If Religion was somehow discredited...

What would happen to the world, if somehow religion was completely discredited, and proven not to be true? Would we break out into mas chaos, and eventually wipe each other off the earth?

Well first off, your cant disprove somethign that doesn't exist (IE a sumpreme being) but I am not going to be drawn into that, people can believe what they want, I'm just an atheist.

No it wouldn't in your hypothetical situation. I have no more urge to kill than a religous person. You have very little faith in human nature.

It will never happen, even if Jesus was prove to be a fake for sure, it will not matter a bit, people follow Christianity because their faith and faith is not something you can take away overnight.

Originally posted by lostineuphoria
What would happen to the world, if somehow religion was completely discredited, and proven not to be true?

You can't prove a negative. You can't prove "God doesn't exist." People hold religious beliefs in spite of reason, not because of it. So I don't see "religion" being discredited anytime soon.

reply to post by lostineuphoria


If religion was discredited, I think people would just find something else to worship. They do already anyway. Money is worshipped more than any religion. Every organized religions counts on it's members money to survive.

If money was discredited, then I could see mass chaos!

Religion HAS been totally proven to be fake, but still the masses that were bred to believe will not stop believeing; the whole culture around religon has been fabricated to keep people within a tight little square of belief in stead of in reality. Thats why all the rituals and rites are there. Thats why peole are being fed lies (and easily disproven lies, at that) about their guilt and culpability.
Thats why the doctrine of original sin is there, and scripture is always interpreted by prests, who disallow you to form your own opinion about the books they want to have you 'study'. Religion is a construct to make people believe in their unworthyness, so the priest-caste and the elite can have their way, without being bothered by the people they usurp. The people will be busy trying to figure out how to be good, as the rules are totally contracictory, just like the stories in the bible or the quran, or whatever 'holy book' they use to oppress people.
In my opinion, the only valid religion is the religion of indigenous people; they believe that all living things are connected and respect them.
Unlike the current religions, who try and suppress everybody who wishes to live in balance with nature...
Thats what you get when you give men in dresses power eh?

Well religion (not spiritualism) is largely discredited.
More and more people are becoming disillusioned with Churches and etc.

BUT. The existence of a Prime Mover/Higher Power/Gawd has hardly been disproven as more than a few of you seem to think, getting your beliefs mixed up with facts if you ask me, like any other "religious" person. Unless of course you could go ahead and lay the irrefutable proof on me right now in such a way I could in no way poke holes, and trust me I am very good at poking holes.

It IS impossible to prove the lack of the existence of such a being you are correct.

But ALSO it is impossible to irrefutably prove the existence of such a being especially if I am right and such proof would be counter productive as to why we are here in the first place I would go into this deeper but very soon I will be launching my own thread on this subject.
I know I have heard the rant about magical cupcakes that don't want to be eaten gobbledegook. (more food metaphors ugh)

Either way. Just my 2 cents.

Originally posted by WraothAscendant


It IS impossible to prove the lack of the existence of such a being you are correct.

B

Yeah, of course, just as it is impossible to disprove the existence of faeries and goblins and Jinns, for that matter.
Just as it is impossible to disprove the idea that our universe is an atom in some giant being's fingernail. Or that an atom in our fingernail is a tiny universe...
I think it is even impossible to prove if I have made the universe...or YOU...
Granted, there are no books stating that either YOU or I have created the universe...but dammit, they can still be written.
I think its safer to assume that all these things have validity IN THEIR CORRECT CONTEXT..
Even most scientific theories can not be totally proven or disproven. Thats why they remain theories.
Its just idiotic to assume that people who do not believe in a god are by default wrong/sinful. That would mean that god makes sinful creatures and would ofcourse disprove the whole god-superior-being-ineffable-infallible thing. But of course as I said, the bible is a totally contradictry bunch of stories. Written to mislead vulnerable people.
And as I think, it has been written by exactly the same faction in the world which now tries to enslave the whole world.
Not the same persons, but they represent the same ideologies.

reply to post by dervishmadwhirler


Seems like we agree then.

I did say this after all.

Well religion (not spiritualism) is largely discredited.

Personally, i think a lot of chaos would take place.

Yes, people kill each other EVERY day, but if all religion came out with straight-to-the-facts evidence that proved it fake, a lot of people would just lose it.

No, actually a lot of people wouldnt lose it, but im sure all the people we wished wouldnt, would, i think crime and murder rate would sky rocket. The only thing they would have to worry about is the law, besides that, knowing that nothing happens after death, would just snap inside some people. It would for me. Can someone supply me with a think in here to a good thread with evidence that religion is not real? It would be a good read for me.

reply to post by lostineuphoria


This is an interesting point. If religion was somehow discredited overnight, would people go nuts? Surely the only people it would affect are the followers of the religion(s) in question, and if they did go nuts, surely that means that previously the only reason they didn't go nuts was because their religious texts said it was bad (and not because they know right from wrong).

So, if people go nuts, then the followers were already unethically unhinged beforehand, and if they don't, then it speaks for their character.

Originally posted by lostineuphoria

Can someone supply me with a think in here to a good thread with evidence that religion is not real? It would be a good read for me.

www.zeitgeistmovie.com...

It's not a read, but a very good movie!

reply to post by lostineuphoria

Religion is a lie, and what's worse the Catholic Church knows it. There is no heaven, no hell, although there is some kind of afterlife. God is not a person, but consciousness. God does not get involved in our lives. There is no Satan.
We all are born with a contract for our soul or life essence to experience certain things. We have lived many times before and we will live many more times.
It is in this contract how and when we die, so no one dies before or how they are supposed to.
If people would wake up and understand that there is something more if we let go of this awful crutch we call religion, they would come to understand that we are here to do the right thing not because if we don't we will be punished, or if we do we will be rewarded, but simply because it is the right things.
Religion is control, the worst control that there is. The religions of the world today will fall by the wayside just as the the worship of treees and animals so many thousands of years ago fell to make way for today's belief's. We are an evoling species, yet our religion still clings to 2000 year old ideas.
Letting go of the old ways of believing will and is the hardest thing you can imagine, there is a lot of fear, because we truly have to be responsible for ourselves.
As much as I wish there was this God watching over us, sadly it just isn't so.

reply to post by superhappy


Perfect video to suggest, star for that, mate!!. I wish I had thought of that, but zeitgeist is filed in my brain under conspiracy...I should cross-reverence it with; religion, prove against...
Zeitgeist is in my opinion a MUST SEE for all who are interested in the truth about religion. Pro-faith, or anti-faith. It will open your eyes to a lot of truths.
But dammit, they are a hard nut to swallow for followers of any religion.
Strange to see so little responses to this thread; I suspect people do not want to burn their fingers with this subject.

Well, for me my faith is based on Christianity that I was raised in.
However, I dont seem to follow mainstream Christianity on many things. I dont even go to church - gasp. With that said. My faith is not based on what others teach me or necessarily what I read. It is based on something that I can not even put into words. It is something inside of me. Something I just feel in my gut and heart. It is something I can live with/by even if I happened to live somewhere, where Im not allowed to practice any type of faith/religion.

I think that is imporant to those who have faith or follow some religion. What happens if the government forbids all religions....will you survive? Can you survivie w/out your Bibles and Sunday church gatherings?

Anyways, that is my take on it all.

Originally posted by WraothAscendant
Unless of course you could go ahead and lay the irrefutable proof on me right now in such a way I could in no way poke holes, and trust me I am very good at poking holes.

My standard argument that disproves the existence of "God" is that there's no need (or way) to disprove something that is essentially undefined and undefinable. The question itself is irrelevant, because we can't agree on the definition of the basic terms.

For most people, God is a given. It's something that is thought of as understood with common sense, and doesn't need to be defined. People will tell you they believe in God, but when you ask them just what they believe in, they're befuddled. When you try to pin the concept down, it's unpinnable. I have yet to encounter a definition of God that is not inherently paradoxical, and therefore useless for debate.

But, as I said, that's typical of religion. People firmly believing in stuff they can't even define, with no basis for proof. How much more discredited can it be? And yet, people still cling to it.

Did McDonald's create the hamburger or did the hamburger create McDonald's?

God and religion have nothing to do with each other. There are countless religions that will provide you with whatever belief system you are silly enough to get into, it does not alter "God" at all.

The end of religion would be fantastic because "God" would be back in the hands, hearts and minds of the people and not the puppet of some "righteous" hole with control issues.

Brainwashing someone with negative reinforcement (you're going to 'hell' for not believing this), rituals(singing, confessing, scheduled prayer, rosary beads, etc.) and inducing paraschizophrenic behavior (did god see that? drowning your children before they turn 'bad'...) all for a small donation is not what I call "love".

Tell whoever is standing with their back to "God" to quit preaching, turn around and experience "God" for themselves. "God" should have no problem giving them insight as long as they are not trying to listen for voices in their head.

Originally posted by Nohup
My standard argument that disproves the existence of "God" is that there's no need (or way) to disprove something that is essentially undefined and undefinable. The question itself is irrelevant, because we can't agree on the definition of the basic terms.

Then I guess we can throw out Reality as well since it's essentially undefinable.

So then if there is no religion, does that mean Karma is true? What happens when you kill someone for un just means?

Originally posted by lostineuphoria
So then if there is no religion, does that mean Karma is true? What happens when you kill someone for un just means?

Religion is not a single thing. It is a body of behaviour unified by our failure to find a simple rational explanation for it when seen from the perspective of the individual.

Here are some of the principal reasons why religion exists:

1. An explanation for what we don’t understand.
2. A psychological reaction to our lives and surroundings.
3. An expression of social needs.
4. A tool of the status quo to keep some people in power and others out.
5. A focus upon supernatural and 'sacred' aspects of our lives.
6. An evolutionary strategy for survival.

Within the context of which your final question is asked and asuming that you were mentally stable - If you were lose faith in your religion and kill somebody unjustly, then that would be a moralistic dilemma for you personally. Unable to seek forgiveness for the sin from your God, you would feel the entire burden of your guilt, remorse and regret.



[edit on 17/4/08 by Myrdyn]