops and snorting coke.

[Edited on 3-1-2004 by Djarums]

Well I guess in my town there's not much of a problem. I live in a place with 35,000 - 40,000 people.

Seeing that you're from New York City, that is an understandable post. Here no one ever brings a gun to school, maybe a knife. I'm 13, so I know firsthand. In high school it may be worse - I'll see next year.

I think there is a big difference between catching some student with a bag of weed in their locker and catching someone with a loaded gun...in some cases it is related, but usually not as much as you would think. Let's assume there is drug testing..if you fail what would happen? The student would most likely have to go to some kind of rehab program outside of school, and have to face more drug tests in the future. This usually doesn't help anyway. And we especially can't just test random kids for drugs...but as I said I think the problem is more complex than drugs.

...Peculiar.

I know I wouldn't feel safe if I knew kids were bringing guns to school. For some reason I doubt many are - those who do are very few.