Ron Paul Wins Nevada Republican Assembly Straw Poll

money.aol.com...

JAN 7, 2008

"Ron Paul supporters showed their dedication by coming out to vote in the middle of a snow storm," said Jennifer Terhune, a Nevada-based spokeswoman for the Ron Paul campaign. "Dr. Paul's message of freedom, peace and prosperity is resonating with Nevadans."

The Ron Paul campaign has over two hundred and thirty registered volunteers in the Reno area, as well as over six hundred in Las Vegas.

Ron Paul has had other recent straw poll victories in northern Nevada. He won the Conservative Leadership Conference straw poll last October with 32% of the vote, and a Washoe County Republican Party straw poll in the same month with an overwhelming 41% of support from local Republicans.

A straw poll is a straw poll and not many people voted in it (over 90, according to the article), but still it is encouraging to see him gaining support all over the country.

Perhaps we will have ourselves a little revolution after all.

In other news, a current AOL straw poll shows RP in the lead in every state so far, with a little over 31,000 votes in. Overall percentage at this time shows 32%.

A whopping 65% in D.C. Seriously - go vote, check it out. RP all the way.

news.aol.com...

^^^ Cast your vote here.

You have to realize he doesn't really have any chance at all, right?

Here are some polls, a group actually, from reputable polling agencies..

USA/Gallop.... 01/10/08.... Paul 3%

Washington Post/ABC News ...... 01/12/08 .... Paul 3%

CBS/New York Times... 01/09/08.... Paul 5%

American Research Group..... 01/09/08 ... Paul 5%

CNN/ Opinion Research Corp... 01/09/08 ... Paul 5%

Pew Research ..... 01/09/08 ..... Paul 4%

Fox News .... 12/18/07 ... Paul 3%

Facebook... 10/19/07 .. Paul 6%

NBC/WallStreet Journal .... 12/14/07... Paul 4%

Reuters/Zogby..... 12/12/07... Paul 4%

Polling Report.com

(There are several others, see the URL, but they are all in line with those I posted.)

The fact is no matter how passionate we may feel about any one single candidate, that wont get them elected. Paul does NOT have the national support his ardent advocates claim/wish that he had. That is a simple fact.

He will not get the nomination.

That is also a fact, not with 3 to 6 percent of the population in favor of him. Not even if he doubled those numbers which is not likely to happen anytime soon.

All of the hype in the world is not going to get anyone elected.

It is also a fact that many of the actions, as I personally saw, of the Paul supporters scare the heck out the the single largest voting group in the country. "Middle Class, age 40 to 70"

All the screaming, throwing things and yelling obscenities at supporters of other candidates is only alienating Paul even more.

Don't fret too much, if I called the right people, I could get a favorable opinion on Felix the Cat for President...

Semper

reply to post by semperfortis


OK... exactly how are those polls conducted?

Over the phone with "likely republican voters?"

There is no way that this isn't going to keep growing -- mark my words. You see what happens when the "polls" are open to the public; it's happened time and time again.

Naysay if you want; I (and many others) choose to be an Agent of Change.

Now hold on a minute...

Naysay if you want; I (and many others) choose to be an Agent of Change.

How can you possibly be an Agent of Change when you defend YOUR "single" poll and deny the many "I" put out for comparison?????

I completely don't understand that line of reason...

Are you only defending polls that give you the results you desire?

That is not denying ignorance at all now is it?

You say in the polls I display, they called "likely Republicans", how do you know they did not call "Likely Ron Paul Supporters" in the "90" people they called for your poll?

Come on now, that makes no sense at all...


Semper

reply to post by semperfortis


I don't deny them, first of all, and as I said in my initial post, a straw poll is just a straw poll... indicating that I am aware that it is unreliable for predicting real-world votes. I think the mainstream polls are purposely narrowed and published so as to give the public an impression, personally.

I was merely commenting on the fact that whether people like it or not, Ron Paul has a national following; now whether or not it is enough to win the nomination? That remains to be seen. I have my doubts but I have my encouragements as well. When my wife and I are sign-waving, we get a very high number of thumbs-up/honks in comparison to thumbs-down or even the occasional "birdie."

There are many other signs that this is by no means over, and we will not be discouraged by media blackouts, political hits, or the standard rhetoric we get from the "front-runners." They are like children up there, cracking their jokes while the country has gone to Hell and they lie through thier teeth about it. I think they think we're stupid.



Now the thing that is interesting about the Nevada story (did you read the story?) is that this was at a republican commitee meeting in the real-world. These were boots-on-the-ground "I'm here and I will be counted" votes, not internet clicks or phone polls a la telemarketer. Again, it's just a straw poll. But it is interesting nonetheless, because people who vote in straw polls at the republican committee are likely to vote in the primary. That's my point, not that straw polls are the bottom line. Not to mention they "came out in a snowstorm" to do it.

To be fair, Hillary has about twice the number of votes in the aol straw poll referenced above, which is active until Jan. 21. That disgusts and terrifies me, but there you have it.

Look at what is happening to cause our economy to come crashing down around our ears and then tell me who's the only one talking about that, and more importantly, how to fix it. We cannot continue to bleed like we are currently. Unless people wake up to that fact, we're all seriously screwed -- and that's just the tip of the iceberg. In all of the videos I have seen of him speaking, he came across as honest and sincere in what he said. He believes in what he is saying, which is more than I can say for anyone else in the race.

You want denying ignorance? Check out some videos of RP speaking in the House of Representatives. He is certainly comfortable there, and has no problems as you descrbed from the SC debates. I thought he did well there given what he was up against, by the way -- that little bastard asking stupid questions and everyone waiting for their chance at a one-liner and all.

Disgusting, but not unexpected.

We will be heard.

[edit on 1/15/08 by The Axeman]

My perception of the economy is completely different from yours as I am doing very well as are my friends and associates. I expect to be doing just as well or better in the near future..

However we differ in a number of ways, so I will not waste time here giving examples. I for one would not back one poll over another just because it fit my agenda...

However, I wish you the best of luck in your endeavor.

Semper

Well that's great for you but what about the rest of us that have to balance groceries, rent/mortgage, utilities, child care, transportation, skyrocketing fuel and health care costs, and ever-increasing taxes? What about them? They just have a "different perspective," eh?

Pfffft. Arrogance at its finest.

How about a lesson on why our economy is doomed and why it is such an important issue: Money as Debt

As for the polling issue, see my above comments which you ignored in order to take a shot at me for being audacious enough to challenge a system that is robbing my family of buying power every day.

Watch that film, and then tell me that our economy is OK. Go ahead. I dare you.

[edit on 1/15/08 by The Axeman]

It' a problem.
The polling techniques.
It shows that Paul has not broken through the invisible wall between the internet, and Mainstream. There are still many any people that have not heard of him. Other's in this same group only have Television to inform them.
And Television has been instrumental in denying him a fair shake.

Semper,

Why are you able to put yourself in the Iraqi point of view, when it comes to Democracy. But, you're a bit stubborn, when it comes to putting yourself in the point of view of Americans, when it comes to the Economy?

If an American is at fault for their own economic destiny, why isn't an Iraqi in charge of his/her own destiny?

But, you're a bit stubborn, when it comes to putting yourself in the point of view of Americans, when it comes to the Economy?

Well I can come back now as the conversation has improved..

Despite selective editing...

I do consider myself "putting myself in the point of view of Americans" ignoring my double entendre'.

The fact of the matter is I don't see the doom and gloom that some do. I have heard all the "over and over again hype" about how the debt is going to destroy America.. MAN!!! Have I heard it to death. The strange thing is that we all are still here, all still plugging along and all still doing pretty well. What the doom sayers are forecasting is nothing new, in fact it is as old as time, only the venue has changed from placards on the street corner, to forum boards on the internet...

Everyone wants to complain about how bad they are doing, but they can obviously afford luxuries like the internet and a computer. Now I have been poor, WAY too poor for such things, did without a TV for YEARS while my kids were growing up and I was raising them on my own, much less a computer or the internet. So the "Internet Sob Stories fall on deaf ears...

As for Tax breaks. I love it when people complain that there are no tax breaks for the poor.. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

Now recall I have been poor...... and answer me this....

Why do the poor need a tax break?

They already get 100% of their money back... YES THEY DO.... And if they have a kid or two, they get some of my money on top of all of theirs back...

Poor? Naw, I have been and seen poor... If they can type it here, they are not poor...

Now back on topic for a minute...

That is one HUGE problem with RP supporters. Besides the juvenile actions you can see on the street at one of their protests or rallies, their inconsistencies are glaring examples of their lack of research or interest in any other point of view. For instance the backing of one poll over numerous others all because one particular poll expressed their own desires. Perfect example....

Add to that the reaction to my pointing this out and you have a volatile reactionary instead of a serious political pundit.

Are these supporters the "mark" of a serious candidate? Not for me or any of the groups I belong to and that is showing in the polls and RP's showing thus far.

Semper

reply to post by semperfortis


Selective editing nothing. I let my passions get the best of me, went ad hominem, and said something I shouldn't have. The post was removed, so I rewrote it and toned it down. I still stand by the original statement, however.

Did you even watch the film? No, of course not... because you seem to be fond of dismissing my arguments out-of-hand. If you had, perhaps you would have something constructive to add; maybe a comment or two on why you feel the logic and info presented in the video is flawed. I have a friend that is a banker by profession, and he didn't have any specific beef with it; in fact he commented that he pretty much agrees with the conclusions, and that the system we have is inevitably going to collapse and needs to change. It's only a matter of time.

Funnily, you mention that this has all been said before... but, those cultures/empires/nations who depended on something like our current system have invariably fallen, usually due to economic reasons. We've seen it happen time and time again... what makes you think we are immune? If you didn't watch the video and see what was presented, say so. Don't try to debate the issue if you haven't looked at the material; it only makes you look ignorant.

I'm not saying I'm dirt poor, but I have a family of 5 trying to make it on a single income. Whether the money comes back or not is not the point. The tax is illegal and it is indeed a racket. I don't know about you, but I'd rather have my full paycheck every two weeks than give the government an interest free loan so they can pay the Fed the interest on the money the government borrows from them, and risk being arrested or audited if I don't dot all the i's and cross all the t's. It's BS and if you can't see it you're either blind or you just don't care. Either is dangerous.

When every single dollar already has interest attached to it when it is printed, there can never be enough money in circulation to cover the debts. It is perpetual and ever-increasing. It's a scam, and we've been complacent with it so long that everyone just accepts it now. Sad, really. The Grace Commission found that 100% of revenues from income tax goes right to the Federal Reserve as interest. It's disgusting. We need to give congress control of the money again, the way it's supposed to be according to the Constitution.

And again with the polls... you really don't pay attention to what is being said, do you? I stated IN MY ORIGINAL POST that a straw poll is just a straw poll. The difference is the one referred to in the OP was a straw poll IN PERSON at a Republican Committee meeting, not a phone-based poll, which is what you cited. Not to mention the fact that the "reputable" polling sources are attached to the "reputable" news sources... so... It's not exactly a shocker that Paul does poorly in those polls.

Likewise, it doesn't surprise me that, in other polls that aren't specifically targeted, Congressman Paul does much better. What does that mean? Nothing really, except that the media bias is as evident as ever. Try to make me an "example" of what you describe if you want to, but that's like saying "My son loves apples. Want proof? Look at him devouring that orange!"

My "reaction" before was to you implying that my problem with the economy is a "perceptual" one, and as such you presume that I am somehow less "well off" (paraphrase) than you are. That was a dispicable comment and it pissed me off. My mistake was letting you bait me into lashing out instead of arguing the point.

You continue to misrepresent my position and switch around my words to make it appear that I am taking the position you claim with regard to the polls. That is not the case. I've explained it, you ignored it (repeatedly) and I think I made it pretty clear how I view the straw polls.

Let me say it again, just in caseyou missed it or you didn't understand: Straw polls, no matter the outcomes, are not necessarily indicative of real-world votes -- what is interesting is the difference in the results based on the sponsors, manner, and venue of the polls.

Please continue to argue your point, but do not put words into my mouth. You want to debate the economy? I'm game. Bring it on, guy.

Regardless of grassroots tactics, the word is getting out. The more telling observation is that young people are actually interested and give a crap about what is happening for a change. If Ron Paul does nothing else, the young people, the FUTURE of this nation, are being made aware of what is happening in this country and they actually CARE. That's huge, I don't care what you say.

Before Ron Paul, most people under 30 were so jaded and tired of politics as usual that many, many of them didn't ever even bother to vote because they felt like it wouldn't make a difference. "Granny Smith, or Golden Delicious," they say. "Who cares," the kids say, "Give me a friggin' orange!" Now Ron Paul is that orange. We (young voting age Americans, specifically) see some hope for change -- REAL change -- and that gets people fired up. Juvenile tactics probably means juveniles are taking notice, and THAT, my friend, is encouraging.

So, the economy: tell me why it's so great and you don't think it's a problem (other than "My associates and I doing very well." ). How are we to avoid the whole house of cards (make no mistake, it is a house of cards) from crashing down on our heads?



[edit on 1/15/08 by The Axeman]

It' a problem.
The polling techniques.
It shows that Paul has not broken through the invisible wall between the internet, and Mainstream. There are still many any people that have not heard of him. Other's in this same group only have Television to inform them.
And Television has been instrumental in denying him a fair shake.

I disagree.

Not with the polling, of course you are correct there, but with RP's exposure. Several debates. The internet and the media have not ignored him any more than they have ignored any other candidate with his numbers.

The simple fact is there is only so much broadcast time and they have to manage it in accordance with what they see as desirable by the viewers. regarles of what some of the more rabid RP followers want to tell us, "we" the public do not need anyone telling us who we should be listening to.

That is the crux of the problem though isn't it? People again thinking they have the right to know what is best for us. The old and tired, "Ron Paul must be what is best for America because it is what I believe." "Ron Paul has to be put on more television because it is what "I" want to see and it's good for America."

Last I checked the numbers for election coverage were through the roof, indicating no shortage of viewers that are tuning in to what "they" want to see. Regardless of what RP followers tell them is good for them. "We", the American Public, want to see our candidates, the ones polling above 5%, and not spending an inordinate amount of time on the ones polling less. Simple numbers. If "we" wanted to see more RP, "we" would be more than 5 or 6 %. (If you go with the majority of the polls and not the single one of course)

Spacedoubt my friend, I find I need to prepare for a debate and there are other threads demanding my attention. The floor is all yours.

I'm gone.

Semper

Originally posted by semperfortis
If "we" wanted to see more RP, "we" would be more than 5 or 6 %. (If you go with the majority of the polls and not the single one of course)

...and all the polls following the debates that were open to everyone... contrary to what Hannity says, you cannot vote twice in those polls, at least from the same phone, anyway.

And polls like these: "Ron Paul has had other recent straw poll victories in northern Nevada. He won the Conservative Leadership Conference straw poll last October with 32% of the vote, and a Washoe County Republican Party straw poll in the same month with an overwhelming 41% of support from local Republicans."

But it's just the one...

[edit on 1/15/08 by The Axeman]

Good for Nevada!

And for the record...

Ron Paul won the MySpace primaries with 37% of the Republican vote.

Ron Paul won the MySpace primaries with 37% of the Republican vote.

Who was second on the Myspace primary, Barney the Dinosaur?



Just kidding apc...

But Myspace is hardly as scientific as the numerous professional polls I referenced above...

But I guess one can go on whatever one chooses. Just like the 5% that support Paul have every right to vote for him. I applaud there/your tenacity apc.

Semper

there is another online primary over at www.newsmax.com...

reply to post by semperfortis

Yeah not legitimate at all, no doubt. For all I know 14 year olds could vote and they went by user not IP. And the polls you reference are indeed scientific, as social engineering is in fact a science. Any good salesman can get you to say just about anything, and pollsters are some of the best.

Then of course you have to look at the demographic factors... these are polling calls made over landlines, yes? Most people under the age of 30 don't have a landline these days. What's funny is I do have a landline and I haven't gotten a single political call this round.

Polling on college campuses? Can you say rampant socialism? FOX News, NBC, CNN? Now they wouldn't manipulate their polls! Gallop? The same polling agency that found most people thought Republicans control the gas prices? I'm surprised they even included Paul in their questions.

It's noteworthy that almost every poll that uses human interrogation shows low numbers for Ron Paul. But every one that is straight from the horse's mouth shows Paul on top.







[edit on 15-1-2008 by apc]

Come on apc. I've debated issues with you before and your better than that. I know you back RP, but you are also aware enough and in-touch enough to know you can excuse away anything, but only so far before it becomes ridiculous...

To imagine some HUGE conspiracy against a candidate as minor as RP is a stretch even the reptilian believers would scoff at.

He really is not that big a player. I know and understand that you want him to be, but he is not.

He has a large internet following of youngsters and radicals such as I saw at the MB debates, but only about 3 to 5% that vote.

Make every excuse in the book if it makes you feel better, but the fact remains he has no chance of getting the nomination. Not if he was aired 24/7 on TV.

He will not be the President, not this term anyway. All of those indicators can't be wrong, every single pollster I listed is not corrupt, every vote is not rigged to exclude Ron Paul.

Semper

Under the new conspiracy laws co-conspirators can be indicted even if they have no knowledge of the actions of other conspirators.

Unlikely I know, but what do you think will happen if every radical and youngster votes? At 25 I suppose I'm still a youngster. I've never voted before (maybe that's why I didn't get a poll), and I've triple checked to make sure my registration is current. I'm going to be in line, and I know I won't be alone.

You old people better be shakin' in your penny loafers.

Originally posted by semperfortis
The internet and the media have not ignored him any more than they have ignored any other candidate with his numbers.

The simple fact is there is only so much broadcast time and they have to manage it in accordance with what they see as desirable by the viewers. regarles of what some of the more rabid RP followers want to tell us, "we" the public do not need anyone telling us who we should be listening to.

Care to reevaluate that statement?

www.msnbc.msn.com...

Of the three candidates who competed hard in Michigan, Romney needed a victory the most to right a bid weakened by the searing losses in Iowa and New Hampshire. He was the only one to watch the voting returns in Michigan; his top Michigan opponents, McCain and Huckabee, campaigned in Michigan earlier but flew out of the state by afternoon to plant themselves in South Carolina, which votes Saturday.

Feeling optimistic in the run-up to the Michigan voting, Romney went back on the air with TV ads in South Carolina after a brief hiatus.
Fred Thompson, a former Tennessee senator, has been camping out in South Carolina looking for his first win. Rudy Giuliani, the former New York mayor, is doing the same in Florida, which votes Jan. 29.
Guiliani adviser Tony Carbonetti congratulated Romney on his Michigan win.

"It's clear after tonight that while the race remains fluid and competitive, our strategy remains on track," Carbonetti said. "Rudy is going to continue to campaign aggressively in Florida, and after the energy we've seen on the trail this past week, we're confident that we'll be successful on the 29th."

Ron Paul has gotten more votes than both Giuliani and that Fred Thompson clown - almost s much as both of them put together... yet there they arementioned in the NBC article -- he even beat them both in this primary -- and not so much as a mention of his name.

Yeah. He's getting fair coverage, alright.

Eye rolling, wink-and-a-nod coverage.

You'd think Ron Paul was a UFO.

Gotta love the fact that he whooped Rudy and Fred.
Remember how Fred "won" that last debate in SC?
cracks me up.