John Lear's Claims Of Civilizations on Most Planets

well it looks like MJ-12 is working great with most of these coments.
The late WilliamCooper explains www.youtube.com...

mentions mars question at 3:19

And yes Saturn

that those objects are massive OVNIS (UFOs) photographed by Cassini near Saturn, and put under wraps by NASA. One of the objects is Earth sized and one over 50,000 Km in length (Four times Earth’s diameter!)

right here on ATS..www.abovetopsecret.com...

Science is all based upon measurements of this physical reality. If you believe this is the only reality, I guess you're stuck with science, and I guess you're pretty out of luck when you die because you are just the sum of your parts, in that case. You are just some coincidence of a cold cruel universe, and so arguing about how great your scientific evidence is doesn't do you much good anyway because you're just a talking lump of meat in the first place. So what good does all this science do for us talking lumps of meat in the first place? Seems like every day, more science come up to affirm to us that we are just flukes, that we are utterly alone, that we are meaningless. Why do people want to know this? Why do people revel in proving to everyone around them how utterly pointless existence is? Seems to me a lot of science is fear mongering. If you think that everyone who can't produce evidence is a liar and a kook, that's fine... but at least maybe it inspires them to have more hope and not be an angry pessimist who rips into everyone for having grand ideas about a more interesting universe full of life. I'd rather die in my own happy universe full of life, than your small lonely fact filled narrow band of reality, Ignorethefacts. I know my truths, and I have my evidence. Maybe John feels the same way. I've experienced incredible things that I can't prove happened. Does that make me a liar and/or a nut? just because I can't throw numbers and figures and pictures and diagrams at you to prove something that I can barely wrap my mind around, I'm the bad guy? I'm embarrassing everyone? Who cares if I embarrass you? You will never get it until you get it, I guess that's the only way to put it. It's a frustrating thing... because I'd love to prove it to you. I'd love to make you happy to know about the multi-faceted universe, and to be able to enjoy it with us.... but I can't. Scientists can't. It's not something that can be measured yet, with any known scientific method, because it does not operate within the laws of known physics. Life most certainly can exist anywhere.

Hey look a probe went to Jupiter !

I know, I know... I have been spoon fed this false information, right?
Ok Prove the information above is inaccurate. Did mr. Lear or 11 11 send a probe to Jupiter or go there himself so he can contradict the above information?

Here's the hard part folks. People like myself are required to provide proof. People like 11 11 can make wild, fanciful claims with no proof and somehow it's ok. When confronted with facts, all they need to say is that the fact is a lie and they have some special knowledge and we must trust them that they are special and right and we are dumb and wrong.
So if I'm wrong, show me the aliens.

Are you are going to get is one convenient excuse after another as to why none of their fanciful claims can't be shown to the likes of you (because you have common sense, lol.)

And your right, they make up some of the most outlandish, fanciful stories and people fall over themselves believing it, we can just state on simple fact (like the surface temperature of a planet) and we get jumped on for "fear mongering' Jeez.

The only way to win against a skeptic is to not argue with him, since there is no scientific proof for any of this, and that is what he want to be shown to believe it.

Ive had people claim that 1,5 km large moving discs in space are space junk. Ive had people tell me that the ancient pictures of UFO's are god or angels.

Its all about what YOU believe in the end, and its impossible to tell someone who sees a angel that it is a alien, and vice versa.

Skeptics arguing with believers is a waste of time, much like its a waste of time to fight "terrorism". In both cases, there is no way to win and you are never done.


[edit on 11-9-2007 by Copernicus]

Did John ever mention who gave him this information or how he found this out? Very bold claims.

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts

Science is more accurate than John Lear. Plus, for science to be noting but a cover up by some secret "cabal" or whatever you woos claim then there would have to a LOT of people in on it, lol.

Now, wheres that scientific, verifiable evidence that the moon does indeed have a rich atmosphere?!? Please, do tell. Thousands of astronomers are on the edge of their seat to find out how you figured out their little scheme, lol.

First we have to start the moons gravity. We can't have a breathable atmosphere without a gravity at least 50% that of earths.

So to start off we have to understand that the moons gravity is about 64% that of earths, not the 1/6th you are told.

How do we know this? We know this because we know that the real neutral point between the earth and the moon, that is the point at which the gravity of the earth equals the gravity of the moon for an object in between, is 43,495 miles from the moon. How do we know this? We know it because Werner von Braun told us so and because all books published by Apollo astronauts elude to the fact that the Apollo ships were in the 'pull of the moon' at least by 38,000 miles not the 22,000 mile neutral point that NASA would have you believe. NASA insists on the 22,000 mile neutral point because that’s the distance that would work out to the moon having one sixth of earths gravity according to the Bullialdus/Newton law of inverse square.

The Bullialdus/Newton law of inverse square which states that the gravitational attraction between two massive objects, in addition to being directly proportional to the product of their masses, is inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them; by using this law we find that the gravity on the moon is 64% that of earth if we use 43,495 miles as a neutral point.

We are not going to use Newton’s Law of universal gravitation because the densities of the moon and the earth (required for the formula) are very likely theoretical fabrications. In order to fabricate those fabricated densities scientists had to hypothesize an iron core within the earth in order to increase the density of the earth in order for the assumed density of the moon and assumed density of the earth to equal one six earths gravity on the moon. In other words scientific theories are hypothesized with fabricated data in order to provide the result that we are expecting and/or would like to see.

The advantage of using the Bullialdus/Newton law of Inverse Square is we don't have to assume any density or fabricate any data because we are comparing the relative gravitational pull of the 2 bodies (earth, moon) and not relative densities.

Now that we know that the moon gravity is 64% that of earth we are more likely to accept that there is, in fact a possibility that the moon has an atmosphere.

That the moon has a breathable atmosphere and maybe even a civilization has been proposed and/or hypothesized by many scientists and astronomers over the years, including:

Aristarchus of Samos
Nicolaus Copernicus
Hans Kepler
William Herschel
John Wilkens
William Leitch
Peter Andreas Hansen
William Whewell
Asaph Hall
Mikhail Vasin
Alexander Shcherbakov

That the moon has an atmosphere is evident from a photograph of the moon dating back to January 1946 by the Lick Observatory which shows a huge explosion being not only suspended in the atmosphere but the clouds of which are rising. Also Lunar Orbiter photos show vapor rising in the mining area of Copernicus.

William L. Brian, in “Moongate: Suppressed findings of the U.S. Space Program” Future Science Research Publishing Co. Copyright William L. Brian II 1982 LOCCCN: 81-69211 ISBN: 0-941-2929-00-2, suggests that ‘the reason meteors seemed to be stopped more effectively in passing through the Moon’s atmosphere than the Earth’s is that measurements made during the Apollo missions indicated that a huge bulge exists on the farside of the moon. The ‘huge bulge’ is also hypothesized by respected Danish mathematician and astronomer in 1856.This implies that the density and depth of the atmosphere on the near side are much greater than the average density and depth.’

Brian further suggests:

“It is significant that the nearside is primarily comprised of the so-called maria. The farside is determined to be mostly mountains, giving the moon extremes in elevation greater than earth’s. The same condition would occur on Earth if the ocean’s and sea lost their water. If that happened the atmosphere would seek the lowest level and fill up the oceans beds which reach depths of many miles. Since the earth’s oceans cover the majority of its surfaces, millions of square miles would become uninhabitable because the air would be on the ocean bed. It is conceivable that life and vegetation could exist in certain regions of the moon despite the long lunar days and nights. Sheltered canyons and valleys at the right elevations and latitudes would not experience extremes of temperatures found in the uninhabitable areas.

The previous references to drifting clouds and mists suggest surface water. George Adamski reports mountain lakes and rivers which emptied into a large body of water. He also saw snow on the peaks of peaks of higher mountains on the farside.

In his book, “Two sides of the Moon” (Thomas Dunne Books copyright 2004 ISBN 0-312-30865-5 EAN 978-0312-30865-0 David Scott, Commander of Apollo 15 wrote (page 291):

The view of the moon as we began our final descent was stunning. As we caught our first close-up look at the lunar mountains below us, Jim (Irwin) lightened the atmosphere of growing tension and excitement a little with his usual dry humor.
“Make a great ski area if they’d just put some snow on it,” he said.
“Looks like there is in parts,” I replied adding, as I took a closer look at the horizon beyond, “The sky is just as black as the ace of spades.”
“Don’t think there is any atmosphere,” said Jim because, of course, on the Moon there isn’t. “I’m going to write me a joke,” he went on, getting into his stride. “”Astronauts come back from moon; say it’s great, but has no atmosphere.”
“That’s a good,” I chuckled. “You ought to save that one for the surface some time.”

Excerpt from Moongate: Suppressed Findings of the U.S. Space Program (The NASA-Military Cover-Up) by William L. Brian II:

Photographic analysis (Fred Steckling) shows that condensation of clouds take place at very low altitudes between 2 and 6 thousand feet.

Steckling says that the densest part of the atmosphere on the moon is to be found in the valleys and craters close to the so-called lunar sea level. This law applies to earth so it should apply to the moon. The lunar clouds formed at these very low altitudes, seem to hug the mountain side, much like the monsoon clouds over tropical islands on earth. While heavy cloud formation are quite rare and appear to depend on the seasons, they do occur on occasion, mostly in the northern and southern hemisphere on the moon.

There are several natural lakes on the moon, close to the North Pole. These appear on photographs with a very black surface.

Color photos clearly show the color green in the shady areas of brown colored hills and craters, very much the appearance as the southwest desert areas in the Untied States. While some color photos appear brown, others definitely show a green color.

Howard Menger reported a dense, breathable atmosphere and when reaching a terrain on the moon which reminded him of Nevada, claimed to have breathed the lunar atmosphere. As expected, he held that the heat was extremely great, but that the air pressure was evidently adequate to sustain life/ He also observed wind, a yellow sky overhead, and a yellowish-orange sky near the horizon. The colors indicate that the atmosphere at that elevation might be deeper than the earths. As light passes through the atmosphere, it shifts to longer wavelengths. The yellow sky overhead indicates a longer wavelength than the blue in Earth skies. Similarly the orange hue above the mountains can be attributed to light which is shifted in wavelength sill more as a result of the increased thickness of the atmosphere when looking through it to the horizon. Menger’s description of the surface was similar to Adamski’s: a yellowish-white, powdery sand with stones and miniscule plant life.”

The photo below is the crater Copernicus with the saffron colored sky that Howard Menger described. I contacted Mr. Menger at his home in Florida (August 16, 2007) and asked him to select the exact color of saffron that I had provided by email to him the day before. Howard selected the color by placing a mark on one of the 16 different swatches we had provided. The color of the sky in the photograph below is the color that is the closest match to the color that Howard selected. Zorgon did the color matching and color sky on the photo below.

“Another indication of the moons gravity and dense lunar atmosphere was provided when Apollo spacecraft and lunar probes orbited the moon at an average distance of 60 to 70 miles above the lunar surface. No specific reasons were given by NASA for choosing this height. In fact, the best altitude for the Lunar Orbiter satellites would have been much lower. Lower altitudes would have produced more refined maps of the surface. Most Lunar Orbiter camera altitudes where in the 1000 to 5000 kilometer distance.”

A few were taken at 44 kilometers (about 27 miles) about 150,000 feet. The only way they could do this was to use a highly elliptical orbit.”

A photograph of the moon taken by the 36 inch telescope at the Lick Observatory on January 17, 1946 shows the plume of dust/smoke/debris of an apparent explosion 150 kms west north west of Endymion in the area between Schwabe and Thales. Debris of dust/smoke/rock appear to be thrown in a radial pattern of more than 100 kilometers. The well-defined plume appears to rise several thousand feet and then, holding its cylindrical shape, expands and drifts to the west north west for about 35 kilometers and then appears to rise to the top of the atmosphere while expanding somewhat.



The top of the atmosphere cannot be determined with any great accuracy because the top of the plume has been ‘cut off’ at the visual horizon of the moon. The height of the plume at the ‘cut off’ however is estimated to be more than half the diameter of Endymion which was used to measure it. The diameter of Endymion is 125 kilometers so the top of the atmosphere would be in excess of 62 kilometers or about 38 miles (200,000 feet). At that point the plume is still intact. In a photo taken by Lick on May 3, 1947, about 16 months later the plume is still intact although does not appear to extend upward as far.

The fact that the plume from the explosion is still intact and relatively unchanged in 16 months indicates a very stable atmosphere free from very much disturbance. But it also poses the question, if there is substantial gravity on the moon, why is the dust/dirt/debris still apparently suspended after 16 months?

A good print from a Lunar Orbiter 16 by 20 inch negative of LO-II-162 gave us close up look at a huge mining operation in the interior north face of the crater Copernicus. Huge bucket excavators, buildings, vapor from storage tanks, platforms, equipment, all obviously in the process of mining.





An overhead view of this identical area taken a year or so later by Lunar Orbiter V provides ‘smoking gun’ evidence of this mining operation in that we can see a ‘crane with an extended boom’ from the overhead view, the same as we can see it in the oblique view.

An enlarged photo taken by Apollo 8 (AS8-12-2209) clearly shows in the area to the northeast of Joliet-Curie and just south of the crater Lomonosov a large city with buildings, streets, lights and vegetation and a curious ‘space port’ type structure with a bridge.





An nearside photo taken by Lunar Orbiter 1 shows a large area of mining operations in and around craters with roads, turnarounds, suspended lengths of pipes, vehicles, sediment or dust ‘sprays’, a ‘control tower’ type building and other constructs.





A building 40 miles in length and 12 miles tall was photographed by Zond 3 in 1963. An arch with an approximate diameter of 10 miles is on the right on the ‘contruct’ and three vertical cylindrical tanks, each of a different size sit on a ‘bench’ to the left.



A strange object dubbed the ‘mechanical dinosaur’ is located southeast on the crater Lomonosov.



On the southeastern shore of Mare Crisium on the Agarum Promontory rises a ‘contruct’ miles high:



A photo of King Crater on the farside shows large structures carefully disguised with airbrushing and cliffs with hanging vegetation.








A least 7 different photos of the crater Tsiolkovsky on the farside show the transformation of what appears to be a gigantic space ship into an ‘island’ in the middle of a black ‘mare’.



Another Apollo 8 photo (AS8-12-2189) shows a huge nearside city near Petavius B with many neat rows of lights which are regularly spaced.



A photo taken by an amateur astronomer of Endymion shows a clear view of several large, antenna-like constructs on its southeast edge.



Another part of the moon taken by that same astronomer shows the crater Aristarchus to very likely some kind of nuclear reactor, the blue glow being the Cherbokov effect (the effect of radiation coming in contact with molecules of air).



Numerous other photos taken by the Lunar Orbiter series of lunar photographic satellites, photos taken by the Apollo astronauts and the Lick Observatory photos show clear indications of buildings, bridges, lights, mining operations, and cities on the moon.

The above photographic and scientific evidence clearly shows that possibly our moon has an atmosphere and gravity very similar to our own. Not the ‘airless, 1/6th gravity, colorless, chalk-like, gray, dead world that NASA and others would like you to believe.

We also have the research of both V.A. Firsoff (Strange World of the Moon) and W.H. Pickering, respected astronmers, both of whom suggest an atmosphere on the moon.

Firsoff and Pickering follow a long line of respected scientists and astronomers who not only believed the moon had an atmosphere but believed it had a civilization.

Most of these astronomer/scientists were ridiculed for their beliefs.

Take of the case of Peter Andreas Hansen (1795-1874), eminently respected and decorated Danish mathematician and astronomer who served the Duke of Mecklenburg as the head of the observatory at Seeburg, near Gotha (Germany). Hansen was acknowledged by a contemporary as “the greatest master of celestial mechanics since Laplace.” Hansen’s lunar tables of 1857 were considered the finest done to that date and remained the standard for many years.

Hansen wrote a paper on the shape of the moon in 1854 and this paper was delivered before the royal Astronomical Society in French, and was published in the Society’s Memoirs.

Hansen proposed that due to an ellipsoidal shape of the moon which he discovered because of slight discrepancy between the observe position of the moon and its predicted position by calculation that the moon’s center of gravity was 59 kilometers farther from the earth than the geometric center.

As presented previously in this paper, Hansen stated (P.A.Hansen, “Sur la figure de la lune, Memoirs of the Royal Astronomical Society 24 (1856), 29-90(pp.31f):

One must consider the two hemispheres of the moon, of which one is visible and the other invisible to us, as essentially different with regard to altitude, to climate and to all which depends on them. As the altitude is determined primarily by the distance from the center of gravity, the hemisphere of the moon turned toward us is elevated above the average altitude and above the opposite hemisphere. Therefore the former present itself to us as a sterile land, deprived of an atmosphere and all life, but one can no longer conclude that the other hemisphere does not have an atmosphere, nor that it has no vegetation or living things. The sides of the moon would be at a mean altitude, and cannot say that any trace of atmosphere would appear there.

Hansen’s moon civilization theory was enthusiastically received until 14 years later a respected military gentleman came over from the United States of America to say a few unkindly words about Hansen and his theory about a lunar civilization. In his zeal to discredit Hansen this man never produced any evidence to refute Hansen’s hypothesis. What he said was: “In the case of evection, the supposed discordance between theory and observation would not follow from Hansen’s hypothesis, and therefore, even if it exists, cannot be attributed to that hypothesis.”

The man was held in such high regard by the European community that they abandoned Hansen and his moon civilization theory without bothering to ask for any evidence or substantiation.

Hansen challenged the man to a debate but the man made himself unavailable slipping stealthily back to the United States. Hansen died 3 years later.

The man from the United States of American was Rear Admiral Simon Newcomb, Director of the Naval Observatory in Washington, D.C.

While none of this is absolute proof or even proof of a breathable atmosphere on the moon it certainly does provide reason to suggest that we may have not been told all that NASA knows about the moon and the Navy is just as deep in the cover-up as anybody else.

Thanks for the lengthy post John. Unfortunately you did little if anything to support your claim. You tell us that the moon has an atmosphere because one engineer and a handful of dead, dated astronomers hypothesized as such? Okay, so if that's your evidence for there being an atmosphere on the moon, I cite as evidence 99% of the modern academic physics and astronomy community, all of whom will tell you that there is NO significant atmosphere on the moon and that the moon's gravity is indeed roughly 1/6 that of earth's. And the supposed anomalies in those pictures, as I'm sure even you would agree, take a good deal of imagination to identify.

Also, here is some discussion regarding William Brian's half-baked theories:

www.bautforum.com...
www.apollo-hoax.me.uk...
en.wikipedia.org...

Now John, if you really think the entire academic community is in cahoots with the evil secret new world order, I invite you to use your own brain and reasoning for once.

I'm sure you are familiar with Kepler's third law, yes? You know, the one that has been tested and verified for nearly 400 years. The general form of this equation, as refined by Newton, can be used to get a rough estimate of the moon's mass. We know the average distance from the moon to the earth, the mass of the earth, and the length of one lunar sidereal period. Using these values, the calculated mass of the moon has an error of about 1% with respect to the generally accepted value of 7.36 x 10^22 kg. Thus it appears that NASA isn't lying to us after all. Try it for yourself!

Or you could consider tidal forces in the earth-moon-sun system. The ratio of solar to lunar tides would not be as they are if the moon was as massive as you claim, unless you are also claiming that the sun is more massive -- but that would be even easier to disprove.

John, you're an interesting guy, and maybe a fraction of what you preach is actually true, but I really think you are taking it too far with this "inhabitable moon" nonsense. You are misinformed, plain and simple, and for whatever reason you continue to have great faith in only a few individuals who tell you what you want and no one else. Unfortunately, many people will believe what you say simply because of your "pseudo-celebrity" status.

Originally posted by Postal76

Thanks for the lengthy post John. Unfortunately you did little if anything to support your claim. You tell us that the moon has an atmosphere because one engineer and a handful of dead, dated astronomers hypothesized as such? Okay, so if that's your evidence for there being an atmosphere on the moon, I cite as evidence 99% of the modern academic physics and astronomy community, all of whom will tell you that there is NO significant atmosphere on the moon and that the moon's gravity is indeed roughly 1/6 that of earth's.

Thanks for the input Postal 76 and your thoughtful insight on my post. Regarding the mass of the moon I think I forgot to tell you it was a spaceship.

Thanks again for your post.

If the moon is in fact a spaceship....then WHY would we need to do any mining on it?

....................................just wondering

I have read into the spaceship theory and it DOES make sense in the fact of its PERFECT size to blot out the sun in its perfect position to have this effect happen. It is so dang prefect it seems like it HAD to be done on purpose by somebody..........

Originally posted by theRiverGoddess

If the moon is in fact a spaceship....then WHY would we need to do any mining on it?

There are allegedly minerals on the moon that we find useful on earth.

Consider the moon as a kind of a cosmic bird feeder.

postal76, I'd give you wats just for your last reply! I've been reading on this site for a few years now and the whole thing about the moon having an atmosphere and being mined is kinda "out there" I mean it's possible but when you sum it all up you have this:

The moon is a cosmic soul collecting spaceship birdfeeder that we mine for element 115. It has a atmosphere that we can breathe using a simple oxygen mask dohickey. I don't know John, did I forget anything? The base on the dark side? Do the aliens mine there?

I think NASA might not be the only GAS giant in the solar system after all. postal76 If they offer you kool-aid, don't drink it dude!

Originally posted by GiantPanda1979

I think NASA might not be the only GAS giant in the solar system after all. postal76 If they offer you kool-aid, don't drink it dude!

Good one GiantPanda! Thanks for the post and your excellent summary.

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by theRiverGoddess

If the moon is in fact a spaceship....then WHY would we need to do any mining on it?

There are allegedly minerals on the moon that we find useful on earth.

Consider the moon as a kind of a cosmic bird feeder.

So the moon is a spaceship made out of rocks and minerals that we find useful?

Now I'm sure in your infinite wisdom you know who created this unique spaceship for us to harvest these wonderful minerals, right John?

Originally posted by scooler1

So the moon is a spaceship made out of rocks and minerals that we find useful?

Now I'm sure in your infinite wisdom you know who created this unique spaceship for us to harvest these wonderful minerals, right John?

Sorry scooler1. Apparently my infinite wisdon does not extend that far into outer space.

But thanks for the post.

so, what we have here is another "John Lear is crazy, but he is ok...it is the morons who believe him I am worried about" thread? Do we really need another one? And why do you worry so much about people who might believe him? Aren't there homeless people who need feeding, or dogs and cats that need to be spayed/neutered? There are some REAL causes out there that don't involve policing the reading material of the even the most naive readers.

having said that, i offer little in the way of "evidence" (mostly because much of what i would offer is already posted in the few threads that i really participate in).

What i can offer are some concepts that would allow the use of our immediate space with little or no detection by the common, earth bound astronomer. Before i do that, however, i want to remind you that before anyone see's anything from NASA/DoD/ESA space imagery, it is "scrubbed" and cleared by people with the proper credentials (do your research, as Pegasus has posted many links/images/.pdf's referring to this exact practice, and the processes driving it).

Firstly, have you heard of The Woodpecker Grid? If not, Google it. The premise is that using microwave and electromagnetic energies one can possibly control the mental and physical functions of a human being. Russian scientists reportedly took this to quite an extreme degree. The fact that we don't hear a whole lot about this, to me, speaks volumes. There is documentation of this path of research starting, but it trails off somewhere in the 60's when progress was beginning to be made. Obviously, it would do no good for the populace to understand the technolgy or its capabilities.

Of course, we have microwave towers littering the landscape nowadays. Just in time for the technology boom that gives all Americans the "stars at their fingertips", huh? Not to hard to imagine that if microwave/EM energies were capable of such actions, the proliferation of wireless technology provides a wonderful "cover" for the erection of such microwave stations. Obviously, using the scalar interferometric concepts of Bearden (and the Woodpecker Grid/HAARP) these towers are useless.

Next option: camoflauge. Pegasus has quite a bit of information (check out Jack Arneson...that dude is prolific in his research) regarding the ability to camoflauge large building. Zorgon posted an image showing the hiding of a huge crane on an Earthbound construction site...but imagine it would be quite simple to copy this feat in grander scale. OK, so this doesn't work for whole civilizations, but it does work for human outposts on the moon.

Next option: cloaking. Perhaps there are properties of our ionosphere that would allow for some level of cloaking? Perhaps we have had something strange introduced that prevented a true assesment of specific light wave frequencies?

Next option: trans-dimensional physics. Yeah, very techie, but very possible. Just follow the gravity, it will lead you into another dimension.

Honestly...could we not go on for days? There are very feasable options for what could be done to obscure the truth. We know that there is something going on (once again, just visit the Pegasus website and look around....but you ahve to look with your eyes open).

but, then again....John is here to bring in posts/posters. I guess dealing with these threads goes with the territory?

Originally posted by scooler1

So the moon is a spaceship made out of rocks and minerals that we find useful?

Now I'm sure in your infinite wisdom you know who created this unique spaceship for us to harvest these wonderful minerals, right John?

First of all, scooler1, i like your avatar quite a bit. that is my favorite SNL skit of all time. The maniacal glee that Will Ferrell portrayed in that skit was pure genius.

Regarding your post....

....all objects that we know of (which would include the moon) appear to be made of matter. Presumably, this matter is composed of elements found on our periodical table. It would seem natural that there could be something on this device (the moon) that would be harvestable.

Consider this: millions of years ago another race of humans acquired space travel and started to colonize the moon. when they died, were returned to the stone age at the end of the macro cycle, or moved on to greener pastures, there was quite a bit of foreign debris left behind. Things such as storage for various items (which have since decayed and been returned to the primary elements) and constructions using foreign materials. yes, perhaps something more along the lines of In Situ Resource Utilization could have been employed....but my point is that no matter how improbable something is, it doesn't make it impossible.

We all know so little, it is silly to ridicule one person for a thought or concept they have. The truth is likely far more exotic than you believe.

Another part of the moon taken by that same astronomer shows the crater Aristarchus to very likely some kind of nuclear reactor, the blue glow being the Cherbokov effect (the effect of radiation coming in contact with molecules of air).

OK so an advanced civilization traveled from another planet and colonized the moon and built a NUCLEAR REACTOR???? Why didn't they just burn coal???

You see we ourselves are now working on FUSION reactors and the beginnings of Anti-matter. If a more advanced race were doing what you said, they would have left fission (ie nuclear reactors) by the wayside long ago.

Also, the effect you are referring to is called The Cherenkov Effect or Cherenkov Radiation and it happens when radiation interacts with LIQUIDS.

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
I figured he did not actually believe it himself. It's just too darn entertaining to be true, lol. And John has always been a good guy about anyone who doubt him. I just worry about the people who take him seriously.

Okay This is just getting ridiculous... what is it with you guys? Surely there are enough threads like this already? What is the purpose of starting a new one? Is it maybe because the other threads contain answers you don't want to address?

John is a good guy about those that doubt him because he has the advantage of KNOWING... that makes all the difference...

I really don't have time to waste on another thread going over the same stuff, but John asked me to address one poster, which I will do shortly. I also spotted a couple of other questions in here I will respond to, then go back to the real work.

But first a statement...

To IgnoreTheFacts....

I really find your remark offense!! "I just worry about the people who take him seriously." That is so arrogant of you. I and many others in here do NOT need your concern...

AS many who have followed this recent (over the last year) presentation know, I was skeptical about many of the ideas John discussed... but as ALL of you here... I was interested...

But rather than waste space in the threads attacking the ideas... and more so attacking the presenter... I did RESEARCH. As I did the research, things started coming out. At first slowly, but then as Pegasus grew we started getting information from many source... people coming forward, people sending documents, etc...

It is your right and your choice NOT to believe... It is your right to "Ignore the Facts" as you have aptly chosen your name...

But to sit there and tell those who accept other alternate ideas that "you worry about us" --- thanks I do not need your concern

Now then this thread specifically askes about "other civilizations"

The evidence we have already collected is on the Living Moon website, but the stuff you specifically want to see is being prepared and its taking a lot of time to assemble in an easy to follow format... You will have to take my word that it WILL be presented, but we are not ready yet...

As to John and his "wacky ideas"

In many threads he has made several statements...

The following is a short list of items for the others in the thread who do not ignore the facts to ponder over... I will list them as a statement... the data supporting it has already been posted in other threads and I will not waste time going over it again... If you REALLY care to know, contact me and I will point you to it... and as I stated all the completed topics are available on our website...

John has said that we have anti gravity tech...
We have documents showing Lear Inc and TT Brown worked on Anti Gravity Tech in the 50's with the DOD... Guy Cramer's grandfather was also 'involved'

John has said there are tubes beneath the planet with high speed trains
We have documents to support tat from Rand Corp and DOD and it was published in the LA Times in 1972 (but people ignored the facts)
We have patents issued to the DOE on Atomic powered TBM's that melt the rock - 3 patents issued 1972 (but people ignore the facts)
LA Times reported 8000 miles of Tunnel dug in 1960 (but people ignore the facts)

John says there is a Secret Astronaut Corp
Gary McKinnon is doing 85 years because he said the same thing. The only difference is Gary got HIS info by hacking into government computers while we have to rely on publicly available data that IS out there but requires hours of hard work finding it, writing letters to various government agencies, and actually filing FOIA papers to get original copies that are declassified but NOT found online.

All this info that we get through these methods (including the purchase of expensive out of print books) we share openly and freely on our website and selectively post this as time allows.

We are also in direct contact with many 'on the inside' that share info...
"I'll answer any question you might have so long as I do not violate and
secrecy agreements I (may/may not) have made.
Best regards, JR"

That letter also came with a warning... one I will cover later in one of our regular threads and there will be a special page on that issue.

You doubters forget one very very important thing...

IF ANY OF THIS SECRET STUFF IS REAL... it is Secret because THEY don't want you to know. If you then start digging and get too close... well surely I don't have to spell it out. We are not interested in joining Gary McKinnon just to satisfy the skeptics

So within the confines of what is legal we shall continue to present the evidence. We are also accepting volunteers to help us seek and process this information as it has been so much lately that it is overwhelming

As to the Secret Astronaut Corp... well it is not as secret as you might think...

I am going to quote one article from a Space Command internal (publicly accessible if you get a subscription) magazine called "High Frontier"

Excerpt from:
United States Air Force Space Command
"HIGH FRONTIER"
The Journal for Space and Missile Professionals
Summer 2004

Initial identification of the cadre began in mid-2001 with
the standup of the Naval Space Cadre Working Group and
culminated in a naval message (NAVADMIN 201/03 DTG
211435Z JUL 03) announcing the first 700 officer members of
the cadre. These officers were identified by the subspecialty
codes of 6206, Space Systems Operations, and 5500, Space
Systems Engineering or by the additional qualification designator
of VS1, VS2, VS3 or VS4. Identification of enlisted and
civilian cadre members is more challenging, as these groups
do not have specific space identifiers like the officers do.
Approximately 265 billets are currently identified as space
billets. These jobs are in Navy, joint and National Security
Space organizations. Space cadre members are currently
assigned throughout the National Security Space arena,
including the National Reconnaissance Office, National Security
Space Architect, National Security Space Integration,
MILSATCOM Joint Program Office, as well as in all Navy
organizations that deal with space.

Now I am sure anyone in the Forces can identify what this means...

"Approximately 265 billets are currently identified as space
billets. " Okay John we found who is eating the 1/2 ton of fruits and vegetables that the Progress 60 delivered from Russia

I do not know if posting this with the codes will get me in trouble, but the magazine is available by subscription to the public.

The thing you have to realize is this..

NASA is an agency set up to be "Public" they are the 'front' If you want to REALLY know what is going on you have to do research at places like LANL, LLNL, AFRL DOD... the site we search at have .MIL not .COM in their URL's most of those sites track and record everything you do... also check the US Patent Office...

John says there are secret spaceships and spacestations out there...
We have a thread following that and we are just now putting all that data together for the website... and will be adding to the posts.. You will have to go to the Shuttle thread to get that.

In the process of tracking these ships we questioned how they could be hidden or "cloaked" as one poster jokingly asked... Well we asked... and that led us to Stealth Tech... and a polite warning... and trust me we will heed that warning.

John says there is a Fusion Reactor in Aristarchus Crater...
Check out the Infrared Moon Images thread we have all the data posted there... And I will address the one poster on that (the one John asked me to respond to jfi123) in a few minutes

John says the weather on Venus is not as NASA says...

NASA says ... Venus looks like this...

"This is a 3-D image of surface of Venus by Magellan. NASA/JPL"


"This is a global view of the surface of Venus compiled from Magellan's radar mapping results. The image is centered at 0 degrees east longitude. Simulated hues are based on color photographs taken by Venera 13 and 14. (Courtesy of NASA/JPL)"

VERY inhospitable Could not POSSIBLY have life as John describes it...

But WAIT... NASA says that the "orange" color is SIMULATED

Can this be? Well of course because Magellan did not take pictures in color... so why do the paint them orange?

Here is another picture of Venus... taken from space... taken by Magellan showing a bright sunny day clear as crystal, not a cloud in the sky except for that vapor trail with shadow...




This came from the University Corporation for Atmospheric Research (UCAR), University of Michigan and is Courtesy of NASA/JPL. When we posted this in the Venus thread everyone got silent... no response from either skeptic or believer (talk about people ignoring the facts)

Here is the Full Res version...





Now then if you people who dislike John's views continue to IGNORE THE FACTS that we present, how will you ever learn anything? It is really a waste of time and space to constantly say "John never backs up anything he says" over and over, but brush over the volumes of data we have provided as if it was nothing.

John said he flew for the CIA
There is update on that... I have seen the document that came from the Feds... not my place to show it... all I can comment on it is "Its about time!



Now anyone who is serious about all this feel free to U2U me with any questions and how you can help

And to those who are so fascinated by John that they constantly feel the need to start another "About John Lear" thread...

To you I say... Welcome to the CULT... You are doing us all a favor...

No Press is Bad Press

Thank You for your efforts!!



[edit on 12-9-2007 by zorgon]

[edit on 12-9-2007 by zorgon]