Kids at Church Praising Bush?

Originally posted by Jeff Riff
too bad Bush is going to hell

That is not for you to say... By the way, I don't believe in "hell" so it's really a moot point to me.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by scientist
clearly, you are biased on this matter.

No. Clearly YOU are biased.

it seems I hit a nerve, which was not my intention. I was hoping to point out that your view was extremely biased as well. I never claimed to be unbiased, but I don't find any of it shocking, I just find it wrong.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

So is there nothing unusual about having a room of children praying for a politician?

NO!

It's a camp for kids. The room is going to be full of kids.
It's a camp for evangelical kids who are taught to 'pray always' (as the bible says to do).

It's what the camp is for - kids and prayer.

you didn't even comment on the infusion of politics into a christian day camp. I prefer the separation of church and state, in all forms - not just official ones. Of course, this isn't a public program, but it is associated with many politicians that are supposed to be upholding the constitution (as if that were the case anyways )

Same with Catholics. Catholic children in Catholic school - right from Kindergarden - pray for the leadership of their towns, states, and country. They pray for pro-life laws. They pray, pray, pray.

And that means there's nothing wrong with it? I was raised catholic myself. I remember hearing commercials in church. Seriously, right after they gave out the body and blood of christ in the form of communion wafers and wine, (respectively) some guy would get on the podium and let you know that Johnson's Ford Factory was a Catholic family, and they had a great deal on 4WD, just mention St John's Roman Catholic Church to the salesperson.

AGAIN - get a grip people. :shk: These are evangelical kids at an evangelical camp PRAYING OVER and PRAYING FOR someone who they have been told needs prayers. (and I agree with that prayer need). No one is 'praising Bush' or committing idol worship as has been suggested.

I disagree. They are not praying over and for him as if he were sick in a hospital bed about to go under quadruple bypass surgery with a case of hemophilia. These kids are being taught that this man, above any other politician, is worthy of Christs, and all of their attention and love. Maybe I am closer to childhood than you, so I still understand how differently an undeveloped mind interprets these things, opposed to an adult looking back assuming these kids already have a sturdy set of values and beliefs. It's being forced into their heads while their skulls are still soft.

Our time is better spent praying FOR him rather then posting this kind crap - crap that IS NOT TRUE - on the internet.

:shk:

Again, this is that blatant biased (and somewhat condescending) attitude you are displaying. I hope we can continue a civil discussion without getting emotional.

Originally posted by deezee
And unless the entire movie was a mockumentary, i don't think it was staged.

It doesn't have to be a mockumentary to be staged. Modern documentaries do not so much document fact as they do the viewpoint of the directors. Facts get twisted, opinions portrayed as truth, and events are taken out of context to prove the documentarian's point.

I'm not saying that is what happened here. It's just so beyond anything I can even comprehend, that I can't believe it.

Originally posted by SaviorComplex
I'm not saying that is what happened here. It's just so beyond anything I can even comprehend, that I can't believe it.

what part? nothing in the movie was hard for me to believe, having been to a real, grown-up pentecostal service before.

Originally posted by SaviorComplex
Modern documentaries do not so much document fact as they do the viewpoint of the directors. Facts get twisted, opinions portrayed as truth, and events are taken out of context to prove the documentarian's point.

I agree.

What i meant was, if you watch the entire movie, you will notice things much stranger than this particular clip.

Because of that, i don't think this was staged. The entire movie is like this or worse. So if this was staged, the rest would have to be staged as well.

That's what i was trying to say, anyway...

I just bumped Jesus Camp up to the top of my Netflix qeue. I probably shouldn't watch it though, I'm already scared enough.

Religion causes wars, Jesus doesn't.

The bimbo from hades is none other than pastor Becky Fischer and her consort was pastor Tedd Haggard but he turned gay and was thrown out of the movement after being convicted.

Bimbo tells her baby minions to go 3 days without food and fast. Looking over bimbo, it looks like she needs to fast to be a good example to her preaching.

My favorite 10 minute video of bimbo from hades preaching her venom to little minions with parents falling under the spell as well.

Originally posted by pjsconcrete
I just bumped Jesus Camp up to the top of my Netflix qeue. I probably shouldn't watch it though, I'm already scared enough.

It's not really scary. It just makes you aware of the fact that what is occurring in this world is being fueled by religious and political hatred. It's sickening, really. That's alright though, the "king with the fierce countenance" taht everyone fears so much makes his approach quickly.



[edit on 28-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

No offense, but the boy in the blue shirt looks like a futuire Jim Jones or David Koresh to me.

[edit on 28-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by scientist
you didn't even comment on the infusion of politics into a christian day camp.

Sure I did. I said it happens all the time. And .. there is NOTHING wrong with Christians praying for politicians. It's what they are SUPPOSED to do.

I prefer the separation of church and state, in all forms

1 - there is no such thing as 'separation of church and state' in our founding documents. What IS said is that the state will not sponsor any religion.

2 - Christians praying for our political leaders is NOT in any way even close to the state sponsoring a religion.

3 - The different churches in this country are NOT under any obligation to ignore politicians - either by this country's laws or by their own church laws.

4 - What you 'prefer' doesn't matter. The law is what matters and their freedom of religion is what matters.

it is associated with many politicians that are supposed to be upholding the constitution

No it's not. This is a case of evangelicals teaching their children to pray for political leaders. Period. George Bush 43 is NOT associated with the camp in any way other than being the recepient of prayers that he didn't solicit. And there isn't anything even close to violation of the Constitution happening here.

And that means there's nothing wrong with it?

There is nothing wrong with children being taught to pray for others.
There is nothing wrong with children being taught to pray 'evangelical style' for others - including politicians.

These kids are being taught that this man, above any other politician, is worthy of Christs, and all of their attention and love.

That's not true. That's dead wrong. No where does anyone say that George Bush 43 is 'more worthy' than any other man or politician to receive Christ etc etc. The people who run the camp UNDERSTAND that the man has been put in charge of this country (to some degree) and that he needs their prayers and he needs God's Grace in order to make good decisions.

No where does anyone say that any person is 'more worthy' than any other person. The fact is, however, that some people are in more NEED of prayers. George Bush 43 is definately in MORE NEED than some others simply because his decisions effect so many people.

Maybe I am closer to childhood than you,

I have no doubt that you are. I'm rather old.

Again, this is that blatant biased (and somewhat condescending) attitude you are displaying.

:shk: I already stated that I'm not evangelical and actually do not agree with many of their beliefs so it is impossible for me to be 'biased' in their favor, let alone 'blatantly biased'. Did you bother to read when I said that ???

I am stating FACTS. The FACT is that the OP stated, and was backed up by many who didn't bother to view the clip, that children were being taught to 'praise Bush' and that they were crying and kissing his feet. The FACT is that they were PRAYING FOR HIM evangelical style - by laying on of hands.

FACTS FACTS FACTS. Deny ignorance people. Come'on .. give it a try.

Bush is being prayed FOR ... not to.
The Children aren't 'crying and kissing his feet'.

I don't agree with the Jesus Camp .. but ya'll really shouldn't be making up LIES about what is going on. tsk tsk tsk

Flyers, its so good to see you again, however, my Gawd, how can you justify these kids being brought to that point of ecstasy of prayer where they cry and treat the image of Bush as an idol, a GOD????

This is demented, sorry. Disgusting and demented and there is no justifying it.

Praying FOR OUR PRESIDENT TO MAKE BETTER CHOICES is not done in this manner.

Have you noticed? The prayers to Bush are not working either. He's still the same loser and getting worse by the day. The warmongering is out of control, the world is in total turmoil, and some of you are STILL out there apologizing and justifying it all.

it makes me sick. God help all those who stand behind this evil.

I guess evil and goodness are perceived differently by everyone, unfortunatly. I dont know what its going to take, i just dont know.

The purpose of this church is to make him an "idol" and brainwash these followers, and that is very evil.

What kind of people are these? I mean, they cant have a mind of their own.

Just pathetic.

I'm Catholic and many of us don't support Bush. We don't worship idols and using religion to get votes is wrong in my opinion. My political stance is more of a Libertarian/Republican and I can't stand Bush. The Catholic Church is actually tradionally Democrat, people like JFK.

Evangelicals make me angry sometimes. A few weeks ago, some Evangelical told me that Catholics are going to hell and we aren't Christians. He wanted me to convert and I don't want any part of that hate machine. These people are so hateful.

Originally posted by Clan in da front

Evangelicals make me angry sometimes. A few weeks ago, some Evangelical told me that Catholics are going to hell and we aren't Christians. He wanted me to convert and I don't want any part of that hate machine. These people are so hateful.

Apparently the "Do not judge lest ye be judged" doctrine is a long forgotten one to most "Christians." They sure are awfully quick to condemn those they disagree with to their mythological "hell."

Originally posted by FlyersFan
... more of the same ...

We will have to agree to disagree on this matter. I am strongly opposed to brainwashing children to support politicians. If you do not see the link, you aren't looking for it. And I'm sure you would say I'm only seeing a link because I'm looking for it. Hence, an agreement of disagreement. I'll leave it at that, with you at least.

While I think the "Jesus Camp" thing is despicable, the title of this thread is misleading. They were not "praising" Bush. They were praying for him, which, obviously, someone should. Not because he's an "idiot," but because of the world situation and the fact that he is in way over his head.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
While I think the "Jesus Camp" thing is despicable, the title of this thread is misleading. They were not "praising" Bush. They were praying for him, which, obviously, someone should.

Not because he's an "idiot," but because of the world situation and the fact that he is in way over his head.

Even if they are praying for him, bring out a cardboard cut out is just ridiculous. You don't need a cardboard cut out to pray for someone.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
While I think the "Jesus Camp" thing is despicable, the title of this thread is misleading. They were not "praising" Bush. They were praying for him, which, obviously, someone should.

Not because he's an "idiot," but because of the world situation and the fact that he is in way over his head.

Even if they are praying for him, bring out a cardboard cut out is just ridiculous. You don't need a cardboard cut out to pray for someone.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
While I think the "Jesus Camp" thing is despicable, the title of this thread is misleading. They were not "praising" Bush. They were praying for him, which, obviously, someone should.

Not because he's an "idiot," but because of the world situation and the fact that he is in way over his head.

Even if they are praying for him, bring out a cardboard cut out is just ridiculous. You don't need a cardboard cut out to pray for someone.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

Originally posted by Clan in da front

Evangelicals make me angry sometimes. A few weeks ago, some Evangelical told me that Catholics are going to hell and we aren't Christians. He wanted me to convert and I don't want any part of that hate machine. These people are so hateful.

Apparently the "Do not judge lest ye be judged" doctrine is a long forgotten one to most "Christians." They sure are awfully quick to condemn those they disagree with to their mythological "hell."

I'm sure most of them aren't ignorant, but from my experience with most Evangelicals is that they're ignorant when it comes to Catholics. They hate us because we pray to Mary, they think we worship her, we don't. We just think very highly of her.

I don't judge other relgions, other sects, or atheists. You don't need to be religious to be a good person. I just wish politicains wouldn't use religion to gain support. I know a lot of atheists they can still have good family values. Things like honesty, being polite and giving respect.