Kathy Griffin tells Jesus to "Suck it!"

ok so lets take a look at it you screw up and GOD forgives you for it, what happens
a.) you are forgiven, but he leaves the mark on your record.
b.) you are forgiven, mark is completely removed form your record.

Salvation in Christ does not mean I am free from the consequences of sin. I am saved from eternal damnation, but sin separates me from God until it is confessed and repented.

As I understand it, my role in heaven is predicated on my performance according to God's will here on earth after my salvation, during my sanctification and glorification.

Romans 8

1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Matthew 21

21 His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.

Salvation does not mean I will never sin again, nor does it free me from the consequences of my sin. Salvation is a starting point, not the finish line.

never said you werent responsible for the consequences, the consequences are not GOD induced however, they are the results of your actions. You never answered the question either you kind of danced around it imo.

Ms. Griffin, as prior posts have suggested, is enjoying the attention generated by the fallout from her comments at the Emmy's. She is completely unapologetic and has had "the best week of her life." Below is an excerpt from her recent appearance on "Larry King Live."



Witness the pride and unabashed hubris oozing from her. That she would trade her opportunity for eternal life in Christ Jesus for fifteen minutes of fame and a shiny statue (idol) is just incomprehensible to me. I wonder what she has been through that would harden her heart so and lead her to utter, not to mention revel in, such blasphemy.

Matthew 12

36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

[edit on 21-9-2007 by Icarus Rising]

I was offended by her statement.

I am often critical of religion and religionists, but at the same time I try to be respectful of their faith.

Christians believe in forgiveness and rather than putting a price on her head, Christians can just choose to patronize others.

She really has nothing to fear, but if she had insulted Islam, homosexuals, blacks or Jews, there would have been a deafening outcry.

The truth is that anyone who must resort to such statements for a laugh are not funny and those who find such things offensive can vote with their feet and their pocketbooks.

Nothing else needs to be said about it. She can just go back to waiting tables.

[edit on 2007/9/21 by GradyPhilpott]

reply to post by Jovi1


I will try to clarify my answer for you.

Of the two choices you gave, I would have to go with b.

Your statement that the consequences of sin are not from God makes no sense to me. Ultimately, everything that happens is allowed to happen by God. He is the Creator of the Universe. He will use you whether you believe in Him or not.

Keep in mind that I am not God, and I have no desire to exalt myself above His throne. Simply put, God can do things that I can't.

When I say I won't forget what Ms. Griffin has done, I mean I don't trust her to have respect and consideration for my beliefs anymore. This is similar to the old "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me," saying.

Matthew 10

16 Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves.

17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;

18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles.

19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak.

20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

I hope this has answered your question completely, though I suspect you will not be satisfied.

The consequence of the act itself does not come from GOD when i say this i am stating that when you chose to commit then sin you chose the possible outcome of that sin he did not choose to inflict it upon you, merely lifted the hand of protection from you.

The simple truth of it is if you forgive you have to forgive all the way, or not at all. There is no forgivness without forgetfulness, you are still holding a mark against he,r this is a form of resentment and not forgivness.

And this is exactly why I love this woman. It was crude but it's exactly what all of us non-believers think when people of faith thank god for some trivial reason. "What? Are you serious? You're thanking Jesus for what?!" As if god is pulling the strings for someone to win an Emmy or complete a touchdown... Sure has the religious bunch heads spinning though..

reply to post by Jovi1


You are entitled to your opinion. I disagree. Forgiveness and trust are two different things. I am a servant to others, not their punching bag.

I do like your point about sin and the removal of the protecting hand of God.

Thanks for your input.

Ok so what you are saying is when Jesus forgave the various sinners he ran across, we will look at the woman that was about to be stoned as an example your telling me that while he saved her life, it would have been ok for him to think, "you slut" about this woman the next time he came across her path again.

Again, I am not God, nor am I trying to claim equality with His son. Christ was subject to all the same temptations as man, yet He never sinned. Why do you continue to fail to see this important distinction? I am flattered that you seek to compare me to God and Christ, but I will continue to fall short in that comparison while I struggle with the temptations of the flesh.

Romans 7

19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

The woman at the well was not married, though she'd had five husbands. As a man, I may not think "slut" to myself when she walked by, but I would certainly be wary of proposing marriage to her. Wouldn't you?

Being saved, I have the opportunity to become co-heir to the kingdom of heaven with Christ, but I have a long way to go. Justification, then glorification.

Matthew 22:14

For many are called, but few are chosen.
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reply to post by Jovi1


With the adulterous woman, Christ was pointing out the hypocrisy of the crowd preparing to stone her. Under Mosaic Law, both she and the man she had committed the adultery with were supposed to be stoned.

It seems, perhaps, that Jesus Christ wasn't the only one who was "set up" that day. While they used the woman caught in adultery as the means to try to entrap Him through His answer, the woman herself may have been partly entrapped - the man that she was "taken in adultery, in the very act" with (by definition, if she was "caught in the act," the man had to have been caught too) was not brought to Him with her. Whoever he was, he was just as guilty and just as subject to "the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death" (Leviticus 20:10 KJV) that the scribes and Pharisees quoted in condemning the woman. Letting him go was more hypocrisy on the part of the themselves-adulterous scribes and Pharisees.
link

Christ forgives the woman for her adultery.

John 8

11b And Jesus said, "Neither do I condemn you; go your way. From now on sin no more."

He does, however, admonish her to sin no more, for He has not yet forgiven any future sin.

Otherwise, the day is coming when she, if she didn't thereafter repent, won't be stoned, but will be burned - along with the hypocrites who brought her to Him that day, if they didn't thereafter repent of their sin.
same link as above

Thank you for helping me prove my point. Perhaps instead of saying I wouldn't forget what Ms. Griffin had said, I should have said I no longer trusted her. That is what I meant by saying I wouldn't forget. Ms. Griffin could begin to regain my trust by repenting and retracting her statement. Not that she will, and not that my trust has any meaning to her or is of any importance to her.

Psalm 1

1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.

2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.

I'm working on it.

Also 5 husbands equals being married and commiting adultery at least 4 times accordingly but that is only if you believe what Jesus taught on divorce. I am not equating you to God simply pointing out that you are in fact not forgiving. You like to throw up scriptures but you have yet to actually use ones that teach about forgivness.

Matthew 18:21-35

Seems to me this is saying limitless forgivness which implies forgetting the original offense actually occurs.

Again, you are entitled to your opinions and assumptions. I don't agree.

We do not know if the woman at the well had her four previous husbands die on her either, so she may not have been adulterous.

Forgiving does not mean trusting to me. Yes, we are called to forgive seventy times seven times. That does not mean we have to put ourselves at risk by trusting again someone who has betrayed our trust before.

If you loaned someone $100, and they promised to pay you back, but didn't, you could forgive the debt, but would you loan them money again? If anything, I would give them the money, if I could afford to, and tell them not to promise to repay me, since I could no longer trust them to do so.

Matthew 18:21-35 says nothing about forgetting nor the restoration of trust. You are ascribing those attributes to it. That passage is more about hypocrisy in being forgiven and offering forgiveness than about forgetting and trusting, imo.

Christ has forgiven my sins. He has also called me to stop committing them. I'm working on it.

Have you guys ever seen a dog chase its tail? Just around and around? They don't lose those tails...

Have you ever seen someone honing a blade? Iron sharpens iron. Great insight can be gained from discussions such as these. We don't have to agree on everything. We can respectfully disagree, and possibly come to a shared point of view that helps us both achieve greater understanding.

You guys are playing for the same team and stealing the ball from one another. I like the way you talk though.. Makes me feel hella 8th century'ish.

Intresting you should put it that way, because the only team i play for is the human team, I dont really care who you are or what you believe i like to learn and do my best to try and understand where others are coming from so that i myself may become a better part of society as a whole. Stimulating conversation is a way to do that. By the way what you see as stealing the ball i view as passing the ball.

I watched "Real Time" with Bill Maher tonight. I occasionally watch it when I am super bored and there is nothing better on. He was really attacking religion tonight. He may invite Ms. Griffin on as a guest soon the way things are going.

He says 20% of the people in the US are "Rationalists." I used to be one. Then a bunch of stuff started happening to me that defied rational explanation. I am slowly making sense of it all. What has helped me the most has been the Bible and my faith in God. There is truly a supernatural, inexplicable element to life that can not be explained rationally. It has always been that way. That is why we have mythology and religions. To deny it is to deny a part of our very existence.

I am struggling right now with a desire to make fun of Bill's nose. Please forgive me. That thing defies rational explanation, too. I keep thinking its going to hatch or something.

I shouldn't talk about facial features, though. I have railroad track teeth and a butt chin.

Really the best thing people could do right now is ignore this woman in all reality. She did this to get this reaction and is loving every minute of it, and is going to profit from as a result of a knee jerk reaction on the part of the christian community as a whole. And another thing that really bothers me about is the acting troupe who took out 2 full page ads 90k a pop just to complain about it, im sorry but couldnt that money have been put to better use in a shelter, soup kitchen or otherwise worthwhile charity?