The speed of Silence

Hey, I was sitting here doing my science homework when I was asked what the speed of sound was. I answered that then thought:

'Whats the speed of silence?'

I really wonder about this and have searched the net and gotten only theories. Well out of everyone, ATS is by far the best theorists around.

Thoughts?

Well, the speed of sound depends on it's medium it travels through (I.E. air, water, gas, etc.) and it's just vibrations traveling fairly fast form a source point outwards.


Silence is an absence of vibration/sound so I guess it could be infinite?

I really don't know and I have my head scratching, but i would like to hear what other members have to say.

Your best bet would be to ask Terry Pratchett.
He would probably say the speed of silence is sightly faster than the speed of sound on the account that you never have silence and sound together.Hence silence can get out of the way faster!

[edit on 27-1-2008 by Azador]

reply to post by Azador


Is it possible maybe the speed of silence is a sound so extremely piercing that there is no possible way for it to be picked up?

A shoot I double posted. sorry ATS delete this post please!

[edit on 27-1-2008 by Nyte Angel]

It could be?
But we have extremely sensitive equipment now days so the vibrations would have to be seriously fast.Interesting question though because what is silent to us is loud and irritating to a dog.

There is no speed of silence, as silence is the absence of all sound, and can only exist in a vacuum. Earth, technically speaking, has no silence, even in areas without men or animals. Even plants give off a constant buzz. Atoms can be heard exploding constantly in all locations as well f you have instruments to hear it.

Originally posted by Azador
Your best bet would be to ask Terry Pratchett.
He would probably say the speed of silence is sightly faster than the speed of sound on the account that you never have silence and sound together.Hence silence can get out of the way faster!

[edit on 27-1-2008 by Azador]

Your theory sounds pretty good to me, but let me add something extra.


Since the speed of sound is not a fixed speed and can vary, so can the speed of silence because silence depends on the absence of sound. I guess you could say sound always travels faster than sound, but who knows.


Or another theory, sound doesn't travel faster or slower than sound becasue it has no speed, it's just an absence of sound vibrations in order to take away silence, you create sound. Silence doesn't go at a speed, it instantaneously goes away.

Silence is the complete absence of sound. It has no speed as the word silence refers to something that is absent.

[edit on 1/27/2008 by Blaine91555]

reply to post by Monsterenergy791


Yes but there has be a speed at which the 'silence' takes over all known existence of that sound. Correct?

just a thought

Damn it i suppose im not as funny as Terry.
My lame attempt at a joke went woosh over everyones heid(haha just finished reading wee free men)

reply to post by Nyte Angel



Silence takes over sound by time. Hearing a train come by and then go away from you; the sound lessens and lessens until you can't hear anything, but point between the very last low sound you hear and complete silence is (I guess) a plank length of time.

I hope I don't sound dumb, but that's my take form your post.

reply to post by Monsterenergy791


Good point, but it can't just stop. It obviously has to end somewhere, just the rate at which it completely ends is what I'm curious about.

[edit on 27-1-2008 by Nyte Angel]

Here are my .02 cents on this theory.
Absolute silence is not possible.....

1.)
The total absence of sound (complete silence) is almost incomprehensible to most humans, since our auditory system will only "pick up" on a limited bandwidth of frequencies... and there are multitudes that are beyond our perception.

For instance, the average human hearing range is around 15 or 20Hz~20kHz, (which is 15 to 20,000 cycles per second) anything beyond that wavelength will not register in the primary audio area in our cerebral cortex... I'm sure that sophisticated instumentation can measure more than this, but that is outside the scope of this idea. I'm thinking more on a human level here to start this off.


2.)
Since sound is a vibration that can be thought to have similar properties of light, it can deflect off of objects, or simply cause other objects nearby to vibrate also. (resonance) This can cause echoes, intensity, doppler effects. The list could go on and on, but the surroundings play a very important role in our perception of sound, and in order to have a pure absence of sound (or total silence) the listener must be devoid of any surroundings that would cause any of the effects listed above.
The only thing that can come close to a "flat" neutral listening environment would be an Anechoic Chamber.

On more of the scientific level though, my theory is that everything creates it's own wavelength... or vibration so to speak, from the smallest of particles to the planets themselves... we are constantly surrounded by these vibrations whether minute or massive. The rock we live on has it's own frequency, heck... even the human body does. Have you ever sat around in a totally quiet room... only to find you are hearing yourself breathe, or the beating of your heart? There is no absence of "sound" only multiple variations of the sound itself. Everything is always buzzing around us.....



Interesting concept indeed, I would like to hear some more on this......
(no pun intended)


regards,
T.

Silence is an idea and as such is not measurable!

reply to post by telemetry


Lets assume we can hear every little thing down to the smallest atom, we could shut off our bodies taking complete control of our senses and record for 1 minute. Lets create a location surroundings etc.:

Location: A panic room so sealed its impossible to let any type of wave through its walls.

Surroundings: Something very think and not penetrable, say Kevlar walls. And a bed that won't ever make a sound.

The recording device: something sitting in the middle of the room that picks up completely every wave length that gives of even the slightest of noise.

Now after one minute of complete silence we walk in and grab the recording device. We listen very closely and hear.. nothing!

We then measure the .... I'll let you figure that out I just have the base for you to work on

I'll try to help you out with this concept as well

[edit on 28-1-2008 by Nyte Angel]

reply to post by Nyte Angel


Excellent forward thinking!
I understand what you are implying here, and with regards to the bigger picture of things and to yourself also... this is something that really makes me wonder. I will see if I can keep this in laymans terms for all of the other readers out here, but since my profession deals with sound on a somewhat elaborate level, I'm gonna try and keep it simple and hopefully add to the discussion. Let's see what we can come up with here regarding this theory....


A baseline measurement is taken within an absence of sound or external influences on vibration (preferably a vacuum of some sorts with very little mass or matter) and from here on out that is referred to as "nothing" or "the empty" for future testing.

For the second test measurement, we flood the recording device with a combination of pink, brown and white noise (at maximum amplitude) which encompasses the full spectrum of frequencies available, for the sake of testing.. and that becomes "sound" for future reference.

We listen to "the empty" and don't hear a thing, we measure the output... increase the volume or amplitude and measure it again with instrumentation capable of picking up bandwidth beyond our our. We sit back and listen, we as humans still might not hear a thing.... I agree with you on that.

So then we run the "sound" through the same neutral environment... and we as listeners hear something, so we increase the output further until it is almost unbearable to us in an ear-splitting way.

So in theory, this is what it would take:
We measure "the empty" and then somehow produce the "sound" within the void, decreasing and increasing the sound to come upon a duality of sorts. Sound right?


Sorry for the pun, but this really leaves me on the fence as far as the possibilites go... it seems to me that it is almost a catch 22 in the realms of current thinking.

Looking forward to your ideas,
Telemetry

Is there any chance that we can wake up a moderator to shut down these 'speed of' threads? As far as i know this is still a 'science &technology' forum and not one for these types of jokes?

Stellar

reply to post by telemetry


You have struck home with that. Best answer that I thought about, you just spread it out more and looked into more intensely.

The silence being so piercing when found seems like a very reasonable answer to me. We just have nothing that can pick up that level of frequency.

Good post Telemetry, starred for that

Sorry it's been awhile since I jumped in here... I was really hoping to get some more debates on this one. Anywho,
Thanks for the star man, I appreciate it... and enjoy your outlook.
If you have any other good theories you want me to chime in on, just say the word.

Regards
T-