Parents sue over the sex of their baby.

Originally posted by apc
... it would be her decision too. Women aren't property yah know.

If for whatever reason I am unable to father a child I will adopt. But otherwise my demon spawn having my blood is important to me. Call me old fashioned.

Yes i do understand women ARE NOT property....we as men may be to them..depending on who you ask ...

But I understand that...you will both have ALOT to think about when that day comes...and I am glad to hear you would consider adoption as a resort. I can't blame you for wanting your own little devil....lol...they joy of your own must be unreal....its just a concern to me that many will treat this like lottery tickets...keep trying and throwing them away until you finally get a winner!

Ahh, i see your point now. I totally agree that the more intelligent choice would have been to adopt in this case. Something that far too many people overlook, (even me!)

I really do hope that the child won't just suffer SIDS within a year, and they try again, that would truly be a tragedy, i agree.

reply to post by rcwj75

Enough kids get flushed without so much as morning sickness. Sometimes because the mother's body detected a problem. I don't really see what the difference here would be. As a form of birth control, yeah that would be a bad practice just to get a certain eye color. But the prevention of unnecessary suffering... set suction on high.

reply to post by D.E.M.


I agree with you fully. It's not like the parents said...Gee, we really want a girl and not a boy, cuz we got all these hand-me-downs for a girl.

They were trying to ensure that the child they brought into the world would not suffer.

That it failed is not the issue. The issue is that the ultrasounds must have shown the development. And now a child, doomed to agony, is in this world.

Originally posted by apc
But the prevention of unnecessary suffering... set suction on high.

I understand your opinion...but IMO if you TRULY want to prevent unnecessary pain and suffering on ALL accounts (i.e. the entire family, not just the child) when you KNOW you have a history of something that can kill or destroy...why even try it!

Its like having sex with someone who you know is HIV positive. The condom is the science that could help prevent the exchange of the virus...is it 100% effective..no...does it work...sure most of the time...do some people still end up with HIV even after using a condom, you bet...but guess what, there is an easy way to avoid all the fear, all the problems....NO SEX = NO VIRUS!

Originally posted by rcwj75
reply to post by apc

 

I just would rather see a parentless baby get adopted then fetus after fetus aborted, or child after child suffering because of people "trying" to get the right one.

This is off topic, but you seem to have an issue with abortion. Is this a religious thing? Maybe we should take it U2U?

Originally posted by Amaterasu
That it failed is not the issue. The issue is that the ultrasounds must have shown the development. And now a child, doomed to agony, is in this world.

So by the time the child is far enough along to determine sex...we what.. kill it...because its not a girl? I understand the point your making..that if it is a boy and knowing it will suffer we should kill it and start over....but doesn't that just seem wrong?

reply to post by Amaterasu


No to me its ON TOPIC considering HAD the doctors told the parents they were having a boy, what outcome for that unborn baby do you think would of been chosen?

Maybe I am just branching out to where this type of story will go in the future or has gone many times in the past. But there is NO DOUBT this kind of story ties directly into abortion when it WILL BE a means to develop this kind of alteration.

reply to post by rcwj75

Well... actually the odds approach impossible. Not that great a comparison!

Why try it? Because it's possible. My parents knew the risk with me. Why am I here?

reply to post by apc


Im thinking you were to thickheaded and stubborn to be taken over by the trait.....

NOTE THIS IS A JOKE! NOT AN INSULT....lol

Luckily you are here...and it didn't get you. I just still think its a hell of a chance to take....

Actually, i doubt that by the time the baby had developed a gender they could have aborted. I am not certain of the point of no return, but i am pretty sure that by the time gender is fixed and definable that the period where a standard abortion can be carried out is past.

Thus, they could not have aborted and your fears are groundless.

First of all I believe some of you are wrong. Sex is determined AT fertilization not by the mothers hormones. The male sperm will carry the x or y chromosome to determine the sex. Genitalia doesn't form until about 12 weeks and you can determine sex via ultrasound at 16-18 weeks. I've been through this, I know. So the sex is determined AT fertilization. It's easy for a lab to pull a sperm from the donor with the x or y chromosome so I do believe the lab is FULLY negligent from the very beginning not to mention having two ultrasound before the birth. I'd be so peeved if it was me, considering the illness in the family.

Just wanted to say thank you to the various posters who have replied, for both your various opinions as well as maintaining respect for one another.

I still remain undecided - what worries me is that disability, disease etc will be one day selectively taken out of humanity through a process like this - and while i completely understand a parents desire to make life as easy as possible for their child, i cannot help but wonder what this does to our "human beingness".

Impairment has always caused society discomfort. People with disability have historically been segregated, isolated and, consequently, abused. The inclusion of people with disability in our community remains an ongoing source of struggle for people with disability, their families, friends, and advocates. Our inability to embrace difference has resulted in the othering of people with disability, placing them outside the "paradigm of humanity." A lot of able-bodied members of society seek to keep people with disability out of their own lives and worlds because they represent a threat to the security of their own perceptions of self which are embedded in a culture of perfection and control.

I, for one, do not want to live in a perfect world. From my own experience, it has been the moments which have caused the most upheaval, struggle and pain which have allowed me to grow as a person - and subsequently i see those moments now as a gift.

This is most interesting.

being a bit thick, but a father of four, if the need for a female was so high why didn't they just draw some emboic fluid at 3 months?

1 of ours had that and we knew for afact she was going to be girl. also arent they just continuing the misery if they had a girl?

She will need to ensure she has a girl and then the next and the next.

Pure selfishness on their behalf and just like using a condom not 100% gauranteed.

Classed as act of god and get on with it.

Bloody designer babies.

reply to post by NewWorldOver


In other words, GOd is probably punishing that kid, and his will is not to be thwarted. Right? Better to let someone have some atrocious genetic disorder than piss off the big bearded white guy in the clouds by trying to prevent it.

I personally don't think there should be sort of limitation of choosing your child's looks and whatnot. I can certainly understand other peoples' perspectives on it, though.

Nonetheless, at the very least I think this case is exceptional. Knowing that they could pass on a detrimental trait to a male child, they certainly did the right thing

Wow tough topic. I can understand these parents wanting a healthy child. To each their own. Many, many people will move heaven and earth to get a child, more so a child of their own blood.
My interest is more on the research being done to be able to do this. ivf in ND runs between 15000 to 18000 per cycle. Thats without any other modifications. Many couples have to do multiple cycles befor they are sucessfull. I am sure this couple paid much more than that. Talley that up to a lot of money that could be used for research of the orginal disorder. Are doctors and researches looking for the easy stuff?

reply to post by D.E.M.


im sorry but thats quite frankly not true - my wife is 38 weeks pregnant - and until 3 weeks ago on all the scnas the baby was in awkward positions and so they couldn`t tell if it is a boy or a girl.

so having experieinced this myself - i can say it is perfectly possinle not to know.

my daughter will likely be here before next weekend

There is a technology available for sex selection before an embryo is transferred to the womb. No one can implant an embryo - it will or won't. Implantation is one of the last remaining mysteries of fertility treatments.

As to those going on about adoption. Do you know anything about it? It is extremely expensive and invasive - often more so than multiple IVF treatments - or even a Donor Egg cycle. And I am not just talking about international adoption. Today potential adoptive couples are competing for a much smaller pool of infants of any color (please don't' go on about "white" infants!). There are at least 3 couples for any one infant born according to almost every adoption source available. Please learn something about today's adoption realities before going on about it. Older child adoption is often not a viable solution for first time parents. Social workers who are honest will admit this. Donor gametes is often a much more viable solution - even with a surrogate.

Should they sue? I don't know. The thing is, I have no problem with most reprotech short of creating chimeras. (Zoonotic disease is my main concern with chimeras.) It really is no one else's business. Many IVF clinics do advertise PGD (tech used to determine sex and genetic maladies) as a way to prevent your future child from suffering from disease. I don't know what the actual success rates are on this. I am not up to doing a Medline search right now. Depending on what exactly was promised vs. what has happened, well that all depends. I do have to wonder about the pre-natal care if the sex of the fetus was not known earlier. But, I am one of those people who believes most people in any profession are incompetent. Something about statistical likelihood.

I understand that there is a lot of fear around reprotech for some idiotic reason, but really, most of the time it is just a way to build a family.

ok - i know chuff all about babies

but someone said earlier in the thread that [ paraphrase ]

male ecternal genitalia are visible @ 6 months

yes and ???????????

my friends wife is 7 months preagnant

is abortion etc even possible @ 6 months ??????

lastly - a ` pop psychology ` observation - might it have been a clinical descision to conceal the childs sex from the parents - once the medical staff realised thier IVF filtering had failed ?

if the parents are " so upset " might the psychological impact have had repercussions on the health of the parents ????

or prompted them to do something stupid ???

just my musings YMMV