Giza: A Warning From Antiquity - Part 1

Here is Part 1 of 5 of ‘The Pyramids of Giza: A Warning from Antiquity’. I have created a separate thread for each Part as they essentially deal with quite specific aspects of my work. Part 5 ‘The Cataclysm’ will be made available later.

Each Part is available as a Flash or Powerpoint download. The Flash version auto-runs so it may be preferable to download the Powerpoint version as this allows you to click through the presentation at your own pace.

Even if you are familiar with my work, I would urge that you take your time and work your way through each section before continuing to the next. This is important in order to fully grasp the ‘big picture’ of what my work presents.

‘The Pyramids of Giza: A Warning from Antiquity’

Part 1 – ‘The Beacon’

Flash (2.25mb) – Running Time: 5 mins
www.scottcreighton.co.uk...

Powerpoint (2 mb)
www.scottcreighton.co.uk...

I look forward to all constructive comments and questions.

Best wishes,

Scott Creighton

Thanks for all this info Scott! Looks like I have some research ahead of me here tonight!! Good deal! I wasnt sure what I was going to be reading up on this evening!
We have been very interested in everything you have going on in that mind of yours, and happy to have you share you're knowledge with us here!

Thanks agin!!
Zysin5

For the puposes of this post I am going to be a debunker, but a reasonable debunker. I am surprised that the center of the circle is as far out as it is considering the vaunted skills of the builders of the Great Pyramid.

Is it possible that the apex of the Great Pyramid deviates from the exact center of the square at the base of the pyramid? Going further is it possible that the center of the circle that you are talking about is actually at the center of the square base?

If it were, I would be a lot more intrigued at your presentation than I am at the moment, although, contrary to instructions I haven't read past Part 1 of your presentation.

[edit on 10-10-2007 by ipsedixit]

I have looked at all of the parts of your presentation and I am definitely intrigued now. You might be on to something, but isn't this a very awkward way to present information?

Keep in mind that this is early in the 21st. century and only now is this sort of thing coming to light thanks to the activities of a very few people and I might add, not the people that would be the targeted demographic for such a message (i.e. the mainstream scientific establishment.)

Why didn't they carve this message on the walls of the interior of these pyramids? lol. How would you know the answer to that question?

I am intrigued by the sort of speculation that you bring up with your presentation. As a layperson, the relationship of the pyramids at Giza to the constellation Orion (specifically the belt of Orion) doesn't seem like a wild supposition. I'm not so convinced of the rest of it.

Having said that, I read a translation of Herodotus' Histories, and he said that while in Egypt he talked to priests at a temple who said that they had records of kings dating back 30,000 years! If that is true, they might have had records of the repeating cataclysm, and thus have possessed the knowledge that you say they were trying to communicate.

Fascinating stuff. I already knew that the ancients were way, way, way, smarter and wiser than we give them credit for. (That's another story.)

Suggestion: That you consolidate discussion to one thread. People could refer to specific parts of your presentation in their questions. I think it's going to be hard to follow this on four threads. But hey, whuddo I 'no?

reply to post by ipsedixit
Hello Ipsedixit,

I have looked at all of the parts of your presentation and I am definitely intrigued now. You might be on to something, but isn't this a very awkward way to present information?

Keep in mind that this is early in the 21st. century and only now is this sort of thing coming to light thanks to the activities of a very few people and I might add, not the people that would be the targeted demographic for such a message (i.e. the mainstream scientific establishment.)

Why didn't they carve this message on the walls of the interior of these pyramids? lol. How would you know the answer to that question?

SC:Think about it. Your civilisation has been all but completely obliterated in some cataclysm. You know that very quickly the survivors will descend into a much more primitive existence and much of what had been learned will be lost. In time reading and writing skills will also be lost. Written language (e.g. hieroglyphs) will be meaningless to future generations.

However, you wish to pass on knowledge of such cataclysmic cycles to your children and your children’s children. (Note: the ‘cataclysmic cycle’ does not mean there will ALWAYS be a cataclysm within the cycle – only the potential for one). You know that the ‘danger points’ within the cycle occurs approximately at each end of the Orion Belt ‘pendulum swing’. So you create a design – a PICTORIAL CORRELATION – of Orion’s Belt (three large pyramids) and the start and end of the ‘pendulum swing’ – (the 2 sets of ‘Queens’ pyramids). It is very easy for any civilisation to SEE this correlation since it is not written in a language we do not understand. Even now there is much in Ancient Egyptian hieroglyphs that we just do not understand and much that is purely educated guesswork. It would have made no sense to convey such information using a language because the Designers could not have been sure that their descendents would be able to read their language which they believed would have been lost. Thus they devised a PICTORIAL message – the Giza layout.

Furthermore, that the Gizamids are largely devoid of such inscriptions forces us to look elsewhere for their meaning. The next most obvious place to look for any meaning is in their arrangement and this is what I have done.

I am intrigued by the sort of speculation that you bring up with your presentation. As a layperson, the relationship of the pyramids at Giza to the constellation Orion (specifically the belt of Orion) doesn't seem like a wild supposition. I'm not so convinced of the rest of it.

I think that there are good grounds to suggest that the ‘Giza Precession Wheel’ and the ‘Greater Orion Correlation’ are indeed presented on the ground at Giza. What they mean I can only speculate on. However, I do feel that it is more than coincidence that the dates presented in the ‘Clock’ match the dates that science is now telling us a cataclysm occurred on the Earth and also matches the date Plato tells us Atlantis sank. Yes, this is speculation on my part but not entirely baseless speculation.

Having said that, I read a translation of Herodotus' Histories, and he said that while in Egypt he talked to priests at a temple who said that they had records of kings dating back 30,000 years! If that is true, they might have had records of the repeating cataclysm, and thus have possessed the knowledge that you say they were trying to communicate.

SC: Yes – the history of AE goes far beyond the Dynastic period taught in our classrooms. The Shemsu-Hor (Followers of Horus) were a group of enlightened individuals whose history apparently goes back thousands of years before Menes ever unified Egypt. I speculate that it is perhaps this group who were the ‘custodians’ of the ancient ‘codex’ which Imhotep finally initiated the construction of.

More..

reply to post by ipsedixit

I am intrigued by the sort of speculation that you bring up with your presentation. As a layperson, the relationship of the pyramids at Giza to the constellation Orion (specifically the belt of Orion) doesn't seem like a wild supposition. I'm not so convinced of the rest of it.

SC: I think that there are good grounds to suggest that the ‘Giza Precession Wheel’ and the ‘Greater Orion Correlation’ I propose are indeed presented on the ground at Giza. What they mean I can only speculate on. However, I do feel that it is more than coincidence that the dates presented in the ‘Clock’ match the dates that science is now telling us a cataclysm occurred on the Earth and also matches the date Plato tells us Atlantis sank. Yes, this is speculation on my part but not entirely baseless speculation.

Having said that, I read a translation of Herodotus' Histories, and he said that while in Egypt he talked to priests at a temple who said that they had records of kings dating back 30,000 years! If that is true, they might have had records of the repeating cataclysm, and thus have possessed the knowledge that you say they were trying to communicate.

SC: Yes – the history of AE goes far beyond the Dynastic period taught in our classrooms. The Shemsu-Hor (Followers of Horus) were a group of enlightened individuals whose history apparently goes back thousands of years before Menes ever unified Egypt. I speculate that it is perhaps this group who were the ‘custodians’ of the ancient ‘codex’ which Imhotep finally initiated the construction of.

Fascinating stuff. I already knew that the ancients were way, way, way, smarter and wiser than we give them credit for.

SC: Glad you found it interesting.

Suggestion: That you consolidate discussion to one thread. People could refer to specific parts of your presentation in their questions. I think it's going to be hard to follow this on four threads. But hey, whuddo I 'no?

SC: Thanks for the tip. I thought it best to split my work in this way because in order to manage the various topics better.

Best wishes,

SC

reply to post by ipsedixit

Hello Ipsedixit,

For the purposes of this post I am going to be a debunker, but a reasonable debunker. I am surprised that the center of the circle is as far out as it is considering the vaunted skills of the builders of the Great Pyramid.

Is it possible that the apex of the Great Pyramid deviates from the exact center of the square at the base of the pyramid?

SC: The ‘implied circle’s’ centre is within 0.02% of Khafre’s pyramid centre, not the ‘Great Pyramid’ (Khufu) as you state. Certainly I would have preferred that the centres matched precisely but I think the error is within acceptable construction tolerances for such a large scale project. That we find such a small error and find also that the Sphinx ends up sitting on the outside edge of the circle can be no coincidence. This is – in my opinion - intentional design.

Best wishes,

SC

awesome stuff man, thanks a lot for posting this for all of us newbies to this subject, this is very interesting, I'm hooked, lol, anyway, I'm off to part two!



[edit on 14-10-2007 by luis9343]

reply to post by luis9343

Hello Luis,

Luis9343: awesome stuff man, thanks a lot for posting this for all of us newbies to this subject, this is very interesting, I'm hooked, lol, anyway, I'm off to part two!

Many thanks for your post. Glad you find it interesting. Part 2 is my personal favourite. Hope you enjoy this too.

Best,

SC

reply to post by Scott Creighton


Thanks for the explanation I was also wondering why it was not a perfect center within the pyramids circle.

I wonder if you have physically done the measuring of the circle.

reply to post by marg6043

Hello Marg6043,

Many thanks for your post.

Marg6043: Thanks for the explanation I was also wondering why it was not a perfect center within the pyramids circle.

SC: What you have to understand is that the map I use is from the Giza Plateau Mapping Project (GPMP) and is the most accurate groundplan that is presently publicly available. This does not mean, however, that it is entirely 100% accurate. Certainly when one uses an image of the pyramids from Google Earth the results are slightly different (better):

www.scottcreighton.co.uk...

I do not, however, recommend using any Google Earth image for such purposes since the Earth's atmosphere acts like a lens and causes a slight distortion of the images. There is also the consideration that Google Earth uses multiple composite photographs that are 'knitted together' which can also introduce errors.

I have also considered the possibility that the 'Queens Pyramids' of Menkaure should have been placed further southwest but were restricted from this due to the Maadi formation. This would have resulted in the circle's centre being more accurately placed over the centre of Khafre.

At the end of the day I do not think an error of 0.02% is too significant and is certainly within construction tolerances for a building project of this scale. I think the AE of the 4th Dynasty have given us enough accuracy for us to understand what is really being presented to us at Giza - a precession wheel and calendar.

Best wishes,

SC

Hi Scott, thank you for sharing your work, I for one find it very fascinating and very well done. Keep it up!

In a previous post/thread found here
I asked if you thought maybe Extraterrestrials were involved in passing down information to the AEs which you replied with a "No", but I find it interesting that maybe you are leaving this "possibility" out of the equation. As found in part 1 'The Beacon'

”They [the temples] were built according to an architectural plan
which was supposed to have been revealed in a codex that fell from
the heavens at Saqqara in the days of Imhotep.” - Aldred 'The Egyptians', P32

Since the 'codex' is not physical matter that "fell" from "the heavens" then 'whom' do you believe Aldred was referring this information may have come from? God(s) in the heavens, if they exist, which could also mean ETs, if they exist, couldn't it?

Also from part 1 'The Beacon'

It seems also, from the evidence of advanced
mathematical and astronomical knowledge we find encoded
into the groundplan of Giza, that a relatively advanced
civilisation existed on the Earth at that time and – as Plato
confirms – was completely destroyed.

Does this mean that you believe this has a connection to the Lost City of Atlantis, (aka Keftiu by the Egyptian records), according to the dialogs of Plato?

Also, do you think maybe the "secret plan" was from the Minoans? who were known for having very high and advanced knowledge of mathematics?

Sorry if any of this was already covered in another post/thread of yours, theres a few of them , or in another one of your Power Point Presentations, I just seen part 1 and wanted to ask these things before seeing the rest and filling up my brain and while my questions/curiosity was still fresh in my mind.

Thanks,
Bzzzzzzz

reply to post by BuzzingOn

Hello BuzzingOn,

Thanks for your post.

BuzzingOn: Since the 'codex' is not physical matter that "fell" from "the heavens" then 'whom' do you believe Aldred was referring this information may have come from? God(s) in the heavens, if they exist, which could also mean ETs, if they exist, couldn't it?

SC: Aldred’s quotation is a hieroglyph translation from the collonade in the Temple of Horus at Edfu. My interpretation of this translation is that ‘heavens’ refers to humankind when we existed in a ‘higher’ state or a ‘Golden Age’ known in AE mythology as the ‘First Time’ or Zep Tepi. This is a time before the Earth ‘fell’ (i.e. its axis toppled); a time when there existed a global, sea-faring civilisation who held a deep understanding of mathematics, astronomy and geodesy. After the cataclysm of c.10,550BC, the remnant (i.e. survivors) of this civilisation created a small-scale model of Giza, perhaps crafted in granite or mabe even in gold.

Into this model (template) they encoded a cycle of time using the Belt stars of the Orion constellation. This model or template would have been passed down for many generations until mankind had recovered from the cataclysm sufficiently to initiate the actual construction of the model which – after thousands of years – would have become very sacred to the AEs who inherited it. It would have been deemed to have come from ‘heaven’ which is simply to say it came from a time when humans of higher intellect and ability existed. In all probability the AEs of the 4th Dynasty who implemented the construction of Giza most likely had no understanding of the deeper knowledge encoded by their ancient forebears into the template they were themselves building. But nevertheless, the AEs built it because it was so sacred to them – it supposedly came from ‘heaven’ after all.

BuzzingOn: Also from part 1 'The Beacon'

SC: It seems also, from the evidence of advanced mathematical and astronomical knowledge we find encoded into the groundplan of Giza, that a relatively advanced civilisation existed on the Earth at that time and – as Plato confirms – was completely destroyed.

BuzzingOn: Does this mean that you believe this has a connection to the Lost City of Atlantis, (aka Keftiu by the Egyptian records), according to the dialogs of Plato?

SC: Possibly. As well as future dates, there are 3 key past dates encoded into the Giza Precession Wheel: 10,550BC, 9,884BC and 8,066BC. The first date corresponds reasonably well with the date for the asteroid strike science is now telling us afflicted the Earth at the end of the Younger Dryas period. The second date, 9,884BC corresponds fairly well with Plato’s date for the sinking of Atlantis given as around 9,500BC. The close observer will notice that from 10,550BC to 9,884BC is a difference of 666 years! These dates are all plainly encoded within the Giza Precession Wheel. So it seems that there were 2 cataclysms – one in 10,550BC but the main event occurring 666 years later, in 9,884BC. The final date – 8,066BC – has been given to us to mark the end of the ‘cataclysmic phase’ the Earth must pass through every 13,000 years or so.

BuzzingOn: Also, do you think maybe the "secret plan" was from the Minoans? who were known for having very high and advanced knowledge of mathematics?

SC: It think we should be looking for a civilisation who understood the use of decimal fractions, Pi, a circle as 360 degrees and have the ability to understand precession of the stars and be able to calculate and project precessional motions far into the future. No civilisation we presently know of had anywhere near such abilities which is why I think we are looking for a civilisation that is lost to our history books. We may have none of their artefacts but at Giza we can see their incredible mind.

SC

This is a time before the Earth ‘fell’ (i.e. its axis toppled); a time when there existed a global, sea-faring civilisation who held a deep understanding of mathematics, astronomy and geodesy.

Howdy Scott

Global? I thought your previous postion was that they religious stayed only on coastal areas - so that all evidence was lost in the sea rise?

How come we can find evidence of hunter gathers before and after the alleged destruction of a global civilization but absolutely nothing, not even a pottery shard, for the civilization itself?

If it was global how did an event(s) in North America selectedly wipe them out completely, absolutely and without a trace but leaving lots of other peoples -who left traces. Puzzling? Please explain.

[edit on 27-10-2007 by Hanslune]

reply to post by Hanslune

Hans: Global? I thought your previous position was that they religious stayed only on coastal areas - so that all evidence was lost in the sea rise?

SC: No, Hans. You are placing words in my mouth again. Most of the world's population then - as now - would have been located near to the world's coastlines. There would undoubtedly also have been some inland communities.

Hans: How come we can find evidence of hunter gathers before and after the alleged destruction of a global civilization but absolutely nothing, not even a pottery shard, for the civilization itself?

SC: Why shouldn’t we find such H-G evidence from before and after? Not all areas of the Earth would have been affected in the same way. What I am saying is that we will discover ‘evidence’ of earlier civilisations under the sea. But what we will find will be bones and broken pots probably not dissimilar to those you have mentioned. No iPods, no betteries, spark plugs or anything of the kind. Some of the people who were lost did, however, have a high understanding of mathematics, astronomy and geodesy. But how do you leave artefacts of this? You create a design which you pass on to your descendants which you hope they will understand

Hans: If it was global how did an event(s) in North America selectedly wipe them out completely, absolutely and without a trace but leaving lots of other peoples -who left traces. Puzzling? Please explain.

SC: An asteroid or bollide exploding high above the North Atlantic would certainly have immediate catastrophic effects for that part of the planet and the peoples living there. However, (according to the theory of Dr Flavio Barbiero) even if a relatively small chunk of that exploding asteroid hit the ocean at the right angle, this could result in a chain of events occurring that ultimately results in a shift of the Earth’s axis. You can see this here:

www.grahamhancock.com...

And such a shift of the Earth’s axis would have dire consequences for peoples all over the planer, although depending on the angle of the tilt, some parts of the world would be affected greater than others. This would result in melting ice sheets, rapidly rising seas forcing people to higher ground and ultimately bringing about the end of the last Ice Age.

observer.guardian.co.uk...
www.physorg.com...

Best,

SC

------------------------------------
fixed quote


[edit on 27/10/07 by masqua]

Hans: So Scott where are they? Before basing a complex idea on a purposed civilization wouldn’t it be wise to actually have evidence that that civilization existed? Why didn’t the survivors (since it was global) simply move and set up shop elsewhere-they were by your own omission, seafaring? It is indeed puzzling that a global sea faring civilization would be completely wiped out by an event in one part of the globe-one that left 'survivors' all over the earth.

Hans: Why only under the sea? I find it very difficult to understand how a global civilization would ONLY leave artifacts on coastal areas – especially as the entire world wasn’t wiped out meaning a large portion of the civilization would have survived.

Hans: Outside the problem that you have no evidence for this civilization what evidence do you have that these unknown survivors had these skills – other than your idea you are presenting- what other evidence do you have? Restating your idea as evidence sets up a circular logic of evidence. Strangely these super smart people didn’t just keep there civilization running – I mean you say (and Plato agrees if is story is correct) they had no technology except mental brilliance, being smart is easy to transport – why was the culture just not continued?

Hans: Are you claiming the Egyptians are there descendants?

Hans: Hmmmm, well unfortunately the Ice cores and sediment cores from various places in the world don’t support a world wide disaster- something or more correctly a series of events appears to have occurred in North America over an unknown period of time. The Axis of the Earth has not shifted. I read your link and just couldn’t complete it- the blatant errors and misrepresentation were just to much to bear. Not a good reference to say the least-Scott you do know the difference between real science and fringe pseudo science don't you?

So all the good Atlantean people were killed but everyone else kept on going…

Oh one more question, the main vegetable crops developed after this time period-so what did these guy eat?

reply to post by Hanslune

Hello Hans,

Many thanks for your post.

Hans: So Scott where are they? Before basing a complex idea on a purposed civilization wouldn’t it be wise to actually have evidence that that civilization existed?

SC: Hans, I keep saying this to you. I have no idea who this civilisation was or from where they came. What I do know, however, is that there exists within the arrangement of the structures at Giza relatively advanced mathematical and astronomical knowledge that we cannot attribute to the AEs. And yet it exists – I have shown it to you and everyone else watching this debate. These mathematical and astronomical findings are unequivocal. So, if we cannot attribute this knowledge to the AEs (who undertook the actual construction of the monuments) then what are we to do? What is your answer to this paradox, Hans?

Now, Plato tells us of a high civilisation having existed in remote antiquity – and I have no reason to believe Plato was speaking falsely of the priest, Solon, who related the initial story. Is this our missing link? I don’t know. What we do know is that the history of Egypt goes much further into antiquity than the vast majority of our history books care to detail. The Shemsu-Hor (‘Followers of Horus’) an apparently enlightened group existed in Ancient Egypt thousands of years before the dynastic period ever arose. Is this our missing link? Again, I do not know.

It does, however, seem a remarkable coincidence that Plato tells us of a high civilisation having once existed in remote antiquity, was destroyed around 11,500 years ago and now we find evidence of advanced mathematics and astronomy at Giza indicating these very times! Furthermore, we now find science telling us that catastrophic events did indeed occur on Earth at those times which seems to have been the catalyst for bringing about the end of the last Ice Age.

It does not take a genius to join the dots and, in my considered opinion, this is all more than simple happenchance. A pattern is now beginning to emerge and we ignore this and rubbish it at our peril.

Hans: Why didn’t the survivors (since it was global) simply move and set up shop elsewhere-they were by your own omission, seafaring? It is indeed puzzling that a global sea faring civilization would be completely wiped out by an event in one part of the globe-one that left 'survivors' all over the earth.

SC: Hans – I am not going to speculate any further than need be. I do not know the geographic or demographic disposition of this ‘Lost Civilisation’ so how can you possibly expect me to comment on such a question. That’s just absurd.

Hans: Outside the problem that you have no evidence for this civilization what evidence do you have that these unknown survivors had these skills – other than your idea you are presenting- what other evidence do you have?

SC: We have already discussed the Antikythera Mechanism in an earlier thread. This device was dated to about 200BC because it was found on a sunken Roman boat, the wood of which was carbon dated to that time. The device itself, however, has not been dated and could be much much older. Even so, this artefact presents us with clear and unequivocal evidence that advanced knowledge existed that even YOU accept is out of time and place. Where did it come from? How long did it take to acquire the mathematical, astronomical knowledge the device clearly demonstrates? Ironic, don’t you think, that such an advanced artefact was recovered from under the sea! I wonder why we haven’t yet managed to find any other similar artefact?

Hans: Restating your idea as evidence sets up a circular logic of evidence.

SC: I cite my work as corroborating evidence to the pattern that is beginning to emerge from a number of quarters.

Hans: Are you claiming the Egyptians are there descendants?

SC: The AEs themselves tell us their history is much older and existed in a higher state in great antiquity.

More...

reply to post by Hanslune

From previous.

Hans: Hmmmm, well unfortunately the Ice cores and sediment cores from various places in the world don’t support a world wide disaster- something or more correctly a series of events appears to have occurred in North America over an unknown period of time.

SC: Sorry, but the ice core record does indeed show that the poles have shifted. The ice core record does indeed show evidence of a world wide ‘event’. Read the work of Dr Paul LaViolette. Are you saying this is not true? Are you saying that the former northern hemisphere ice sheet did not cover most of America and Europe and disappeared – relatively speaking - overnight? Alas, all that ice has now gone so how can it be tested?

The Axis of the Earth has not shifted. I read your link and just couldn’t complete it- the blatant errors and misrepresentation were just to much to bear. Not a good reference to say the least-Scott you do know the difference between real science and fringe pseudo science don't you?

SC: Stating that my work is full of errors simply won’t do, Hans. Point out the errors I have made and then perhaps we can have a proper discussion.

Saying the Earth’s axis has not shifted simply demonstrates your complete ignorance on this subject. The Earth’s axis shifted (fractionally) as a result of the December 2004 tsunami. I have told you repeatedly how Dr Barbiero’s work shows how a relatively small asteroid striking the Earth at the right angle and in the right location (ocean) can ultimately result in a shifting of the poles. You simply choose to ignore this.

Furthermore, you ignore the voice of the many anceint cultures from all opver the world who, in their own words, tell us the Earth's axis shifted. We know its possible so why do you so easily and arrogantly dismiss such ancient references?

Hans: So all the good Atlantean people were killed but everyone else kept on going…

SC: The survivors – from ALL of Earth’s cultures at that time - kept going.

Oh one more question, the main vegetable crops developed after this time period-so what did these guy eat?

SC: So where do you think these crops suddenly, miraculously appeared from? Divine intervention? Seems to me such crops already existed SOMEWHERE on Earth but were only introduced to other places/cultures after the cataclysm c.10,550BC. Hmm – I wonder how that could have been?

Best,

SC.

Hans: I’m afraid I have to disagree with you Scott. You are making a fundamental error. Laviolette has proposed a “theory” it has not been accepted by those in the scientific community, as a matter of fact it has been the talking point of much discussion. It is a talking point only, a theory not an accepted fact. I believe the point is now that they don’t accept his evidence of a spike of beryllium-10. What does the ice sheet covering NA have to do with believing LaViolette? The Ice left traces in particular the lake and ocean sediments – not to mention the surviving Greenland ice cap. I seem to have missed the world wide news flash that this had occurred. oh I was referring to the work of Flavio Barbiero in regards to simplistic errors not yours.

Hans: Really? You are saying that there was a major change of the World’s Axis around 10,500? I’m unaware of a scientific consensus on that – is there?

"The Earth’s axis shifted (fractionally) as a result of the December 2004 tsunami."

Hans: So what? What does that have to do with what we are talking about?

Hans: Again he has put up a theory – no one in the scientific community has accepted this. Again Scott, seriously do you understand the difference between a proposed theory and one that has been accepted? I can state a theory – but it doesn’t make it fact.
Furthermore, you ignore the voice of the many anceint cultures from all opver the world who, in their own words, tell us the Earth's axis shifted.
Hans: That is your interpretation – which you need to support your own idea.

"We know its possible so why do you so easily and arrogantly dismiss such ancient references?"

Hans: Is pole shift possible? Yes it is and it has happened in the past, but you have not shown anything to prove that it occurred in a massive way in 10,500 to wipe out your global Atlantean empire.

SC: The survivors – from ALL of Earth’s cultures at that time - kept going.

Hans: And not a single one of them demonstrated a sliver of common technical knowledge? Not even common pottery – I mean they didn’t bring a single thing from Atlantis?

SC: So where do you think these crops suddenly, miraculously appeared from?

Hans: Ooops, you do realize that they didn’t miraculously appear don’t you Scott? They evolved quite slowly, in 10500 BC no grain crops were domesticated. I recommend you read Diamond’s work on this matter. As a matter of fact in most cases the original wild versions still exist we know where they were all from – none were introduced from an unknown area. I recommend you read about the evolution of the Maize and Emmer Wheat.

“SC hhmm – I wonder how that could have been?”

Hans: you probably need to do some study on this subject, it’s a rather large hole in the old idea eh? Along with no vast global empire!

Best,

Hans

Edited to include a linke to the International geological congress
www.33igc.org...


[edit on 30-10-2007 by Hanslune]

reply to post by Hanslune

Hello Hans,

Hans: I’m afraid I have to disagree with you Scott. You are making a fundamental error. Laviolette has proposed a “theory” it has not been accepted by those in the scientific community, as a matter of fact it has been the talking point of much discussion. It is a talking point only, a theory not an accepted fact. I believe the point is now that they don’t accept his evidence of a spike of beryllium-10.

SC: I am unaware of the ‘fundamental error’ you seem to think I am making. Do explain.

As for LaViolette’s work – ALL twelve of Dr LaViolette’s scientific predictions made in the 1980s have since been independently verified by the scientific community. Indeed, some scientists who initially disagreed with LaViolette’s work have since changed their minds.

Prediciton #3: [Cosmic Ray Bombardment. LaViolette concludes that a volley of Galactic cosmic rays bombarded the Earth and solar system toward the end of the last Ice Age (ca. 14,000 years B.P.). Also, his findings suggest that other such superwaves passed us ar earlier times and were responsible for triggering the initiation and termination of the Ice Ages and mass extinctions. He is the first to suggest that the Earth is exposed to recurrent and frequent bombardment by cosmic ray volleys.

1987 – Verification: Glaciologists discover berylium-10 isotope peaks in ice-age polar ice. These indicate that the cosmic ray flux on the Earth became very high on several occasions during the last Ice Age, confirming Dr LaViolette’s theory that galactic superwaves have repeatedly passed through our solar system in geologically recent times.

’Earth Under Fire’ – LaViolette (p.382)

SC: As you can see from the quoted passaged, LaViolette did not himself provide the evidence for the Be-10 isotope spike as you have stated. This was verified independently by glaciologists.

Hans: Really? You are saying that there was a major change of the World’s Axis around 10,500? I’m unaware of a scientific consensus on that – is there?

SC: No, I do not say this. What I am saying is that it is not impossible and it is possible that particular features of the Great Pyramid may well allude to such.

SC: The Earth’s axis shifted (fractionally) as a result of the December 2004 tsunami.

Hans: So what? What does that have to do with what we are talking about?

SC: The point, Hans, is simply to demonstrate that pole shifts can and do happen and not even the stabilising effect of the equatorial bulge seems able to prevent it. It was not so long ago that it was believed by science that such shifts were simply not possible. Now we see that they are. Science slowlybut ever so surely is moving towards the words of those ancient voices, whispering, “We told you so!”

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