9/11 What evidence would make you believe in a conspiracy?

originally posted by: wmd_2008
a reply to: loveguy

Well done how about tellings us something we don't know about.

Like what happened to your steel reinforced concrete claim

maybe this happened to the steel

IT'S A MYSTERY

a reply to: douglas5

Okay then you need to explain how all those charges were installed and how all the wiring was run to an external point, with no one noticing.

Also, posting a pic taken at the WTC after the steelworkers had cut those beams to help remove the debris, does not really help your case.

a reply to: douglas5

www.flickr.com...

Yes, they are.

a reply to: douglas5

What's that got to do with the steel reinforced concrete claim

Also lets see now you are claiming a diagonal cut near the column base will make a building collapse high up

That was done during clear up!!!

Ain't it telling a story;

Take traditional building practices and toss them away.

"We need these things to pancake" i assume was somewhere in the initial schematics?

a reply to: cardinalfan0596

Also, posting a pic taken at the WTC after the steelworkers had cut those beams to help remove the debris, does not really help your case.

That's just an assumption made by debunkers. For a start, if you look at the photo you'll see that the column is in the middle of a pile of debris. There's no way they climbed over that just to get to that one column. They would have cleared it first. Secondly there is absolutely no reason for a steelworker to waste so much time and energy making a perfect 45 degree cut. It'd take twice as long and use twice as much gas and would be a very dangerous way to do it. The column would telescope vertically and you wouldn't know where it was going to fall.

originally posted by: Flatcoat
a reply to: cardinalfan0596

Also, posting a pic taken at the WTC after the steelworkers had cut those beams to help remove the debris, does not really help your case.

That's just an assumption made by debunkers. For a start, if you look at the photo you'll see that the column is in the middle of a pile of debris. There's no way they climbed over that just to get to that one column. They would have cleared it first. Secondly there is absolutely no reason for a steelworker to waste so much time and energy making a perfect 45 degree cut. It'd take twice as long and use twice as much gas and would be a very dangerous way to do it. The column would telescope vertically and you wouldn't know where it was going to fall.

You don't KNOW the reason why it was cut like that also as posted above why do that at a column base the Tower collapsed from top down if YOU remember.

As for where it would fall ,what if a crane was already in position to lift it ?

originally posted by: loveguy
Ain't it telling a story;

Take traditional building practices and toss them away.

"We need these things to pancake" i assume was somewhere in the initial schematics?

From the guy that DIDN'T know the construction of the Towers in the first place

almost everything presented as fact by nist and the OS proponents.

originally posted by: RoScoLaz4
almost everything presented as fact by nist and the OS proponents.

Facts are better than OPINIONS!!!!

a reply to: wmd_2008

too bad all you have are opinions....

ouy have NO physical evidence to represent the claims pushed
NO like situations to compare to
and a refusal to release a scientific white paper representing the claims pushed.


100% agenda

2005 NIST found NO scientific reason for collapse x3...

"No conclusive evidence was found to indicate that pre-collapse fires were sever enough to have a significant effect on the microstructure that would have resulted in weakening of the steel structure." NIST NCSTAR 1-3C, p. 235

no evidence the type of joining methods, materials, or welding procedures used was improper NIST 1-3 p.99

recovered bolts were stronger than typical. NIST 1-2 p.133

"no core column examined showed temp. above 250C" NIST 1-3 6.6.2

NCSTAR1-3 7.7.2 "because no steel was recovered from WTC7,it is not possible to make any statements about it's quality"

so ENTER ...the hypothesized collapse sequence they REUSE to support with actual science.

"NIST is withholding 68,246 files. These records are currently exempt from disclosure. All input and results files of the ANSYS 16 story and the LS-DYNA 47-story global collapse model that were used to simulate sequential structural failures leading to collapse."

both the tower and WTC7 collapse models, their ONLY supporting evidence of the claims PUSHED.....and they refuse to validate, verify, PEER REVIEW outside the authors.

you don't HIRE your OWN peer review team to keep the data a SECRET from the world!!!!

" The NIST reports were peer reviewed by "5" individual subject matter experts CONTRACTED by NIST" NCSTR1A xxxi

but oh yea....a NEW never before seen physics took place.....REALLY!!!!

"the phenomenon that we saw on 9/11 that brought this particular building down was really thermal expansion, which occurs at lower temperatures."

Shyam Sunder and the HYPOTHESIS crew at 2008 NIST technical briefing

a reply to: wmd_2008

You don't KNOW the reason why it was cut like that

I've done quite a bit of steelwork over the years, and I can not think of one good reason to cut the column like that. It would be a complete waste of time and effort. And still doesn't explain why they picked that one column in the middle of a huge pile of debris without clearing access first.

As for where it would fall ,what if a crane was already in position to lift it

Again, why the weird 45 degree cut, and why not lower down instead of that awkward height?

a reply to: wmd_2008

the Tower collapsed from top down if YOU remember

Now that I think of it, do YOU remember how the "spire" collapsed? That cut would explain it perfectly.

a reply to: Flatcoat

It would be a complete waste of time

absolutely!

specially when time is of importance, rescuing......a straight line cut is faster....and that angle insinuates direction.....there was nothing that was allowed to just fall during rescue/clean-up, specially with OSHA there....before any member was cut, it was tied off to a crane so it would not fall and endanger anyone else.....and the wider angle shot shows a full-dressed FDNY in full rescue gear...they were dressed like that only on that day....and there were no cranes to hoist debris yet.

a reply to: Flatcoat

When you are cutting steel that still sticks in the air 50-70 feet...you might want to make directional cuts that will give you SOME idea of exactly where its going to fall.

Or... check here....

www.debunking911.com...

a reply to: slipstreaming

wmd.....lookie who is back.

Bob....are you ready to actually look at the evidence this time?

a reply to: cardinalfan0596

.lookie who is back.

Bob....are you ready to actually look at the evidence this time?

???????....but as soon as you present some...I will gladly look..

debunking911 is NOT one of those......the initial NIST 2005 report is.....perhaps you can point to some ACTUAL scientific findings in there that support what you claims here.....pointing to a debunking site that 'specially interrupts' what the reports might mean, is not support.

physical evidence is support.....got any?

a like situation to compare with is support......got one?

taught agreed upon science is support......???????

you might want to make directional cuts that will give you SOME idea of exactly where its going to fall.

obviously you are someone whom has NEVER dealt with OSHA!!!
nothing fell by a means of someone cutting at that site.....specially on unstable structural debris with HUNDREDS of people working around you......everything was tethered off from above and lowered after so NOTHING fell after it was cut.

no need for angled cutting......"the fasted way between two points is a straight line" [Ginger, Gilligans Island]

a reply to: cardinalfan0596

When you are cutting steel that still sticks in the air 50-70 feet...you might want to make directional cuts that will give you SOME idea of exactly where its going to fall.

No, you would use a crane. And the purpose of a 45 degree angle cut, is to cause the beam to "walk off".

originally posted by: Flatcoat
a reply to: wmd_2008

You don't KNOW the reason why it was cut like that

I've done quite a bit of steelwork over the years, and I can not think of one good reason to cut the column like that. It would be a complete waste of time and effort. And still doesn't explain why they picked that one column in the middle of a huge pile of debris without clearing access first.

As for where it would fall ,what if a crane was already in position to lift it

Again, why the weird 45 degree cut, and why not lower down instead of that awkward height?

So from that picture you can tell location & number of columns?

a reply to: slipstreaming

obviously you are someone whom has NEVER dealt with OSHA!!!
nothing fell by a means of someone cutting at that site.....specially on unstable structural debris with HUNDREDS of people working around you......everything was tethered off from above and lowered after so NOTHING fell after it was cut.

I can't believe you said that.
Total hogwash.

I wish you and your clones would get out of your basement and go visit real demolition sites. Then talk to real workers.