America, America...God's judgment is on you

reply to post by MajKarma


Hello. If you went through all that it is brave of you to share it so openly. I too have known the numbing pain of tragedy, such as the loss of a child. Last year one of my remaining two children broke his neck, and is still in hospital after nearly 9 months. How does this fit with trusting and living for Christ over the last 28 years? I don't know. But I do know it has nothing to do with whether Christ was who he said he was. What happens to me has no bearing on the fact that he healed the sick, raised the dead, ordered the wind and the waves to stop, rose from the dead, etc., and in the process fulfilled millenia of prophecies written beforehand in the Old Testament.

When Christ was on the cross he prayed "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Abandoned by both friends and enemies and in unimaginable pain, and then abandonned by his Father in Heaven. Yet he still knew his Father was real, and was present, otherwise he would not have prayed. He was voluntarily experiencing this abandonment so that his people would never endure it, either in this life or the next. Jesus Christ literally experienced his Father turning his back on him, as a fact, and it tore his soul apart, deeper than any torture in existence.

We can, and do, sometimes feel like God has abandoned us. The difference is that he has clearly promised "Never will I leave you, never will I forsake you". Seeing as it is impossible for God to lie, we do have this fact as something to hold on to. We experience the feeling - Christ was the only one of God's people who actually, factually had the experience. And when you reflect on why he was prepared to go through with it - to save us from eternal separation from God - your heart begins to warm as you begin to realise his love is beyond any other love known to man.

What you experienced was the result of man's detestable depravity and wickedness. I can't fully say why God permits such things to continue. The Bible only draws back the curtain a little in this realm. One clue it gives is that he has such unimaginable patience that even when people rail against him in their words and actions he doesn't stop them in their tracks, but gives them some time to seek out his mercy before they enter eternity.

One result of this is that suffering is prolonged, and even increases. His solution is different to what we would have devised, but he is the eternal God, perfect in wisdom, and we'll agree with it without question when it is finally revealed. It is the removal of this present universe and its replacement by another, to be populated by all who love him as their Father. May I humbly suggest that the way for you to find your way back is to pray that those detestable people will find God's forgiveness and peace. Not easy, but this is Christ's way. If you do, you will find a tremendous release. God always responds those prayers he specifically commanded us to pray, such as "bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you". Prayers for physical safety are not ignored, but the tragic history of this world shows that they are not always answered in the way we long for.

Praying for you.

reply to post by MajKarma


I apologize for neglecting to read your post entirely. I saw a couple of people who DID-read it- writing how sorry they were about your family and situation and I was like "what"??? So now I've read it and feel terrible for what you've been through, I hope you receive the support you deserve here and where you are.

I wish for you that you would read the book of Job. I thought of Job while I was reading your post, so God must have planted that thought Job suffered badly and lost everything, down to his dignity, but at the end, God blessed Him immensely! Just when we think all hope is gone.....God comes to the rescue. Just don't let your heart grow cold(er) God can peal away every layer of stone and ice and heat you up with passion and love.

From the very mouth and heart of our Savior prior to the crucifixion.
Mark 14:36
And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.

Mark 10:27
And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.

And here is something to look forward to:

Isaiah 25:8
He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.


Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

May The Word of God (Yahshua) keep you and bless you.

Some time back I was involved in building a Horse Racing Facility, like a Santa Anita/Hollywood Park here in So Cal and as one of the processes of embracing and seeking to be embraced by the local community, we sponsored an Equestrian Special Olympics on at our 132 acre ranch, which had extensive facilities to accommodate such. We spent close to $50K on the two day event, including catered food and basically everything anyone needed for free, including stabling, hay, RV spaces etc etc etc.

Several Churches came with many of their members and naturally each had their concerns about the "Gaming/Gambling" aspect of our proposed project, stating how it was gambling and God didn't approve of gambling and other concerns about what Horse Racing, Paramutel Wagering and the like would bring to the community. The fact that the facility would create hundreds of jobs and many millions into the local coffers seemed to settle most everyone down to agreeing the project would be an over all good for the community, except for the Ministers, Priests and I suppose you could call them the management of these churches, who voiced their continued opposition. The event and weekend ended.

Then over the next 4-5 days I was contacted by someone from each of the 6 churches wanting to meet. I won't labor with explaining the details of the meetings that followed except to make the point that in every case, each had come to "Blackmail" us, wanting donations, concession rights, access right to the facilities for events and a long list of other "Wants" and in return they guaranteed the endorsement and support of their congregation/church. ((Am I telling this clear enough?)) What it boiled down to was if we paid them off, they and God would be on our side and if we didn't, they would make our lives miserable...several actually said it like this.

So, here is my point: I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH GOD OR JESUS except that he doesn’t appear to be answering my prayers, as I so stated ,,it is Christians I have the problem with...people who quote scripture out of one side of their mouths and violate some of the most important teaching of Jesus...like "He who is without sin, cast the first stone" and "Judge Not, Lest Thee Be Judged".

And so, in response to your response, I will do as you did and cut and paste a few scriptures for you:

(1) Thom 26 = POxy1 26

26 Jesus said, "You see the sliver in your friend's eye, but you don't see the timber in your own eye. 2When you take the timber out of your own eye, then you will see well enough to remove the sliver from your friend's eye. [Complete Gospels]

= POxy 1
26 2 [...] "then you will see well enough to remove the sliver from your friend's eye." [Complete Gospels]


(2) 1Q: Luke 6:41-42 = Matt 7:3-5

6:41 Why do you see the speck in your neighbor's eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye? 6:42 Or how can you say to your neighbor, 'Friend, let me take out the speck in your eye,' when you yourself do not see the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbor's eye.

= Matt 7:3-5
7:3 Why do you see the speck in your neighbor's eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye? 7:4 Or how can you say to your neighbor, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' while the log is in your own eye?

7:5 You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbor's eye.

I believe in God; I am just disappointed that he hasn't seemed to have been listening.

I think maybe people should be careful speaking for God and judging; careful about images and Icons they use to imply some form of “Holier than thou” status; I think there is extra special scrutiny and judgment waiting for such people. However, if I am wrong and God is listening to someone here, would you mind asking God to tell clue me in!!

Have I been off subject?

God is always there. We are in a relationship with him. You don't leave your husband or wife simply because they are angry and will not speak to you. You work it out. a relationship needs plenty of patience, plenty of nurturing. Find out what pleases God and you'll get on his good side, as David did - God said of him, "He is a man after my own heart." If you think that God does not have feelings, think again. we are made in his image, this does not just mean physically, it means emotionally as well. We get angry, so does he. We are happy, so is he. We are mirrors of him. Would you walk out on a friend in need? Would you use "tough love" to get a point across? Are there times you feel you should not help someone and it would be better for them to do it themselves. Don't treat God like some pet. He is not an animal that he should jump and do tricks. If he could be moved so easily, even evil men would use him to do their dirty work. Don't be surprised when he does not act, does not do what you wish. Always be prepared to do good, to love, to honor him. Never be ashamed of him is the rule. Always trust in him is the commandment. Never trust in men is a way of life. Admire the One who can take the whole universe and wrap it around himself like a man wraps a robe around himself - let's see the devil pull off that trick. God bless.

Originally posted by MajKarma

I think maybe people should be careful speaking for God and judging; careful about images and Icons they use to imply some form of “Holier than thou” status; I think there is extra special scrutiny and judgment waiting for such people. However, if I am wrong and God is listening to someone here, would you mind asking God to tell clue me in!!

Have I been off subject?

To answer your question, no I don't think you've been off subject at all. I can't grasp the entire scenerio surrounding what happened with you, I think I misunderstood from your original post, but now I kind of get what you're saying. Your bitterness, correct me if I'm wrong, is due to something that happened involving church orginizations. But I'll say it again, as I'm sure you've heard it before, not all Christians and churches and even religions are one and the same. I think what happened to you could be taken as a lesson or rather learn from what happend? I myself can't say that I'm not familiar with that feeling you have. It just takes time and prayer, prayer and time and growth to move past it.

I initiated this topic because I see something Biblical happening here in America, it isn't ME that judges by any means. I read a lot of the OT & the New and I see not only America, but even myself sometimes in the warnings, but instead of retreating into a corner somewhere and sulking or hiding and denying the obvious, I bring it to you guys here, and talk about also here in my non- computer arena as well. There is absolutely not a thing wrong with sounding the alarm when you see fit:

Joel 2:1
Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand;
&
Ezekiel 33:6
But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand

I live in America, I see the sword coming. I'm not the/a prophet, I learned from the best; The Word. Does anyone think I want to see America fall to the sword??? No my loved ones are here, I'm here, it's where God has chosen I live. I have no fear of what man do to me, I fear what God can do to me and you and a nation and an entire planet. I pray all the time for our country and it's inhabitants, I beg for His loving mercy upon us, I plead weekly for forgiveness for the 'actions' of myself and the people. God is ever so clear in the things He does not like and even clearer on the consequences of not moving away from those things which He detest. We ought to be pledging allegiance to God rather than a flag, the flag can't save us.

I again apologize for your circumstances, but don't let what happened to you put division between you and God. Use your situation to embrace His truth more than ever. No man should ever come between you and God, but buddy, will man test you, or maybe God tests us, but like I said, let that be a reason for you to embellish His Word all the more, not less. And to love His children more too. We're all sinners while we remain in the flesh, and no matter how close we are to the Word (Yahshua) we are still bound to trip up and sometimes fall, but only to purge us and make us white.

Also warning and judging are quite different. It's OK to warn your brothers and sisters:
1 Thessalonians 5:14
Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men.
Romans 15:14
And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another.
2 Thessalonians 3:15
Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.







[edit on 12-3-2008 by Elisha4Yah]

[edit on 12-3-2008 by Elisha4Yah]