Is google/norton/itunes a virus or monitoring structure, amongst others?

reply to post by Areal51

Get rid of anti-virus because the best anti-virus is none, really. Turn off all the firewalls on your computer too. This may sound bad, but you have to be smart about this. If your a gamer, you'll know that everything that runs in the backgound is a waste to system memory and resources. Like in an earlier post, if you know your way around the computer, especially the "system 32" folder, you should have no problem with virus' in the future. Also, where people tend to get their virus' the most is from visiting bad websites (these could be any websites, just with bad modderators or something) and when you enter the website, it automatically runs a hidden script that you cant see, which installs a virus. To prevent this, I don't use Microsoft Internet Explorer. Instead, use Mozilla Firefox with adblock plus and Noscript. It works like a charm.

As for all these programs haveing mointering capabilities, I'd say that a company like google would probably pose some interest to a company that would have a "bigger" plan for this world. Being the most widely used internet search engine, not to mention almost all private office servers are google made and run, I am sure they can moniter all that we search. I even found a code that when you type it into google, you can view security camera's that are un protected. That was sooo cool. Programs like iTunes and stufff, I doubt it. I'm sure some of these people that are behind all this NWO stuff do have a hand in microsoft, being the most widely used OS for everything. (Sorry Apple. you just suck ) As for me, from time to time, I use a program called "Peer Guardian" Its a program that blocks millions of tracker IPs, Local, Buisness, and Government from accessing your computer. I don't know if it works, but it makes me feel better inside. But anyways, don't use antivirus. Remember, Anything is possible in safe mode (F8)
But yea. thats my 0.02$ CAD

So youll use something that you dont know that works yet advise using something that everyone knows that it works, yeah that makes sense.

My firewall (sygate) and AV (Nod) have zero effect on gaming, Ive unloaded both of them and I didnt even get a 1fps increase and they work perfectly fine with both running, even online games. Ive also added my games drive to the exception list of the AV.

Saying you dont run these thing because you need resources is laughable, are you on a 10 year old PC?

Originally posted by Flyer
If you knew anything, youd know a router doesnt stop any trojans or or programs phoning home.

Actually thats not entirely true. In its native state (ie. out of the box) you are correct a router will pass packets as desired. However if you establish well defined ACL's it would stop traffic from "phoning home", assuming by this you mean packets that would leave the local network and assuming you know what type of packets are involved.

brill

reply to post by djaybeetoo


Words from a wisened old soul. For some time way back I was a faithful beta-tester for Norton (free software that was decent, etc.), but then I installed a new package from them (Utilities) on a month old Thinkpad. The machine never booted up again. I sent it to IBM under warranty. "Sorry, but installing this (any beta realease) voided your warranty." Norton-"It's not our problem. This is a risk you agreed to take when you became a beta-tester." When I boot my system I open the task manager, then the processes tab, and kill anything with a small i as the first letter. My usage is very media heavy (particularly music) and I have yet to notice any adverse affect (and I transfer media files to portable devices daily). Any media file that wants a license or attempts to pull up the web for any reason is immediately flushed to an old external harddrive just as all new probationary files are placed there. All are screened before being put on the system. A year ago I would download one or two a month that were bad, but now it can be several a week. I advocate and practice the death penalty. Anything that attempts to do anything without first asking me (beware of queries that flash on screen a few seconds then default to their own agenda) is killed mercilessly at once. The source is blacklisted. Trust NO ONE on the web PERIOD. On this site it is amazing to me how many former Green Berets who are recipients of the Medal of Honor were personal security for the Illuminati at a secret base in the Nevada desert. My opinion is most of those writers' biggest concerns are passing sophomore health or Drivers' Ed. Hint to all those "vets": The reason that little hottie in Spanish class will not go out with you is because your hand is still sticky (wiping it off on your bedspread isn't the same as taking a good shower).

Originally posted by Flyer
My firewall (sygate) and AV (Nod) have zero effect on gaming, Ive unloaded both of them and I didnt even get a 1fps increase and they work perfectly fine with both running, even online games. Ive also added my games drive to the

Hey, try the freeware version of Kerio (version 2.something) instead of Sygate. It's unbelievably light. You'll love it if you love light programs.

Originally posted by brill

Actually thats not entirely true. In its native state (ie. out of the box) you are correct a router will pass packets as desired. However if you establish well defined ACL's it would stop traffic from "phoning home", assuming by this you mean packets that would leave the local network and assuming you know what type of packets are involved.

brill

and how many people who are asking about protection know about that or have the inclination to do that? Do you do this too?

Its ok for geeks but to suggest to others to do that is pretty dumb, especially when you consider most peoples knowledge level.

Id rather just install a software firewall for them. If people on the net were intelligent, there would be no phishing, no malware and no viruses.

reply to post by For(Home)Country


You ommitted one caveat in your dissertation on risk: FOR GOD'S SAKE NEVER USE A CONDOM!!! just open up your spleen and pick the little buggers out. I was a systems developer and security analyst for the World Wide Military Command and Control Computer System (WMCCCS) (those who worked on it know what it was) before you were a glimmer in your Momma's eye. I know my way around the soft parts of a computer and I won't mess (and that's all you can do) in the deep system folders of Windows. Son, a word of advice from Grampa--get real and get some Clearasil.

reply to post by Ankil


Thanks for the good laugh. I needed one.

*thread hijack*

But maybe you're right. But it all depends. Say for instance, you don't have anti-virus (like me) and you get infected. Well, first, you have to take a look at what happens. If you're computer say, shuts down 60 seconds after entering windows, it's obviously a .dll file that is killing your machine. In this instance, you boot up in safe-mode (only loading nessicary system drivers and files, thus not loading the .dll file into your boot sequence.) Once in windows, you can go into "msconfig" and from there, go into your bootup items and pick out the startup driver/file that shouldn't be in there, that is obviously the virus. Then, you can search for this .dll (it will give you the full name of it in msconfig) and delete it. Another problem that virus' cause is wrecking your internet. Say for instnace, you get a virus that locks your homepage to a website you don't want, and you can't go elsewhere. Well, solution is simple. Go into your webbrowser, under tools, and under options. There is probably a pluggin menu. From there, disable any internet explorer pluggins that look fishy. Problem solved. Once browser is restarted, delete the pluggin. Simple as that. So, as you can see, you don't nessicarilly need anti-virus to get rid of a, well, virus, but they do do a good job of preventing them. As for the resources, well, I myself don't have the newest computer (but it's not 10 years old either), and while running windows vista ultimate, it kind of takes up alot of resources as it is, and anti-virus would only slow it down more, well, from the anti-virus programs I've experience anyways. My processer is getting outdated, so I try and keep the load on it to a minumum while still keeping the visual appeal of vista (windows areo is sooo nice), but yea, thats just me. I hope no one got offened by what I said before. It sure seemed like it though....

reply to post by Beachcoma


"We only have One Planet" Speak for yourself

reply to post by For(Home)Country


Homeboy,
That is all fine and good, but consider the demographics of PC users. In general they have neither the education, skills, experience, or interests "we" have. If they turn it on and it works-fine; but if it doesn't they call someone or buy a new one. I use AVG from Grisoft. It is lite, easy, free, updates free daily, and has never missed a bug in my ten years with it. In the spirit of the thread: Your PC is one of their tools now, too. There is nothing sacred to them. They would gig up and rape their own dead mama's copse if it would help them reach their goals. Understand this; These people really have sold their souls to the Devil. The PC is a risk and convenience we choose to use, and they can only get what I choose to give them-you, too.

iTunes does access the store automatically when you load it, and compares your files to online ones and tries to find album artwork. I believe the function of accesing the store online can be turned off in the preferences, but it mifght be somewhere strange, like parental or something like that.

Otherwise, kids would be buying all sorts of songs and pissing off the parents.


I am not sure if you are on OS X since you mentioned Norton, but there is software called Little Snitch
that allows you to see what programs are trying to access the internet, and allow you to deny that capability (I think there may be a newer version than the one in the article). I am sure that there is something similar for PC

DocMoreau

Originally posted by Flyer
and how many people who are asking about protection know about that or have the inclination to do that? Do you do this too?

Its ok for geeks but to suggest to others to do that is pretty dumb, especially when you consider most peoples knowledge level.

Back up a step. You made the claim that "youd know a router doesnt stop any trojans or or programs phoning home." Those are your words, I merely pointed out that your claim is inaccurate. My reply was meant to clarify. I never made any suggestion that anyone do anything, that's their choice not mine but you made a false claim.

Originally posted by Flyer
If people on the net were intelligent...

But then I'd miss the opportunity to read your posts.

brill

reply to post by djaybeetoo


Every thing you do is monitored and/or recorded. If you want a good source/watchdog kindred spirit who speaks out on this, it is Matt Drudge. His website called "The Drudge Report" is an excellent news compendium. He has a nationally broadcast radio program on Sunday Night. Even wealth can no longer buy privacy. Unless everything you do is cash there is a record. Wait for laws limiting or prohibiting posession of cash. Cash is king and the government's Achille's heel, but getting rid of it too suddenly would be a bit too bold. Courage is found in men and women, not in governments.

Originally posted by Flyer
If people on the net were intelligent, there would be no phishing, no malware and no viruses.

Your saying someone who knows nothing about computers makes viruses? That is absurd friend!!!

Originally posted by Flyer
Give it up no one is falling for it.

Listen, I have my ways (that I consider superior) of protecting my system. It has been FLAWLESS since I have started them. If I had my way, YOU, along with other people, would not have a system to spam worthless crap on the internet with. If no one wants to take my advice, FINE, I'm ok with that, but you should not debunk proven methods that could aid the mental growth of others. I consider this a crime against humanity.

Stop insulting me, its giving you NO power, only the illusion of so. You seem desperate to make YOURSELF feel better, not I. I actually would prefer you think this about me, as it gives me a cloak I can work behind. Insult me again, or fail "trying" to prove me otherwise, and I will not hesitate to notify an admin of your childish ways. I think your mood says it all "dazed".

I am a certified A+ computer technician, Thank you.

My name was cshacker for 'computer systems hacker' as of late '90. I hack single player games and I hack hardware, not software (volt mods, etc), I do not know any scripting or complex languages. I know visual basic/HTML, but thats easy stuff. I added 1337 because I am elite compared to 99.9% of people on a computer, it was also not I who added this title for myself, but a dear friend. I mod and build computers. Currently I have just built a dual xeon machine that beats a core2 6400 in most benchmarks. If you do not 'deem' me leet, it makes zero difference, because I do not judge my computing skills on your inferior opinion.

You should not use "retarded" like that, it is very offending, since I have known many great friends that were mentally handicap. This shows what kind of tool you really are. You have just proved it to everyone.

Any further response directed to attempt to insult me, or insult my intelligence, will fail. You just drank phizzy lifting drink...

Good day sir.

edit: I decided to contact an admin anyway, I won't allow my intelligence, or more important, the mantally handicap to be dealt with in this childish manor. If you can't communicate intelligently and respectfully, get off.

[edit on 7-10-2007 by 1337cshacker]

For anyone who sees the light and decides to give Norton the boot, make sure you use this to do it.

/6oq8f

Otherwise, it's a bitch to get rid of.

Originally posted by 1337cshacker

Your saying someone who knows nothing about computers makes viruses? That is absurd friend!!!

No, Im saying if no one installed or fell for these things, there would be no one making them.

Originally posted by 1337cshacker
Listen, I have my ways (that I consider superior) of protecting my system.

I stopped reading there. You said no one should use an AV, it isnt about what you do or not, its about what everyone else should do and you are clearly wrong.

The whole tone of your posts makes you come across as sad and pathetic. This is about general users, not some script kiddie who thinks he too "1337" for an AV or firewall.

i dont know much about the search engines and google programs but what i do know is that google is monitoring everything searched and creating a personal file for all users. soon they'll know what your favorite music is, what your sexual preference is, but also they will know your vital info like ssn, banking codes and any number code involved in everyday life. Google itself was created with seed money from the CIA. you do the math. on a similar note there is a company offering free internet service for those who allow them (the internet company) to monitor all web surfing done by the customer. also most newer computers now come with microphones for internet conversations. but what they dont tell you is that the microphone works two ways so they know when you eat, sleep, what you watch on tv, when you take a crap, or when you and the one you love are gettin' it on.

Originally posted by 1337cshacker
edit: I decided to contact an admin anyway, I won't allow my intelligence, or more important, the mantally handicap to be dealt with in this childish manor. If you can't communicate intelligently and respectfully, get off.

(If I get a warn for a 1-liner, it will have been worth it. )

I recommend you read this one, for your sake. (honestly I think you read the last, but thats my opinion, you see how that does not change what 'happened'? Remember this.)

Originally posted by Flyer

Originally posted by 1337cshacker

Your saying someone who knows nothing about computers makes viruses? That is absurd friend!!!

No, Im saying if no one installed or fell for these things, there would be no one making them.

Originally posted by 1337cshacker
Listen, I have my ways (that I consider superior) of protecting my system.

I stopped reading there. You said no one should use an AV, it isnt about what you do or not, its about what everyone else should do and you are clearly wrong.

The whole tone of your posts makes you come across as sad and pathetic. This is about general users, not some script kiddie who thinks he too "1337" for an AV or firewall.

You read my post right now. If you think anyway who dosen't use your noob programs are wrong, your clearly off track. I say again, my methods have PROVED, as effective, or better. Get over whatever your problem is with me so we don't spoil an otherwise perfectly acceptable topic. Your words do nothing to me, nor change the real facts. Moving on to facts:

You would plainly see if you read my civilized response:
A: Where my name comes from. (perfectly acceptable)
B: What I hack. (mostly hardware, single player games)
C: How wrong you really ARE. (I'm not what you think)
D: Who dubbed me 1337. (A dear friend)

If you want to be like that, I won't read anymore of your post, and neither of us can will have a logical, civilized conversation. I have contacted an admin. I do not prove myself to immature, "noobs", if you want to continue acting like one. I will not continue bickering back and forth, waiting for admin to clean up your mess.

Why must you feel the need to take such energy out on me? Is it really that rewarding? Do you really get off to fighting with people across forums? I think you have had a bad past few days. I think you should stop bickering at me and get to the real problem. If my first post did not make you defensive, you would not be saying anything of which you said! Do these words sound truly like something from a "script kiddie". Frankly, no. Take your energy out on something useful and constructive. You don't even know me to judge me or my knowledge, therefore you have ZERO merrit in anything you say about me. Much less call me wrong for something you have never tried and cannot see the results. You are not using deductive reasoning, try it.

Finally, you seem resistant to learn anything new. You must let this go, because it will only hinder you. Open your mind sir. Do not insult mentally impaired, do not blindly insult intelligent people whom you know nothing about, and your life will be allot easier. Hell, you might actually enjoy something from time to time, how about a logical, knowledge building conversation with a fellow computer "geek"? Are you up for that? because I am.

I would be more than happy to take you as my friend and add to your knowledge. If you let me.

Further, I forgive you, and accept you, your ways and love you/everyone. Why not accept mine as being just as effective when they in fact are? That is a question to ask yourself. Do not shrug this off, ask yourself; WHO are you hindering by not learning a new technique? WHO is lacking?

I said the software was no good, 'for my purposes', as there are better ways than having a program sucking CPU power.

Originally posted by loam

Originally posted by 1337cshacker
edit: I decided to contact an admin anyway, I won't allow my intelligence, or more important, the mantally handicap to be dealt with in this childish manor. If you can't communicate intelligently and respectfully, get off.

(If I get a warn for a 1-liner, it will have been worth it.

)

I have nothing to say to you other than your not in this conversation. I would hardly call it a conversation though, since flyer has not shown any means of constructive communication.

Originally posted by chainsaw freak
i dont know much about the search engines and google programs but what i do know is that google is monitoring everything searched and creating a personal file for all users. soon they'll know what your favorite music is, what your sexual preference is, but also they will know your vital info like ssn, banking codes and any number code involved in everyday life. Google itself was created with seed money from the CIA. you do the math. on a similar note there is a company offering free internet service for those who allow them (the internet company) to monitor all web surfing done by the customer. also most newer computers now come with microphones for internet conversations. but what they dont tell you is that the microphone works two ways so they know when you eat, sleep, what you watch on tv, when you take a crap, or when you and the one you love are gettin' it on.

Funny you mention this, because I happen to know some interesting facts. Google is working on a supercomputer with a massive database to collect information like this about EVERYONE. They will integrate computers into everything, and use this information they collected for total control. Choices we make could be very limited soon, from where we work, what music we listen to, what we order at a restaurant, etc, could be planned and executed automatically. The gov has given them the OK on it, and they have all the software they need. Its a matter of making it a reality now. Google also has helped/agreed with cameras being put up all over America, the world, in all towns, to help gov keep an eye on people and track people.

Originally posted by brill
"""Its ok for geeks but to suggest to others to do that is pretty dumb, especially when you consider most peoples knowledge level."""
You made the claim that "youd know a router doesnt stop any trojans or or programs phoning home." Those are your words, I merely pointed out that your claim is inaccurate. My reply was meant to clarify. I never made any suggestion that anyone do anything, that's their choice not mine but you made a false claim.

Just would like to second brill.

[edit on 7-10-2007 by 1337cshacker]

If no one has tried processes explorer, I highly recommend it. ANY virus or malware will show up here, as some like to 'evade' task manager. You can disable the processes (keeping it in mem) then search and remove it. Given you would have to snoop for the regkey, but that in itself is not totally necessary (unless the virus has another copy of itself in a diff directory, that replaces the deleted. Your search will pick this up though, so still, not totally necessary.) Nothing escapes proc exp as it uses its own code to scan the mem, not the kernal's. Yes it uses the kernel to communicate with the mem (as any other software does/has to), but not the specific code for scanning mem for processes. Thus a virus altering the kernel so task manager wont see something, will not effect proc exp. All you have to do is make proc exp read only, and not even a virus could change ITS code, I don't know of any viruses/malware that attacks proc exp anyway.
www.microsoft.com...
i2.photobucket.com...
You can clearly see if you have a big HDD, or 4 SCSI (small computer system interface) disk in RAID1 like me, it would take a while to scan, so this method of spotting a virus is better than waiting for hours for a scan to be complete. Further, I have used AV in the past for experimental reasons (not as a main defense) and it has been unable to remove some viruses, specifically some worms. Forgive me I forget their names.

Also, encrypting and applying read only attribute to critical files/system files is recommended. If someone would gain to your system, through the firewall, through the router, through windows firewall (all unlikely) he could not decrypt the information, without having your decrypting key for it on his system. If he did get that as well (VERY VERY unlikely) it would override his. If you ever found his not reformatted system, you could easily identify him and press charges. I know from experience for ANYONE to have control of your system, or copy files for that matter, you MUST run an executable. Being VERY careful what you download, from where, and from who, you can totally avoid this, out ruling the need for 'real time' protection in my eyes.

I did say "no one should use anti-virus", ok fine THAT only was wrong, because noobs do need it. Saw it first hand how it helped total tools when I was working in shop as PC repair tech.

Also, I used to use a 64bit system when M$ (microsoft) first developed it. Given mac has been 128bit since G3, this was an improvement for windows. No viruses at the time could attack a 64bit os, the WOW32 emulator could not emulate it, so there is no need for virus software, not even for noobs, on a 64bit machine. I do not run athlon 64's anymore, except my fathers system (3400+ clawhammer/win64), so I'm not up on if there are 64bit viruses out yet. If so, probably not thousands like 32bit.

I can't name a custom software firewall that bugs the hell out of you every time a program has to "phone home". I'll stay off of that, thanks.

Calling me a script kiddie now makes someone look like a joke.

[edit on 7-10-2007 by 1337cshacker]