'Lost:' Season Four Discussion...

Originally posted by The Big O
All I've got to say about tonight's episode...
WOWWIE WOW WOW!
But how did Charlie talk to Penny!

I thought this episode was great. To answer your question, Charlie talked to Penny while he was in The Looking Glass Station.

Originally posted by Rren
I'm so, well, Lost this season. I haven't posted anything on it yet 'cause I've no idea where to start?

We missed you, fellow Lostie!

-What the significance of the 3.2 number?

No idea. Maybe it's just an amount that Miles thought he could get from Ben. Miles did say he knew more about Ben than the Losties did. With 'Lost,' however, as you have already noticed, there are always coincidences (or should I say fate?).

-Is Faraday time jumping too? What's up with the 'remembering two out of three cards' thing he was doing with the anthropologist girl? And the note in his notebook that 'If things go wrong, Desmond is his constant'? Means he's jumping time too, no?

Awesome thought, I love it! I thought, when I watched the scene with Faraday attempting to remember the three cards, that Faraday might have some issues with memory loss. This could be related to him time jumping.

-Is Hurley the new Locke, who was the new Ben (seeing Jacob/finding the cabin)?

I still don't see Hurley becoming a major character. Yes he is a main character, but I don't think he can match up to Locke or Ben. I see your point, though. Hurley can see Jacob/his cabin/Christian and Locke, I see, is becoming more of a control freak, like Ben or Jake to an extreme.

-Who's Ben's guy on the boat and who are his off-island contacts/benefactors?

I thought that the guy on Ben's boat could have been (spoiler-ish) Michael or Walt. I don't, presently, think this is the case, though. I don't know who Ben could be working for outside of the island.

-What's up with the shipmate's journal 'only ever having been read by the [Hanso?] family.' Why was Penny's father bidding on it?

I think that this is pretty much a confirmation that Widmore might actually be behind the entire thing. I think that he was bidding on the journal in order to either hide the secrets of the island or to find out about them. In other words, he either read the journal and found out about the island and the mysteries behind it or he already knew about the island and the mysteries and desired to suppress the truth from the world.

-Why a 30 minute time difference in Faraday's clock experiment, but a 8 [or 9?] year difference when Desmond 'time jumps'?

Don't know.

-What happens to Claire, why does ever[future]body think that Aaron is Kate's son?

Maybe Claire dies or is simply left on the island. I don't think that Kate is pretending that Aaron is her child. Actually I think the outside world knows that Aaron's mother was Claire, but Kate "adopted" him when Claire died (as the cover story might go). Remember, Jack's story he told in court involved 8 people surviving the crash and two dieing (are my number right?). Who knows, maybe Claire, according to the cover story, could have been one of the two that died.

I could do this for days.

I love Lost.

Me, too.

Originally posted by ucanneverdie
-probly some little connection thing between character that the writers did

Yup.

-yes he when he came to the island hes jumping too because remeber that he asked desmond if he was ever exposed to radiation or magnitisim and faraday was.

I agree.

-probly the one who cut all the wires on the boat

Yup.

Originally posted by ucanneverdie
OHHHHHH!!!!!! everyone look... im so smart... i just relized something!!!!
We now know what the sickness was that happened to all he people on french chicks boat that made her kill them!!!!!! ohhhhhhh im so freaking smart.

Awesome thought. I like it.

Originally posted by spikedmilk
Only he (Miles), is playing sides - just not the Widmores.

So he is not on the Widmore's side?

Originally posted by Rren
But, why? Same thing with the numbers entered into the computer, Hurley's lottery numbers, etc., etc. It's got to have some significance.

I think we have to decide whether it's coincidence or fate.

Sorry that was poorly worded. Ben was special because he could see/communicate with Jacob. I got the impression that he couldn't do that any longer but was pretending he still could and that's why he felt threatened by Locke once he knew that Locke could hear Jacob. Seems now that Locke is having issues with finding Jacob but, Hurley can. I was thinking that's why that creepy guy (flash-forwards) is trying to get Hurley to come with him. Whomever is now on the island in flash-forward time needs someone whom can communicate with/find Jacob. Maybe.

I like this.

An aside: Did y'all notice that when Charlie came to Hurley at the mental hospital that other patient saw him too? He told Hurley something like, "that guy is staring at you." Hurley looks and there's Charlie. ???

You reminded me about that cool tidbit.

Originally posted by The Big O
If what he was saying about time travel really being able to move around on your own stream of conscious, then he might have been overwhelmed by a feeling from his consciousness in the future at that very moment.

I love this. I agree.

Originally posted by Rren
On viewing the episode a second time I noticed that the calendar (in the ship's communications room) had X's noting how long they'd been out to sea (I assume) which put them in the water within one week of the crash. Strangely, there's about four days [?] in late September where the days are unmarked. Could this indicate some missing time, perhaps from when the ship first arrived at the island and was effected by its strange electromagnetic properties?

Within one week of the crash they were in the water!? That's crazy.

Originally posted by The Big O
I just like how I've really got a sense of the direction the show is headed in this season. For the first time in three years I feel like stuff is starting to come together, the pieces are falling into place.

Yes. 'Lost' will be on for two more seasons, so the pieces better be falling into place. I have full faith in these writers. Do the rest of you have the same faith? Sometimes, I admit, it's easy to loose that faith, especially with the "filler" episodes and etc. Supposedly there will be no more of these "filler" episodes, as the show now has (well, had for awhile) a definite end point.

Originally posted by The Big O
The hiatus will be less...but we won't get new episodes after these eight, and the addition five they started filming after the strike ended, until the next TV season starts.
That means next fall.
Or spring.

Are you sure about this? I am sure that the current plan (as was posted on page two of this thread) is to have 'Lost' return on April 24th (and not next fall or next spring, as I think you were saying). Here is what I am aware of:

Episode 4.06
Title: "The Other Woman."
Centric: Juliet.
Flashback/Flashforward: Flashback.
Air date: March 6th.

Episode 4.07
Title: "Ji Yeon."
Centric: Jin/Sun.
Flashback/Flashforward: Flashforward.
Air date: March 13th.

Episode 4.08
Title:
Centric: Michael.
Flashback/Flashforward: Flashback (?).
Air date: April 24th.

Thus, the only thing that has changed since the plan at the start of the season is that Episode 8 will be pushed back (as, supposedly, it makes for better storytelling). I don't know why this episode has been pushed back, though, as I have heard that (spoiler-ish) it has a little cliffhanger that could have kept fans thinking until April 24th. The writers, however, didn't want this cliffhanger to be a cliffhanger for the entire season (as would have been the case if the strike continued any longer), but, from what I have hear, the cliffhanger is good enough. Personally, I am expecting something huge. As always, though, I don't read spoilers anymore (actually, I haven't since the season started) so the details around this cliffhanger are unknown to me (and this is just how I like it). Also, the details around Episode 8, such as if it is a flashback/flashforward episode, are unknown to me). Whether the episodes are flashbacks/flashforwards are the only spoilers that I would want to read (in addition to the titles and whose centrics the episodes are and, maybe, a little description of the episodes). These details, I think, make better discussions.

Here are some news/articles:

'Lost: Via Domus' Arrives to Average Reviews...

Flash Forward...

'Lost' Heads Back Into Production Next Week...

Doc's Review - LOST: Via Domus for Xbox 360...

Writers endorse new three-year deal...




[edit on 3-3-2008 by they see ALL]

Could Miles also be jumping? This would explain him "communicating" with the dead and finding the money in that ladies house.

I've had similar thoughts about Miles. Not sure, of course, but it seems as if his thing isn't exactly like Desmond's. He can talk to dead people, but he has to have contact with them - like Naomi - or something they owned - boy's room - in order to communicate with them? The device he used in the boy's room... what the heck is that about?




Here's an interesting piece of information from Lostpedia.com's Miles page:

It was observed that when Miles first went upstairs, the pictures on the stairs wall were in a wooden type/colour frame. When Miles came back downstairs, the pictures had changed to a metallic type frame, quite different from the original frames

I hadn't noticed that.


Lostpedia also has a small page on Miles' device - Ghostbuster Device. I originally thought he just used it as a con (ya know, to look like he has some advanced spirit technology), I mean, C'mon, the thing looks like a Dustbuster! But, Miles did use it when in the room and outside of the mother's sight. It appears to be necessary. Maybe that's what he uses to communicate with spirits when he doesn't have access to the body.





Two more days and we'll have some answers.



Maybe.


...




Okay, probably not.

Originally posted by they see ALL
Thus, the only thing that has changed since the plan at the start of the season is that Episode 8 will be pushed back (as, supposedly, it makes for better storytelling).

Actually, this isn't quite true. Two things have been changed since the original plan (before the strike made a mess of everything). First, Episode 9 has now been pushed back a couple of weeks (the original plan was to have absolutely no breaks in between each episode). Second, this season's length has been shortened to 13 episodes (the original plan was to have this season, along with the two remaining seasons, be comprised of 16 episodes).

Kristen update on Lost Scheduling...

Even though episode seven is said to make a more logical endpoint for the pod, ABC wants Betty, Grey's and Lost to return all at once on Apr. 24, so they may be bumping episode eight back from Apr. 17 to its original airdate of Mar. 20. Good news for our greedy Lost-lovin' selves, yes? Meanwhile, for more Lostie goodness, check the Spoiler Section.

Official Revised ABC Lost Schedule...

Even though it's probably breaking the quoting rules (because of the length), here is the new schedule:

Episode 6: March 6
Episode 7: March 13
Episode 8: March 20
............
BREAK
............
Episode 9: April 24
Episode 10: May 1
Episode 11: May 8
Episode 12: May 15
Episode 13: May 22 (Season Finale)

The confusion ends here . I actually typed out a pretty long post (that I ended up not posting), in an attempt to explain the schedule based on old information (based on Episode 8 airing on April 24th). Oh well, I should have checked out one of my favorite 'Lost' sites before typing . It's a good thing I didn't post that post, as it probably would have created more confusion. I should have checked that site (I mistakenly skipped it) before I made my post last night, as it took time to type that post I was working on just now and I ended up not needing to post it. I usually check all of my favorite 'Lost' sites before I post here, so that I can update you all with news and etc. So, all in all, we get our Episode 8 back to where it belongs. I'm hyped (who wouldn't be, it's a Michael-centric episode)!

Can I place my bet that, in the next episode, we will see The Orchid Station? When I saw the preview for the next episode, I immediately thought of this new station. Plus, I think, what that station was working on, based on the video, was kind of similar to what Daniel was/is working on.

Lockdown - Lost Convention UK - Adetokumboh McCormack added to guest list...
Episode 4.05 - The Constant - Ratings...
Finally - The Alex Petrovitch Interview...
Kos Tour - Behind the Scenes...
Some behind the scenes photos...

EDIT:

Originally posted by Mitch Khumstein
Could Miles also be jumping? This would explain him "communicating" with the dead and finding the money in that ladies house.

I don't think so. I am under the impression that each of the Freighter People were chosen because they each had a different talent/character trait.

Originally posted by Rren
He can talk to dead people, but he has to have contact with them - like Naomi - or something they owned - boy's room - in order to communicate with them? The device he used in the boy's room... what the heck is that about?

Are you saying that Miles could possibly talk to Naomi or that Naomi has this ability too? I am positive that Naomi didn't have this ability. I think I first thought that the device he used in the boy's room was to suck up a ghost (it reminded me of a "dust buster") :shk:. Upon further thinking, I guess it was just used to make noise so that no one could here what he was saying. Then again, I am sure it must of had some other use besides that.

Here's an interesting piece of information from Lostpedia.com's Miles page:

That's interesting. I hadn't noticed it, either.

Lostpedia also has a small page on Miles' device - Ghostbuster Device. I originally thought he just used it as a con (ya know, to look like he has some advanced spirit technology), I mean, C'mon, the thing looks like a Dustbuster! But, Miles did use it when in the room and outside of the mother's sight. It appears to be necessary. Maybe that's what he uses to communicate with spirits when he doesn't have access to the body.

My sentiments exactly (although I don't think I thought that it was a con even though he got money, good catch). We both (probably along with many others) thought it was a "dust buster," that's cool.

Two more days and we'll have some answers.

Let's hope!




[edit on 5-3-2008 by they see ALL]

I know who it is.... Who The Spy is

To find who it is click here....:
SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!






...........lol

[edit on 6-3-2008 by ucanneverdie]

I say BAH!

We all KNEW Widmore was the one gunning for the island. Give us something more!

Good deal on explaining how Ben pulled off the stunning upset of the Dharma crew. I thought that just a bunch of others tossing on gas bombs on the barracks was a bit far fetched. Nice to see that there was a contraption that gassed the whole island. Makes a big more sense.

Well, now we know why Juliet had all that animosity toward Ben when we first met her. And Ben "owns" her? YIKES! That's crazy talk. However, I wonder if she only likes Jack because she knows it ticks Ben off. Hrmmm....

Obviously we all know who's on the boat. Unless they pull a switcheroo, which would be nice. I mean, we know that Michael is coming back...and it makes sense he'd pop up on the boat, but I'm hoping they pull a surprise and don't go that way.

Another good episode, nice to see more pieces falling into place. Next week looks super intense!

Oh Snap! i just relized something... Juleit must have died before getting off the island!!! Because it was a FLASH BACK!!!! we had flash forwards all season!!!! well except desmond but we can all say that doesnt count on the fact that it wasnt a flash of anykind since it was time travel. lol

Can I just say, that I feel this series has totally jumped the shark.

After following the first 3 seasons religously, I find that this new season cannot hold my attention for more than 5 minutes, and has become nothing more than background noise while I play poker online.

I've often wondered throught the 2nd and 3rd seasons, "how can a show like this continue to perpetuate itself without become mundane at best, and ludicrous at worst?"

The simple fact is that all great "stories", whether a novel, movie, or TV show, must have an ending. For this new kind of "perpetual" story-telling to survive, it has to keep adding new characters and new storylines that quite frankly, to me anyway, make it nothing but a glorified soap opera where all the creativity is being used to perpetuate the show rather than tell a good story.

I'm over it already, obviously.

[edit on 3/8/2008 by Kaiser Sohse]

Originally posted by ucanneverdie
To find who it is click here....:
SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's not really a spoiler (thanks), but, yeah, you are probably correct.

Originally posted by The Big O
We all KNEW Widmore was the one gunning for the island. Give us something more!

Hopefully, it's not just Widmore. Maybe Sun's father is involved, too? I remember a fan once translated a conversation he had with, I think, two of his workers and he said something to the extent of delivering something to Hanso.

Good deal on explaining how Ben pulled off the stunning upset of the Dharma crew. I thought that just a bunch of others tossing on gas bombs on the barracks was a bit far fetched. Nice to see that there was a contraption that gassed the whole island. Makes a big more sense.

I don't think I thought that was that far fetched. I probably just assumed that it was some sort of poison gas.

Obviously we all know who's on the boat. Unless they pull a switcheroo, which would be nice. I mean, we know that Michael is coming back...and it makes sense he'd pop up on the boat, but I'm hoping they pull a surprise and don't go that way.

In my opinion, they spoiled Michael coming back themselves: it was announced at Comic-Con last year, Harold Perrineau has been credited in every episode since the start of the season, and this week's preview said something like we will be seeing a face that we haven't seen for a while. The only problem I have with Michael being the spy is: how wouldn't the freighter people know (or, at least, be suspicious of) Michael was working with Ben? I mean, the freighter people must know that Michael was on the plane. He should have been dealt with by the freighter people as soon as weird things (such as the wires/equipment of the freighter being cut/destroyed) were occurring. I think the spy could even be Walt (as Michael should hate Ben and we haven't been shown a scene of them creating a fellowship), but, still, my argument still holds for Walt (as the freighter people should know of Walt, too).

Originally posted by ucanneverdie
Oh Snap! i just relized something... Juleit must have died before getting off the island!!!

I knew that Juliet wasn't one of the Oceanic Six (I read spoilers before the season began airing, sorry) and so I was amused that the first scene of the episode attempted to make it look like she was one of the Oceanic Six. The tell-tale sign for me (besides the spoilers I read) was the metallic door knob Juliet had in her house (those doorknobs belong to the houses at Othersville).

Originally posted by Kaiser Sohse
Can I just say, that I feel this series has totally jumped the shark.

Sorry you feel that way.

Originally posted by they see ALL
Can I place my bet that, in the next episode, we will see The Orchid Station? When I saw the preview for the next episode, I immediately thought of this new station. Plus, I think, what that station was working on, based on the video, was kind of similar to what Daniel was/is working on.

I guess I was wrong :shk:. The station that was introduced was the The Tempest and not The Orchid, as I thought would be the case (so said a spoiler I read before the start of the season). Actually, I am pretty sure that the building fans saw on site of production was indeed The Tempest (what do you think?). I wonder where the confusion came from.

Episode 4.06 - The Other Woman - Ratings...

ABC's LOST won it's 9PM slot once again this week with Season 4 Episode 6 The Other Woman. The ratings increased slightly from the previous week with a total of 13 Million viewers tuning in for the live broadcast.

Time Tripping Clarifications from Damon Lindelof...

WHAT REALLY HAPPENED TO DESMOND?

In ''The Constant,'' Desmond became ''unstuck in time'' after flying through a thundercloud crackling with strange electricity. He experienced something like time travel, though not bodily time travel; instead, his consciousness shuttled between two different time periods, Island present 2004 and Desmond's past 1996. But here's the tricky twist: Desmond's Island-present mind wasn't the one doing the time traveling. When Desmond got hit with Island magic, his consciousness got knocked off-line and was replaced by his 1996 self. It was this older Desmond consciousness that toggled between present and past throughout the episode. Once Desmond '96 completed the errand of getting Penny's phone number so he could call her on Christmas Eve 2004, Desmond's present-day mind came back online, but rebooted with the new memories created by his time-travel adventure. I know: tricky stuff. But I had the chance to run all this by Damon Lindelof — and he says this interpretation is correct.

PARADOX R/X, or ''HOW COURSE CORRECTION WORKS''

To be clear, Desmond's past was different before ''The Constant.'' Before his time-travel adventure, Desmond never met Faraday at Oxford, never got Penelope's digits. As a consequence of changing the past, Desmond's personal history has been ''course corrected'' by The Powers That Be, beginning from the moment he walked away from Penny's apartment. Lindelof says this interpretation is also correct. But here's a Big Question: since scoring Penelope's phone number, has Course-Corrected Desmond lived his life knowing that on Christmas Eve 2004, he MUST be on a freighter in the South Pacific in order to make a call to Penelope if he wants any chance of having a future with her? Lindelof says this is indeed a matter we should be mulling. Perhaps in the future, Lost will give us an episode that replays Desmond's backstory (getting the boat from Libby; killing Kelvin; meeting the castaways) from the point of view of this knowingness.

The last paragraph introduces a very cool idea. Read the entire article here.

Lost Easter Eggs: "The Other Woman"...

EDIT:

Segment Ratings for "The Other Woman"...




[edit on 10-3-2008 by they see ALL]

I just found out that my 'Lost:' Season Three Discussion thread is now number one (in the "Television" forum) in views (in addition to replies and flags). That's so cool! Thanks all for participating in that thread. Anyway, where all my Losties? It's been almost a week since the last episode aired. Did the smoke monster get you all?

I enjoyed the last episode (even though I missed a bit of, about, the first fifteen minutes, as I had to help my girlfriend with dinner). After rewatching the episode tonight, I have a new theory about Michael. I, originally, thought that Michael may have had his memory erased by something/someone. I now think that he is simply pretending that he does not know Sayid/Desmond. I think this as Michael attempted to, in my opinion, not come into close contact with Sayid/Desmond by stating, when the doctor called him, that he had to go up to the deck. The only problem with this is that the Freighter People must know Michael's identity if he ended up on the freighter by sailing on the on the boat he acquired from Ben. I read an interesting (and crazy) theory that stated that Michael somehow traveled back in time (by traveling, after he got the boat from Ben, in the direction Ben told him) and this somehow allowed him to never end up on the flight (and thus somehow end up on the freighter since it first sailed off, thus eliminating him as a saboteur suspect). This has some problems, but 'Lost' could pull it off.

I originally thought that Jin was working for Sun's father in order to protect Sun and the baby, but, upon looking at some links, however, I have found out that, according to Jin's tombstone, Jin died in the plain crash! See this and this. This realization is crazy! I was so shocked about Jin's/Sun's storyline after they got off the island when I thought that Jin faked his death and was working with Sun's father. I am even more shocked now!

Wasn't that undermining how Juliet told Jin that Sun cheated on him? And wasn't Jin's speech, towards the end of the episode, to Sun justifying her cheating sweet! When I first watched the episode, I thought that Hurley and Sun were together (imagine that)! The preview foe the next episode looks awesome!

Addicted to LOST?
LOST: Season 3 - Original Television Soundtrack Coming Soon!

Remaining Episode Schedule

Episode 4.09 24th April
Episode 4.10 1st May
Episode 4.11 8th May
Episode 4.12 15th May - Finale Part 1
Episode 4.13 22nd May - Finale Part 2

It sucks that the two parts of the finale are going to air in two separate parts. I always look forward the the two-hour season finales.

Episode 4.07 - Ji Yeon - Ratings Hit Season Low...

...

Surging from its lead-in by 6.6 million viewers and by 167% in Adults 18-49 (replay of the previous week’s episode = 5.3 million & 1.8/5), ABC’s “Lost” won Thursday’s 9 o’clock hour in Total Viewers (11.9 million) and Adults 18-49 (4.8/13). The ABC drama dominated the time period among Adults 18-49, beating its nearest competition by 55% (4.8/13 vs. 3.1/8 – NBC and Fox tied). In fact “Lost” led its time slot for the seventh consecutive week in the key young adult sales demographic.

Please Note: Due to the impact of the changeover to daylight savings time, overall Adult 18-49 TV usage levels declined in the hour by 8% from the prior week (38.0% vs. 41.3%). Despite the decline in available audience, “Lost” retained all of its audience share week to week.

Confirmation of The Oceanic 6

...

They are Jack, Kate, Sayid, Hurley, Sun and Aaron.

Hopefully this will end some of the debate that's been going around.

Note: I know back in December when we had the Oceanic 6 revealed and we had Jin instead of Aaron. This was due to the fact that my source who watch an early cut of Ji Yeon, like a lot of us, assumed the Jin part of the story was a Flash-forward and not a FB (The end scene was not on their cut of the episode). I hope this clears things up.

I thought, before looking at the previously mentioned links regarding this, that Jin didn't count as one of the Oceanic Six because the world considered him dead. Now, however, I know that he really is dead. I am still shocked! Ever since "Eggtown" aired, I always wondered why Aaron didn't count as one of the Oceanic Six (I read spoilers about the Oceanic Six a while ago, maybe even in December). I guess Aaron is in the club now and Jin is out (as he died in the plane crash supposedly).

Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse
Doc's Interview - Carlton and Damon Decoded
More Than You Want to Know?
Minor Spoilers for a Post-Strike Lost Episode (I might read this during the break)
Harold Perrineau Talks to TV Guide ( minor spoilers supposedly, I will not read it as I have had self-control since the season started )

Hey there They See All, congrats on yer thread and is that a new badge? Well congrats to you if it is !

For Jin, I'm under the notion that he stayed on the island to let Sun get off the island to ensure their babies survival, hence the date of the crash on the tombstone. Otherwise, what a weird episode concerning Jin...

Michael, ohhh I can wait to see his story as we'll find out how he came to the ship this week. I'm starting to wonder if all the Oceanic 6 are experiencing some sort of 'time-lapse'. I read some spoilers ( I think it was on the tailsection) that when Lost returns from its hiatus, that we will find out exactly why Jack has turned to drugs and booze. Remember back when he said to the other Chief Surgeon about his father being drunker than him...its got me thinking, he might be confused where/when he is at....

spikeD.

[edit on 19-3-2008 by spikedmilk]

Originally posted by they see ALL
I just found out that my 'Lost:' Season Three Discussion thread is now number one (in the "Television" forum) in views (in addition to replies and flags). That's so cool! Thanks all for participating in that thread.

Congrats! Just remembered that I never starred or flagged this one. I'll do it after I post.

Anyway, where all my Losties? It's been almost a week since the last episode aired. Did the smoke monster get you all?

The last episode was decent but I didn't have very many 'oh wow' moments or new insights. Figure after this week's episode that will change. . . I'm hopin' anyway.

After rewatching the episode tonight, I have a new theory about Michael.

I'm prepared to be POed by him/the storyline already. Sayid: "Explain everything; start from the beginning." Michael: "You wouldn't understand!" Rren: "Oh yeah! Try me! Please! Give me somethin'! @#$%^&!" We'll see.

I, originally, thought that Michael may have had his memory erased by something/someone. I now think that he is simply pretending that he does not know Sayid/Desmond. I think this as Michael attempted to, in my opinion, not come into close contact with Sayid/Desmond by stating, when the doctor called him, that he had to go up to the deck.

Agreed. They seemed to act the scenes as if to tell us they recognized one another but were pretending otherwise in order to not blow Michael's cover.

The only problem with this is that the Freighter People must know Michael's identity if he ended up on the freighter by sailing on the on the boat he acquired from Ben. I read an interesting (and crazy) theory that stated that Michael somehow traveled back in time (by traveling, after he got the boat from Ben, in the direction Ben told him) and this somehow allowed him to never end up on the flight (and thus somehow end up on the freighter since it first sailed off, thus eliminating him as a saboteur suspect). This has some problems, but 'Lost' could pull it off.

I don't like that one. Remember everybody who time travels only seems to do so temporarily. So even if Michael traveled back to before he got on the plane it'd only be temporary and he'd still retain his memory of the island. The previews I've seen seem to imply that Ben tells Locke that Michael's his guy on the boat. I figure - if true - then Michael is most likely the saboteur. I'm thinking that they [Ben/Others] never really let Michael go - It was only for show. The previews seem to hint that they're still holding his son and using that to make him do their bidding.

I originally thought that Jin was working for Sun's father in order to protect Sun and the baby, but, upon looking at some links, however, I have found out that, according to Jin's tombstone, Jin died in the plain crash!

I imagine that "dies in the crash" will be the cover story for all the losties whom never get off the island (IOW, for all but the Oceanic Six.)

This realization is crazy! I was so shocked about Jin's/Sun's storyline after they got off the island when I thought that Jin faked his death and was working with Sun's father. I am even more shocked now!

Eh *shrug* Off topic: Is it just me or is Sun getting sexier? She looked really good in the last couple episodes... she never used to do it for me. Of course, I'm easy.

I thought that Hurley and Sun were together (imagine that)!

Ha! That would be cool; Hurley's still my favorite character on the show. With the exception of Kate, but I like here for other reasons.

Now, however, I know that he [Jin] really is dead. I am still shocked!

How do we know that there's a body in the grave? Remember, 'they' planted a fake plane and bodies so the world wouldn't come looking for survivors. I assume the cover story is that the Oceanic Six were the only survivors and the Six are being forced to lie to that affect to keep the cover up... covered up. For all we know the other Losties are still alive and (relatively) well on the island (or elsewhere) and their deaths/graves are just a part of the cover story which keeps friends/family/whomever from searching for them and perhaps finding the island and finding out about the cover up/fake crash site. Surely whomever planted the plane and bodies ["you realize how powerful someone has to be to pull that off"] never admitted to it and the world at large still thinks that's what happened... with the exception of the Oceanic Six whom return to the world.

My guess is that Jin dies in whatever catastrophe befalls the rest of the Losties that don't make it off the island (or maybe there isn't a catastrophe at all, but they just stay there)....

So, do we have the correct Oceanic Six list?

Jack
Kate
Hurley
Aaron
Sayid
Sun

or, will Aaron not count, as he wasn't born when on the plane?

As for Michael, it seems that Ben somehow still has a hold on Walt, as he explains, "What wouldn't a man do for his son?" in the preview, so this at least points to a basic motivation for his spying for Ben. But yeah, how do Widmore's guys seem to miss the fact that a "plane victim" is right on deck? Surely, these peoples' pics had been all over the news....

We keep going further and further down the rabbit hole...

Originally posted by they see ALL
I originally thought that Jin was working for Sun's father in order to protect Sun and the baby, but, upon looking at some links, however, I have found out that, according to Jin's tombstone, Jin died in the plain crash! See this and this. This realization is crazy! I was so shocked about Jin's/Sun's storyline after they got off the island when I thought that Jin faked his death and was working with Sun's father. I am even more shocked now!

That's OK, I originally thought that Jin had a flashforward and got brainwashed and his death was faked.
I think that Jin's tombstone was put up when the plane crashed and they found the fake wreckage. Explains the date on it. But Jin is probably still dead, Sun acted like he was.

Originally posted by Gazrok
So, do we have the correct Oceanic Six list?

Jack
Kate
Hurley
Aaron
Sayid
Sun

or, will Aaron not count, as he wasn't born when on the plane?

I think Aaron counts as one of the 6. That sounds too technical. 'Oceanic 6' is probably just a term someone in the media came up with when the losties got back.

Originally posted by spikedmilk
Hey there They See All, congrats on yer thread and is that a new badge? Well congrats to you if it is !

Congratulations should be given to all who participated in that thread. And, no, the badge is not new (I have been a tinwiki editor for a while now).

For Jin, I'm under the notion that he stayed on the island to let Sun get off the island to ensure their babies survival, hence the date of the crash on the tombstone. Otherwise, what a weird episode concerning Jin...

I agree.

I read some spoilers ( I think it was on the tailsection) that when Lost returns from its hiatus, that we will find out exactly why Jack has turned to drugs and booze.

This sounds like a good reveal. I thought that Jack turned to drugs and alcohol because of him leaving others (or so it would seem) behind on the island (or, at least, because of events that occurred on the island) and because of that person's death (the person that was in the coffin).

Originally posted by Rren
Congrats! Just remembered that I never starred or flagged this one. I'll do it after I post.

Again, congratulations should go to us all! Thanks for the star and flag, though.

I'm prepared to be POed by him/the storyline already. Sayid: "Explain everything; start from the beginning." Michael: "You wouldn't understand!" Rren: "Oh yeah! Try me! Please! Give me somethin'! @#$%^&!" We'll see.

I am sure that we will get more than that (even though 'Lost' is guilty of stuff like that). This week's episode is Michael centric and, obviously, this episode will feature Michael's flashbacks. These flashbacks should tell us a great amount of things.

Agreed. They seemed to act the scenes as if to tell us they recognized one another but were pretending otherwise in order to not blow Michael's cover.

Are you saying that Sayid/Desmond desired not to blow Michael's cover or that the doctor didn't want to blow Michael's cover. If the doctor knows Michael's true identity, then Michael cannot be Ben's man of the freighter (and I am sure he is).

I don't like that one. Remember everybody who time travels only seems to do so temporarily. So even if Michael traveled back to before he got on the plane it'd only be temporary and he'd still retain his memory of the island. The previews I've seen seem to imply that Ben tells Locke that Michael's his guy on the boat. I figure - if true - then Michael is most likely the saboteur. I'm thinking that they [Ben/Others] never really let Michael go - It was only for show. The previews seem to hint that they're still holding his son and using that to make him do their bidding.

Yes, there are a lot of holes in that little theory I mentioned. I like what you have thought of! I never thought that Michael didn't really get away from Ben and his people. This is a very cool thought.

I imagine that "dies in the crash" will be the cover story for all the losties whom never get off the island (IOW, for all but the Oceanic Six.)

Yes.

How do we know that there's a body in the grave? Remember, 'they' planted a fake plane and bodies so the world wouldn't come looking for survivors. I assume the cover story is that the Oceanic Six were the only survivors and the Six are being forced to lie to that affect to keep the cover up... covered up. For all we know the other Losties are still alive and (relatively) well on the island (or elsewhere) and their deaths/graves are just a part of the cover story which keeps friends/family/whomever from searching for them and perhaps finding the island and finding out about the cover up/fake crash site. Surely whomever planted the plane and bodies ["you realize how powerful someone has to be to pull that off"] never admitted to it and the world at large still thinks that's what happened... with the exception of the Oceanic Six whom return to the world.

TSA:

Are you saying that Sayid/Desmond desired not to blow Michael's cover or that the doctor didn't want to blow Michael's cover. If the doctor knows Michael's true identity, then Michael cannot be Ben's man of the freighter (and I am sure he is).

I'm saying that Sayid and Desmond were playing along because the doctor doesn't know who Michael really is. If Michael is Ben's guy [which is what I'm thinking] then I figure nobody on the boat knows who he really is. The captain (and those who recently arrived on the island from the ship) are there, so they say, for Ben. If they knew who Michael was I'm sure he'd be in the brig and not wandering around the ship swabbing the deck, fixing toilets and what-not. He's probably been on his own up until now.

Michael always seemed like a good enough guy but, he'd do anything (even murder) to protect his son. If he's helping Ben then Ben must have something on him. Like before, I figure that "something" is Walt. Seems to make the most sense... for what that's worth when it comes to Lost anyway.

Tomorrow should be good.

PS,

Sun could be mourning Jin and still know he's alive. If he's still on the island and she knows he can never come back and she can never return (for whatever reason(s)), he's as good as dead. So far as being a husband and father there'd be no difference for all practical purposes. Mourning would be appropriate considering she just had a baby and knows that neither of them will ever see Jin again. Maybe I'm over thinking it. Maybe I'm too cynical when it comes to the writers and the storyline; I always feel like I'm being set up. Curve-balls abound.



:bnghd:

Originally posted by Rren
I'm saying that Sayid and Desmond were playing along because the doctor doesn't know who Michael really is.

Okay. Actually, now that I have seen the last episode before the hiatus, I think the captain knows that Michael is a Lostie. I am almost sure that he did not seem shocked about the news about Michael that Sayid shared with him. I don't know why the captain would wait this long to let Michael know that he knows who he is (as Michael has already done great damage to the ship), but, for some reason, I think the captain knew the whole time. Yes the captain did seem really pissed about the saboteur's actions, but I am still stuck on this idea. 'Lost,' I think, is very well written and there is no way in hell that the Freighter People did not know the faces of every person on Oceanic 815 (even though Frank did not know that Juliet wasn't on the plane just by looking at her). The Freighter People not knowing the people on the flight intimately is a huge hole, for me at least.

Michael always seemed like a good enough guy but, he'd do anything (even murder) to protect his son. If he's helping Ben then Ben must have something on him. Like before, I figure that "something" is Walt.

Seems like you were correct. Ben has control over Michael by threatening him with telling the truth to Walt (or, at least, threatening him with telling Walt that Michael indirectly killed, if he did not help Ben, everyone on the island). I guess that the plot of Walt getting recaptured by Ben's people would be way too redundant (kind of like in '24,' where Kimberly Bauer would always, in multiple seasons, be captured by the baddies).

Sun could be mourning Jin and still know he's alive.

Good point.

Let's talk about Michael's episode (even though I have already discussed it a bit)! I really enjoyed this episode. At first, during the episode, I thought that this was a flashforward episode and so I was amazed by Tom's appearance (I talked to my brother about this episode and I, even after the episode, thought for a second or two, maybe by accident, that the episode was a flashforward). I liked the fact that Michael and Walt got off the island and that it had to be hush-hush (thus, they are not a part of the Oceanic 6). And what about Michael not being able to kill himself!? Tom stated that the island will not let him kill himself (I like how the island, through the character's words, is becoming a character in it of itself - even Hurley, in his episode this season, stated that the island wants them to go back).

I was disappointed, a bit, about the cliffhanger, as I was anticipating a cliffhanger (because of the spoilers I read before the season started). If I wasn't expecting a cliffhanger, I think I would have enjoyed the ending more. Don't get me wrong, it was a great cliffhanger, as the episode ended in a sort of medias res, it involved the deaths of two characters (one, in my opinion, a huge character), and it will keep us "thinking" for awhile. I say "thinking" because I really think that it isn't a surprise who shot Danielle and Karl. I think it is the Freighter People (think about it, the helicopter left the freighter - where else can it go besides the island? I think a character has already mentioned that point by sarcastically asking that question). So the war has begun (as the preview tells us) and there has already been casualties (Naomi, Danielle, Karl, anyone else?). Thus, the cliffhanger, for me, wasn't that great. The only shocking thing about it were the deaths. Even though deaths make great cliffhangers, I believe that they must be about something more than deaths (I was just typing about Charlie's death in order to use this as supportive evidence for my opinion, but, luckily, I double checked my facts and I have found out that his death did not occur at the end of an episode and so it wasn't a cliffhanger, but this would have made great supportive evidence as this involved a death and something more: the revelation that the freighter wasn't Penny's).

I cannot believe that Danielle is dead! She was supposed to get a flashback episode! We still don't know much about her! She has been there since Season One! Oh well. I don't care much about Karl, although it was sad because Alex cared for him. I initially thought that Ben sent Alex (and her company) on a trail to find The Temple so that they could get captured so Ben could be exchanged for them (even though Ben stated that, if his people wanted him back, his people could have stormed the barracks). I could feel that something was going to occur during the last scene (especially when Karl stated something along the lines that their present situation didn't feel right). Even when the shooting occurred, I thought that it would be Ben's people (up until, about, Alex screaming that she was Ben's daughter).

So Alex must now become Ben's daughter, in order to (hopefully) not get killed by the Freighter People. I like it! Alex was raised almost all her life believing that her father was Ben. Then, she found out that this was a lie. Now, she must take the role of Ben's daughter up again. Very cool

LOST Mind Games – A Brand New Book For Fans of the ABC Hit TV
Episode 4.08 - Meet Kevin Johnson - Ratings
Lost Easter Eggs: "Meet Kevin Johnson"
4x08: Here's the Shooter

EDIT:

I liked the cliffhanger also because it was like (and it reminded me of) the cliffhanger that split up the two parts of last season. Remember that one? It's the one where Jack, talking to Kate on the walkie talkie while performing the surgery on Ben, said "Kate, dammit, run" and then the episode ended. That was great, as it definitely left me wanting more (so did this one). The medias res-like style is always great!




[edit on 25-3-2008 by they see ALL]

Originally posted by they see ALL
I cannot believe that Danielle is dead! She was supposed to get a flashback episode!

What makes you so sure she's dead?
I didn't see anyone pronounce her dead did you?

Originally posted by they see ALL

Originally posted by Rren
I'm saying that Sayid and Desmond were playing along because the doctor doesn't know who Michael really is.

Okay. Actually, now that I have seen the last episode before the hiatus, I think the captain knows that Michael is a Lostie.

Maybe. I don't think he does know, though (if he does, why didn't he act sooner, especially after the sabotage?). On the other hand, the helicopter pilot may know, as he's already shown (on the island with Juliet) his familiarity with 815's passenger manifest. He comes across a good guy though and that (or something similar) could be why he hasn't outed Michael yet. Surely Most likely Maybe, somebody else on the freighter knows who he his but, I'm not sure why (if they're not in cahoots with Ben et al) they would keep that a secret though.

'Lost,' I think, is very well written and there is no way in hell that the Freighter People did not know the faces of every person on Oceanic 815 (even though Frank did not know that Juliet wasn't on the plane just by looking at her). The Freighter People not knowing the people on the flight intimately is a huge hole, for me at least.

Re: The writing on Lost, I agree. I see the hole too but, I'm not sure what that is supposed to mean or imply. I imagine there are several creative ways to get out of it and have Michael's true identity remain unknown. Although his mother (in the flash-forwards) did know he was on the plane and was supposed to be dead which implies that it's common knowledge - to the general public - he was on the plane.

Michael always seemed like a good enough guy but, he'd do anything (even murder) to protect his son. If he's helping Ben then Ben must have something on him. Like before, I figure that "something" is Walt.

Seems like you were correct.

Not so much. It seems Michael's doing this to make amends for the people he killed and friends he stabbed in the back in order to get Walt back and leave the island. I was assuming that Ben's people still had Walt and were holding him hostage in order to get Michael to do what he's doing now.

Ben has control over Michael by threatening him with telling the truth to Walt (or, at least, threatening him with telling Walt that Michael indirectly killed, if he did not help Ben, everyone on the island).

We learned in the last episode that Michael has already told Walt what happened and that is part of his reason for helping Ben [e.g., Tom (to Michael): "You told him didn’t you? Couldn't keep guilt of what you did (killing two women) so you shared it with a 10-year-old kid."]

Let's talk about Michael's episode (even though I have already discussed it a bit)! I really enjoyed this episode.

Me too. Well written and lots of information given this time.

Tom stated that the island will not let him kill himself (I like how the island, through the character's words, is becoming a character in it of itself - even Hurley, in his episode this season, stated that the island wants them to go back).

Michael's inability to kill himself in very reminiscent of Desmond's first time-jump after 'turning the key' in how he couldn't change a future event that was supposed to happen. IOW, Michael isn't supposed to die (yet) so no matter what he does or tries he can't off himself. I thought that was interesting and quite clever.

I really think that it isn't a surprise who shot Danielle and Karl. I think it is the Freighter People (think about it, the helicopter left the freighter - where else can it go besides the island?

Good point.

I cannot believe that Danielle is dead! She was supposed to get a flashback episode!

I imagine she'll still be a part of the story... her flashback episode would do just that.

I initially thought that Ben sent Alex (and her company) on a trail to find The Temple so that they could get captured so Ben could be exchanged for them

Not sure about the "exchanged for them" part but I also thought that Ben was setting them up.

Even when the shooting occurred, I thought that it would be Ben's people (up until, about, Alex screaming that she was Ben's daughter).

If her saying that stopped them from shooting her then we know that, at least, it wasn't the others doing the shooting as they would have already known who she was.


Well a friend of mine hooked me up with season one of Jericho so I'll be checking that out in the interim. So far, I like it. Not as well written as Lost (imho) but the premise is great and the acting isn't bad either.

Regards.

[edit on 27-3-2008 by Rren]

Hey all, semi-new member. Been watching lost since season 1.

After every episode, i will be happy to share my input.

Damn the writers strike!