Before 2050, America is a Third World nation

The irony here is good old Pat is responsable for some of the decline.

Will the US become a third world nation? Not likely. Will it remain the sole superpower that was at its peak right after the Cold War? Far less likely.

There are many factors that favor the US remaining pretty high up in the pecking order:

Food: the US produces a huge amount of food. Even if you take out the dependance on hydrocarbons etc it still out produces everybody. With the trend towards organic farming, the dependance on fertilizers will wain.

Culture: Yes, most of you mock American culture as shallow etc. yet it remains one of the most pervasive forces in our world. Why? The US is truly a melting pot. Each culture adds to part of our collective culture. Each person that comes here or sees the culture, can recognize elements of thier own in it. It makes the country diverse (There is a downside as well, racial tension, but that exists everywhere), and in diversity there is strength.

Robust and adaptable Constitution. We have the oldest form of government in existance right now. No other country can currently make this claim as of today. The guiding principals and documents this country was founded upon are no less relevant or important that they were at the coutnries inception.

In my short life I have been through two periods when people were shouting "THe US is doomed". The CCCP was this unbeatable monster that lurked in one of our nations darkest times: the 70's. Many felt we were at an end, but we still are here. In the 80's remember how Japan Inc was going to take over the world?

Are we any worse than the days after Watergate? The fall of Siagon? The economic meltdown of 1980? I dare say No.

The reports about the death of the United States are greatly exagerated

[edit on 11/26/07 by FredT]

America destined to become a third world country... Maybe the Free State Project is one option for protecting ourselves?

reply to post by GirlNextDoor


How can you say that or even know that about America People have doubted us before and thought we were down for the count, but when America rises to the challenge it rises tall and strong. The thing is, everybody underestimates the power of freedom and the will of the people to keep America free. We will rise to the challenges of the future, the question is, " do other nation want to rise with us? "

those companies making the weapons will be the one getting richer not the US. They make the money not the US. And for the money your government may make out of tax will be wasted in more weaponery for the country's millitary. Debt is not being paid thus the US aint doing better but worse. Those same companies are mostly owned by investors and most are not even americans... the money doesnt stay in american soil. If fighting as much as the US is was as important as they tell u it is... the whole world at least developed countries would be supporting the US in such wars but no, in fact they make the US guilty of many charges... but we all know the US is just the mean, the weapon to world contro and daddy UN is the one driving the car, for they will not send their troops my friend they will send the amerincan troops. And that whole alert system impose just to keep everyone scared. NORAD, the C'IA and F'BI new what was gonna happened nobody did nothing. the let you guys down. Reason? to have an supported excuse to go to the middle east and bomb the hell out of countries down there and carry on with the hidden agendas. There were no nukes in iraq, in fact they didnt even have money to buy the screws and screw drivers you need for making the machines to make nukes .... come on what a joke,.. but hey the UN new about this they didnt not declare war on iraq,... they sent you folks like they always do. Hahaha is hilarious what else... WTC falling down cause of two planes? you telling me that a bunch of arabs that have no idea what they do in life, that walk up and down mountains all day, and live in caves cuz have nothing to do put the strongest country in the world to its feet????? huh??? without the government knowing or allowing so to happen? right.

Madrid Spain. The tallest and most advanced building burned to its bones the complete structure... not designed to stand fires, yet it stood there... it had to be brought down actually by construction companies. Then, come along the WTC, desgined to stand everything there is, falls down cuz of two planes? ahahahah right! hahaha seriously now.... 7 buildins felt down mmmm one even felt and wasnt in the area. The hilton hotel was closer yet didnt suffer any damages and the building behind... own by the same guy that bought the WTC months earlier... felt down hahahaha ok.. so for the building to colapse they said at least 4,000 degrees of hit caused by the fuel was going on... yet you had ppl in those same holes.. waving their hands? what ... they were wearing 4,000 degrees proof wetsuits?... firefighters saying they hear the explosions floor by floor... NORAD thinking they were doing training on the same topic that was actually happening in real life? thus no fighters were sent to put this planes down? mmmm the world's most powerful country fooled like this? by that bin laden guy hahahah is the biggest joke Ive heard. Take it. This country is nothing but a instrument to the same ones that created it just a few hundred years ago ... and that fast will be demolished... most importantly because it owes tooooo much money that is not able to pay back.

reply to post by plaetorian


Wow !! Sounds like you enjoyed seeing the the towers fall on 9/11 and 3,000 humans killed. I really feel sorry for you.
The other sad part about your statement is that it has nothing to do with America becoming a third world nation by 2050. 9/11 is in the past and will never be forgotten, but Americans will live on and keep this country strong and headed towards the future.

not 3rd world, but for sure the American Dream is a bygone thing...

in just a few/several years be prepared for rationing,
price & wage controls,
maybe by 2050 the 'middle class' will be history,
but in this immediate future lots & lots of Mexican nationals
and many other Central-&-South American expatriots will swell
the American homeland...and will be more welcome than now.


the mining resources of Mexico will be ramped up 5 fold for the
copper and silver they have in abundance,
the water and shale resources in Canada will be ramped up
too.
American Corps & workforce will be the white collar & engineers in these new strategic resource management Corps of the NAU,
while the welcomed immigrants from southern nations will take the
service industry jobs as the eucated & trained Americans are forced out,
most likely starting in 2008.


it's not a dystopia scenario, everyone gets to better their selves and
their standard of living in this future model- -if you think about it

By 2050 I really hope there are no third world countries left. I think a change is coming and third world will be a thing of the past. Whether we like it or not we have to change to adapt for bigger populations and jobs to be available. I really like all the countries on this earth and hope that some day we all realize that we can make a difference by working together and solving our problems. Then maybe space is the limit not the sky.

One thing that you are forgetting is Global Warming. Whether its man made or not, it's happening now. Not in 5 or 10 years. The bread basket of America will have to be shifted, but most will be lost.

Currently, the area around Georgia and its neighbors are in a historically bad drought. This is also true in southern California also and into Vegas and Phoenix areas. Both these areas are heavy agricultural areas that are starting to get rationed. If we run too low, whole areas will have mandatory rationing and AG water will be allocated to the population. The population booms in Phoenix and LV will be halted.

If these two areas do not get significant rain in the next two months, mandatory rationing will happen. It has already been reported on local news channels to ask residents to conserve water.

The point is, not only are energy, credit, recession and the political pressures great, but mother nature are pressuring us to again make painful choices that we have no control over.

All these forces may conspire to force us to do the unthinkable and give up our sovereignty. If this happens, the good times that we enjoyed in the US will be over
forever.

Originally posted by PrplHrt
I hate to admit this, but I agree with that old fart. I don't like his religious fanaticism, but he often hits the nail on the head.

I read this book, in 2002 (in French, a big chuck of it, was written before 911)

www.amazon.com...=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1196124760&sr=8-2

This guy (E. Todd) became famous, when he predicted, before everybody else (by some 15 years) the fall of the USSR.

Now, in this book, he predict the fall of the USA, within 50 years.

He is not predicting that the US will be a third world nation, but no longer an Empire, an important nation (but among several others).

I don't know, if this was mentioned here, but Pat Buchanan will give an interview, on his new book, on Coast to Coast AM Radio, this Wednesday 28 November 2007.

I will sure try to listen to this.

Originally posted by johnsky
j_kalin's post is a prime example of how the United States is dividing itself.

One person is a prime example? Youve never been to the US have you...Americans in general are very patriotic.

I have long assumed the "bible belt" would be the defining line of a rift between two disgruntled halves of the US.



Granted, Canada teaming up with the US as a whole would be economic suicide for Canada... but if the North US were to separate from the south, Canada may just benefit from picking up the pieces.

Unfortunately, the rift that separates the North from the South US is the same rift that makes Canada and the South US unlikely to co-operate.


Either way. Whether Canada gets involved or not is beside the point at this moment in time, the foundation of which the US was built upon is no longer there. If it weren't for the complacency of the US people to world affairs, the US would be in a chaos of rioting right now.
But people can only be taken so far down this road before they are forced to wake up and realize what their government has done to the country.

The US is no longer the land of the free. Yes, it still shares some freedoms the rest of the free countries share, but one by one they are being taken away, and the scary part is, nobody down there seems to be willing to do anything about it.

Its not going to happen..

OK I will deal with Pat assertions .
The US military can be expanded so that is the way of solving the first problem. A low dollar favour exporters here in New Zealand our exporters complained about the high dollar before it fell. Pretty much any country that has open it self up to global markets as seen most of it manufacturing sector move to China.

Illegal aliens are launching a cultural assault on the US similar problems can also be found in other country's. Now this is a serious that the US needs to address. Citizenship is something that should be valued above or else . Illegal aliens in the US are devaluing US citizenship. I don't think that the US will the way of the Balkans .

Well everything is about race in America I don't like terms such as Italian American your either an American or your not. I don't go round saying that I am an Australian Kiwi. Despite my heritage I am either one or the other. Society is always divided by income levels I don't know any millionaires personally but I don't view this as a problem.

The fiscal habits of US politicians can be described as nothing but insane despite the amount of money being spend Social Security is still in trouble. I don't see social security being put on a sound path. Plans to partially privatise Social Security are doomed for the foreseeable future because they are connected to Bush.

Well the US looks like that it will lose its number one economic crown . The first things that need to be done is to ensure that any ID BS is kept out of schools. The next step is to ensure that kids don't leave school not knowing that Londoners speak english. The problem with Neo con thought pattern is that they expect the likes of Iraq to adapt American Cultural. Now I support knocking over rogue regimes and allowing democracy's to flourish but we must chose our targets more carefully and to work within there own culture.

Cultural war ?
Well given that I support the likes of Gay rights Pat probably would view people with my social views as a greater enemy then the Islamic extremists. The US and its allies can only lose the global struggle against Islamic tyranny if they lack the will to continue the fight and they view there fellow country men as an even greater enemy. No divided nation has ever won a war outside of its own borders.

Hmm as for the North American Union a lot depends on how it is mplemented . When it comes to today economy access to markets is crucial the US cant expect other countries to let down trade barriers if they don't. I am unsure of what to make of the author next point other then that he appears to be objecting to foreign investment . You cant really make a fair comparison between Islamic extremists and the illegal alien problem.

The only thing worth noting from the next few points is that may of the immigrants in question will be in the US illegally . I have to conclude that the majority of Pat positions are off base and take away from the real issues at hand that need to be dealt with.

reply to post by j_kalin


thats right... bunch all of us southerners in with the idiots and the bible thumpers...

some of us just happen to be stuck here...


just wanted to add my 2 cents on that

Originally posted by coven
reply to post by j_kalin

 

thats right... bunch all of us southerners in with the idiots and the bible thumpers...

some of us just happen to be stuck here...


just wanted to add my 2 cents on that

I feel for you...

Actually, although I don't personally care if the continent of NA is 1 NAU or 500 smaller nations, I doubt the US will fragment. The world is run by big business now and it's only getting worse. They like uniform standards and easy border crossing for both trade and labor(legal or illegal). They may never call it the NAU, but we are getting very close to a de facto NAU. The future is one where oil is expensive, overseas trade decreases due to high fuel costs and low dollar value. That means more interstate trade and more trade within the continent of NA. Therefore, the 3 nations will get knitted closer together. I don't mind that either, the Mexicans and Canadians are nice people and Spanish is a beautiful language. Besides, if they want to come up here and work in the bad jobs, I'll happily move down there and live on the beach...

Seems that there's a good few people who're a bit enthusiastic about all this America is doomed stuff. Good for them because as a part of the next generation I intend on proving them wrong.

I'll give some of the reasons why;

1. The Chinese threat is way overplayed. China depends on us just as much as we depend on them.

2. People have been predicting the down fall of the US since the founding of our nation. We've overcome the Imperial British, Nazi's, Imperial Japanese, and the Soviets. And those are just the military enemies, that's not including all the various recessions and depressions that we've gone through. Plain and simple, economics is a cycle, and it's nothing we can't handle.

3. If water is predicted to be the next big resource then the US is pretty much set. Between us and the Canadians sharing the Great Lakes we've got the largest source of fresh water that'll still be around if the polar ice caps completely melt. Even if for some reason everything just so happens to fall apart, at least we have that to fall back on. The Middle East has it's oil, and we have our water.

I see only one problem with America breaking up and that is what happens to all those shiny nuclear weapons of theirs?

Other than that it would be nice to see the US break up a bit sooner rather than later ~ while you're all still on relatively good terms and still prosperous (on the whole). In smaller chunks you'll be looking after your own more and will be less bothered with probs on the other side of the world.

reply to post by FredT

today USA believes it is invincible and like Rome and calls other cultures as failed and tries to impose itself on others

well, Mr.David Walker , the comptroller general of USA , did give a warning that with current conditions and policies , the USA could collapse like the Roman Empire

The US government is on a ‘burning platform’ of unsustainable policies and practices with fiscal deficits, chronic healthcare underfunding, immigration and overseas military commitments threatening a crisis if action is not taken soon, the country’s top government inspector has warned.

David Walker, comptroller general of the US, issued the unusually downbeat assessment of his country’s future in a report that lays out what he called “chilling long-term simulations”.


Drawing parallels with the end of the Roman empire, Mr Walker warned there were “striking similarities” between America’s current situation and the factors that brought down Rome, including “declining moral values and political civility at home, an over-confident and over-extended military in foreign lands and fiscal irresponsibility by the central government”.

“Sound familiar?” Mr Walker said. “In my view, it’s time to learn from history and take steps to ensure the American Republic is the first to stand the test of time.”

Mr Walker’s views carry weight because he is a non-partisan figure in charge of the Government Accountability Office, often described as the investigative arm of the US Congress.
www.ft.com...

with US arrogance of itself , the genocide it is carrying out in iraq(for oil) and afghanistan(for caspain sea and trukmen oil) for oil and a external debt of 10 trillion$ and public debt of 9 trillion$ and sky high military budget, I can bet that USA will go into massive recession or even collapse, and

Mr. David Walker , head of GAO is warning that USA is going the way of Rome

It is destruction by design. The military infrastructure or the shadow government wants this to happen. why? to gain further control, thus gain further economical gain.

the only way the roman empire was destroyed was from within, the same goes for America.

the United States peaked in the 1950's. it's been downhill since the 80's. the powers that be want America to fail. Ask yourself...why?

yes we chave a big pile of debt/ yes we have little oil . but let me see one little blue helmeted un peace keeper trying to liberate my country well lets just say he would make a nice tarhet for my 30-o6 from 500 yards away.
we may be considered dumb hicks in the south nut we are mostly good shots.all you southerners out there stop by your walmart and by plenty of shells for the great blue helmet shootout.]

I was really suprised to see Pat Buchanan having these views, as he has helped to bring about America's weaker status. But, for the most part, I agree with what he said in the article. Who knows where the U.S. will end up and whether it will continue to exist, but either way, we're in for some seriously difficult times, I think. We have way over-extended ourselves financially, militarily and with credit.

On another note, I am proud to say that I live in Tennessee, one of the most beautiful places I've ever seen, where the people are hard-working, honest and caring by and large. They also know how to survive on their own and they help each other out alot. Just because people here are too poor to afford higher education, doesn't mean we're all stupid.

The North and South separating? That might happen but I don't think it's such a bad thing. They have always been very different and there exists alot of prejudice and propaganda on both sides.