Religious beliefs over laws. Reasons people fear religion.

Religion and Laws don't mix. it should be legal to practice your religion without government rules and regulations. let's speculate for a moment. A man follows a Mayan religion. Let's call it, "Mayanism". According to his religion it's ok to sacrifice someone on top of a pyramid. Should the government allow this? I think..yes. Otherwise, wouldn't the government be violating his constitutional rights? I think so.

A man practices a religion that says that he can have 12 wives. And that he can then marry all his daughters. should that be allowed if it's his belief? his religion? this is the reason I think that the goverment and many people fear religion. because it gives you more freedoms that society won't accept.


A man feels that a friend has been a bad person. And in the bible GOD killed many people for being sinners. So, let's say that this man feels that his friend is a sinner..and he kills him. it's his belief, his religion..and therefore the government and regulations shouldn't apply. I know this might sound extremely absurd. But think about it, we let people dress up like dead people during halloween..we cut trees during christmas and dress up like Santa.

Think about the spanish conquistadors and the killing of the american indians. We saw them killing people and sacrificing them over mountains and taking their hearts out, and in the name of GOD decided it was wrong. So we killed them. So the question remains, do you think that Laws should be imposed on religion and acts of religion. I think it shouldn't and anyone who works under a religion is free of all government law. Discuss.

[edit on 13-1-2008 by jedimiller]

People should have the right to practice thier religion in any way that they need. However, just as all discussions regarding rights and freedoms -

the right for you to practice your religion ends at my throat. You do not and should not have the right to practice your religion to the point that it infringes on anyone elses rights.

"an it harm none, do what thou will" applies in this case

Can you sum up for me why you feel that this should be on ATS as opposed to BTS? I do realize that this is just another "jedi special" written simply to get responses due to the insane or inflamatory nature of thread. However, I am curious about how you justify it.

Originally posted by Karlhungis
Can you sum up for me why you feel that this should be on ATS as opposed to BTS? I do realize that this is just another "jedi special" written simply to get responses due to the insane or inflamatory nature of thread. However, I am curious about how you justify it.

I been thinking about this for a while. I heard about the man who killed his dauthers and said that something had gone wrong. He was a wican I believe and he was doing a spell that went "terribly wrong" and he stabbed them. That's what I heard from the news. And it got me thinking, shouldn't people be able to practice their religion without the government getting involved? I know it sounds insane, but again think about Gibson's message in Apocalypto..the Mayans sacrificed and killed people and they believed in the sun god and the crops and such. So in essence if you are doing it for the right cause, and the ammendment gives you the right why is it illegal and why does the governemnt get involved.

If Tom Cruise wants to clone his children..and his religion accepts it, then who's the government to say otherwise.

reply to post by jedimiller


IMHO you say that if my religion is based up on sacrificing Trollers on ATS, then you are ok with it? That I simply can march in to your house and stab you down in the name of my god, whom I believe so dearly in?

The one commandment
1. Kill trollers on internett forums.
2. Stone to death the one who believes in Egyptian Cat-people.

etc ..

It's like anarchist, they are all for anarchy, but in reality, they would have been the first to be killed if it was anarchy. A funny dilemma.

Edit: Can someone please put a post quarantine on this guy?

[edit on 13-1-2008 by tep200377]

ummmm.......maybe the mayan needs to find themselves a willing sacrifice???

but then, our society and laws seem to infringe on a person's right to kill themselves also, don't they?

our government infringes on our rights all the time, and gives wide avenues for others to also. and the problem will probably just get worse.
so, who cares about the danged mayan's right to kill my virgin daughter against her will? I have the right to put a bullet into the side of his head when he comes into my home to get her!

Ok, I understand. Guess this thread wasn't such a good idea. I was just trying to explain why I think religion can't be regulated by government and why it shouldn't ....and those examples I gave, didn't help.

The answer to this problem is to simply outlaw religion. Thereby the state will be infringing on everyone's rights equally. Of course the penalty for practising religion would have to be death

Originally posted by jedimiller
Religion and Laws don't mix. it should be legal to practice your religion without government rules and regulations. let's speculate for a moment. A man follows a Mayan religion. Let's call it, "Mayanism". According to his religion it's ok to sacrifice someone on top of a pyramid. Should the government allow this? I think..yes.

this is where i stopped. a man should be able to sacrifice someone else and the gov should allow it. now i am not usually in favor of more laws but your rights stop where mine begin...

maybe you being a start wars freak is not why you are alone. maybe it is cause you have warped ass views like this..

matter of fact though i don't think you believe this for one second. as i think about it i think you are trolling as someone has already mentioned. gotta be.

i'm outta here

If your religion brainwashes you into thinking something like human sacrifice is acceptable in the name of God, then the government needs to step in and save you and others from your own lunacy.

reply to post by AshleyD


...oh the irony of saying that with a METHOD OF EXECUTION as your avatar....


the government shouldn't dictate what people believe, but, as boon already said, your rights end where mine begin.

if your religion says that 8 years old can take a sip of wine... whatever, go with it on that one
if your religion says that it's ok to stone homosexuals to death... sorry, not legal at all. you can believe you should be stoning them to death, but the second you stone them you must be punished.

I understand what you're saying. You know everyone, particularly fundamentalists, talk about how "evil" Babylon was. Do you know why it was perceived to be "evil?" Excessive freedom.

Babylon was a culture where you could practice any religion you chose without infringement. You could pretty much kill someone without having your "rights" infringed upon. Yet, most view Babylon as an "evil" civilization.

Why? Simple. If you have, let's say, group A who thinks that there should be rules and regulations and you have a group B which claims everything is beyond the natural laws of man, you're going to have an issue. If group A is a majority, they are going to quickly label group B as "evil."

[edit on 15-1-2008 by SpeakerofTruth]

Religion is a POISON,
A prison,
A means of ultimate CONTROL.
The ultimate way to seperate people.
the ultimate excuse for WAR.
the ultimate way to steere you away from your true path with god.

only when religions are proven and excepted to be LIES, will mankind
live as one.

we all are one ...is that so hard to understand?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
...oh the irony of saying that with a METHOD OF EXECUTION as your avatar....

Well, I tried using an image of Stalin, Mao Tse-Tung, and various atheist role models as my avatar but it wouldn't fit!

Seriously though, crucifixion was not a method of religious execution but a form of political execution performed by the sovereign government of Rome, among others. And I'm darn thankful for what my God endured for me... and for you even if you choose to never accept it. Anyways, relax. It's an avatar. One I will never change so you might as well get used to seeing it around.

But please help me sleep a little easier tonight and allow me to give you the benefit of the doubt that you do indeed know what the cross stands for and that it is not a rallying symbol to start gathering people up and crucifying them? Thanks.

Originally posted by AshleyD
Well, I tried using an image of Stalin, Mao Tse-Tung, and various atheist role models as my avatar but it wouldn't fit!

wow...divergently off topic and uninformed...
tempted to address it... but this isn't the thread for it.
bring it up somewhere more relevant, i've torn that sort of line to pieces many a time.

Seriously though, crucifixion was not a method of religious execution but a form of political execution performed by the sovereign government of Rome, among others.

um...clearly
i'm just saying... you're encouraging one form of human sacrifice, but not another.

And I'm darn thankful for what my God endured for me... and for you even if you choose to never accept it.

too bad he sort of wimped out on it and didn't even endure the AVERAGE crucifixion length, let alone the worst torture imaginable...
and yes, i know he was scourged...others were too, and still had longer crucifixions
hell, some were up there for so long that they broke their legs to speed things up...

Anyways, relax. It's an avatar. One I will never change so you might as well get used to seeing it around.

that's a bit bland and boring... at least use a different cross if you intend on using one.

But please help me sleep a little easier tonight and allow me to give you the benefit of the doubt that you do indeed know what the cross stands for and that it is not a rallying symbol to start gathering people up and crucifying them?

...well, considering how much i've studied religion... obviously
but you missed my point that is is ironic that you're saying it's bad for one religion to think constant human sacrifice is good while your religion continuously glorifies a human sacrific

and...well...
if i was jesus coming back to earth, i'd probably not really appreciate that bad memory being dangled around everyone's neck...
i'd probably wonder why you don't have something a bit more upbeat..

and i actually find it as a rallying symbol for people to crucify people

well...metaphorically

it crucifies their common sense as they give into their base instincts of fear....
but that's just my opinion that i could back up if that's what this thread was about

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


Goodness, I can't believe you just made that big post about my avatar. I mean, it's your right of course but... it's an avatar. Don't be a nitpicking whiner. It's an avatar on an internet forum. There's people dying in this world from starvation and disease but you've got your panties in a bunch about my avatar. Put up your own avatar. I promise, I won't complain about whatever you put up. It's none of my business because I realize it's not worth being upset about an avatar.

A Christian agrees that people who do horrible things in the name of religion are disgusting and an atheist still finds something to complain about. Something as meaningless as an avatar. On an internet forum. I think you might need to get some perspective.