Real IRA

Despite the general media's depiction of Northern Ireland being a bed of roses; look beyond the thin veil of Stormont, Gerry Adams and Martin McGuiness fawning over Ian Paisley and you'll see a Northern Ireland still plagued by the problems of old.

Shootings still go on, as do punishment beatings and probably knee cappings. Some thing the Provos crafted into a fine art. There's also this piece :-

The brother of one of the Real IRA's founders has been arrested in Lithuania while allegedly trying to buy arms for the dissident Irish republican terror group. Michael Campbell, 35, was arrested in Vilnius on Tuesday in a "sting" involving the local police, Garda Síochána, Interpol and British security services.

An unnamed Irish woman was detained alongside Campbell as he allegedly tried to negotiate a deal with a police agent who was posing as an international arms dealer.

The arms were said by local police to have been destined for a breakaway Real IRA faction led by Campbell's brother Liam.

Irmantas Mikelionis, deputy head prosecutor at Vilnius, said Campbell had been remanded in custody for three months and the woman for a fortnight.

"They are accused of trying to get arms, munitions, guns and explosive material and they are accused also of being supportive of a terrorist group," the prosecutor said.

It is understood that the duo were placed under police surveillance when they arrived in Lithuania last weekend. As part of the sting, Campbell, from Dundalk, County Louth, was shown an array of firearms by the police agent.

The pair were arrested at around midday on Tuesday after armed detectives raided a garage. They were brought in for questioning and then appeared before a court in the city yesterday.

Guardian Newspaper

Ulster Herald



[edit on 28/3/08 by Flyboy211]

Sure the IRA are still active, but it's all about the drugs and prostitution these days, which in fairness was mostly what it was about in the old days too!

More organised crime than political movement and I think that the British Gov is OK with that in a backhanded kind of a way.

Interesting story

MonKey

Sorry Flyboy but this is all a little like saying that because there are tiny numbers of ludicrous nazi-wannabes posing in front of their bedroom mirrors or around friends houses that we still have a nazi problem.

We don't - not by any serious or credible measure.

The same applies to the so-called dissident republican groups.

They are not (of course) without the potential to create mayhem and injury and even deaths but to imply that little has changed or that our current situation as depicted in the media generally is somehow dishonestly & knowingly inaccurate is patently false.

I don't know of anyone saying the dissidents pose no threat whatsoever but equally it is just to wildly exaggerate their potential to imply they can do very much at all.

It is very well know that not only are they thoroughly penetrated by the security services north & south but that they cannot even rely on their own as they are also pretty much incapable of operating in 'republican areas' without the 'old' IRA knowing about it.

I suppose they could get 'lucky' but that is hardly any basis to say they are a major & serious threat to any of us (and I do not see any chance whatsoever of a repeat of something like 'Bloody Sunday' to act as a huge recruitment aid or generate money & material for them).

(why do you think they regularly get caught out in these kinds of 'stings' when they're trying to do something more serious like this?)

Of course there are still beatings (but sadly the truth is that this has almost nothing to do with 'terrorism' these days and that there are many within both communities who see that kind of thing as a 'proper' response to 'anti-social' behaviour).
I am also aware that we still have occasional shootings - but they too are mainly 'criminal' in nature, not 'political'......and who doesn't expect we weill have this kind of thing for years yet as indicviduals pursue & 'settle' oldscores?

Happily though the numbers show our crime (which is comparitively low compared to the rest of the UK) is on the decline and the numbers of such incidents are minuscule compared to what went before.

I'd far rather our situation as it is now (with Martin, Gerry & Ian all able to talk and do the serious business of putting things right here - a process only the most determinedly impatient would not expect to take many years yet) than anything remotely like that which we had before.

Our crime numbers are actually getting better -
Norther Ireland Crime Stats


[edit on 28-3-2008 by sminkeypinkey]

Sminkey is right and ChiKeyMonKey is right. I remember when at least one person was shot every week on the news, never mind the occasional massive bombing.

Of course there are still beatings (but sadly the truth is that this has almost nothing to do with 'terrorism' these days and that there are many within both communities who see that kind of thing as a 'proper' response to 'anti-social' behaviour).

It is a proper response!!! If they want to hang a crack or heroin dealer by the lamp post, then I'll never testify against it. There are plenty of countries where scum like that get's the death penalty anyway.
Whilst I usually disagree, I take a different view if it's the local community that's doing the punishment, ultimately it's more like self defence, and they need to be provoked enough to find individuals willing to risk imprisonment.
Basically if there's enough police they do good. But if there's not enough police they can do harm by preventing people from tidying up their own area. In such situations the public pays tax for a police force to protect the yobs who burn you're vehicle because "it's nice" (and no doubt a change from the bus station) or the criminals who turn 16 year old girls into helpless prostitutes.

Frankly I find it ironic that organisations that used to bomb the public are now just concerned with protecting it.
Some people are criminal rights activists, but they're usually the ones who have the least experience of it. They'll always be exceptions but in my opinion those who frequently witness unproved trouble have the right to join the local majority in self defence, at least until-if the government can sort it out. And in some places it really is "if" since some areas have been decayed for over 15 years.

Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
Sorry Flyboy but this is all a little like saying that because there are tiny numbers of ludicrous nazi-wannabes posing in front of their bedroom mirrors or around friends houses that we still have a nazi problem.

Facetious remark aside, this has nothing to do with national socialism. One annoying thing is people always referring to terrorists and the like as "fascists" and "nazis" when it isn't appropriate. I think the hardline twats (both loyalist and republican) are utter c**ts however I'm not going to dignify them to the same level as the nazis, who made the IRA, UDF etc look like amateurs. I'm not making light of the troubles in Northern Ireland, which in my opinion were just as bad as what's happening in Afghanistan and Iraq.

We don't - not by any serious or credible measure.

The same applies to the so-called dissident republican groups.

Not exactly, as seen here :-

Orde warns of threat from Real IRA

Northern Ireland faces an imminent threat from a group of disorganised but dangerous dissident republican terrorists, Sir Hugh Orde said today.

After his officers put out a warning last night about an increased terrorist threat from the Real IRA and the Continuity IRA, the PSNI's Chief Constable said that while they appear to be concentrating on mounting attacks in the North, he has no doubt that dissidents will target other parts of the UK if they can.

Irish Times

They have been described as "disorganised", because they haven't seeminly employed a coherent strategy other than shooting the odd police officer and firebombing business premises. The latter having stopped since the spate of firebombing in August 2006. They obviously twigged that harming businesses does little for support from the local communities (or public), many of whom must work in these businesses.

They are not (of course) without the potential to create mayhem and injury and even deaths but to imply that little has changed or that our current situation as depicted in the media generally is somehow dishonestly & knowingly inaccurate is patently false.

I don't know of anyone saying the dissidents pose no threat whatsoever but equally it is just to wildly exaggerate their potential to imply they can do very much at all.

My fault for not elaborating further than despite the general media's depiction of Northern Ireland being a bed of roses; look beyond the thin veil of Stormont, Gerry Adams and Martin McGuiness fawning over Ian Paisley and you'll see a Northern Ireland still plagued by the problems of old.
; whilst the troubles have clearly gone (and it is highly unlikely they ever will return), that doesn't negate the threat of fringe nutters like the RIRA or CIRA. Yes of course the frequency of shootings aren't as high but they still go on, and now RIRA are more determined to step up their attacks. You might laugh that off but the shootings of those police officers are more than coincidence and go beyond 'petty criminalism'.

I believe this article supports both of our views, and describes more eloquently than I. The caveats and potential hazards ahead and that things simply aren't purely "all and well" :-

However these are not, given time, insurmountable hurdles to peace. More worrying is that beneath the shiny new veneer of "post-conflict" Northern Ireland there is an insidious gnawing away at the hope of the past few years because of recent murders. Just last week, the body of 27-year-old Andrew Burns, who had been shot, was found near a village church on the border with the Irish Republic, allegedly the handywork of a dissident republican group. And last March, the bodies of 38-year-old Joe Jones and 36-year-old Edward Burns - a childhood friend of mine - were found in Belfast. Burns had been shot, while Jones was beaten to death.

But it was perhaps the death last year of Paul Quinn in Co Monaghan and that of Robert McCartney in Belfast in 2005 that have resonated most because their families have emerged as unlikely but vociferous campaigners. (Indeed, the McCartneys' campaign took them all the way to the White House.) Both say they want justice for their loved ones - innocent victims of brutal beatings - and the perpetrators convicted. But they are also attempting to use what happened to highlight problems that persist within Northern Ireland.

Catherine McCartney claims that although there is government at Stormont and relative peace on the streets, her brother's death is indicative of a "sick society" that is still a long way from coming to terms with its past. "People really want [peace] to work," McCartney says. "But outside Northern Ireland people only see the bigger political picture. Real people on the ground are still living with it. The threat is still there." We need to be wary, McCartney argues, of "sweeping under the carpet" those events that do not fit in with the "peace agenda".

It has been a long, hard road to get to where Northern Ireland is today, and there is an understandable reluctance to focus on things that might destabilise it. This includes in any way exaggerating the impact of recent murders. This is not, after all, the 70s. Nevertheless, we should be cautious about brushing aside the concerns within communities affected by deaths of people such as Robert McCartney or Paul Quinn. As I was told recently: "People in Northern Ireland have very long memories."

I have been interviewing a lot of people recently who, like myself, lived in the areas worst affected by the Troubles: former paramilitaries and soldiers, people who lost family and friends and who were, to varying degrees, damaged by what they saw and experienced.

What we all share, I realise, is a horror at the prospect - however unlikely it appears - of returning to "the bad old days". Sometimes there is a feeling that we should be grateful for so few deaths compared to the years of the Troubles. This is a misguided impulse. We should be grateful that the worst is over and for the enormous strides made by one-time political foes. But we should only be satisfied when there are no more deaths, no more "punishment" beatings, and no more generations who have the threat of these hanging over them.

Guardian

It is very well know that not only are they thoroughly penetrated by the security services north & south but that they cannot even rely on their own as they are also pretty much incapable of operating in 'republican areas' without the 'old' IRA knowing about it.

I suppose they could get 'lucky' but that is hardly any basis to say they are a major & serious threat to any of us (and I do not see any chance whatsoever of a repeat of something like 'Bloody Sunday' to act as a huge recruitment aid or generate money & material for them).

(why do you think they regularly get caught out in these kinds of 'stings' when they're trying to do something more serious like this?)

Well in recent years the RIRA (and possibly the CIRA) were very much compromised and infiltrated by the security and intelligence services. However over the past three years or so it seems they have reorganised the whole structure. As the leaders put it euphemistically :-

The Real IRA said that, after substantial restructuring, which saw some members in Belfast and elsewhere dismissed and units that "weren't up to scratch" disbanded, it now had "a new confidence".

Sunday Tribune

You can guess what that all means.

As for being lucky, wasn't it PIRA who said :-

You have to be lucky every time, we only have to be lucky once

Which unfortunately is chillingly true.

I can't understand how you can say the RIRA are not a major threat when just recently :-

Return of road blocks by police

Checkpoints back after dissident IRA terror threat

Wednesday, February 06, 2008

By Deborah McAleese

Northern Ireland was back on terror alert today as the PSNI issued a warning of a serious threat from dissident republicans.

Such a high level of threat warning has not been seen here for a number of years. An increased number of police officers were visibly back on the streets after the PSNI said it has stepped up its security operations across the province.

Just days after it was announced that the Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh are due to visit Northern Ireland next month officers have been forced to increase activity on the ground and set up vehicle checkpoints across the province after receiving intelligence that the threat from dissident republicans has intensified.

Belfast Telegraph

Also it would stand to reason that organisations such as MI5 are still keeping a close eye on dissidents and the like (the Lithuanian arms sting was a joint MI5/6-Interpol-Lithuanian Police operation); hence why they've been able to stop them. Why? Because they're a threat surely. Since NORAID can't give aid to RIRA (it's a designated illegal terroist organisation since May, 2001) US supporters/sympathisers can't do anything to help them out without being jailed. Libya has turned more friendly towards the west under Gaddafi. So they have to travel quite a bit to get weapons from eastern Europe and even the Balkans. Now the logistics of that will always make a shopping trip-trek across Europe hazardous and almost impossible to succeed, but they still try. The reason why RIRA were able to get their hands on quite a bit of arms and explosives was due to its former leader and founder, Michael McKevitt being the Quartermaster General for PIRA. So he knew were all the ammo/weapon dumps were (having procured much of it) so he could effectively pilfer them. He also managed to attract quite a few of the experienced 'engineers' (or bomb makers). Because McKevitt and many of the experienced bomb makers were arrested and were slapped with big jail sentences, RIRA got knocked on its arse. However the organisation has continued to attract disaffected and disillusioned republicans and former PIRA members. Not to mention some young members who don't know better.

Of course there are still beatings (but sadly the truth is that this has almost nothing to do with 'terrorism' these days and that there are many within both communities who see that kind of thing as a 'proper' response to 'anti-social' behaviour).

It has nothing to do with 'political terrorism', although it was always thuggery to begin with. Although they still run many areas and they continue to do business as they know best. Well PIRA has decided that after 30 years or so it would pack it all in (as it didn't get very far). This report by Liz MacKean for the BBC Newsnight programme isn't exactly encouraging for the province :-

Newsnight