Where's the proof?

I've noticed that no one on ATS has been able to prove that remote viewing, OBEs, or anything of the like exists. Many people claim to be capable of these things, but have they proven themselves?

Anyone who believes that they can do these things, prove it. I'll write a word on a wall, and you can post exactly what I write. Or I'm sure you'll be able to describe one of the local small towns near me if I tell you the general area. I'm sure someone else on this site has tried this, and I know scientists do this to disprove fakes. Anyone up to the challenge? Or are you all fakes? I'm not saying it isn't possible, I'm just being skeptical.
If you need specifics, what kind?

Then the next person after you comes here and say, "prove it, i will write a number on the wall" ect... If someone proves it, then only you will know it for sure. There are probably hundreds of these tests out there, but do you believe in them ?



[edit on 4/9/07 by Luminal]

have you read this thread yet??

www.abovetopsecret.com...

You can't prove things like this, you can only give evidence. For instance, if I told you exactly where you lived, what you wrote on the wall, etc., it could still just be accepted as a very wild guess, perhaps a coincidence. Even then, as has been stated, you could not prove to anyone else that what they said was true, because they do not know where you live or what you wrote.

One can give evidence by correctly answering your questions. But it's not proof, unless you can prove it to other people. So far, there is no real way to "prove" these things.

Great question and I love the verbiage being used in responses.

There have been any number of experiments done on this for near death and out of body experiences. Everything from numbers on top of cabinets in the same room of the person claiming to have the experience, to rooms set up and the person just has to "remotely view" the contents.

Not one of them has yet been scientifically proven. Does this mean it can't happen. Not yet, there are still too many gullible people that think it can.

Of course it would only be evidence if I did the experiment once. Anyone who takes the challenge would have to repeat it several times. Different words each time of course. If I use odd words like aorta and catamaran, doesn't that affect the odds of guessing? Or if I make up a word, like "kazfoo"?

I've read a few studies. Like the one with arrows painted on the hallway ceiling of a hospital, then having a man with a near death experience try to follow the arrows. Or similar challenges where a word is written. As far as I know, none of the writ tests have showed any evidence.

What is ‘Proof’?

Proof is evidence sufficient to establish a thing as true, or to produce belief in its truth.

Evidence is something that makes the subject or object in question plain or clear.

If I take a picture of an airplane up in the sky and show it to you as proof that man can fly, you are likely to believe me based on your own past experiences with airplanes. You have seen them, ridden in them and know that the photo is indeed evidence that helps support the premise that man can indeed fly. It is proof.

Yet, if I take a picture of a flying saucer, this is not proof, because you can not make the mental connection between the evidence I have provided and your lack of experience with such an object.

Remote Viewings are very personal experiences of extra-sensory insight, often, but not always, open to interpretation. It is basically a disciplined use of Extra-Sensory Perception. Before one can offer up evidence of its effectiveness, one must provide evidence that ESP is a real and consistent phenomenon, which has yet to be done to the public at large.

There is an underlying truth about evidence and proof that can be a touchy subject for some. The mental connections I mentioned earlier are wrapped deeply in faith, a topic that is taboo in most scientific discussions. To have faith in any evidence, requires one to also have faith in he who provides it, his integrity and motivations are always subject to question. ‘Seeing’ might be ‘believing’ for some, but hearsay is also a nice way of calling someone ignorant at best, a liar at worst. Making things plain and clear is not so clear cut an objective when dealing with such skepticism, it becomes completely relative upon the messenger, and that is because of faith and doubt, something we all have in varying amounts.

For instance: Cosmologists and Philosophers have theorized that we may not truly exist; that we might be simply a simulation in some other-universe based computer program. In light of that statement, can you prove that either you or I exist?

This is not to make light of the subject of proof in anything ... just a statement that proof, like faith, is often a personal decision, especially concerning such subjects as the paranormal, spirituality, ufology, and the unknown in general, based upon your experiences, knowledge and what you are willing to accept.

When you fall asleep, your consciousness and body fall asleep.
Once, not so long ago, my consciousness woke up in a dream, and it realised I was in a dream, the dream stopped, and in my mind I was zooming in and out of the fixed image that had become my dream. Then I woke up, quickly difted back into sleep, but my mind was still awake. I quickly got past phase 1 of sleep, and felt myself entering into phase 2 of sleep. At that point, I heard a seemingly young and enthusiastic voice very clearly, say hello three times. I felt I was going to enter phase 3 of sleep, and wouldn't be able to hear the voice anymore, so I forced myself to wake up, but I went overboard, and woke up completely.
That's my little proof to myself, I lived it, and I know it's real. That voice could have been my higher-self, a spirit guide, a channelled conversation, anything. But it was very real.

Sleep is a good way to get proofs. Go to sleep, and expect something to happen, ask outloud for someone to communicate with you in your sleep, then if your honest about it, wait a few nights, will happen.