How to keep savings intact in an economic collapse?

I wasn't sure where to post this question so mods, please move if necessary.

I need some advice on keeping my savings intact if and when the economy crashes. I've read that savings in the bank is insured but 401k accounts are not, so they could be lost. Should I keep the money in 401k or should I do something else to protect it? I've also read about buying silver coins that would be valuable in a survivalist situation.

reply to post by annestacey



In an economic collapse ..the only thing worth anything is food...money, silver gold.. will be worthless!!

I'm pushing this back out since it's been awhile and I've gotten no useful information at all.

Should I take my money out of the 401k? Should I take my money out of my checking account?

reply to post by annestacey



Well, I was going to agree with the other poster and say to invest in ammo and gold.

Just make sure you don't have all your eggs in one basket. That's probably the best thing to do.

Other than that, I really don't have any magical advise to pass on. Wish I did.

any money that you do not have in gold will be of no use in the event of severe economic collapse.

savings, checking, investments can all be frozen or even taken away in the event of martial law. as early as the nixon administration, executive orders were set in place by the executive branch that allow the president to declare a state of national emergency with very little reason. economic distress clearly falls under this umbrella. one of the more poignant executive orders, #11490, is a compilation of some 23 previous executive orders, outlining emergency functions which are to be performed by over 20 executive agencies and departments whenever the president declares
a national emergency (as in severe recession, or in defiance of an impeachment edict). under the terms of 11490, the president can declare that a national emergency exists and the executive branch can:
- take over all communications media
- seize all sources of power
- take charge of all food resources
- control all highways and seaports
- seize all railroads, inland waterways, airports, storage facilities
- commandeer all civilians to work under federal supervision
- control all activities relating to health, education, and welfare
- shift any segment of the population from one locality to another
- take over farms, ranches, timberized properties
- regulate the amount of your own money you may withdraw from
your bank, or savings and loan institution

paper money will be no good, as it is only worth anything now because the government chooses to acknowledge it. formerly, when our money was backed by gold, the statement on the front of a bill read "REEDEEMABLE IN GOLD ON DEMAND AT THE UNITED STATES TREASURY, OR IN GOLD OR LAWFUL MONEY AT ANY FEDERAL RESERVE BANK." note the period. the period makes the bill into a binding contract between the bearer and the federal reserve. our money now reads "THIS NOTE IS LEGAL TENDER FOR ALL DEBTS, PUBLIC AND PRIVATE". there is no period, making this statement, not a sentence, but a clause, and therefore it may be subject to change at any time upon the whim of the issuer. paper money no longer serves as a contract between the bearer and the federal reserve, rather a loose commitment that is only honorable until that clause is closed, either with a period, or with another sentence fragment.

the federal reserve could declare all paper money currently in circulation worthless at any point in time.

hope that gives you a better idea as to what to do with your extra funds.

Thanks for that information dominusluciferi.

So if I wanted to stock up on some gold, where would be the best places to buy it and in what form?

moneycentral.msn.com...

when reading the above article, remember that if you don't have it in your posession, you may never see it.

Coin shops, jewelry stores, gold dealers, and sometimes banks.

Great! I know what you mean and yes I would be looking for the product to be in my possession. Thanks so much for the info.

First of all you should realize that any money you take from your 401K before 59.5 years old, will mean 10% penalties + regular income tax. Your 401K should offer you many different investment options. There should be fixed income,metals, etc. Plenty of refuge if thats what you want.

If I were you, I would not pull the money out and pay the penalties and taxes. Instead change your investment allocation if you must, though it doesn't sound like you even know how you are invested at this point. If you are still young and expect to be contributing for many more years you want to own 100% stocks(Small, Large, International). If they go down you will buy more shares at lower prices. As long as the markets recover at some point you will be sitting pretty.

If you are within 10 years of retirement or living off 401K withdrawals, then you want to have about 2 years worth of income in cash or cd's. The 401K should have a money market or short term bond fund thats erves this purpose. Other than that stay in the stocks. Our currency could come and go, and America's greatest companies will still be around and paying dividends. Even during the great depression, dividends only fell by half, and the dollar got 25% stronger, so people invested in stocks did not fare as badly as one would think. If they were still young and kept investing they ended up doing better than most could dream of.

I would also venture to say that if we saw the end of our financial system and everything in banks and brokerages became worthless, then it really won't matter what you own. Someone bigger, stronger and more heavily armed will come and take your gold/silver/food just a soon as you try to use it to barter. Might as well believe that everything will get better, because if you are right you will have better life, and if you are not then it probably won't matter anyways.

The point is not full economic collapse.....the point is that in the event of a partial economic collapse, there is a system already in place vy which bank and investment resources can be completely halted or taken over by Uncle Sam to do with as they wish.

I'm not saying that everyone should pull everything out of the bank, out of investment solutions and retirement plans and sit on a pile of gold with a shotgun in an underground bunker. This would only contribute to the problem. I am saying that everyone should have a backup system to ensure financial well being in the event that this system is put into action.

I think people are missing the point of owning gold to save wealth.

Yes, in the event America's economy crumbles you're much better off worrying about food, water and probably ammunition.

The point of gold is that in the even of some stability it will help re-instate the wealth you have lost when the paper money was deemed worthless.

Or, if you are exceptionally wealthy and if the entire globe has not collapsed into cave-dwelling foraging, gold or silver will still have value in the currency of some other nation in case you should be relocating away from America.

As a side note, if you're moving from one nation to another and fear losing money on currency exchanges put your money into gold before you move then sell it after you move. No exchange rate loss.

That is why you have gold. Not because you'll be able to barter it for food because in a barter situation, yes, gold is worthless.

I think the comments here about Silver and Gold being worthless in an economic and or a societal collapse are incorrect. People in these situations know that someday order will return, and that a new monetary system will be introduced, and of course precious metals will once again have value.

Therefore, opportunists will always barter to get as much Gold and Silver as possible during the period of chaos, so they can "cash in" after order is restored. This has happened during every civil and international war and I do not see a reason it will be different in the next one.

What would be a really bad idea (even if there is no situation X) is buying "rare" or "collectible" coins. The amount of value paid over the metal value would disapear immediately in this type of situation. Buying a bag of low collector value silver coins to "keep under the mattress" might help you sleep easier now, and could be useful if the worst happens. A good rule of thumb when buying coins for this purpose (and investing in precious metals in general for that matter) is to stay within 5% of the metal value for a coin.

Edit to add: A situation X may or may not be on the way, but an economic meltdown is inevitable. This may not mean your savings are "seized" it just means they will become worthless due to inflation. Precious metals are the only true hedge against this inflationary loss. Even though we now currently (USA) have a debt based "fiat" monetary system, trades and debts on the international scale are still paid using precious metals(PM).

Many big players in the investment world are moving more and more of their capitol directly or indirectly into PM and its production. Warren Buffet is a good example, he has moved Billions of dollars into PM and more importantly into PM mining companies in the past couple of years. When the dam breaks and the dollar begins to collapse people will flock to PM as security.


[edit on 7-2-2008 by ItsHumanNature]

reply to post by annestacey

You may want to read a few posts by this Guy. He lives in Argentina, and survived through an economic collapse and the ensuing civil disorder. He has a lot of great information and it's a good read as well. Good Luck!

....'great depression two' stories are arriving:

"Economist: 100 Dollar Bill Worth Nothing In 2 Years"
(3/1/08 CNN Your Money: Talks of Great Depression Coming)

[edit on 11-3-2008 by anhinga]

Originally posted by annestacey
... Should I keep the money in 401k or should I do something else to protect it?

If or when a collapse comes... it won't be an overnight phenomena
but it will be a steady process of deterioration of your money/purchasing power.
Plus, the means to make a daily wage sould become rare, as the standard consumerism we knew all these years will no longer be the engine of the economy.

your correct that a 401K is not FDIC insured, but if your 401K is administered by a large fund , say Fidelity for an example,
then i'd take my holdings and roll over those funds into a
Gold & Precious Metals fund, there is no penalty for immediate transfer or rollover of the (your) 401K. to a legal & authorized 401K manager who
would have a G&PM fund available for you to avail yourself.

This act alone should both increase the wealth of your stash, plus grow
as fast as the inflation steals away the value of dollars...

Reminds me of the line to a song by Pink floyd "Welcome to the machine"

Oh by the way this is happening,right now all around the world, especially in the western economies.

I keep hearing that gold and silver and great options. They are at least good for stability because natural resources are always finite, and therefore valuable. Great thread. We need more like this...

I was wondering what you guys think of US Mint $1 coins as a hedge against any civil disorder or semi-economic collapse.

You can Order Dollar Coins from US Mint at Face Value with Free Shipping.

To encourage robust national circulation of $1 Coins (non-numismatic, circulation-grade coins), the United States Mint has introduced the Circulating $1 Coin Direct Ship Program. This program makes it easy for retailers, financial institutions, and other interested parties to obtain smaller quantities of $1 coins than can otherwise be obtained from the Federal Reserve.

Originally posted by Tuebor
I was wondering what you guys think of US Mint $1 coins as a hedge against any civil disorder or semi-economic collapse.

You can Order Dollar Coins from US Mint at Face Value with Free Shipping.

A US Mint $1 coin is not going to be worth any more than a paper US $1. It will be heavier, though.

You can get them at "Face Value", because like every other US (non pure gold or silver) coin except the penny, it doesn't cost the US more than face value to make them.

A US Mint gold coin, like a Golden Eagle, however, is a different story. But buying from the Mint, you pay a big premium (currently ~$200 looking at their web site) because they only sell proof or uncirculated coins.

Expect your local coin dealer to charge spot plus a profit fee (~$36) for foreign gold coins (like a Krugerrand). US Golden Eagles typically have another profit fee added on top of that (~25$) because of US govt. rules on privacy when exchanging more that 20 foreign coins at a time.

But I don't see your average World Recession barterer being able to make change for a 1 oz. gold coin.

Right now, locally, Silver Eagles are running spot plus a $3.50 profit fee per coin.

The best deal would be to find a source for 1 oz. silver slugs. However, most average people are not going to be able to tell a silver (or even a gold) slug from a plated plug, so it would probably be easier to barter with actual coins.