Bush to Bypass Laws to Build Fence

Originally posted by kerontehe
reply to post by Mr. Ree

Agreed - for the period of time stated.

Then it failed.

A wall is not the whole answer IMHO. We must also address the multiple issues that motivate them to come here illegally by the millions.

 

Of course for the period of time. It remained there until the region's political bodies could come to an agreement that would make the wall obsolete - or in this case probably mainly Hungry allowing East Germans to travel through their country to West Germany - which really had nothing to do with the Berlin Wall in and of itself.

The Great wall of China, and Hadrian's Wall also did fairly well for their periods of time, but now they are just history. Even with those two walls, the empires were still attacked. That said, I don't particularly think that the Berlin wall failed. It was effective as much as a fortified wall can be, and it became obsolete after it was no longer needed. Obsolescence dose not necessarily equate to failure. Just because CD's replaced Floppy disks doesn't mean floppy disks are failures, does it?

The Mexican wall will do well for it's time, but it will one day become obsolete, but that hardly means it will be a failure. Nothing lasts forever, and I doubt anyone thinks it is the whole answer. It's merely a physical supplement manifested from current political and immigrational conditions.

reply to post by Mr. Ree
Agreed again.

I think we could take some lessons from why our Northern border, which is just as porous, only presents us with a fraction of the issues.

Originally posted by mattifikation
Wasn't the Berlin Wall also built to keep people "out?"

That's totally ridiculous. Sure the communists may have said that as some sort of propaganda ploy, but even the most simple-minded now understand that the wall was to keep their people from escaping to the West and a better life.

Still don't get it and want more proof? The east german troops only shot people trying to escape, not people trying to get into east germany. Of course, I'm not sure if anyone ever tried to "escape" to a communist country.

[edit on 4/1/2008 by centurion1211]

Totally agree with bush on this one.....these new complaints are just more reasons to stall...enough is enough 80% of the country wants this done and it needs to get done.

I take it nobody noticed that the word "out" was in quotation marks in my post. I'm well aware that it's real goal was to keep people in, which is the reason for the quotation marks. They said it was for keeping people out, but it wasn't.

At any rate, what I was implying is that this fence is supposedly being built to keep illegal immigrants out. Something about that wall gives me the creeps though. Why now? I've heard stories about illegals pouring over the border literally my entire life. All of a sudden, somebody wants to build a fence and do something about it?

I think there's another motive behind it. That's what I was getting at in my other post. They're building this fence to keep people "out." Supposedly. It's like closing the barn door after letting the cows out...

Funny. Even a cow or sheep recognizes when it is being "Fenced In" but Humans are so much smarter; that is why it has been so easy to out smart this country of urbanites and city dwellers. We are being Fenced In and our problem is not a bunch of illegal aliens who want to mow your lawn, pick your fruit and do the jobs you don't want to do.

All that has been going on is about Control..control of you and me by those who want us as their slaves. Chipped, Fenced in and glad for a crumb of bread is how it will be and frankly, many deserve nothing more.

This is a thread from February that is pretty much echoing our discussion today. I mentioned my concern for oppression and being "walled-in" there as well:

Divided views as US fence goes up



So we're trying to keep "illegal immigrants" out when they do jobs that most Americans don't want to?

There was a recent raise in fines for hiring illegal workers, courtesy of the DHS. It was something like $14,000 per employer per employee. That's some incentive, ain't it?

What about the day workers? I see them lined up every day I'm in town, tens to hundreds of them alone in one spot. Are we going to send every single illegal immigrant back or give them citizenship like Bush wants?

This is not the best way to deal with an immigrant problem. It would be much more effective to educate them, teach them english, and let them stay here. We were all immigrants at one point, arguably even "native" americans. My family came here legally, but that doesn't mean all the irish and english who came here were "legal".

Back in the day there was no border patrol, no Ellis Island to "check-in" with. People came in boats and that was that. No one turned them back.

Who are we to say, "sorry but you have to wait in your country 5 more years and pass all these tests before you're allowed in!" That's bull#.

What happened to compassion?

I guess it doesn't matter much as the DHS are building the fence anyway, despite the law (which they have proven doesn't exist when "national security" is involved).

You know its funny. These people claim they're protecting us from the "bad guys" when it turns out the "bad guys" are more prevalent in our own country, and they're the ones supposedly defending us from the "bad guys."

What a load of #.

Homeland Security Dept. waives laws to finish fence on U.S.-Mexican border

The Homeland Security Department used its legal authority Tuesday to waive environmental and land management laws so it can complete 670 miles of fence along the U.S.-Mexican border.

Who needs laws right? Its not like we pretend to follow the law in this country anymore. Jackasses.

The waivers will allow the department to move ahead with miles of pedestrian- and vehicle-fence construction as well as roads and detection systems.

Homeland Security, under orders from Congress to build the fence, has run into intense opposition along the border from landowners, ranchers and environmentalists. Many didn't want their land taken or for wildlife and rare species to be disturbed.

"Criminal activity at the border does not stop for endless debate or protracted litigation," Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said. "The waivers will enable important security projects to keep moving forward."

The DHS took land from ranchers, the BLM (bureau of land management), Parks Service, and is going to ruin miles of land to build their gestapoesque fence.

Nazi Germany here we come! I get to be the first in the gas chamber, I called it!


Environmental Laws to be waived for fence

The Bush administration will waive more than 30 environmental and land-management laws in order to finish building 470 miles of border fence in the Southwest by the end of the year, officials said yesterday.

The move, permitted under an exemption granted by Congress, will be the most sweeping use of the administration's waiver authority since it started building the fence to curb illegal immigration. It will affect environmentally sensitive areas in California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas.

I really despise the government more and more when they make moves like this.

Keep all of us in, and keep those bad guys out. That'll protect us...

[edit on 4/2/2008 by biggie smalls]

just a quick question

does any one have any pictures of what it looks like now ?
what direction is the barbwire pointing ?

reply to post by Rockpuck


To keep us in. Make no mistake, to build a fence is to keep something from escaping. This summer we attack IRAN. Total anarchy. Dogs of war birth puppies. Cheney is in a permanent orgasm.