NAMBLA, Pedophiles and "Conspiracies of Silence" -- We're Not in Kansas Anymore.

The North American Man/Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) is a New York City and San Francisco-based unincorporated organization in the United States that advocates the legalization of sexual relations between adult males and under-aged boys. NAMBLA defends what it claims to be the right of adult men and minor boys to explore their sexuality with each other. It has resolved to "end the oppression of men and boys who have freely chosen mutually consenting relationships," in spite of opposition claims that such relationships are child sexual abuse where the minor is unable to give consent. It also calls for "the adoption of laws that both protect children from unwanted sexual experiences and at the same time leave them free to determine the content of their own sexual experiences."[2] NAMBLA's webpage claims that: "NAMBLA does not provide encouragement, referrals or assistance for people seeking sexual contacts" and that it does not "engage in any activities that violate the law [or] advocate that anyone else should [violate the law]."[3]

NAMBLA holds an annual gathering in New York City and monthly meetings around the country.[4] In the early 1980s, NAMBLA was reported to have had over 300 members, and was supported by such noted figures as Allen Ginsberg.[5] Since then, the organization has kept membership data private, but an undercover FBI investigation in 1995 discovered that there were 1,100 people on the rolls.[4] It is the largest organization in the umbrella group Ipce[6] (formerly "International Pedophile and Child Emancipation").[7]

Source


You know, there were times when a 13 year old boy was considered a young man. In certain cultures, children as young as 6 have been ACTIVE rulers and policy makers with a nation at their beckon call.

However, those times are over (especially in the United States) and if anything, the children of this country (and others) are taking even LONGER to mature than before.

Yet, this fact doesn't seem to deter certain "groups" of people from apparently having a "need" to enter into sexual relationships with children.

For the sake of brevity and to avoid confusion, I will focus this on one of these groups which happens to go by the name of Nambla, or, the North American Man/Boy Love Association.

These pieces of human garbage have made it an open policy of theirs to fight for a day when adult males can have open sexual relationships with small boys of ANY age without fear of legal consequences.

While there seems to be absoultely nothing illegal about their "proposal", can there really be any doubt that ANYONE who is fighting for this cause is likely ALREADY engaged in sexual relations with underage children? I would think it foolish to even ASSUME that anyone who encourages and fights for the right to have sex with small children at their leisure is actually WAITING to do so in the hopes that it will become LEGAL in their lifetime. I think it's pretty safe to assume that a good number of these pieces of trash are already engaging in acts of pedophilia and child pornography.

Having common sense lead me to this conclusion has, naturally, caused me to form a question.

WHY IN THE HELL IS THIS GROUP (and others like it) ALLOWED TO EXIST?

Not only are these guys allowed to exist and have meetings at their discretion, they have actually managed to keep their entire membership a SECRET. Yes, that's right, in a time and age when everything we do or say is subject to governmental spying, a group of would be baby rapists actually manage to communicate in secret and keep their entire membership list hidden from the government.

How is this possible?

Honestly, I don't believe it IS possible!

I propose that the government does indeed know every name on their membership list. I say this because logic dictates that they (who see all) MUST know.

In fact, I have absolutely ZERO doubt that you would find some VERY interesting names of government officials and others in positions of power on that list.

"Well Jasn, why do you say that?"

I say this because logic dictates that they are being allowed to exist for SOME reason.

This organization's stated goals are ensuring safe environments in which men can have their sexual way with little boys. Any organization that is bold enough to make this their mission statement MUST have some means of protection from the law.

Let's think about this. Let's say one of us is caught trying to solicit a minor on myspace with the hopes of a sexual rendezvous. If we were caught, it would take no time for them to have us behind bars and every stitch of our personal belongings would be seized as possible evidence. That includes computers, mailboxes and mail, bank account records, credit card records, phone records...EVERYTHING! After there investigation, you would have absolutely NO secrets left.

Yet, this organization fights in the hopes of seeing a day when one of the worst crimes a person can commit is made LEGAL. And the government does NOTHING.

These guys have addresses listed to receive mail and they also mail out newsletters. Are you honestly telling me the government that knows not what civilian secrets are can't find out ANYTHING they want to know about this organization and put a complete end to it?

Of course they could.......IF they wanted to.

We have all heard the stories of the Franklin Cover-up and government officials soliciting little boys on the internet like it's going out of style. That being what it is, and given the seeming protection NAMBLA has, would it not be wise to assume that some high power figures are members of AND in charge of this group?

Naturally, as despicable as these people are, they ARE protected under freedom of speech laws to say whatever they please. However, with pedophilia running rampant and these guys dedicating themselves to an illegal act, should these guys really be allowed to act in secret as they do?

After all, the government stormed the Branch Davidians in Waco and wiped them off the face of the Earth with extreme prejudice under the SUSPICION that they MIGHT be planning to break the law or "rebel" against the government. And did they not use the suspicion of pedophilia as one of the reasons?

I have to believe that a group that ACTIVELY PROMOTES pedophilia would certainly be open to the wrath of "the law" were they NOT protected by people in high places.

Perhaps I am wrong, but the mere FACT that this group is allowed to act in total secrecy without being raided and their membership made public record SCREAMS government protection and affiliation.

Of course, I could just be jumping the gun, but I cannot wrap my mind around this group being allowed to openly exist if it's nothing more than a low-level private organization.

Would I be allowed to operate a group whose mission statement was, say, wiping black people off the face of the earth or ensuring that all of our school children are provided with easily accessible drugs and weapons? Of course not! And, even if I somehow WERE allowed to operate this group, would it even be REMOTELY possible to keep the signed membership secret? Not a CHANCE!!

MSNBC currently runs a program where they set up pedophiles online and record them visiting what they think is a child and their subsequent arrest. I say, why don't they make a point of infiltrating NAMBLA and getting their membership into the public record?


No matter what the case, I definitely sense something fishy in this whole ordeal and most certainly believe every record this organization has should be made public record for ALL to see.

I cannot imagine this organization being allowed to exist OR them being able to keep everything they do a secret WITHOUT some kind of powerful assistance.


As always, thoughts, comments and criticism welcomed!

Jasn



NOTE: NO! Of course I don't want our children provided with drugs or black people wiped off the face of the Earth, they were examples people!

wow!

No replies?


Have we become jaded by the constant news of pedophilia? Or are there just no comments?




Jasn

Well I think it is possible for the group to have a secret membership without the help of the government. It is possible that the group has a very strict membership board that do background checks on possible new members. Also I would imagine that potential members probably would need a sponsor from one of the older members to vouch for him. If I wanted to run a group that was going to be a huge target by the government and activists I would probably only let in those that made it through all of the checks, if someone looks good except for one thing in their background I'd probably deny them access. Better to have a small group of people loyal to the cause then a large group with possible leaks to the outside.

I would just like to go on the record that I personally do not support NAMBLA or any other group wanting sex with children to be legal.

I am absolutely amazed at this.

As much as I am an a believer in freedom of choice and believe that as an ADULT I have the right to choose what I want to or don't want to do as long as it does not harm anyone else.

The point being ADULT, not child.

How many of these people will have committed sex crimes against children?

As stated on another thread, I am sexually attracted to women and like having sex with them. (And I am sure it's reciprocated )
They are obviously sexually attracted to children and one must assume like having sex with them.
The US government could easily obtain the members names and investigate, if they haven't already.

The fact that they haven't leads me to the same conclusion as you; they obviously have something to hide.

[edit on 15-11-2007 by Freeborn]

Is this thing for real?

I just thought it was a southpark joke???

Napalm the scum... or chemically castrate them or just lock them up for eternity...

reply to post by mr-lizard


NAMBLA has been around forever. Im talking a very very long time.

And again, very well said Jasn.

I too find it absolutely disturbing that these groups are allowed to congegrate, etc etc.

And I agree that the government is more then likely aware of this list (and maybe some politicians are on the list)....and many members have been investigated im sure....

However, I think the problem is that they havent been caught comitting a crime. Apparently its not illegal to talk about child pedophilia in the sense "I want to participate in it"....

These [admitted] pedophiles know the law inside and out...and they know just what the line is...and they make sure that nobody is aware of them crossing that line.

This goes for the dude Jack McClellan (admitted pedophile) who runs a website that tells other pedophiles how to find little girls, etc etc. LEO cant do anything to him, because he hasnt [be caught] at anything "illegal".


[edit on 15-11-2007 by greeneyedleo]

Oh and for those reading who dont know about McCellan...Here is info on the disgusting monster:


Jack McClellan

Example of some FBI "busts" on NAMBLA (though an old article)

FBI Bust




[edit on 15-11-2007 by greeneyedleo]

reply to post by mr-lizard


Yes, it is indeed for real.

It's one of many similar groups. If I remember correctly, they all operate under a sort of "umbrella" organization.


Some say that they basically only exist in name these days, however, I find that very hard to believe.


Jasn

I think you laid out the reasons that this group(and every one like them) isn't raided, convicted and locked away for eternity already Simius. There is NO way the FBI or whoever doesn't know the membership of this group. If they can bloody well infiltrate the Mob, they can get inside this organization. I think I would be ok with my tax dollars paying to get rid of these kind of people.

Even the thought of people trying to legalize this makes me disgusted.

reply to post by GAOTU789


Indeed!

I can't imagine this group not getting reamed if they had no power behind the scenes.

Their mission statement, coupled with the sheer amount of politicians that get caught trying to solicit little boys and repeated accusations of political figures having little boy molesting and abusing parties, makes me feel that they absolutely MUST have some kind of governmental protection.


jasn

I also thought South Park just made it up. If they want to be gay, fine, just not with little boys.

Can you imagine a better way to control someone who has a vote in congress than to have video of them doing such things? We’re not in Kansas anymore, apparently we’re in Nebraska.

"You love freedom of speech untill you hear something you dont like" -cant remember who said it.
Bit two faced perhaps?

SimiusDei,

Thank you for your post. I found it to be very thought provoking and well written. Several years ago I stumbled upon NAMBLA. I am sure you could imagined my horror and confusion as I learned about what they are and what they stand for. I am sure it is a feeling shared by many when they find out about this organization. For anyone who stumbles upon this thread, make no mistake about it NAMBLA is not just something made up for laughs on South Park. NAMBLA is VERY real, and for the most part they have operated under the radar with little to no mention in the mainstream media. I would suggest that this lack of coverage is mainly in part to the way they operate. NAMBLA, unlike many other organizations that work toward the legalization of acts that are considered illegal, do not try to get in the spotlight at all. They prefer no press. They prefer to work behind the scenes to accomplish their goal.

Now your questions of legality and the secrecy of NAMBLA is what I consider a double edged sword. Part of your argument is centered around behavior and common sense, as well it should be and I do agree with you. History has shown us that organized groups who support a particular idea do tend to live the idea they support. Groups that support the legalization of marijuana do have a large portion of their membership who use the drug. Groups who believed (as your example) to do away with blacks did take steps to do so. So it is well within reason to believe that members who support NAMBLA would also be active pedophiles.

Now the other side of the sword.... The Ku Klux Klan is one such group who wished to do away with blacks (as well as all "non whites") and carried out acts of violence to accomplish their goals. In doing so members of course were arrested, imprisoned and in some cases executed. Members of groups for the legalization of marijuana, due to acts of growing, selling and using, have been arrested and imprisoned. However these groups still exist. The groups themselves are based on ideas not actions. It is their first amendment right to do so and this country is based on a free flow of ideas. America itself was once nothing more than an idea. If groups like the ones I have mention are able to exist under the first amendment, then so should groups like NAMBLA no matter how disgusting, vile, and sick I think it may be. The most one can hope for is the same you would hope for other groups that I have mentioned. You catch their membership living their idea.

As a firm believer in our Constitution and the principles that this country has been founded on you have to take the good with the bad. I, like you, do believe that NAMBLA should open their records and disclose who is a part of their membership. However I am not sure if they have to do it and that is something I will look into just out of my own curiosity. If other groups do have to disclose membership information, then NAMBLA should be held to that same standard. I would assume they do not as they would have a right to privacy, but I could be wrong and I hope I am.

On a more personal note and nothing more than pure speculation, I do believe that members of the government are members of NAMBLA or at the very least support their idea and goal. Even though stories of pedophilia that include members of the government are largely buried and rarely given the attention it so rightly deserves, I do not feel anyone can dismiss it or deny it.

Again thanks for your post and the thread. Definitely food for thought and hopefully this thread will spark some good debate as it continues, provided people can get past the emotional response. Which I do admit is not easy to do. Starred and Flagged!

[edit on 16/11/2007 by section8citizen]
edited for spelling and one extra comment

[edit on 16/11/2007 by section8citizen]

I don't really have a problem with adults having sex with under aged teens. I feel teens can make their own decisions about sex, and that their bodies are ready for sex. Parents should have a say in who their children can date until they become adults, but I don't feel that the law should be involved.

Simius: You stated in your initial post that Pedophilia is "Running Rampant". I would appreciate any studies and statistics that can demonstrate that pedophilia is on the rise, preferably in measurement over a decade at least.

Every time I see topics like this, I am reminded that people have preconceived notions about certain things. Like the notion that there is no way that such a relationship could not be harmful. It is assumed that any relationship is harmful to the child, and there is no if's, and's or but's.

It's a logical shortcut. I know I've heard terrible stories about people doing things to toddlers and other such stuff in the news. I think things like it get reported on more, and give the appearance that it happens a lot more frequently.

Very similarly to a lot of crimes, where crime is actually on the decrease in a lot of areas.... but crime keeps getting reported and focused on. It is more entertaining when things are terrible, it glues you to the TeeVee, and the producers ratings soar. Bad news is Good Business (TM).

It is also due to note that on another thread, someone supplied an article detailing the recidivism studies for sex offenders. It showed that it is hard to predict who will recommit to the act, and that jail time did not seem to be a deterrant. Considering how most sex offenders are treated in Jail, it is unfathomable how it would not be a deterrant unless something is hard-wired wrong.

And if such is the case, is it nature or nurture that is responsible? Environment or biology? It has been found that certain chemical imbalances in the brain contribute to pedophilic tendencies.

It is also well established that people who have been abused often end up abusing. The way I try and look at it is this... if my own son was abused, could I look him in the eye and tell him that someday people are going to want to murder him for being broken by what happened?

I am really not sure what the solution to all of this is. I know that what is going on now isn't working for many people who, apparently, have an ingrained problem with their attractions to children. There needs to be a solution that doesn't call for the murder of the people who, very likely, can't help themselves. Preferably a solution that also breaks the cycle of abuse.

Originally posted by TheColdDragon
Simius: You stated in your initial post that Pedophilia is "Running Rampant". I would appreciate any studies and statistics that can demonstrate that pedophilia is on the rise, preferably in measurement over a decade at least.

You are correct there. Perhaps I should have worded it different.

With the seeming rise of child molestation cases over the last few years, it seems as if pedophilia is a steadily growing epidemic.

There, that's better.

However, with the ever growing populations of children on the internet and sites such as myspace and facebook growing more popular, it seems that children may be more readily available to pedophiles now than ever before.

Molestation and rape are two crimes of opportunity. When there are more opportunities, common sense dictates that there will likely be more crimes.

Thanks for calling me out on that one!

Jasn

reply to post by section8citizen


Likewise section8.

I very much appreciate the input.

I VERY much agree with what you say about their ideas and speech being protected. It is protected and it SHOULD be protected.

However, I feel that they should, at the VERY least, but closely scrutinized and monitored. Not because of what they say, but because of the likelihood that SOME of them actively participate in acts of pedophilia.

If one was trying to crack down on pedophilia, groups such as this seem to be a good place to start.

However, if a member is found to be doing nothing wrong, they should not be punished because they happen to have different ideals that a good majority of us find despicable.

Thanks again!

Jasn

reply to post by Kingdrakethe3rd

You are kidding right??? Please tell me you are kidding. Have you ever seen the result of such abuse up close? The psychological damage. The physical damage. Have you ever had a little girl so scared of her own father because of the abuse she wont let you go at the hospital? Seen a little one so traumatized that they just sit there like zombies and stare into space. Have you ever looked into the eyes of a little one that has been abused? Surely if you ever had, you would never had posted such a assinine comment such as that. Personally, molesters rank higher for the death penalty than murders.

reply to post by six



I guess you didn't understand what I said, since it seems to me you're talking about children, not teens. Teens making the decision to have sex with adults is not child abuse. They are choosing to have sex, and they understand the decision that they're making. They should be allowed to make that choice, and adults should not go to jail for a mutual relationship.

Parents can step in and actually do some parenting if they don't feel their children are capable of having relationships with adults. I just don't feel like the law should be involved.