Israeli President Calls on World to Unite Against Iran

Originally posted by shrunkensimon


The economy.. is that your only justification, besides the claim of a nuclear weapons program? What gives you ANY right to decide whats best for the people of another country, a country where you do not even reside in!

Well, apparently the people of Iran themselves would rather have a democracy than a dictatorship according to a recent poll....

Most Iranians support nuclear inspections, a democratic government and normal relations with the United States, a poll by a U.S.-based organization has found.

Terror Free Tomorrow found 80 percent of Iranians support full inspections and a guarantee not to develop nuclear weapons in return for aid from other countries.

lets face it, the Iranian people themselves are tired of sanctions and are ready to see some progress within their country again, the question is should the U.S. be the ones to force the change to happen?? another coalition of the willing??

he didn't call for the anihalation of ISREAL,, stop saying that S$%$

he called for anihalting the Zionist group controlling Isreal

and zionists can be broken up into two groups the pre holocaust Zionists who worked w/stern gang and hitler to carry out atrocities ( holocaust) note these zionists came from all ethnicities, but after the TRAUMA which they purposefully carried out there war a new group of Zionists born (mostly good IMO) who changed there minds and decided to support the zionist idea because it provided unity and support and safety in there minds.

so pre holocaust zionism not a much popularity among torah following jews even if those loosely following , pos holocaust big surge in support for zionism, thanks to those who worked to carry out the murders.

the pre holocaust zionists now hide behind semantics and are within the group they sent to slaughter 65 years ago, in the nation state they conspired to develop, and it gives them shelter and if anyone question's them they yell anti-semite and hide behind the very atrocities they committed.

The sentinal;

Yeh, im sure everyone wants their life to be easier, to be more American and globalized, to just give in to corporate greed and lust.. but deep down thats not what anyone wants, not even the people who live in the US!

Iran has been pushed into a corner (Problem)

Now we are in the last stages of Reaction

And very soon, the US and globalists will try to unleash their solution.

Originally posted by cpdaman
he didn't call for the anihalation of ISREAL,, stop saying that S$%$

he called for anihalting the Zionist group controlling Isreal

I would have thought by now that this issue would have been resolved, why does everyone think that he didn't say it??? come on, re-read Muaddib's post on page one, it covers the issue quite well. I gotta go get some sleep now.

OK. Time out.

Lets take the "who said what" argument out of the equation and focus on the practicalities of the issue.

A nuclear armed Iran goes and does the crazy dance in the middle east and blows Israel into kingdom come.

What do you think the established nuclear powers are likely to do about that? Heres a country, sitting there, and its just wiped a nation it disagrees with off the face of the planet.

Do you think that any of the established nuclear powers, regardless of their current affiliations are going to stand for that? Really?

Isn't it more likely that the entire nation would instantly become a world pariah and probably be on the recieving end of some additional megatonnage (assuming Israel launched on warning) in order to prevent it from happening again with the next nation that Iran doesn't see eye to eye with?

No happy ending for Iran there, really, when you think about it. Certainly no glorious muslim empire. Just a few rather large smouldering radioactive craters where cities used to be, a whole load of plague, pestilence and death, in both Iran and Israel - in fact given the small size of Israel the area would be particularlty uninhabitable for quite a while if it was on the recieving end of 5/10 nukes in the 1 Megatonne range, as would the more hospitable sections of Iran.

Now - short of Bond villans - we've not come across anyone stupid enough to think that risking such a venture was worth it, because when it comes to nukes, if you launch one you are more than likely to get one right back at you. Its called MAD, and its just about kept us all alive since WW2.

Nobody in their right mind is going to do it.

Now before someone says "the Iranian guy IS nuts enough", please remind yourself that the various religious factions in Iran wield a damn site more power than he does, and they sure as hell aren't going to risk their necks on letting the mad dog loose, because no amount of praying to Allah is likley to help them should Uncle Trident, or SS-21, or Long March come a knocking on their door - not unless they have a level of faith in Allah that no one has seen the likes of, unless you believe Moses waved his hands and the Red Sea did part.

Politically, having nukes makes you one of the bigger dogs in the yard and capable of intimidation and political leverage, which is why Israel wants to keep theirs and why they don't want Iran to have them, and thats about the end of it really.

Neither side is stupid enough to use them. (In my opinion) Its just like pro-wrestlers talking trash at the end of the day.

[edit on 24/0707/07 by neformore]

neo,
It is good that you see the MAD synero working, but I am just not so sure. Iran has been supplying weapons to Hezbollah, as we as the fighters in Iraq. You also talked about the religious leaders having more power then the leaders. It is often the religious who are the ones calling to destroy some group of people or a country. MAD worked with the U.S. and Russia, not so sure about it in this case.

So...Israel can have nuclear weapons but its Muslim neighbor cannot?

We give Israel nukes....But they don't want anyone else having them.

Hypocritical?

Ahmadinejad did not refer to Israel the country or Israel the land mass, but the Israeli regime. This is a vastly significant distinction, as one cannot wipe a regime off the map. Ahmadinejad does not even refer to Israel by name, he instead uses the specific phrase "rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods" (regime occupying Jerusalem).

So this raises the question.. what exactly did he want "wiped from the map"? The answer is: nothing. That's because the word "map" was never used. The Persian word for map, "nagsheh", is not contained anywhere in his original farsi quote, or, for that matter, anywhere in his entire speech. Nor was the western phrase "wipe out" ever said. Yet we are led to believe that Iran's President threatened to "wipe Israel off the map", despite never having uttered the words "map", "wipe out" or even "Israel".
The full quote translated directly to English:

"The Imam said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time".

Word by word translation:

Imam (Khomeini) ghoft (said) een (this) rezhim-e (regime) ishghalgar-e (occupying) qods (Jerusalem) bayad (must) az safheh-ye ruzgar (from page of time) mahv shavad (vanish from).

Source


Israel will fail without West's support

Originally posted by neformore
Well, he wouldn't want to disarm himself, would he

Certainly not.

Hypocrisy is the greatest luxury and certainly Israel has an arsenal of nuclear weapons it wishes to keep....off the record officially of course. I wonder if that odd annihilation of Israel quote had never been attributed to President Ahmadinejad, would people still be okay with their nuclear pursuits?

That ubiquitous (and suspicious) quote sure did it's job in turning sentiments. What a smoking gun.

Originally posted by RedGolem
I just don't see Iran giving up the weapons.

What weapons?

to Israel. I would however support a united front against the israeli regime.

Whomever has been indoctrinated with Israeli rhetoric and propaganda will hate my position. Why? Because they don't want to wrap their head around the alternative.

So sorry.

BTW, if I was living in the area I would call for Israel's removal from the regine to. Why? because they are destabilizing the entire region. Divide & conquer is their plan. Divide is the progress.


AAC

Yes they don't talk of destruction, they just do it.


A Jew in Iran is way better off than a Palestinian in Israel.


Hypocrites all of them.

[edit on 24-7-2007 by SButlerv2]

We can pick over the words. The intent though was there in the speech. I think "Infinity" has it right though - Iran has a large young population who have a very progressive outlook (I am trying to avoid the word western). They are not happy with the current regime and would like some sort of say in their government. Of course if you are an unpopular government, best to focus your people's mind on a common enemy -in this case Isreal. Politicians around the world have played the "war" card for years e.g. Thatcher and the Falklands.

How far would he play this card? that is the next question?

Originally posted by RedGolem
neo,
It is good that you see the MAD synero working, but I am just not so sure. Iran has been supplying weapons to Hezbollah, as we as the fighters in Iraq. You also talked about the religious leaders having more power then the leaders. It is often the religious who are the ones calling to destroy some group of people or a country. MAD worked with the U.S. and Russia, not so sure about it in this case.

The fact Iran supplies Hezbollah is not reason enough to assume they would nuke Israel.

It is no different than the US supporting Afghan Mujahadeen or Russia supporting Castro. Russia didn't nuke the US and the US didn't nuke Russia.

It is then reasonable to assume that a nuclear armed Iran and Israel would also follow the same path.

Whilst anyone having nukes is a bad idea, you have one group of people who are supported with money and arms by the world's most powerful nation who also have nuclear weapons (aided by the UK and France in the 50's and 60's).

When you then compare them to another group of people who do not have such backing (they actually have to buy their top of the line weaponry, rather than having it given in "Aid"), you kind of think that nuclear weapons might actually stabalise the region and actually allow some progress.

If both sides have the ability to wipe each other out, then both sides are much more likely to be agreeable at the negotiating table.

Neither side, no matter how much they dislike the other, is going to have their own country nuked because they were not willing to sit down and have a cup of tea together.

In my opinion, a nuclear armed Iran is exactly what the region needs. There is less likely going to be a big War if both sides have the ability to wipe each other out totally. It is the sole reason why NATO and the Warsaw Pact never clashed. Fear of Total Annihilation.

It will bring "balance to the force", so to speak....

Originally posted by infinite
so,
I am to believe a conspiracy site for the true meaning of the statement? Plus, the site refers to Israel as the "Zionist state"....not bias then?

Infinite don't you know that it is okay when Iran says Israel's government will be removed and wiped off the pages of time, yet when Israel or the United States or Europe tries to influence other nations...they're imperialists and evil! (well according to those who toss up the translations of "wiping Israel off the map" to wiping Israel's government and state from the pages of time.

Whatever I say. It is ironic that those who say he was misquoted don't know how to speak his language and probably have never seen the footage. But we are ignorant for believing the news...

Originally posted by lee anoma


What weapons?

I don't see them giving up the pursuit of nuclear weapons.

A few things. First who cares what was said. "Omg he said WHAT? Lets go bomb them." We threaten military action constantly against Iran. Does that make us the bad guy? Come on.

Second, like someone else said.. do you REALLY think Iran is dumb enough if it DID have nukes to go after Israel? I seriously doubt that.

Third, if a so-called US based poll shows that 80% of Iranians want democracy, then let them go get it. Why do WE have to bring democracy to everyone?

And finally, if the US DOES strike against Iran (which I am pretty sure they will), do you REALLY think the people of this country (US) are going to stand for it? People already seriously oppose the Iraq war. No one in their right mind is gonna believe the "Iran has WMD" story again.

I might add that whilst the "Iranian on the street" might not always be overly fond of their Government, any strike against them from the outside will actually serve to foment opinion against us.

Dissatisfaction against their own government would quickly ebb away in favour of nationalist undertones.

It would serve to actually push back further attempts at reform in Iran and only complicate efforts to bring peace to a region of earth that is so important to so many people.

I might add that whilst the "Iranian on the street" might not always be overly fond of their Government, any strike against them from the outside will actually serve to foment opinion against us.

Dissatisfaction against their own government would quickly ebb away in favour of nationalist undertones.

It would serve to actually push back further attempts at reform in Iran and only complicate efforts to bring peace to a region of earth that is so important to so many people.

Originally posted by stumason
It would serve to actually push back further attempts at reform in Iran and only complicate efforts to bring peace to a region of earth that is so important to so many people.

Stumason I totally agree. The fact of the matter is, some people don't care if there is peace there. I feel it is almost what they DON'T want.

? maybe ? I'll read some of the 39 replies in the thread, i don't know,

but I'll say it right off..................
the Israeli office of "President" is only a ceremonial position,
president is a nothing office made for rewarding older politicos instead of putting them out to pasture, as it were !!!


so whatever he 'spouts' was OK'ed by the party in power...


you want a US counterpart...
look at 'Admiral Poindexter' and his position at the D.A.R.P.
[[a political pay-back for a political flunkey who keept their mouths Shut !]]


Wha-Wo....maybe with that text, now i'm a target for being classed as a anti-patriot or a Iraq dilitant that is speaking against administration policy ....& any assets i may own can now be seized

Israel is calling on the world to wage war with Iran.

I always take a stance against the aggressor.

The aggressor is Israel. Iran has not called for anyone to wage war, Israel is the aggressor here.


So you want my stance?
I call on everyone to unite against aggressors. I call on everyone to unite against Israel, and demand that they disarm THEIR weapons, and give the Gaza strip back to Lebanon.

Stop treading on your neighbors. Stop calling for bloodshed. Stop the needless ignorant violence. We've already got a problem throughout the middle east with sectarian violence. Let's fix that, before you begin killing even more civilians.