Russian President Putin Wants NATO to Dissolve

So anyways,

as I was saying, the Russian FOAB is 4 times as powerful as the US MOAB.

If anyone can get me some data on how a Thermobaric Core actually works, that would be greatly appreciated. I understand how a nuclear weapons core works, but the Thermobaric bombs efficiency just doesnt add up in my mind... I need to know the theory behind it.

As for Nato. Has anyone else ever read Red Storm Rising?
It's a very good depiction of how Russia could have dissolved Nato back in the 80's.
I highly reccomend it.

Originally posted by johnsky
If anyone can get me some data on how a Thermobaric Core actually works, that would be greatly appreciated. I understand how a nuclear weapons core works, but the Thermobaric bombs efficiency just doesnt add up in my mind... I need to know the theory behind it.

There's a thread somewhere here about this bomb, but unfortunately it has degenerated into a US-Russia pissing match. Maybe you should open a thread with the above specific questions in the OP. As I saw it, there were a number of people interested in how the bomb works and what the implications might be in warfare in general. But like I said, it needs a new thread.

Alright, I think the best place for that thread would actually be the technology area, you start it, I'll join in.

New bombs don't really concern me at all with regard to Russia - bombs have already been plenty big enough for me for awhile now. I would be more concerned that Putin was threatening us with that "the west needs to drop its silly solidarity if they want us to get along well" (paraphrased.)

Add to that Russia's moves a couple months back to toss aside the CFE (conventional forces in Europe) treaty. Those things are of more interest to me than a bigger bomb.

edit: typo, extra word.

[edit on 15-9-2007 by AlphaHumana]

reply to post by johnsky


Nah, maybe you should. I need to get some sleep. I've been up all night. I'll join in after I've had enough rest.

From my perspective, the CFE was already done and over with before Russia backed out of it.

When Russia disengaged from the CFE, they were one of the few who were still adhering to it. It's not exactly a fair game when you have to follow the rules of a hroup who can't follow it themselves.

reply to post by johnsky


news.bbc.co.uk...

According to the BBC report it uses nano technology.

Yes, thats tech that deals with tiny particles. Nanoaluminum can greatly increase the force of explosives.

technologyreview.com...

Nanoenergetics are changing the shape of warfare. Not as powerful as nuclear weapons but without the radiation.

I wasn't aware the CFE had already been considered a joke, but to be honest I hadn't really been following it particularly closely. I just remember a professor I had years back (former Navy and State Department) praising it as one of the only effective arms inspection programs. This was probably 3-4 years ago, though.

Yeah, I know it was one of the few things that were keeping europe in check, unfortunately, the CFE has become somewhat of a joke.

It's similar to the UN claiming that WMD's are illegal, yet allowing most of it's members to keep and produce them.

It's all a political mess, as is much of any treaty in the end really.

The US themselves are violating it by placing their missile defense systems on the border with Russia... but then again, they never had to sign it.

Communal Interest

Originally posted by 4thDoctorWhoFan
Are you saying because I am knew to this forum that I must agree with you? Dang, you are a commie!

Welcome to ATS.

No, you are not required to agree with anyone. However, the sort of name-calling and labeling you've been using is incompatible with the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use and must stop immediately.

Please read this and try to avoid using insults as a debating tool in the future.

Thanks.

Originally posted by Majic
Communal InterestWelcome to ATS.

No, you are not required to agree with anyone. However, the sort of name-calling and labeling you've been using is incompatible with the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use and must stop immediately.

Please read this and try to avoid using insults as a debating tool in the future.

Thanks.

I will definitely abide by the rules.
For the record, I was not using insults as a debating tool. In Johnsky's 1st post and reply to me in this thread, he called me ignorant. Is that acceptable? Since he said that, I did not think it would be a big deal for me to call him a commie. I figured it was 'dirty hands'.

Anyway, sorry and I will refrain from using further insults as a response to being insulted.

[edit on 15-9-2007 by 4thDoctorWhoFan]

Pilate Program

Originally posted by 4thDoctorWhoFan
For the record, I was not using insults as a debating tool. In Johnsky's 1st post and reply to me in this thread, he called me ignorant. Is that acceptable? Since he said that, I did not think it would be a big deal for me to call him a commie. I figured it was 'dirty hands'.

No, the right thing to do when someone breaks the rules is to notify the staff and let us handle it. Just hit the ALERT button under the offending post and that will send out the bat signal.

Do that and keep your own hands clean, you're golden.

Anyway, sorry for the interruption. The topic is President Putin's recent comments as described in the OP, and all opinions on the topic are welcome.

Originally posted by Majic
Pilate Program

Originally posted by 4thDoctorWhoFan
For the record, I was not using insults as a debating tool. In Johnsky's 1st post and reply to me in this thread, he called me ignorant. Is that acceptable? Since he said that, I did not think it would be a big deal for me to call him a commie. I figured it was 'dirty hands'.

No, the right thing to do when someone breaks the rules is to notify the staff and let us handle it. Just hit the ALERT button under the offending post and that will send out the bat signal.

Do that and keep your own hands clean, you're golden.

Anyway, sorry for the interruption. The topic is President Putin's recent comments as described in the OP, and all opinions on the topic are welcome.

Ok, thanks for setting me straight SuperMod.

I'm not surprised Russia is trying to regain it's prominance
and it would a lot easier without the UN


reply to post by djohnsto77

Well, that's the same stance the current US administration is holding.

The Bush administration only uses the UN's rules if it falls in line with US plans... otherwise, screw UN sanctions. I see no reason why Russia should follow UN rules if the US doesn't have to.

I am left wondering if Russia is a so called Democracy, then why the support for Iran and China? They should partner with the U.S. instead militarily or are we now the terrosrists as Iran inssts...They will sooon find themselves in the Infidel burner as eventually.. Once a Commie, allways a Commie...

I believe "most" of the people on this site don't apreciate democracy at all. My grandfather and other family members died so you can talk smack today without being arrested, unlike Iran or other countries. And, you play us like the bad guys. You selfish un- appreciatice kids........Just wait and see what you might have to do to keep what you have here on this forum. You, "Don't get it" till you lose it. Thank God for Bush!

All that is bullsh|t. Cold war = crap.
They are just brainwashing people again. Putin has nothing against any country except Chechnya (in the past though) so don't listen to the media. They want people to pay more taxes.
Better take a look at the history, Russia has never touched any country first but was under attack many times and fought that attacks off.

The "evil empire" is no more, and since the demise of the Soviet Union, a great many opportunitiues have presented themselves to the world, with few being explored and/or brought to fruition.

While a Nobel Peace Prize may have been a bit more than Gorbachev's policies merited at the time the Iron Curtain came down, the dismantling of the Berlin Wall and all it symbolized for more than 70 years does bear witness to the utter lunacy of applied Communism. Plato examined this in a treatise entitled "The Republic" long before the time of Christ, but leave it to 19th and 20th century political "science" to re-invent square wheels, and adapt them to every vehicle known to man.....

On paper, the concepts look wonderful, and in nature, they work for ants and bees with utmost efficiency. Unfortunately, human beings are not like insects, the latter most often comprising genetically identical individuals, functioning as cells in a global superstructure of hive or colony as a single, collective organism in and of itself. Apart from a few basic variations from the common worker, individuality is not necessary to maintain a collective viability for the aggregate to survive, prosper, and propogate, and for this reason, the processes of natural selection have phased it out.

Specialization is perhaps the most important component in evolution, from how cells take on functions in individual organisms as they evolve, all the way up to the highly refined expertise and skills required to maintain and continually improve technological advancement and delve into the deeper realms of applied science, syllogisitic logic, and innovation made possible, at an expotentially increasing rate, by the unique abilities the human mind alone possesses:-- that of abstract conceptualization.

Show me deaf ants that write symphonies, and I'll show you Communism, Marxism, Fascism, operating harmoniously and equitibly in human society, where the goals or precepts expounded by any of these sick philosophies actually enhance quality of life, confer basic freedoms, allow equitible and just enactment, enforcement, and/or modification of law in any capacity at any level of jurisdiction, by a morally and sociologically acceptable entity of governance, serving all consitutents without bias or ulterior motivation.

Admission of China into the World Trade Organization, this glued to an act of relief to several Central American countries who had suffered hurricane and earthquake damage unparalleled in modern times, was a make-shfit effort of the Clinton administration to grant full membership and privelege worth billions of dollars each year=== just before Easter recess in 1999, this provision was added to the foreign aid package for those countries in dire need of human aid. A Senator by the name of Hutchinson introduced an ammendment to this bill, calling for deletion of the language inserted in the last few paragraphs of this essential hamanitarion legislation, granting China full and unconditional admission into the World Trade Organization.

This action became known as the "Hutchinson Ammendment," and motions to "table" [delete] it were introduced by heavily lobbied opponents. Russia was in far greater need of economic stimulus and lowering of restrications that still prevail today, while China basks in newfound riches of corporate and government investment from the West.
Congress remained in session for 26 hours, biting into the Easter recess. The Hutchinson Amendment was defeated; the single greatest blunder of the Clinton Administration. I've read the transcripts, and it's damn scary..

At this point in time, I would favor Russia's conditional admission to NATO, and certainly NOT NATO's dissolution.
Later on, Russia may also make a welcome addition to the WTO-- for now, this struggling country needs all the help it can get, so as not to slide back into chaos and once again become a menace to all mankind.
Right now, I'd be very wary of China....

NATO will not disband, if it did then it would be easier for Russia to invade a ex-NATO nation.

With headquarters in Brussels, Belgium,[2] the organization established a system of collective defence whereby its member states agree to mutual defence in response to an attack by any external party.
WIKI

There are about 26 nations in NATO, they help to protect each other because some of those nations are very small and can not handle an attack from a bigger country(such as Russia, China etc.)