Just how many satellites are up there?

My entire interest in UFOs started last summer on a family trip to Cape Breton Nova Scotia. While staying at a resort on the Cabot Trail I was up late laying on the patio watching the stars when I saw what James Gilliland refers to as "power ups". At first it appeared to me as a regular satellite moving across the sky when it blew up as brighter than the moon and about half its size. It lasted what seemed like forever but in actuality it was a mere 2 or 3 seconds. It returned to its original size and continued across the sky until it faded out of sight. Thats where my search began.

When I returned home I started to research what could possibly do that. I learned about iridium flares but they didnt fit the bill because they appear cross shaped and are not nearly as bright. No planes have lights that bright. A meteor would have burnt out and not continued on .. and so on and so on.

In August of last year I decided to spend a few warm evenings under the stars in my back yard to see if I could spot anything like that again. To my surprise on the first night I saw an abundance of what I thought were satellites. Just how many satellites are up there? I found the Heavens Above website which told me that I should only be seeing 3 naked eye satellites in the run of a night about my location. So ok.... I decided to count how many I saw the next night.

63 .. yes .. you heard right sixty three!!!

Well ... Im sure there are some military ones that arent on the list so lets double the amount or maybe even triple the amount of naked eye ones, that still doesnt account for that many. I checked with the local airport to see what the regular flight paths are for my area and found that there are 2 major paths that are traveled and both are west to east and quite low on the horizon from my perspective. Besides .... Its pretty easy to tell a plane by the flashing lights.

For 3 weeks last summer the nightly numbers ranged from 10 to 60 or better. I saw "power ups" and ones that blink, ones that "swim", some make sharp turns, some appear from nowhere, some that disappear suddenly, some traveling in pairs and on one occasion I saw 5 going together. I dont know of any satellites or planes that do those kind of things. Then in early September everything just died off. I still saw 2 or 3 or 5 a night but nothing like in August.

Here in New Brunswick its gets pretty cold in the winter so I didnt spend much time over the winter watching the skies but the nights that I did I still was only seeing a few. So over the winter I researched ufos and found websites like this one. I was even lucky enough to bump into Stanton Friedman at a local coffee shop (he lives here) and had a brief conversation with him about local sightings. I was surprised to learn that although many many are not reported there is a surprising amount of sightings here.

Jump to the present...

I watched a show on the History channel last night about a hypothetical situation where all humans disappear from earth. On the show they estimated 25,000 satellites and space debris will crash to earth within 90 days without human intervention. Incidently, in about 10 days most of the worlds nuclear plants meltdown.

Every morning a friend of mine who is a scientist comes to my office for a smoke and we stand outside for a while and chit chat. Being a scientist he is very skeptical by nature and doesnt believe in ufos. As we were chatting 3 days ago, just above his head at about a 80 degree angle and about a mile in the distance I saw a black flash. I thought my eyes had played a trick on me or something so I rubbed my eyes and never mentioned a thing but as the conversation went on we had kind of switched positions and he suddenly grabs his ballcap off his head and look at it with a puzzled look. I asked him what was wrong and he said. "Well at first I thought I had something hanging off the brim of my hat but I think I just saw something big and black in the sky." I laughed and told him about what I had just saw and we were both really confused. He went on his way shortly after and I went back to work. At lunch when going out to my car I looked up in the same direction and suddenly it appeared again. A BIG BLACK SQUARE turned sideways so it looked like a diamond. It was as though someone had turned on a switch. I just appeared and disappeared within a second. Very strange indeed.

Needless to say this sparked my interest again for watching the skies so over the past few days I have been spending about an hour each night watching above. Monday night I saw 37 flybys with some flashers and "power ups". Tuesday night only about 17 and then tonight I saw 27. Tonight was amazing! I saw a "power up" so bright that it was directly behind me and it made me turn around when it lit up. I saw 3 going together and the 3rd one in the group was moving side to side as it went. One just appeared directly above me, flared up but stayed stationary for 2 or 3 seconds then started moving.

Now until something comes down really low and I see an actual disk I will still remain somewhat skeptical but come on... I only wish I had a video camera to record these.

If anyone out there lives near or in Eastern Canada I suggest you watch the night skies closely. In the meantime I will continue my search for the truth.

this should help. there are alot .. alot of satellites up there. and alot of other
junk floating and falling all around the earth. And there are just one ones that
we know about and the ones they tell us.

NASA Sat Tracker

Go to rense.com. Look up the fantastical critters up there 1 of 11 postings. Then get back to me. Organical/mechanical unbelievable sh up there.
Ours? theres? Who knows.

As this is short, I will paste it entirely.

There have been about 4000 launches (some with multiple payloads) and my guess is that several hundred of the satellites involved are still active. Nine individual countries have launched satellites (USA, Russia, Japan, China, France, India, Israel, Australia, UK) as well as international consortia (ESA, the European Space Agency, being the most important of those). A large number of countries have enough money and could easily acquire the technology to launch satellites, but choose for economy and convenience to either have another country launch their payloads or to participate in the space projects of other nations.

Here's the source: NASA

25 thousand, hmm? I believe that includes most debris bigger than a tennisball.

There are a lot of satellites for basic weather and climate data, and then there are lots of communication satellites. Also included are some 36 (or something similar?) GPS satellites, and EU is launching its own positioning system up there.

There really aren't that many of those around, but you do see many of them in a single night if you live in a location that is near their orbits.

Not included are military ones but there aren't thousand of those, either.

[edit on 3/4/08 by rawsom]

[edit: code tags to ex tags]

[edit on 3-4-2008 by 12m8keall2c]

I have always figured there were a lot more up there than I first suspected and that would pretty much account for any of those ones that are just a constant light moving in a straight direction across the sky but how do we account for those crazy ones that flair up and blink, suddenly appear and disappear and the ones that travel in groups or make turns?

The black thing I saw in the sky the other day was by far the most unusual thing I have ever seen. If it had a texture to it and not a flat black surface I would have said "THE BORG ARE HERE" lol

I really would like to find a good video camera so I can document the things I am seeing but I dont want to spend a fortune to document what my wife calls an "over active optical nerve" lol

Originally posted by Tybrus
At first it appeared to me as a regular satellite moving across the sky when it blew up as brighter than the moon and about half its size. It lasted what seemed like forever but in actuality it was a mere 2 or 3 seconds. It returned to its original size and continued across the sky until it faded out of sight.


...

I saw "power ups" and ones that blink, ones that "swim", some make sharp turns, some appear from nowhere, some that disappear suddenly, some traveling in pairs...

Just wanted to let you know that I had the same sightings as you did last summer, and the activity was most hectic in august. I was especcially puzzled the one I saw that suddenly blew up very bright and became much bigger. Perhaps we actually saw the same one? And I still can find no explanation for the ones that seemed to "swim" and the ones that seemed to travel in pairs.

Best regards, Ziggystar60.

[edit on 3-4-2008 by ziggystar60]

Originally posted by Tybrus
Every morning a friend of mine who is a scientist comes to my office for a smoke and we stand outside for a while and chit chat. Being a scientist he is very skeptical by nature and doesnt believe in ufos. As we were chatting 3 days ago, just above his head at about a 80 degree angle and about a mile in the distance I saw a black flash. I thought my eyes had played a trick on me or something so I rubbed my eyes and never mentioned a thing but as the conversation went on we had kind of switched positions and he suddenly grabs his ballcap off his head and look at it with a puzzled look. I asked him what was wrong and he said. "Well at first I thought I had something hanging off the brim of my hat but I think I just saw something big and black in the sky." I laughed and told him about what I had just saw and we were both really confused. He went on his way shortly after and I went back to work. At lunch when going out to my car I looked up in the same direction and suddenly it appeared again. A BIG BLACK SQUARE turned sideways so it looked like a diamond. It was as though someone had turned on a switch. I just appeared and disappeared within a second. Very strange indeed.

Needless to say this sparked my interest again for watching the skies so over the past few days I have been spending about an hour each night watching above. Monday night I saw 37 flybys with some flashers and "power ups". Tuesday night only about 17 and then tonight I saw 27. Tonight was amazing! I saw a "power up" so bright that it was directly behind me and it made me turn around when it lit up. I saw 3 going together and the 3rd one in the group was moving side to side as it went. One just appeared directly above me, flared up but stayed stationary for 2 or 3 seconds then started moving.

Now until something comes down really low and I see an actual disk I will still remain somewhat skeptical but come on... I only wish I had a video camera to record these.

If anyone out there lives near or in Eastern Canada I suggest you watch the night skies closely. In the meantime I will continue my search for the truth.

dude,don't you own a camera? If that was me,by the second night of weird stuff happening,I'd be out there filming!!

Just to answer the question asked in the thread title this image may give an idea of just how many objects there are in orbit around Earth.

View of LEO Satellites (green) and Debris Ring (red) from Chinese ASAT Test

Source


[edit on 3-4-2008 by sherpa]

to the OP,

can you confirm the time of the black object sighting please ??

was it complete still ??

thanks

snoopyuk

Originally posted by Tybrus
I learned about iridium flares but they didnt fit the bill because they appear cross shaped and are not nearly as bright.

I don't know where you heard this, but it's not true! What you described seeing sounds exactly like a bright Iridium flare to me. Check for -7/-8 mag. flare predictions on heavens above, and then see for yourself.

Originally posted by Tybrus
A meteor would have burnt out and not continued on .. and so on and so on.

Again, not true. Some will flare and continue on at a lesser brightness, though it's fairly rare. Also a meteor will usually travel much faster, so you can usually tell that it is a meteor with a high degree of certainty. You should already have a good feel for this having observed so many satellites.

Originally posted by Tybrus
some appear from nowhere, some that disappear suddenly,

That's because they travel in and out of Earth's shadow. To see a satellite it has to be in the sunlight, which reflects off it, and allows you to see it.

Originally posted by Tybrus
some traveling in pairs and on one occasion I saw 5 going together.

Yes - there are military and civilian satellite formations in orbit up there. These are well known in the satellite observing community, and there are people who track them, though as far as I'm aware they no longer publish their data on the net by agreement so as not to help "enemies of the state".

I have only seen a 3 satellite formation so far, so I know from personal experience that they do exist.

Originally posted by Tybrus
Then in early September everything just died off. I still saw 2 or 3 or 5 a night but nothing like in August.

Quite normal... during Summer time, the sun never sinks very low below the horizon, so you can see satellites most of the night due to the sun angle being conducive to observing satellites. As you get into Autumn/Winter, the sun sinks much lower down below the horizon, so you only see satellites for a short time after sun set and before sunrise.

To respond about the black object in the sky ... we first saw it at 10:30am AST and then I saw it again at 12:15pm AST and yes it was still

Thanks CHUD for the useful information.

I initally learned about the flairs from the Heavens above site but found pictures of them elsewhere and most seemed to have a cross like look to them, not at all what I was seeing. I saw a small light increase in intensity and size by about 700%

Kinda like this

www.youtube.com...

That's because they travel in and out of Earth's shadow. To see a satellite it has to be in the sunlight, which reflects off it, and allows you to see it.

that being said if there is more than one traveling along the same line they should appear and disappear in the same general area .. they dont. Sometimes they do it directly above me and in lots of other areas.

I would think that it would stand to reason that I should see the same lights in the same place night after night if they are satellites ... the flight paths always change though. For example .. Monday ... nearly all were going north to south. Last night it was the other way around.

You are right about not confusing them with meteors ... those suckers are real fast... and each summer there seems to be more and more of them. Last years meteor showers were some of the best Ive ever seen.

So, this source of yours does say something different about the amount of orbiting satellites. Here's a quote:

"As of 2008 January 22, an analysis of the current SATCAT shows there are 3,231 payloads in Earth orbit or beyond (see SATCAT Boxscore for details). Of those, we have orbital data for 2,864 payloads in Earth orbit. Of the missing 367 objects, some are in deep-space orbits around the Sun or other planets and some are not released by the US government, for whatever reasons"

Why is it that I get the feeling on this thread that people for some reason believe this number to be a lot, lot bigger than this? Sure it looks like such a number by just looking at the picture, but that is misleading. Those dots over there would not even be visible if actual size was used.

Of course there are real dangers of collision out there, especially with debris. But colliding satellites are not that big of an issue, because those can be sent there with calculated orbits. There's a lot of space out there, infinite actually, and its just a question of what happens when a satellite runs out of fuel. That's when some collisions are even possible to occur.

Most problems with not having space for new satellites is just precautionary values for safe distance, altitude and that sort of thing. This also mainly concers orbits that most would like to use, those with the best fuel efficiency. There is a crowd over there, but they could just as well lower the safe distance a bit or send more fuel with a satellite. Its just that it costs more to operate those thing, then.

Oh, and of those 3,231 not all are operational anymore. Satellites do have a lifetime as well.

I have seen these passing pulsating dots on the sky as well. I don't know what they are, but I suspect they are either airplanes with their driving lights on (those are, of course, always on) or some sort of satellites that pulsate. I can see them almost every night, at roughly the same time.

Why would a satellite pulsate is beyond me, though. Its just some greyish white light, but a bit brighter than stars on average are. I only bother to occasionally look at them when I happen to go for a cigarette on my balcony, at roughly 1am - 2am.

I would not give any space for any view that states these to be ET UFO's, though, as this has been going on for a long, long time. Amateur astronomers and satellite hunters would have taken notice by now. They haven't, and US goverment has not hired all those 100,000 amateur astronomers for their cause. It just isn't plausible, possible or even realistic.

reply to post by Tybrus


thanks for the swift reply Tybrus,
it sounds very similar to another sighting in Quebec, i will email my friend who saw it and ask her for more details.

thanks

snoopyuk

I'm propably too tired to write. I didn't even notice that people were talking about objects that are still at some point of sighting duration.

What I have seen for some reason always go to same direction, I believe its close to magnetic south-north, but I am not 100% certain.

Originally posted by Tybrus
I initally learned about the flairs from the Heavens above site but found pictures of them elsewhere and most seemed to have a cross like look to them, not at all what I was seeing. I saw a small light increase in intensity and size by about 700%

Kinda like this

www.youtube.com...

I think you are seeing "diffraction spikes" which are artificial lens artifacts - here is a good example:



Keep in mind that most photos are long exposures, so they show the cumulative trail left by the flare.

Lots of good examples here.

Originally posted by Tybrus
that being said if there is more than one traveling along the same line they should appear and disappear in the same general area .. they dont. Sometimes they do it directly above me and in lots of other areas.

That is probably because they are at different heights.

Originally posted by Tybrus
I would think that it would stand to reason that I should see the same lights in the same place night after night if they are satellites ... the flight paths always change though. For example .. Monday ... nearly all were going north to south. Last night it was the other way around.

It's luck of the draw.

Originally posted by Tybrus
You are right about not confusing them with meteors ... those suckers are real fast... and each summer there seems to be more and more of them. Last years meteor showers were some of the best Ive ever seen.

Slower meteors (not seen very often) can be close to satellites traveling at the upper range, so it's not always so easy to tell.

Yes - Last year was an unexpectedly good all round year for meteors!

I've seen three, traveling in a (fairly straight) line, all stop one after the other to form a triangle formation.

They came to a stop pretty quickly too. I'd imagine it would require a fair amount of deceleration to come to a dead stop that quickly in space?

Sadly, it's been so long since I've had the opportunity to lie beneath the open night sky.

I am in the process now of trying t find a good deal on a digital video camera that does a night setting. Man those suckers are expensive.

The black object my buddy and I saw the other day is still quite a head scratcher. What still sits with me is how it appeared then disappeared in an instant ... but not fading in or out, more like someone flicked a switch. Its kinda hard to explain.

If anything the sky watching is relaxing and if that is all I end up getting from it thats fine.

Does anyone here have some tips for how to video those "satellites"?