Do people who aren’t Christian deserve be tortured in hell?

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You will never understand God, for he is God. God can send all of us to hell if he wanted to, but he is love and mercy. He sent his only beloved son Jesus Christ our lord and savior. He died on the cross for all of our sins and whoever believes in him shall have eternal life.

Originally posted by Yessy
Stop..... writing.....useless..... dots..... like..... this....

LOL, I am guilty of that at times...

well i say if ur evil u go 2 hell, if your good you go to heaven

I believe that there will be far fewer souls seperated from God forever than many people imagine. The Bible says that hell was made for ' the devil and his followers '. It takes an knowing and self willed denial of what a soul knows to be the case to be able to distance oneself from God. If a person is a floower of the devil, meaning a person that knows that Christ is deity and God is holy and in charge yet decides to follow the evil and wicked path..intentionally chooisng evil over good, knowledgeably, knowingly, with full consequences of their actions. There will be very few of those, guaranteed.

The mentally ill that spout demonic nonsense are not ' lost ' souls any more than some indian in the jungle that never heard the gospel. You cannot be tricked into ' hell ' the condition of total and permanent removal from God's realm and isolation from all others for eternity. God wishes that ' all ' sould be saved. Think of the desires of a father; he will bend over backwards to forgive and redeem a son, won't he? He will not judge harshy because of love; a loving father will never cast away a son: the child who leaves and does not return has not been banished, but is simply missing.

I have personal and direct knowledge of the existence of Christ and the reality of the spirit realm. I have never told the story on ATS or anywhere else online. Only a few friends know about it. I had a witness with me, thank God, to validate what happened. It was a ' supernatural ' event, in a way, although one might be more accurate in saying that it was perfectly natural, depending on the nature of God, his personality.

If enough people want me to tell it, I will, although I ask respect in advance despite whatever you make of the info. All I can do is tell the absolute truth in detail and leave it for others to determine the veracity of what I claim. I hesitate to even mention it because I open myself up for some ridicule, but then again the truth might benefit at least one other person out there and who cares about what the others think?

Direct knowledge does have some problems tho: It demands that you recognize what it means and what is expected, at least to a minimum degree. I feel awful because I know I am not living up to the standards that I could if I were able to totally put away anger, indignity, jealousy, rage, etc. from my life. I feel that someone who has been granted an extraordinay experience should be advanced and living a life exemplifying the reality of that is known..and when I give way to base emotions or allow myself to show less than good examples to others, I feel guilty.

It is a balance between living in the real world and dealing with people and things and trying to enter closer to the source and gaining needed help to comprehend the truth more fully..oh well..

well, god sending people who chose not to agree with him to hell to be tortured for all eternity shows that your deity clearly has the same level of emotional maturity as a child...
you don't agree with me, you're punished.
...let's see who'd be in hell...
gandhi
einstein
vonnegut

actually, i'm looking at this list of people who're atheists, and i guess hell might at least have good company if there is such a god...

I see christians as the ones being tortured by there faith and beleifs. As for atheist and none believers, they seem to be quite happy and content getting on with there lives. Religion makes it only look like life is hell bound to terrorize those who don't believe the bs.

Originally posted by ntech

Originally posted by andre18

Without giving it a whole lot of thought Christians will frequently say all those who don’t accept Jesus deserve to go to hell, they don’t deserve salvation, they deserve to be tortured forever.

Well, the Bible doesn't actually say that. Revelation says this.

20-12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

It's said that the dead would be judged by their works. But by going this route it apparently has a high standard. Higher than being redeemed through grace.

Being saved through grace appears to remove the uncertanity about how you would wind up. But even then it is mentioned that good works are required of the faithful as well.

James chap 2 is all about that subject. But summerized in 2-26.

2-26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Though one last detail here. A human soul is not immortal. It can be destroyed.

Matthew 10-28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Those unfortunates who don't make it through the white throne judgement won't last long in the lake of fire. They will simply cease to exist.

That is some very interesting stuff. Especially about the souls being able to be destroyed. The reason I say this was because I was at one point doing a comic book based on my own original character, where there was a war going on between angels and demons, and I did note that they "the souls" could actually be destroyed and I had never actually read the mentioned above. Yes, I have read the bible in the past, but never entirely, let alone that part... creepy.

reply to post by andre18


Nope. It's a good way for someone to hold your soul ransom. You know, "Do what I say or you will be tormented forever". I have a real problem with the concept of a creator that hates his creation simply for existing.
And yea yea I know "God so loved the world that he KILLED (temperarily) his only begotten son for the world's sin of existing even if he did create it. (supposedly)"

Which all nicely feeds the lie that is christianity, with its promise of saving from an non-existing crime in exchance for a life time of servitude to souless powermongers.

P.s. It's not the human thing called religion's fault the world is as it is it's the human capacity for GREED that ruins EVERYTHING.

[edit on 21-1-2008 by WraothAscendant]

Originally posted by WorldShadow
I see christians as the ones being tortured by there faith and beleifs. As for atheist and none believers, they seem to be quite happy and content getting on with there lives.

Ah. Happy and content you say? Then whats with the whole bitching about religion CONSTANTLY, you know your own anthems so I won't bother typing them back atcha.
You people forget the first rule of a fanatic. You obcess about the enemy you BECOME the enemy.,

Your belief system's desperation to convert the world is painfully obvious atheism.
Problem is, converting the world to one belief system is pretty impossible without wiping out a LARGE number of people. Even then, you will have divergence in later generations.
But I digress sorry OP.

[edit on 21-1-2008 by WraothAscendant]

hahahahaha what kind of religion is that?

"If you don't believe in me, you're going to hades."
*heres my one finger salute to that*

just...LOL nice thread, real nice...

reply to post by WraothAscendant


A big problem I have with the logic of Christianity, is why would god first create us in the first place and then send us to hell after we die…it’s like it purposely created us for the soul reason of going to hell…if god is all knowing…it would have known when it created me, that I was going to hell…..eventually when I die, because I’m an atheist…it doesn’t make any sense, it’s like purposely having a baby for the soul purpose of sending it to jail…..

Why did god create me knowing I was going to be an atheist……and then Christians tell me it’s my bloody fault…..? lol

“ you have sinned….you don’t believe in our heavenly father….god will punish you in hell…”



[edit on 21-1-2008 by andre18]

reply to post by andre18

Well being a "spiritualist" I think that there are no judgements on your soul that stick you don't make yourself.
You get to see the cause and effect of every act in your life and you get to pass judgement on yourself.
God (read this reality) does$ not judge anymore than you judge your individual mussle (yea I misspelled I jusst got up hEh) cells.

reply to post by andre18


Oh and you might want to avoid throwing out the proverbial baby with the bathwater there friend. Christianity is cracked, that is not everyone. As most atheists seem to forget and think they are the only ones who aren't cracked (arrogences anyone?). I say we all are in different ways.

In the kingdom of the blind the one eyed man does not exist. The rulers of the kingdom of the blind the blind man that can best pretend to see is king.

"Do people who aren’t Christian deserve be tortured in hell?"


Sure, the same way as people who aren't Hindu nor Buddhist should suffer in Narak.

The same way as people who aren't Muslim should suffer in Jahannam.

The same way as people who aren't Jewish should suffer in Gehenna.

The same way as people who don't follow the ancient Mayan path should suffer in Xibalba.

The same way as people who don't follow the ancient Greek path should suffer in Tartarus.

The same way as people who don't follow the ancient Briton path should suffer in Anaon.

The same way as people who don't follow the ancient Celtic path should suffer in Uffern.

The same way as people who don't follow the Lapps nor Ugarian paths should suffer in Manala.

The same way as people who don't follow the ancient Sumerian path should suffer in Aralu.

The same way as people who don't follow the ancient Indian path should suffer in Kalichi.

The same way as people who don't follow the African Heida nor Swahili paths should suffer in Hetgwauge.

The same way as people who don't follow the Aztec path should suffer in Mictlan.

The same way as people who don't follow the Inuit path should sufferin Adlivun.

The same way as people who aren't Yanomamo should suffer in Shobari Waka.

The same way as people who aren't Samoan should suffer in O le nu'u-o-nonoa.

Get it?

;-)

reply to post by tankthinker

I think you're misunderstanding Christianity.. Christians do not want people to go to hell, that's like, totally defeating the purpose of the whole religion/gospel. The fact is, we all deserve it (see Romans 3:10). That whole sin thing? It's all too real. There's no getting around it. And if we die and don't have a personal relationship with Christ (as stereotypical as that sounds), we "reap what we sew," if you will. Now, I personally haven't seen Hostel, but I have heard the same things about its graphic content. But the Passion of the Christ? That's pretty graphic, as well. Whether or not you believe Jesus was as much God as he was man, there's no denying he did exist and was in fact crucified. The Crucifixion was known as the most gruesome possible death anyone could have to go through, and in reference to it a Roman officer recorded that no one should even have to think about such torment. But that's what Jesus went through so we WOULDN'T have to go through hell (Romans 8:1 and, yes, John 3:16). Anyway, I hope that helped some...

Originally posted by WraothAscendant

Originally posted by WorldShadow
I see christians as the ones being tortured by there faith and beliefs. As for atheist and none believers, they seem to be quite happy and content getting on with there lives.

Ah. Happy and content you say? Then whats with the whole bitching about religion CONSTANTLY, you know your own anthems so I won't bother typing them back atcha.
You people forget the first rule of a fanatic. You obcess about the enemy you BECOME the enemy.,

Your belief system's desperation to convert the world is painfully obvious atheism.
Problem is, converting the world to one belief system is pretty impossible without wiping out a LARGE number of people. Even then, you will have divergence in later generations.
But I digress sorry OP.

[edit on 21-1-2008 by WraothAscendant]

Thats what I say!. Look at world problems my friend. How many atheist are torturing people in the name of atheism or is it god most high they do it for. How many atheist want woman covered up from head to toe, or want infidels killed, wives beaten, children abused for not following there faith based deity. What about proving your god exist. Bring it forward to say a few words or maybe show its face, snap a finger to end wars, famine, disease, cause a thunderclap over the earth to wake up the fallen. For your gods sake prove it is real and not an imaginative fairy tale that all should fall to there knees and faithfully pray to it without results. In the bible the enemy is written as those who do not believe. Atheist claim no enemy as religion does, nor do atheist claim religious victories over the defeated. The only belief system wanting to change the world is Christianity and other related doctrines. Thank your god for atheism because it doesn't seem to really care all that much. Just so you know not to include me in your suppositions, I am not an atheist.

This why i think religion are just dictatorship.

Believe in me or get hurt.

So in seeing so much religious people influencing so much the mass( us, you and me[ not really me as i'm agnostic] ), i just can understand why the world is going so bad.
I think people should stop to believe in any religion, religion are just there the control us, to keep us in line, not to reach a so-called paradise.

We should learn to our kids that acting bad is concerning them and those they are cheating/beating, they will both have problem later, affection/psycologic problems.
not told them " if you are acting bad you will go in hell ", they will just be scared, they will not acting good because of the respect but because they are afraid to go in hell.

Also if you need a religion or simply a book to ride your life, you must be very boring person.

Goddamit go out, have some fun as you can with your friends and people you don't know, enjoy your life, have sex with who you want girl or boy, drink or whatever you do until you can't anymore, in one word: LIVE
Don't be a closed minded cause of a book or a so called creator.
but the question is, does he created us to his image or did we created him to our images? i guess the second question, that could explain why this "god" do nothing to help his comrade.

reply to post by MaatiHemet


wow it's a plenty of unknow places that i will travel when i'll be dead, do you have some postcards or stuff? just to get a first impression of these sites.
I'm so exited that i could shot me a bullet in the head and go for this trip right now!
How long is it during? do i need passeport or stuff? money?

kind regards.


P.s. if i have a ticket left i'll can take you with me but i can't be sure yet, i'll let you know about that.

www.rael.org...

There is no hell. "Heaven" refers to the paradise which humanity can provide for itself, provided it chooses to do so. Otherwise, we can continue to live with primitive belief systems and mysticism and remain in "hell".

Originally posted by andre18Do you see god as your father, “our heavenly father” if so…..then god must be masculine and in which case….god has masculine features….including a dick

Sorry, for one line, but ROFL at that response. I was laughing so hard.