To all the 9/11 conspiracy theorists...

This is from TIME magazine. If you believe a laser, or bomb brought down the towers, how do you explain this?

At 10:04 a.m. on 9/11, after Tower Two had collapsed, a member of the New York Police Department's Aviation Unit warned that the top 15 floors of Tower One were "glowing red" and might collapse. Four minutes later, a helicopter pilot said he did not believe the tower would last much longer.

www.time.com...

GLOWING RED! That means the fire from the fuel was weakening the steel. Note I didn't say melted - WEAKENED! THat's all that needs to happen to make a collapse happen. Hmm, crashing at 500 MPH, with 200 TONS of fuel burning constant along with furniture and papers, and breaking a couple of support beams when it enters. YEAH! That would do it!

Can't you people just come together as a nation so we can fight these extemists as a NATION - AS ONE? There are plenty of other conspiracies out there to be concerned about.

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[edit on 23/8/2007 by Mirthful Me]

I like how you give sources.

Oh wait...

Well gee, This is the 1st I am hearing of this..

Source????

so you can disprove one portion of a theory......but thats ok, conspiracies are made of multiple pieces. in the end, you havent proven much.

Can't you people just come together as a nation so we can fight these extemists as a NATION - AS ONE? There are plenty of other conspiracies out there to be concerned about.

As soon as someone credible explains why there was no resistance from those 15 floors down. A falling object takes the path of least resistance. That means the structure was weakened to the ground. There were reports and evidence of bombs that are not in the official report.

That's pretty much why for me.

reply to post by Nunny


So the structural integrity of the steel actually WAS weakened. Huh, first I've ever heard about it...

I have a little project for you. Take a piece of high quality steel and burn it with fuel, office supplies and such (in open air). You tell me if it gets red hot.

Ok, thats the top 15 floors then. Out of 101 storeys.
Why would he assume that the whole thing was going to collapse ?
Things collapse when there is a failure at the bottom, not at the top.

Hey if I could just catch a glimpse from any one of the Pentagon's cameras showing me a plane flying in i'll be satisfied. Any camera will do, even the gas station camera from across the street that the owner said the FBI confiscated from him. Just kindly show us the video of the plane and i'll go ahead and forget about the other strange " Facts "..........like ummmmm finding a terrorists passport in the rubble (but the steel at impact was glowing red)...LOL ... i mean c'mon OP you can wish it was'nt true but .........????? Watch some more Fox News for your facts.

just a joke..

anybody how has read just a littul bit into the facts, knows thats a disInfo you got hooked on..


nice try.

So the debunkers are still using this thesis (as well as the might of the world media) to support the official story. I thought they might have come up with something that stood up to science more... ah sorry, I forgot, there isn't one is there.

A hundred story building collapses at the speed of gravity (freefall) into its own footprints, and we're still meant to believe Bin Laden did it??? How stupid do they think we are?

[edit on 25-8-2007 by large jack]

his name is nunny? -nanny? -big brother?

hes probably a disinfo creep. So the floors were glowing red. wow thats genius.

Im sure the thermate/thermite + a small amount of jet fuel that burned off initialy DO make building glow like that. seeing as thermate cuts through iron quickly.

Now dont get me wrong, islamo nazis are real. But so are new world order capitalists and gangsters who use there power and influence to do whatever they want, and dont care about who it affects. And 9-11 was the rich, using the islamo nazi to execute the start of world war 3. They have been trying to incite violence, an excuse to sell more weapons, more bombs and fund the space race.

Its all in the name of a suicidal dream for power over humanity, humans need to wake up, fight this freak of a beast system, and take power for themselves.

All of the cameras pointed at the buildings show exactly what color it was, and it was not red. It is IMPOSSIBLE for an entire structure to glow like a charcoal briquet!! Various substances turn colors at different rates according to heat, heat dispersion, conductivity along the structure, etc.

It is ludicrous to imagine an entire section of the Tower glowoing red!! Silly. Even if it turns out that some cop did say that, it says more about his abilities to percieve reality than it does about the color of the building. There are plenty of photos of that scene, and none seem to show any discoloration except where the thermate is cutting thru corner sections.

It is ludicrous to imagine an entire section of the Tower glowoing red!! Silly. Even if it turns out that some cop did say that, it says more about his abilities to percieve reality than it does about the color of the building. There are plenty of photos of that scene, and none seem to show any discoloration except where the thermate is cutting thru corner sections.

The NYPD observers did not say the all the building was glowing red only
a section about 15 floors down from roof. Reported building was leaning
and starting to buckle in that area. I would tend to believe the pilots
on that helicopter versus any "truthers" do their proximity to the
building and that these are police officers trained to observe.

More complete summary

NYPD Aviation Units: Minutes after the south tower collapsed at the World Trade Center, police helicopters hovered near the remaining tower to check its condition. "About 15 floors down from the top, it looks like it's glowing red," the pilot of one helicopter, Aviation 14, radioed at 10:07 a.m. "It's inevitable."

Seconds later, another pilot reported: "I don't think this has too much longer to go. I would evacuate all people within the area of that second building."

10:20 NYPD – Aviation 14 states the WTC 1 is leaning

Federal engineering investigators studying the destruction of the World Trade Center's twin towers on Sept. 11 said New York Police Department aviation units reported an inward bowing of the buildings' columns in the minutes before they collapsed, a signal they were about to fall.

According to Shyam-Sunder, the concave bowing of the steel was seen on the sides of the towers opposite where the planes hit them. At 10:06 a.m. that morning, an officer in a police helicopter reported that ``it's not going to take long before the north tower comes down.'' This was 20 minutes before it collapsed. In another radio transmission at 10:21 a.m., the officer said he saw buckling in the north tower's southern face, Shyam-Sunder said. Source

I respectfully request that you address my question from the previous post.

red hot steel on the top 15 floors doesent explain this:

AHA!! Here it is, where you miss the boat: " About fiftenn floors down from the top". That means that at a certain point, about 15 floors below the roof, there was a red place. Thats all. It does NOT say or imply in any way that the entire section comprising fifteen floors was red. You misread that or misunderstood it. The English structure of the sentence alone says that it means that he saw a red spot or area, no doubt small, at a point fiftenn floors down from the top. It was him trying to give a semi precise location and not a description of a block of floors.

So, no harm done, but remember that analyzing a sentence in context is important to getting the real intent. Interesting find tho about seeing any red at all; it highlights the obvious fact that at some points the cutting agents were hot enough to make at least isolated areas, all seemingly at critical junctures, hot enough to be seen as red.

JProphet420: They cannot give an intelligent explanation for the dustification of the steel core columns. If they had to admit that no gravity driven collapse could possibly account for the almost unbelievable energy required to turn steel into dust, then they would be hard pressed to try and get suckers to believe the OFFICIAL LIE.

Thjere were NO fires in those buildings, none, that were hot enough to deform or melt steel, NONE. NO evidence of such exists. Mere supposition is the best proof that the official story boosters can muster. ONLY directed energy weapons of one type or another could possibly have caused the effects we see in those pictures. No other way.

And the effect we see in the shredding of the towers from the top down; think about it: If regular explosives were used for that effect, it would have produced far more and vigorous squibs and loud explosions than were felt and observed. There were planty of squibs and explosions, to be sure, but that was to break certain critical joints and supports on the upper levels while the lower levels were basically blown out at the time that Rodriguez testified to.

But, something had to turn the entire buildings, from top to bottom, into dust, tiny shards of bodies are ALL that was found for the vasy majority of victims. No pieces bigger than a finger, according to many firemen.Sifting through the rubble told the tale: some energy source turned those buildings into a flour like dust and it continued down to the very core columns, 47 in all, so thick and robust that they could support the entire structure without any exterior help; all turn to dust within a second or two and caught on film.

Proof POSITIVE that exotic weapons were used against the American people that day, and by elements of our own government and military, as well as spooks and traitors from abroad as well. The facts are known, if a grand jury was to hear all the evidence that is already on the record, there would be a conviction without a doubt. But the perps have friends in high places and they never plan to see a courtroom or face a jury.

But in any event, the pilot said that at a 'point' some fifteen floors below the top of the Tower, he saw some red place and was concerned that that section might be unstable. Not suprising under the circumstances as the cutting agents were in use all along that floor: we can see the entire floor erupt in flames and explosions right when the top part topples..and then CORRECTS THE TOPPLE, and drops straight down turning into dust before that section could even emerge below the dust and smoke from the breaking point!!! Imagine that!!

An entire section of floors, all of a sudden tilts and instead of following the laws of physics, it simply stops the rotation and drops down right into the rest of the building!!It should have, by all known factors, toppled over into the street. The LEVER point was TAKEN OUT at the exact moment that it had to to achieve the desired pattern of destruction, going straight down.

THEN, the entire core column structure turns to dust!!Since gravity CANNOT cause this effect. And since fire CANNOT cause this effect, then what are we left with as a probable causative agent? Hmmm? ONLY two choices that I see; A mini nuke that created millions of degress of heat that conducted quickly thru the steel structure from bottom to top and made the entire thing brittle as glass; OR, and this is my first choice, a directed energy beam from either a space based platform or from a stealth aircraft or some other source, caused the effects we see. ONLY a beam or particle weapon, or some other highly advanced and secretive device, such as microwave, etc. could have caused what we see.

There is no other answer, none. No mundane explanation can satisfy all the evidence, can it? The NIST and the Feds will NEVER discuss this point because it is a smoking gun. It cannot be explained away by the elements that the liars and killers have in their bag of lies and tricks.Just like Bldg. 7, they just do not answer and keep stalling and muttering and hope that we go away sooner or later and stop embarrassing them with questions that they cannot honestly answer. But we will NOT go away and we will NOT accept the ridiculous assumptions that one must make in order to even begin to believe the rantings of the official story. It is lunacy to imagine all these facts and anomalies as just insignificant.

Anyway. glad we cleared up the OP's mistake and I was really glad to see the pics of the steel dustifying; they always make me boiling mad that they are not on every front page of every paper in the nation with prominent scientists from every discipline demanding answers to how the laws of physics changed that day as radically as did our entire defense establishment. The Neocons and their buddies in the shadow right wing government and with intelligence agents and terrorists pulled off the coup that America thought could never happen. We have been taken and we are in a state of war against enemies domestic primarily and foreign as well. The Constitution has been breached and nullified and a coup has overthrown the established order.

It might take a group of line officers to revolt and actually take action and arrest the Bush/Cheney cabal, along with many others that are clearly culpable, and clear out every sorry Congreeman and Senator that are allowing this to happen, and start all over with all new representatives and trials for treason and murdr and war crimes in the Haugue for all that are responsible for this illegal and treacherous attack on this nation.

If they do not step in, we may well be at the nadir of our time as a free nation and the slide into totalitarian fascism will quicken and be in place within a decade. total control. Politicians, all of them now are no more than spokemen for the corporations and none of them have the nerve to address really critical issues, all skirt around the obvious and none dare tell the truth less they end up " Wellstone'd " when they fly around in small planes. Recall the anthrax that the same creeps sent to the Democrat leaders to get the nefarious Patriot Act shoved down our throats? Never found the guy who did that..right? Or did they? Of course they did, and they found out that he was protected by the White House and its hands off pal!! No more investigation!! Just like GWB wanted for 9-11!! NONE! This is war!! Since 9-11.

eyewitness86,
do you trust Fetzer ? what about the rumors he does harm truth movements?

I mean till last month I considered CD as best ´theory´ for many of the effects.
Then, when I read about the weapon theory and looked videos of Fetzer I thought, this is it.as you wrote.
but on the other hand it´s obvious that he contradicts Dr.Jones. and more, he literally tries to prove all of his points wrong. and those of Griffin.
this is dangerous.

I mean, this is the scientific way, (when it works), ok.what else. but in view to this new suit, we have to be careful about our real shots.

its a desaster for the movements. when Reynolds goes to court with no-planes and unproved exotic-weapons arguments .

eyewitness86,
This is war!! Since 9-11.

yes. war of the media, on youtube,ATS everywhere.
these are the times where it all meets.
and ´they´try to take over.

but there are alternative ways for our capitalism. on the long sight this is the main thing.thinking capitalsim-to-its-end.
www.abovetopsecret.com...


[edit on 26-8-2007 by anti72]

Not to derail the thread, but what about electron beams?

Electron beam welding (EBW) is a fusion welding process in which a beam of high-velocity electrons is applied to the materials being joined. The workpieces melt as the kinetic energy of the electrons is transformed into heat upon impact, and the filler metal, if used, also melts to form part of the weld. Pressure is not applied, and a shielding gas is not used, though the welding is often done in conditions of a vacuum to prevent dispersion of the electron beam. The process was developed in France and released on November 23, 1957 in Paris by J. A. Stohr.[1] German physicist Karl-Heinz Steigerwald, who was at the time working on various electron beam applications, perceived and developed the first practical electron beam welding machine which began operation in 1958.[2]

Source: en.wikipedia.org...

As the electrons strike the workpiece, their energy is converted into heat, instantly vaporizing the metal under temperatures near 25,000 °C.

Talk about an exotic weapon for a steel building. This is interesting also.

However, attempting to weld plain carbon steel in a vacuum causes the metal to emit gases as it melts, so deoxidizers must be used to prevent weld porosity.[1]

OK. Back to this red hot spot that only one suppossed police officer (who is not named BTW) saw.

Why go back to a proven nothing story? There was no red area except for a small and localized area that the cop allegedly saw. Big deal. There was yellow thermate reactions with dripping metals pouring down the face of the Tower just prior to it being blown, and yellow actually means something. Extreme heat. red means a cooler fire, no doubt interior stuff burning off..

The more interesting part of this is the fine info you found on that exotic weapon you mention, very interesting indeed. That was a good find.

I do not care about Jim Fetzer one way or another, and any controversy swirling around him would only detract from the facts, and the facts say that the Towers were brought down with a combo of traditional and exotic weapons; there is NO WAY possible that they were felled by fire and gravity, inpossible.

Just examining the films and watching the reactions tells the story, and only fear and coercion could explain scientists keeping quiet about it. There is really NO question about the fact that the Towers were felled purposely by a highly advanced and well equipped team of killers aided by science at the top levels.

Note how the in depth post I made above gets ignored, all the points ignored, and all the official story believers can say is " Look at this guy, he is controversial ". Forget Fetzer and all the rest and just look at the evidence. It tells all we need to know. The fact that the American public is so conditioned and accustomed to obeying government orders without delay makes us prime targets for takeover by the bad guiys, and they have done so. We have been taken by hostile forces and from within.

No wonder that NONE of the ' scientists ' that work for the criminal government will come forward and debate or discuss the events with their peers; there is NO excuse for that, except that they could not stand before their peers with a straight face and spew the lies that we are being fed now.

No one is going to insult our intelligence, and their own, by alleging that those steel core columns turned to dust from the effects of a Tower falling down ; the mass of the Towers was dispersed over a wide area, 90% of the mass GONE, turned into a FLOUR like consistency, and by what? Cool fires? Gravity? Thats a laugh, and only a Bush loyalist would believe that the lies that are being promoted could possibly be true.

Education is what is needed, letting all of the people know the FACTS. But the MEDIA will NEVER allow the FACTS to be discussed as that would mean an end to their game. No discussion, no problem. That is the Bush mantra. Bush and Cheney presured seenior senators and such to forego ANY investigation into 9-11. Recall that? NONE. They did'nt want ANYONE examining the event at all, and stymied and stalled the Commission, which was a joke anyway, because they knew that ANY look at the facts would make them appear as guilty as they are.

How could ANYONE in this day and age believe that the Towers were felled by fire and gravity? It staggers the sound mind. Unreal. But as we are all good little sheepies we will bleat and follow the leader into hell rather than take a stand and face the truth. Shame on us for allowing treason and murder to become a normal part of the office of the P and VP.

Just look at the pics of those steel beams, huge steel beams, truning to dust right in front of your eyes. Then tell us that it was all due to fire and gravity. Nonsense!! No rational person could believe that, and so either we are an irrational society or alseep at the wheel and waiting for a wreck.