Oregon man detained after Internet posting

I've made joking comments to my friend about killing McCain and Giuliani if they become President/Vice President.

Just because I say that doesn't mean I'd actually go through with it. 1) I'm not a psycho. 2) I believe in the Constitution...Freedom of life.

Sure I may dislike McCain and everything he stands for, but that doesn't mean my comments are supposed to be taken literally. Even though now that I said this on the internets, I'm sure I'll be getting a phone call to stop by the police station tomorrow.

reply to post by Double Eights


My dear if the government get hold of my thoughts about the fascist president we have I would be in a crazy ward and tag for life.

Does that makes me a criminal in the making? a mental case? or a danger to society?

I am just a fed up American that is not a crime but our government wants to make all of us one.

Home grown terrorist is what we will be tagged with if Bush gets away with his bills.

reply to post by Double Eights


You will see 88's. domestic terrorism will spill over into the next administration. Bush started it, and it will continue. It is a broad term and has many interpretations. People being accused of domestic terrorism will reach a level that is out of control.

reply to post by Double Eights


But for sake of argument how do I know if you are joking or not?

You say your not crazy, but again, can anybody really make that determination without an investigation, if you started making threats?

Let me assure you having dealt with the Secret Service at work, they have no sence of humor to being with let alone with threats jokes or otherwise and nor should they.



Once again it seems that Pale, marg, and yourself are saying that these types of threats should simply be ignored and HOPE the person is joking or not targeting a school that loved ones go to.

Originally posted by FredT
Again based on that would it be acceptable to yell fire in a theatre?

When someone makes threats, joke or not, you take them at face value IMHO and you need to investigate.

FredT is exactly right on this one. Freedom of speech is not an unimpaired right to say whatever you want whenever and wherever you want.
There are a number of exceptions, exemptions and limitations dependant upon the whole of the circumstance. Things that you may be able to say in private or confidentially may be prosecutable when said in a public forum. Internet chat rooms are increasingly being held as public forums and self-injurious statements are seen as beyond protection of the First and Fourth Amendments.
What you can say to your spouse, priest or lawyer may get you arrested if said in public. This is nothing new in legal principal – it’s just the novel mechanism of the internet that is bringing these issues into current debate.

reply to post by FredT


You are right the FBI or the gestapo police are not in the business of been nice, they rather in the business of making sure that Americans are very afraid of what govenment can do to them.

reply to post by FredT

Once again it seems that Pale, marg, and yourself are saying that these types of threats should simply be ignored and HOPE the person is joking or not targeting a school that loved ones go to.

Fred...you are misunderstanding me. You make it sound like we condone killing sprees.
My point is that there are other ways. You just can't cart every social faux pas off to the nut house. Plain and simple. I never said to simply ignore anything. I said that the judgment that is going to be exercised on these issues is going to get out of control. Big difference.

GREEN BAY, Wis., Feb. 16 (UPI) -- Presidential hopeful Barack Obama openly supported the Chicago Bears during a speech at the University of Wisconsin in Green Bay, a report said.

Obama makes joke
I know this isn't the same as a shooting spree, but the same principal applies. Does this mean Obama doesn't know politics and will not be able to run our country? No, it means he was trying to be funny, but probably ended up not seeming very funny to Packer fans as they are serious about their team.
It is all about how someone interprets something. And words and intent are widely open for interpretation.

[edit on 2/16/2008 by palehorse23]

[edit on 2/16/2008 by palehorse23]

reply to post by FredT


You have no clue what so ever of everything that is as stake here, Fred, you hare moved by emotions as been a parent, guess what I am also one but I survived that stage.

Now my children are adults and if I am going to worry about them every single day of my life I will meet a very untimely death, for worrying so much.

My mentality and view of the world, our nation and my love ones has changed as I got older.

Oh, look ... the soap boxers are at it again.

And - again - they're not bothering to do the research.

The person in question came to the police station voluntarily. He was placed on a Police Officer hold. He will be participating in a mental health evaluation.

He has a prior arrest record (DUI).

His comments?

"ave maria ... this is the song that would be my soundtrack for a killing spree it just inspiers creativity."

"i dont want to think that the world is worth saving. i want to destroy it i want to take my hate for this for this world out of everybody.... I am a morbid f*ck who likes to watch things die."

"It's getting harder to not just start breaking things. It's getting harder to not just start shooting."

As a parent, I firmly believe the police did the right thing.

You guys ... really. Please do the research before you start with your posturing. Geez.

Your pal,
Meat.

P.S. Just so you all know, he (Benjamin Thomas Caldwell) was issued a Concealed Handgun License in 2006. It has been revoked, now.

Originally posted by FredT
reply to post by Double Eights

 

But for sake of argument how do I know if you are joking or not?

You say your not crazy, but again, can anybody really make that determination without an investigation, if you started making threats?

Let me assure you having dealt with the Secret Service at work, they have no sence of humor to being with let alone with threats jokes or otherwise and nor should they.

 

Once again it seems that Pale, marg, and yourself are saying that these types of threats should simply be ignored and HOPE the person is joking or not targeting a school that loved ones go to.

If just a sliver of the things that run through the mind of a normal human being in one day were to be released in the form of text on the internet, said person(s) would be thrown in jail for the rest of their lives. People have some pretty (curse word) up thoughts. I am absolutely 100% positive you've had thoughts in your life that are on par with what the kid in question posted on Myspace.

1) "You know that old Beach Boys song, Bomb Iran? Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran."
2) "I had something picked out for you, too - a little IED (improvised explosive device) to put on your desk." --to Jon Stewart
3) "I think I'd just commit suicide." --in October 2006, on the prospects of the Democrats taking back the Senate in the November election

How am I to be sure Mr. McCain is joking about those things he said. For all I know, he really will bomb Iran for no reason and assassinate Jon Stewart. Should we have him checked for mental illness (personally, I think he should be checked)?

*Note, I'm just playing Devil's Advocate right now.

[edit on 16-2-2008 by Double Eights] - Stupid spelling errors

[edit on 16-2-2008 by Double Eights]

Originally posted by mmmeat

P.S. Just so you all know, he (Benjamin Thomas Caldwell) was issued a Concealed Handgun License in 2006. It has been revoked, now.

Hallelujah he will not be shooting anybody any time soon, have to love justice.

So why the big deal right? so I am not worry anymore not that I ever was.

reply to post by palehorse23


We don't know exactly what was said by this guy at the station. Getting a mental evaluation is spot on if this guy is making threats of mass killings. No doubt we will be hearing from his lawyers soon enough, and threatenting mass killings is enough to get a 72 hour hold on someone to do such an evaluation. The guy has not been committed but is rather being evaluated by a very well establish, strict criteria. If he was just joking, they will not continue to hold him.

reply to post by mmmeat


Please post links with your proof. That will help you prove your point to everyone a lot better.

Oh wait let me do it for you.

He has a prior arrest record (DUI).

Benjamin Caldwell has no criminal history. He was issued a concealed handgun license in Clackamas County in July 2006. Police revoked it Friday.

no criminal record

how do you explain mmmeat????

Leach would not disclose what, in particular, had worried campus officials. He said it prompted campus officials to call the Clackamas County Sheriff's Office on Thursday.

Just thought I would add another snippet from the Oregonian

[edit on 2/16/2008 by palehorse23]

Originally posted by palehorse23
Please post links with your proof. That will help you prove your point to everyone a lot better.

No.

Unlike some people who just seem to throw up topics to build post counts using sources that are (at best) questionable and (at worst) biased, I would just as soon let you do your own research.

Which - again - should have been done in the first freakin' place.

I posted the gentleman's name. Find it yourself.

Your pal,
Meat.

Originally posted by palehorse23

He has a prior arrest record (DUI).

Benjamin Caldwell has no criminal history. He was issued a concealed handgun license in Clackamas County in July 2006. Police revoked it Friday.

no criminal record

how do you explain mmmeat????

Well, for you, I use small words.

An arrest record isn't necessarily a criminal record.

Duh.

Your pal,
Meat.

Isn't it odd that this guy makes a comment in a chat room and all hell breaks loose? However, in cases where an ex harrasses, threatens and terrorizes a woman, nothing is done until she's dead? If we're going to start jumping right on "threats", let's include threats from people with a proven propensity for carrying them out-- as in, thousands of dead women with restraining orders. I'm just saying...

reply to post by mmmeat


I see you added the appropriate title under your ID. It's about time.

reply to post by kattraxx


Why limit it to just women who have restraining orders? It would seem that the law should be enforced regardless of race, creed, culture or gender.

But that's just me, I guess...

Your pal,
Meat.

Originally posted by palehorse23
I see you added the appropriate title under your ID. It's about time.

Been there for quite awhile. Good that you finally noticed it. Devil is in the details, make sure you take the time to read them.

Besides, some threads need killin'.

Your pal,
Meat.

Snide comments directed at each other will stop now.

Stay on topic please. Consider this a reminder.