metal spheres found in 2 million year old rock???

You are thinking too linear.

Civilization destroying itself doesn't mean every human was completely dissolved from existence.

Over thousands of years ... structures tend to decay. Look at two quarter mile high building turned to dust in 10 seconds or any professionally demolished building.

So, if the theory is a large scale war with horrible weapons ... most of it, except for stone (which was melted) would not really exist anymore.

Your claim for lack of evidence of fossils from long ago ... well, there is lack of evidence of human evolution ... from a pile of 'goo' ... you can't pick and choose parts of a theory as you wish to make a point. Evolution will be a theory until they can prove the whole timeline, not just what is convenient. The same with most science ... it is stretched theories that is generally accepted. Just as the world being flat was at one time.

Deciding we know everything closes your mind to the true possibilities. I understand that a lot of theories have a good thought behind them ... but, if we have only been to the moon decades ago ... how do we know that our judgement of distances of stars are accurate? How can we possibly know our dating procedures even come close? They are guesses, that is the best they can be, since there is not a historical, continuous, documented progress from the beginning of time. To claim anything else is a bit arrogant if not ignorant.

Tell me, how do you know how old the earth is? How do you know the age of the fossils?

We discover new things all the time, including ancient civilizations on the dry earth we have been digging into for a few centuries. We have NO IDEA what is beneath the bodies of water. We understand the surface of mars more than what is under the silt of the ocean floors.

You can disagree all you like, but, I have learned to open my eyes and judge what I see, not based on what some goof came up with a couple hundred years ago, but analyze it with my own brain for what it is worth.

What is possible? ANYTHING

Originally posted by Terapin
What I was referring to, is the statement made earlier in this thread, that mankind has in the past developed to its current state of advancement, and then destroyed itself. There is no evidence for this.

[edit on 29/7/07 by Terapin]

What if there's lots of evidence to suggest this, but it's being suppressed? I think it's entirely possible that mankind has advanced before us,( but I don't think it's possible they would have wiped themselves out 100% and then evolved again from pond life, lol) Perhaps some elite escaped to their bunkers and perhaps the scum (innocent civilians) were left to muddle along as best they could, scattered here and there around the globe and forming tribes. Maybe the descendants of that same elite are still running the show? Maybe that's where strange ancient legends come from, and could be the connection between the stories that span the globe but still manage to sound similar? There is a saying that goes something like "WWIII will be fought with nuclear weapons and WWIV will be fought with sticks and stones." Perhaps this has happened before? Entirely possible in my opinion.

As I stated earlier, it is fine to say, 'perhaps,' and 'maybe.' Speculation costs nothing. But making any actual claims requires evidence. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Originally posted by Terapin
As I stated earlier, it is fine to say, 'perhaps,' and 'maybe.' Speculation costs nothing. But making any actual claims requires evidence. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

You're right, it costs nothing to speculate and that's what I like to do, a lot.You will admit though that there's a lot of missing evidence? Isn't that strange?

Why dont you believe we would evolve again from pond life?Nuclear winter my friend.If anything was lucky enought to survive the immediate blast,radiation and all the other good stuff then the nuclear winter would block out the sun,thus killing everything including plant life.

Imma break it down.

WW3 breaks out tommorrow everyhting on earth dies even single cell organisms.

Now we wait millions of years for one single organism to magically appear,then we wait many millions of years for it to evolve into a human.Thats a # load of dirt my friend.A long long time for artifacts to decompose to nothing or be way way way the hell underground.

I find no reason humans wouldnt evolve into humans again.We are top of the food chain,nothing is wrong with us,we sacrafice brawn for brain in evolution and look what we have become.I dont see any bear building cities or flying do you?We also have these nifty things called hands wich let us craft tools and such.I'd say we are pretty damm close to perfect.

[edit on 29-7-2007 by Project_Silo]

perhaps like in the movie Deja Vu, someone has figured out a way to fold time, therefore when a brave soul dedicated their life to the cause ended up lost in a foreign time and had to live the rest of their life from that point. Teaching the locals as much as they knew, hence intelligence beyond our wisdom. That being said, if scholar from this time was to travel back 1,000,000 years and teach the beings then everything he knew then wouldn't that explain the reason for advanced knowledge beyond what we know today?

Originally posted by Terapin

I'd like to add, Where are these miracle spheres today? Why has no modern scientific study bene done on them? Could they be much like the spark plug found encased in a modern concretion, that was clamed to be a million year old artifact? I don't have the awnsers, and there is almost no data on these spheres. We can speculate all we want but for a lack of data, that is all it is... speculation. Bring them into the light of day, and then lets talk facts.

[edit on 29/7/07 by Terapin]

i see you attempted to debunk everything mentioned thus far ...except the
Antikythera Mechanism

wanna take a crack at it?

Dark heart, I haven't tried to debunk anything. I merely pointed out relevant facts. Some people take stories as fact before they do any checking on the source material. That is unwise. There are plenty of mysteries in this world without people believing in false statements.

Early on in this thread it was suggested that mankind had previously achieved a state of civilization on par with today's technology. It was also stated that perhaps said civilization was destroyed and that man evolved for a second time. Both of these statements show a lack of forethought and a lack of understanding.

Many people misunderstand evolution. The above statement demonstrates this. If they choose to seek knowledge, it is there for them to enlighten themselves. I do not debunk, I simply point out an error in thinking.

If dinosaur bones are still found from 100s of millions of years ago, then why do we not find abundant relics from the aforementioned civilization? Dinosaurs roamed the earth for 100s of millions of years, long before mankind existed. They went extinct 100 million years ago. Yet we still find record of their existence in abundance.

When people suggest that evolution could produce the same species twice, under different environmental conditions, from a different starting point, and with different genetic material, they simply demonstrate a lack of understanding of how evolution works.

The Antikythera Mechanism is a very complex astrolabe whose mechanisms demonstrate a remarkable level of skill and knowledge previously thought to be unknown at the time. This would not be the first time we have been in error about levels of sophistication, nor is it the first time that technologies have been lost. While remarkable, it is not on par with the claims made above about a highly technological society comparable with today's world, nor is it from a related time frame. It comes from 100 BC.

Remember, the Chinese were well advanced a thousand years BC.

dude the only person not understanding is YOU.I said over and over that everything dies form nuclear winter lets say.

Then we start from a fricken single cell animal and go through the dinosaur period all over again,so in these terms we would finding only our set of dinosaur bones not the previous civilization.

YOU do not understand at all even after i broke it down.There would be no artifacts with these dinosaur bones because the other civilization would be under millions of years of dirt and such at the point of the dinos.They would inturn have there own set of dinosaur bones because they went throught the whole evolution process over again from one fricken cell.

What dont you get,stop saying why dont we find anything near the bones,the answer is simple.The previous culture would still be under millions of years of dirt since/.

Everything died,then it took millions of years for life to start again.Then it became a fish,then a frog then a lizard then a dinosaur.so by now the other civilizations remains would be way way way the hell underground.You cannot understand this why?

Yes it is my opinion 100% but you just dont seem to get it and its annoying how you say i dont understand evolution.heh ok i know humans are top of the food chain because we developed high intelligence and fricken hands to craft stuff with.i think we would evolve into a human again.I see no reason we would not.

Tell me why we wouldnt be human again?And hell maybe the other civilization was not human who the eff knows..........

So stop compairing it with fricken dino bones man my god.READ the full damm post before you respond.

damm dude.obviously the earlier culture did not live at the same damm time as the dinos they came way way the hell after just like we did.wich in turn would jsut be that much more dirt... You are using the dino bones as your smoking gun when in turn it is 100% irrelivent.We dont find artifacts with dino bones because this is OUR cycle.....They went through there own dinosaur stage wich in turn would make THEIR set of dino bones even deeper in the earth then there artifacts would be.

So start over with evolution and say we are a fish at the very start of evolution.Million and millions of years before that a culture strived on earth.they had their own evolution cycle their own dino bones,there own everything man..So we wouldnt never find a spec of evidence tied in with anything from our own evolution.Their stuff would be burrried way the eff below this.Dont come trying to make me look like i dont understand evolution.Who does not understand it,its very simple.You just cant get over dino bones and artifacts even though i broke it down for you over and over.

Originally posted by dominicus
I remember reading about this some-where on above-top secret.

Metal spheres found in 2 million or maybe even 2 billion year old pyrophyllite rock when it was cut open. Those spheres are on display some-where and was mined some-where in south africa I believe.

Anyone know anymore on this???

I would suggest that you read the following books which mention these metal spheres and more:
Ancient Traces by Michael Baigent
Forbidden Archaeology Michael Cremo
Lost Civilisations of the Stone Age by Richard Rudgeley

[edit on 30/7/2007 by Mukiwa]

I said over and over that everything dies form nuclear winter lets say.

A nuclear winter would'nt be likely the destroy all micro-organisms, especially not those that live in extreme envirronments.

Then we start from a fricken single cell animal

Monocellular animals never existed.

and go through the dinosaur period all over again

Why would life necessarily evolve into dinosaurs again? DNA isn't like a DVD

i think we would evolve into a human again.I see no reason we would not.

Because the proper conditions that made our ancestors evolve into humans may never take place again.

A long long time for artifacts to decompose to nothing or be way way way the hell underground

If there were cities underground, even older than the dinosaurs, wouldn't we find them?

Umm yea there are single cell organisms in the world today right now.how can you say they dont exist haha.

Also with all the nuclear fallout polluting all the water tell me what would sruvive?

And again dont present your side as facts,because its all speculation just like mine....And again i see us being human again because were damm near perfect

[edit on 30-7-2007 by Project_Silo]

Originally posted by Project_Silo
Umm yea there are single cell organisms in the world today right now.how can you say they dont exist haha.

You said they were animals. I said single celled animals do not exist. Micro-organisms are not Animalia

Also with all the nuclear fallout polluting all the water tell me what would sruvive?

Micro-organisms, virus's, maybe some insects.

And again i see us being human again because were damm near perfect

You think so? Then why is the average human so dumb?

How can "we" become "human again", if the "we" (humans) stop existing?

[edit on 30-7-2007 by DarkSide]

Originally posted by Project_Silo
wow man thats way interesting.i found some articles about them,has this ever been debunked?Seems a find like this would change everything we know.

Yes. They're natural mineral concretions.

www.talkorigins.org...

Originally posted by darkheartrising

what about the other "modern" artifacts found imbedded in stone such as this hammer:

www.mondovista.com...

It appears to be a fairly modern hammer contained in a recent mineral concretion. the fact that no independent examination has been allowed - which would quickly prove or otherwise the authenticity of the find, is telling ....

paleo.cc...

or how about this ancient calculator (Antikythera Mechanism):

www.nature.com...

Just goes to show that the Greeks weren't all a bunch of itinerate goat herders...... But then we knew that anyway!

Uhm. Just a tought..

Is it possible that some ancient human civilization lived some milions of years ago, wiped themself out (alternativly fled into space from some natural disaster? Comet or bio-outbreak?)

Then milions of years passed, nature started to re-evolve. Same planet remember, so some of the same basics apply. Something simmilar to the previous "cycle" maybe, then evolution starts over in a simmilar path?

We may not be 100% like the ancient race then, if there ever was one. But we might share some common traits, since they are best suited for living on this particular planet with theese particular materials?

Ie. 2 arms, 2 legs, 5 fingers.. speech and so on?

I defenitly wouldn't rule it out. Since the earth is SO old there´s been plenty of time for evolution to take place atleast twice? no?

The talkorigins site does raise some valid points regarding the spheres, except they've never been found anywhere else in the world. Others from another location would convince me that they are of natural origin.

Originally I thought Paul Heinrich had done a physical study of the spheres, but this isn't the case as far as I know. Some of his arguments fall a little flat IMO. He seems to be more intent on discrediting than giving a fair scientific view, but understandably he doesn't have much to work with except what you can easily find on the web.
His explanation for the sphere with three grooves is that someone had carved them, in other words geology doesn't have an answer for that. He says he's seeking samples, I wonder why he seems to have made up his mind already. He's never seen them except for the images we can find on the net, at least at the time the article was written. How can anyone say that is conclusive?

Some other examples on the site show it's true agenda, eg Proof of the big bang! what a load, it's simply enforcing scientific dogma.

The fact is there are no scientific studies on these available.

Don't get me wrong I'm on the fence about the spheres, I only wish these things were taken a little more seriously, instead these things are attacked by some mainstream academics. Here's an example.

Also the question of why the evidence isn't as abundant as dinosaur fossils has been raised a few times. I'd suggest that we only have a tiny fraction of what is left from the dinosaur age, It may seem like a lot but not when you consider how long they dominated the planet for and how widespread and abundent they were, it's not much really.
Also it's been estimated that if humanity went extinct there would be very little if any evidence of our civilization after only 200,000 years. Of course there would be exceptions just like the extreme human antiquities that have already been found.
200.000 years for all traces of man to vanish from the earth

Originally posted by squiz

Also the question of why the evidence isn't as abundant as dinosaur fossils has been raised a few times. I'd suggest that we only have a tiny fraction of what is left from the dinosaur age, It may seem like a lot but not when you consider how long they dominated the planet for and how widespread and abundent they were, it's not much really.

yes, a good point. Most dinosaurs we know of, we have actually yet to find a complete skeleton. Modern man has been around 200,000. Dinosaurs were around for tens of millions of years. And suppose an intelligent species only developed to the equivalent of the bronze age? Or even the stone age? Still intelligent, still capable of making artifacts, but not likely to leave any trace millions of years later .....

Given the time theres been life on Earth, the number of species that have come and gone, and the very short time that modern humans have been around, I often think that either there have been previous sentient species on Earth - or else sentient species are extremely rare in the universe.

That said, I'm 100% convinced that these 'metal spheres' are not evidence of a past civilisation. I also thought Paul had physically examined them (maybe I'm thinking of one of the other supposed OOParts he's debunked over the years?) , but from the description and my more limited knowledge of geology, I still think they sound natural. It's surprising just what nature can produce

Project Silo. Please try and contain yourself and eliminate the improper language. It is inappropriate. This is simply a discussion and there is no need to get hot under the collar.

Evolution works in very specific ways. Due to the way in which environment, genetic starting points, horizontal evolution, and gene mutation effects evolution, the chances of the same species developing twice is nil. In order for the exact same species to develop twice, you would need to have the Exact same starting genetic material, the exact same environmental factors, the exact same Random genetic mutations, and the exact same horizontal gene insertions. This simply cant occur. If you cant understand that I wont try and educate you further. I do however, suggest that you take a closer look at the science behind evolution as it is a very interesting topic. You may be interested to note, that the timeline for when certain genetic traits occurred in our DNA can be traced to fairly specific dates. These genetic events in our evolution gives us a great deal of information on where we come from and why. The evolution of your immune system alone is well worth looking at and quite illuminating. You can choose to follow your own theory, but this error in thinking on evolution makes it enter into the realm of pure imagination, and that's fine too. Just so long as we agree that it is imagination and not science.

I mentioned the Dinosaurs simply as an example, not as a definite. From what I gather you are now lengthening the timeline. How far back do you propose this original highly advanced civilization occurred? Just toss out an example so we can discuss it's merits.

We do have all sorts of data from before the Mesozoic, which was the great age of Dinosaurs, (245 to 144 million years ago). If there was a Nuclear winter, even prior to those dates, there would also be data of such a significant nuclear event. We have a fairly good idea of the geological events in the Earths timeline going well back to it's origins back in Hadean time, (4.5 to 3.8 billion years ago). In fact, our oldest fossils date to roughly 3.5 billion years ago. There is still a lot to learn to be sure, but you would be surprised perhaps, at how much we all ready understand.

Originally posted by Project_Silo
... i came up with the theory that man kind has made it this far before,but we wipe ourselves out through war or natural disaster.

Then we go through evolution again and millions of years of evolution we came to where we are now.Now any evidence would be mostly decomposed and would be under many many hundreds of feet of earth.

Here is where you posted that Man has evolved more than once. It is a fact that we have fossils from 3.5 Billion years ago. Prior to that earth was a hot, toxic, newly formed ball in space. If you study geology, you would better understand the fossil, and geological record, and why your claim that any evidence of such a past civilization would be totally buried, is incorrect

Imagination is fine, but when you mix it up with reality it makes no sense. This whole post began with "Mysterious Spheres" that some suggested were ancient artifacts. That has been shown to be False and there is no data to support otherwise. You can do a bit more research on that and see for yourself.

I mentioned Dinosaur bones as an example, but if you wish we can go back even further. If we have fossils from 3.5 billion years ago, it follows that we would have some clear data showing a previous advanced civilization. The DNA timeline is also quite clear and shows When things happened in our evolution. One more use of the Dinosaurs as an example... When the Dinosaurs were wiped out, much like your proposed ancient civilisation, why didn't they also re-evolve? Shouldn't there be a second coming of the Dinos? They were around for far longer than we have been. If they were so successful, why didn't they re-evolve? Why?... Because evolution doesn't work that way. It cant. As was wisely stated earlier by another member, Evolution is not like a DVD... you can't simply replay it and see that same story once again.