Home Defence

Ok so recently I was watching the BBC when it announced that a Canadian man was shot dead with a taser. This got me onto the taser homepage where I discovered that tasers are illegal in the UK, this then got me thinking, considering the amount of stuff that is illegal in the UK how easy is it really to prepare for a situation X particularly if that situation X turns violent.

For instance in the UK:
Firearms are illegal (effectively)
Tasers are illegal
Lock Knives are illegal (Yes its true, if you have any knife which locks no matter what the blade size its illegal)
Knives with blades over 3 inches are illegal (unless they are kitchen knives and one or two other exceptions)
Blank firing replicas are illegal (with some exceptions)
Stun batons are illegal (and I think normal police batons are classed as offensive weapons and hence illegal)

And apparently there are plans in the works to force people to register swords etc and air rifles.

So considering all this, when compared to a country like the US, how much can someone in the UK actually prepare for a situation X?

First, you have to keep in mind that if you're in a Sit-X situation 'legality' is a moot point. The problem is how do you prepare ahead of time when you are unable to stockpile the necessary equipment? Given the situation in the UK it would seem you're going to have to fashion your own defensive equipment. You're at a disadvantage for sure but with some ingenuity there are some options.

Wow I knew the UK was a little conservative but thats radilicious, and they complain about American laws. That being said a weapon should never be the first thing to think about. after all it wont do anybody any good if they have no water or are starving to death.

There are other choices for weapons such as baseball bats. A plain old wooden walking stick in the right hands makes for a very effective defense tool. You can get multi tool with locking blades in them. hay its not a knife its a pair of pliers on steroids. check this one its American pricing but Ime sure there is a UK equilivent some ware SOG locking blade multi tool

All those laws just mean you have to get more creative almost anything can be used as a weapon. even a piece of string. I consider a snare as a weapon. string may not hold a man but it will hold a rabbit or a squirl.

A chunk of wood with a nail driven threw makes people think twice. A electric nail gun properly altered can be deadly at close range. just be creative.

You can own a gun in the UK, you just have to jump through the hoops. Fair enough you can't get an assult rifle, but shotguns and hunting rifles are perfectly legal once you have jumped through the right hoops.

I'm not sure on the legal status of bows, but take up archery and you've got anew hobby and a deadly weapon.

Bothering to jump through the hoops now you will put you towards the top of the pile if and when the time comes.

reply to post by kaos1911


would a working ballista or trebuchet siege-engine replica be included on that list?

Just wanted to add

possession of a lock knife in a public place without reasonable excuse is an offence.

Its not illegal in itself to have a lock nife, its just illegal not to have an excuse

Possession of a multi-tool incorporating a prohibited blade/pointed article is capable of being an offence under this section even if there are other tools on the instrument which may be of use to a person in a public place (screwdriver, can opener). It is for the person to prove on the balance of probabilities that he/she had good reason for possession

So Even the old multi tool idea posted above might come unstuck.

However it turns out you CAN own a crossbow....

Originally posted by angryamerican
just be creative.

the more creative you can be, the less likely that your defences will be expected by attackers.

Something as simple as having a removable panel of floorboards behind the doors to send an assailant crashing through a first-storey floor/ceiling or into the basement, or upturned nail-embedded planks under the windows could prove very effective.

Home-gadgets can be used to great effect too if you still have mains electricity, such as a pound of sugar tipped into a boiling kettle to make prison-napalm or a chip-pan/cooking oil heated up on a camp-stove



[edit on 15-11-2007 by citizen smith]

It's true what you say about ingenuity overcoming some of the initial problems but even there, there is a problem:

Say a situation X arives, chances are I am not going to have a whole lot of time to prepare after the inital event. As such I would need to stockpile in advance but here again is where it gets tricky.

Considering the current climate (Terrorism) If I were to be caught making bombs, guns or possibly any weapon which could be considered 'offensive' then I could first be held without trial for 28 days and then presuming I get a trial could find myself locked up. So you see the problem I can't get anything legaly and its too risky to make them, so what do I do?

P.S In terms of guns in the UK to own a shotgun you have to have a policeman check your house, you have to have a docter certify that you are alowed to have one and on top of that have a justifiable reason (e.g. being a member of a gun club and attend a certain number of shoots a year) not to mention the costs of instaling gun cabinets, paperwork costs, membership fees etc. So just saying you have to jump through hoops doesn't really show the sheer amount of stuff you have to do and even then you can be turned down for a licence.

[edit on 15-11-2007 by kaos1911]

[edit on 15-11-2007 by kaos1911]

[edit on 15-11-2007 by kaos1911]

[edit on 15-11-2007 by kaos1911]

A plain old wooden walking stick in the right hands makes for a very effective defense tool.

This should help to make your hands be the right hands:

www.watery.co.uk...

It's a direct download so you might want to right click and save.

Originally posted by kaos1911
P.S In terms of guns in the UK to own a shotgun you have to have a policeman check your house, you have to have a docter certify that you are alowed to have one and on top of that have a justifiable reason

Thats very similar to getting a concealed weapons permit in the U.S. good reasons for a CWP (concealed Weapons Permit) are carrying two hundred dollars on you at all times for business or pleasure. Atleast in my state. the thing I find funny is they have a Medical Doctor say you are mentally stable and not a psychiatrist.

[edit on 15-11-2007 by angryamerican]

If situation X ever arrives in the UK you'll find yourself in a whole different legal system altogether.

The planning for a post nuclear attack Britain envisaged the introduction of a fiercesome Emergency Powers Act & Defence Regulations, with a dissolution of Parliament and the introduction of a system of devolved government where Regional Commissioners not only made the law - they were the law.

That meant execution for looters and anyone else the authorities felt undesirable. There were two movies which best demonstrated Britain under nuclear war conditions, The War Game (1960's) and Threads (1980's).

I know it's not maybe the Situation X you're thinking about but both films give a realistic idea of how things will go.

The War Game

Threads

I can't quite remember their classification but both were shown on the BBC after 9pm. Not for children that's for sure.

First thing is to ensure your home is not in or close to a big city. The average smalltime burglar or gang member is too lazy to travel an hour or more to go terrorizing hillbillies. Especially when many of those are skilled hunters and generally physically active people in the possession of all sorts of cutting and hacking tools for forestry and terrain maintenance, big tractors to block the roads with and flatten ordinary cars, trained dogs...

It may or may not be worth your time to note that if you're in a big city, a firearm won't neccesarily be your best idea. Sure, it'll give you an edge, but if you can't afford it, nor the expense, what then? Dogs make excellent home alarms. Wood axes, cricket or baseball bats, and crowbars or tyre irons come immediately to mind. Remember, you don't need to butcher intruders. Your objectives in matters of home defence are as follows:

1. Maintain a perimeter to prevent entry by unwanted persons.
2. Remove the intruders.

You can kill, maim, or beat them, or scaring them off can do. You don't neccesarily have to hurt htem to accomplish your personal safety. As long as you're okay at the end of the day, go for the gusto. On the other hand, the golden rule: better judged by twelve than carried by six.

DE

baseball bat.
crow bar.
crossbow.
martial arts.
CHAINSAWWWWWW!!!!!

tasers and stun guns are illegal, but what about cattle prods? hehehe

What is up with your Government? They really got you guys on lockdown. If I were over there I would store all the legal stuff that I can, and Option A: obtain a firearm under the cover of night, then hide it in my house, and never tell or show anyone.. or Option B: wait until a SIT X happens and go grab one off of a dead cop or military personal... Or Option C: find out where I could get one (illegally) if I wanted to but hold off until I think somthing would happen where I would need one. I sure do hope nothing ever happens in your country like "28 days later" the infected really tear you guys appart.

It seems that eveything that can be used to defend oneself is illegal in the UK. It's a shame. I thank god for the american founding fathers and their vision! wish we had more like them in this day and age!

just watch some of the Home Alone moves and there is some good ideas

nails are perfect for traps. as was said, so is a thin panel for a pit fall.

if Sit-X happens (im referring to more of a natural disaster causing total collapse of everything, or a man made equivalent) then you wont be able to stockpile anything complicated (tools and weapons designed for a specific purpose, ie killing people). kitchen knives are a good weapon, and a tool. any easy to handle long, blunt instrument is useful (crowbars, bats, just a long piece of metal or hard wood.)

i would suggest your first priority is to stop anyone getting in in the first place, only use your weapon as a third line of defense (after traps for instance if someone has gotten in)

Originally posted by tac109
What is up with your Government? They really got you guys on lockdown. If I were over there I would store all the legal stuff that I can, and Option A: obtain a firearm under the cover of night, then hide it in my house, and never tell or show anyone.. or Option B: wait until a SIT X happens and go grab one off of a dead cop or military personal... Or Option C: find out where I could get one (illegally) if I wanted to but hold off until I think somthing would happen where I would need one. I sure do hope nothing ever happens in your country like "28 days later" the infected really tear you guys appart.

Even there, there is an issue: in terms of having an illegal firearm it’s almost too risky possession alone can get you five years. I've known some people who kept guns (mainly left over from WW2) but as life goes on it becomes a bigger and bigger risk and as you have more to lose (family, Job etc) then it generally becomes not worth it and they generally get rid of them.

There is also the case that even illegally while it is fairly easy to get a gun there is a real shortage of ammunition so even if I wanted to get one; chances are I couldn't get enough ammo for more than one or two clips.

Kaos1911, I think your facts are a bit out.

For instance in the UK:
Firearms are illegal (effectively)
Tasers are illegal
Lock Knives are illegal (Yes its true, if you have any knife which locks no matter what the blade size its illegal)
Knives with blades over 3 inches are illegal (unless they are kitchen knives and one or two other exceptions)
Blank firing replicas are illegal (with some exceptions)
Stun batons are illegal (and I think normal police batons are classed as offensive weapons and hence illegal)

Firearms - difficult to legally own, but not impossible. I own a shotgun, 2 centrefire rifles and a pistol (still legal in N. Ireland).
Tasers - Illegal
Lock knives & blades over 3 inches - illegal to carry in public without good reason. Perfectly legal for home use.
Blank firers - illegal under the new Firearms act regarding replica weapons.
Batons - Illegal to carry in public or to supply under offensive weapons legislation, but perfectly legal to own.

As this thread is based on home defence then the only weapons you can't possess are any requiring an FAC or similar permit which gives plenty more scope to be ruthlessly creative

Any fans of Scrapheap Challenge may remember this little beauty built by the Boat Bouys team...

Golfball Gatling Gun

[edit on 16-11-2007 by citizen smith]