Was Anna Kreisling a Ju-390 co-pilot 1944?

Hi everyone... I have delved deeply into the history of the massive six engined Ju-390 aircraft claimed to have flown to within 12 miles of New York in February 1944.

This topic is hotly disputed, but my question is who is or was Anna Kreisling ?

A gentleman named James Newsom left a comment to a website that his neighbour Anna Kreisling was co-pilot of the infamous New York Ju-290 flight.

Newsom then appears to have removed his e-mail contact.

Now it may be just a hoax claim and I accept that.

On the other hand does anybody out there know about Kreisling or Newsom ?

Please don't let this become a debate over the New York flight. If we find Kreisling it will solve the debate.

[edit on 20-2-2008 by sy.gunson]

"This forum is dedicated to the discussion and speculation of cover-ups, scandals, and other conspiracies surrounding the events of 9/11/2001."

You might get more responses if you were in a different forum, fascinating though the question is.

Germany must have had some great lady pilots. I know of the famous case of Hanna Reitsch, '. . . the crack woman test pilot who, among other qualities, had a capacity for monumental hatred, . . ." The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich". William Shirer, p.1118, who flew into Berlin during Hitler's last days to bring General Ritter von Greim, into der bunker to ze prezenze off ze mad FUEHRER himzelfff.

Anyway, best of luck with your quest.



Edited to refine my Nazi accent.

[edit on 22-2-2008 by ipsedixit]

Thanks ipsedixit, but there does seem to be a lot of denial and cover up about the New York mission.

The Luftwaffe burned 80% of their records in April 1945. A large collection of photographic survey records taken by "Zirkus Rosarius" and later by KG200 are known to be in CIA archives and still classified from WW2.

It's odd that such records are still classified over 60 years since that war ended.


If you can suggest a better forum at ATS then I'd be happy to re post the question there.


Oh hey apologies everyone... I just noticed that the forum which this is posted in relates to 9/11. That wasn't the forum which I opened to post it in originally. Somehow my post got redirected.... OOPs



[edit on 22-2-2008 by sy.gunson]

Originally posted by sy.gunson
It's odd that such records are still classified over 60 years since that war ended.

Len Deighton wrote a novel called XPD, part of the story of which concerned a top secret peace agreement negotiated at a secret meeting in occupied France between Churchill and Hitler. For some reason this deal fell through, but the fact that such a meeting had taken place was a closely guarded secret that the Thatcher government (at the time of the novel's story) was at great pains to keep secret.

Suppose this six-engined bomber had landed in the US and some kind of super secret treachery had been discussed, wouldn't that pee in the pool of "the special relationship" between the US and the UK? When Anna Kreisling got back to Deutchland she was probably awarded the Iron Cross and after the war the OSS probably awarded her a silver bullet. Then, all records were deeply forgotten about.

Just a few conspiratorial thoughts.

Well there was a Ju-88 which mysteriously landed at the RAF base next to Newcastle upon Tyne, disgorged a passenger and then flew off again in August or September 1943.

Suppose this six-engined bomber had landed in the US and some kind of super secret treachery had been discussed, wouldn't that pee in the pool of "the special relationship" between the US and the UK?

Since you mention it, at the Tehran conference Roosevelt and Stalin agreed that their two nations would run the post war world and dismantle colonialism including the British empire.

General Leslie Groves authorised the export in several smaller shipments of 450kg of Uranium oxide to Russia. These shipments went via Peruvian freighters from Seattle to Vladivostock and the Japanese dared not molest them.

Later in the war the SS John Barry was part of a special convoy to Persia where lend lease goods would be shipped to Russia.

SS John Barry was sunk off Oman by U-859, with a highly top secret cargo. Long after the war a French deep sea expedition was launched to recover her cargo from greater depths than any recovery ever before.

The recovery cost more than recovering the Japanese ship Ehime Maru off Hawaii and almost as much as recovering the Soviet nuclear sub K-19. What was aboard John Barry that was worth that efforts and expense ?

A clue is that in WW2 the Germans converted three Heinkel He-177 bombers with extra large bomb bays for the Nazi A-bomb. One of those airframes became a donor fuselage for the Ju-287 V1 jet bomber.

The Ju-287 V1 was test flown through August to October 1944 when test flying suddenly stopped.

The reason why is evident from what General Walther Dornberger told another General in a bugged conversation at Camp 11 after the war.

Dornberger mentioned that in October 1944 he and Werner von Braun, of V-2 rocket fame went to Lisbon for talks with two officials from General Electric Corporation. Dornberger also says he stayed in touch through December 1944.

Now Dornberger at that time worked for the SS in one of the most top secret Nazi weapons projects, yet he was free to talk with Americans in Lisbon ?
Give me a break !

However Dorneberger's boss SS Lt General Dr Hans Kammler shielded the Nazi nuclear scientists and Penemunde rocket scientists when Hitler ordered their execution. He smuggled them south to Bavaria where the SS allowed the ALSOS mission to come and collect them.

In October 1944 Gen Leslie Groves removed Germany from the SBS list of nuclear targets for the Manhatten Project. Much more than co-incidence.

The German nuclear bomber project was abandoned. test flying of the Ju-287 jet bomber stopped in October 1944.

Von Braun and Dornberger it seems saved Europe from becoming the world's first nuclear battleground.

Now there's a good Tom Clancy novel for ya!

I asked this question about Anna Kreisling in good faith because I was intrigued to learn more about a claim on another website, but I have come to the personal conclusion that the person (John Newsom) who made this claim elswhere on line either got it wrong, or perhaps was misleading people himself.

Without any further evidence to go on I must discount such a Ju-390 flight from Norway to Michigan.

If however somebody comes across this post in an old archive and knows about Anna Kreisling, even if in a different context, I would always be intrigued to know more.

Simon

reply to post by sy.gunson


Rob Arndt seems to have an extensive knowledge of the Luftwaffe during the war years he may know something.

U2U me and I will give you his email addy

Anna Kreisling was known as test pilot of Junker aircraft and was with KG 200: she also reported direct to Hitler.

originally posted by: sy.gunson
Hi everyone... I have delved deeply into the history of the massive six engined Ju-390 aircraft claimed to have flown to within 12 miles of New York in February 1944.

This topic is hotly disputed, but my question is who is or was Anna Kreisling ?

A gentleman named James Newsom left a comment to a website that his neighbour Anna Kreisling was co-pilot of the infamous New York Ju-290 flight.

Newsom then appears to have removed his e-mail contact.

Now it may be just a hoax claim and I accept that.

On the other hand does anybody out there know about Kreisling or Newsom ?

Please don't let this become a debate over the New York flight. If we find Kreisling it will solve the debate.

[edit on 20-2-2008 by sy.gunson]

The rumor about the Junkers Ju 390 making a test flight to within 12 miles of New York City to test the Ju 390's capability to attack Manhattan has been debunked by reliable research. This claim originated from Allied intelligence reports based on prisoner interrogations claiming that a Ju 390 had been delivered in January 1944 to Fernaufklärungsgruppe 5, based at Mont-de-Marsan near Bordeaux and that it had completed a 32-hour reconnaissance flight to within 12 miles of NYC. Although this allegation was once accepted as fact in many publications on German military aircraft of World War II, in 1980 Junkers test pilot Hans Joachim Pancherz, the test pilot of the Ju 390, refuted any suggestion that the Ju 390 V1 made a transatlantic reconnaissance flight over NYC. There was a second Ju 390 prototype under construction before all development of the Ju 390 was stopped in September 1944, but it was never completed. Meanwhile, the first Ju 390 prototype was placed in outdoor storage at Dessau in November 1944 after the Ju 390 program was terminated, and it was blown up by Junkers personnel to prevent it from falling into Allied hands, but American troops overran Dessau and captured the Junkers factory there.

Link:
www.luftwaffe-research-group.com...