Science Figuring out what happens to us when we die

More people lately are losing faith in the afterlife and god, but at least you can be creative with the afterlife. And really think if there is one or not. I would like to say that the jews gave there up there lives in the concentration camps because some mad men didn't want them to live. So because of this they have to suffer and not exist anymore. Babies are born, grow a little older, then find out that they have cancer and die from it. So what was the point of it, they just don't exist anymore? So can these people have such bad hands in life and get these certain outcomes? Jus something i thought of.......

As I see it when you take your last breath your soul body leaves the human body.

The human body is buried and decays but the soul continues on to the creator's and they send that soul to where it is next destined to go.

What the hello do I know maybe the Monks or the Hopi know

At least they are more apt to be listened to.

Originally posted by NoSuchAgency
Alright people, when you die you're just dead ok, nothing else happens...

The reason why lots of people believe in stuff like afterlife or reincarnation is because they just can't accept the fact that life has to end once.

As for near-death experiences, I think it's just a state in wich your mind goes right before you die.

That's a good close-minded viewpoint even though there is more than enough first-hand evidence that there is something more. Ignore or dismiss if you feel the need to put up that mental wall to make you comfortable in your own mind.

If your consciousness believe it dies when the body dies then perhaps that is what it gets for a while until you figure it out. You will probably change your views once you are close to death most people do. If not, here's hoping you enjoy your "black box" for a while.

But seriously, I think most people shouldn't worry to much about sin and the afterlife as long as they make peace with themselves before they die and keep an open mind and consciousness that you may just not know what the next step is in existence. In other words, have an open and clean karma. Sin does not exclude you from existing after death.

Ask any priest who works with death row inmates, why it is important for those prisoners to repent and get past their earthly wrongdoings before execution. Those priests know more then they let on a lot times.

You just have to understand that it is a possibility, even if you can't believe without first hand evidence/experience. If you need first hand experience with the other "realms" of possibility you could look into astral projection. I guess for some people the only way in believing is first-hand experience, which everyone gets at some point.

[edit on 15-7-2007 by frailty]

Hate to rain on the afterlife-parade, but even the Bible says there is NO afterlife whatsoever...

Ecclesiastes 9:5,6
5 For the living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten.
6 Also, their love and their hate and their jealousy have already perished, and they have no portion anymore to time indefinite in anything that has to be done under the sun.

Psalms 146:4
His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground;
In that day his thoughts do perish.

Genesis 2:17
16 And God also laid this command upon the man: “From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction.
17 But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will surely die.”

Genesis 3:4
4 At this the _serpent_ said to the woman: “YOU surely will not die".

Originally posted by Kr0n0s
About 2 years ago my heart stopped and I quit breathing for about 5 minutes or so. It happened once at my home, once in the ambulance and again in the ER. They could resuscitate me fine but my heart wouldnt stay beating, finally they had to use an adrenaline shot in the chest to keep it beating.
The only thing I remember about it was the sense that I was alone and VERY cold.
The cold part is especially memorable for some reason. I distinctly remember the point that I was resuscitated at least two of the times and the feeling of being so cold was almost overwhelming. It wasnt the same as being cold like were used to, I was cold on the inside, hard to explain but I dont recall any bright light or seeing dead relatives etc...

I had a similar experience two months ago. For some reason my blood pressure dropped through the floor. I fainted, I think. The thing is the Doc is not sure what happened, it doesn't fit the text book styles of fainting(just finished a ton of different tests last week). My heart and pulse stopped, I became dead cold and became completely non-responsive. I was basically dead. All I remember is coldness, darkness, and the last image I saw flickering like an old video tap being played. If it was a near death experience, I didn't see a tunnel or dead relatives or anything.

I agree with the whole energy and matter can't be created or destroyed thing. We exist now, therefore we have always existed and always will. I don't think that we keep our memories when we die, since they are just a recording in our physical brain, like software on a hard drive. We change form or something, to something else, what I have no idea, but it really doesn't matter for our current life/existence.

Just my two cents.

[edit on 16-7-2007 by halfmask]

First off, that is from the Old Testament, which is the old law before Jesus came and made the necessary amendments for all mankind regarding those living and those dead. Back then, the dead truly were dead.Most of the time in the bible when spoken of the dead it meant those who were unbelievers or evildoers, chosen for destruction, as they truly are forgotten and afterlife is far from hopeful. Also, it is speaking of not living here on earth in an afterlife as we know it again or as some would call it re-incarnation. (example)
Even Abraham had to reside in a place just adjacent to sheol when he passed on. Although his place was was more pleasant, he could still see the sufferers across the gulf from his position.
When Jesus came he gave hope to the living and peace to the dead with a place to reside with him. Let me throw a few verses back to you to ponder.
Romans 6:10 "For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth,he liveth unto GOD."
Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
1 Corinthians 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
15 But not as the offense, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
17 For if by one man's offense death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
John 5:28 "Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice
John 5:29 and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned.
1 Corinthians 42-44
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown corruptible; it is raised incorruptible.
43 It is sown dishonorable; it is raised glorious. It is sown weak; it is raised powerful.
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual one.

1 Corinthians 51 Behold, I tell you a mystery. We shall not all fall asleep, but we will all be changed,
1 Corinthians 52 in an instant, in the blink of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
So you see, there are so many more references to the fact that through Jesus, we shall live again...just not as a chicken or a cow and yep, you guessed it, not as a fleshy human either. Through Jesus we shall inherit new bodies, those that are worthy. It is alot easier to just think that we will fade away into the dirt like a worm and just disappear, but this is not the end and science can do nothing but give scholastic educated guesses about readings from the body, but that is where it stops for them. When the body's battery dies, let's face it....they know no more than you or I. God has given us the answer and it is not an answer without hope, such as just expiring into nothingness. It is a message of HOPE and in the end, that is better than no hope at a

[edit on 16-7-2007 by Phenomium]

Originally posted by UnholyP
Hate to rain on the afterlife-parade, but even the Bible says there is NO afterlife whatsoever...

Ecclesiastes 9:5,6
5 For the living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten.
6 Also, their love and their hate and their jealousy have already perished, and they have no portion anymore to time indefinite in anything that has to be done under the sun.

Psalms 146:4
His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground;
In that day his thoughts do perish.

Genesis 2:17
16 And God also laid this command upon the man: “From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction.
17 But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will surely die.”

Genesis 3:4
4 At this the _serpent_ said to the woman: “YOU surely will not die".

It says your spirit leaves your body. And obviously you won't be doing anything under the sun in a mortal realm when you die; you won't be lingering in a 3-dimensional body. Perhaps you need to re-read what you type before you give an objection on it. Your post completely counters your own opinion.

If our souls are energy, and energy cannot be created or destroyed, what happens as more and more human beings are born? Does this "thin-out" the consciousness energy pool? Who has thoughts on this?



[edit on 16-7-2007 by VampyrOsis]

Originally posted by VampyrOsis
what happens as more and more human beings are born?

Possible answers:

If you consider the human race to be the only intelligence in the universe and confined only to planet Earth, then it could be problematic.

However, if you consider all life on Earth to be part of the spiritual whole, perhaps the eradication of wildlife makes up for the difference brought about by the burgeoning human population.

Good question, though.

Why is it people automatically assume you have to be close to death to experience an NDE. I've had an NDE and I certainly was no where near dying at the time. My NDE was induced through meditation and what a amazing bizarre experience it was. I've never managed to repeat the experience no matter how much I meditate.

This experience got me hooked on anything to do with spirituality. I read many books and practised energy awareness exercises which lead to other experiences such as Paranormal, lucid dreaming, OBE's and astral projection. Regardless I'm still none the wiser about the bigger picture, but one thing I do know, is that there is definitely something beyond this physical reality in which we are all a part of and I will continue to chip away at it until all my questions are answered. Surely the search for the truth of one's own existence is the ultimate quest.

Why is that some people are waiting for scientists to prove life after death. Who cares what science or scientists think. I'm certainy not going to wait around for science to give me the answers. You have all the tools you need to conduct your own research into whether life exists after death. You can start by learning to meditate and discover for yourself that there are other realties beyond the veil of this existence.

I agree "Frailty" your right. If your after the truth there's no substitute for first hand experience. So what you waiting for? The answers you seek are within reach. Go and learn how to meditate and astral project.




[edit on 16-7-2007 by kindred]

[edit on 16-7-2007 by kindred]

When I was four my family went to Cape Cod. It was chilly out and I was wearing a hooded sweat shirt. My parents were walking on the beach, and I was playing in some tidal pools. Apparently I fell into one. My parents tell me that they looked for me, and the only thing they saw was the very tip of my hood sticking out of the water. My father rushed over and yanked me out. I was cold and blue with no heartbeat. He estimates that I was in the water for a couple of minutes. My dad resucitated me right there on the beach. He swears I was clinically dead.
I remember nothing at all. There were no lights, no tunnels, no incredibly warm presence. The only thing I know is that to this day I'm not real fond of swimming.

Originally posted by The Phantom
Does anyone think that someday, maybe in the near future, maybe in the distant future, that scientists could possibly find out what happens to us when we pass over?

Why would you want scientists to find out what happens? The fact is everyone is going to find out sooner or later what really happens. And I believe until they you shouldn't try to find out, because it is one mystery that we all will find the answer too.

Originally posted by Mitzella
I believe everything can be explained scientifically regardless of it's nature. It's just a matter of science getting to the point where it can understand it all. So just because there's a chemical process involved in the brain during the transition between life and death doesn't make that process devoid of spiritual value.

Originally posted by twitchy
Quantum Physics is fun to say and it sounds and looks real impressive up there on a shiny blackboard, but sadly it doesn't explain jack diddly in the realm of human consciousness. You show me one theorum, or a single formula to explain laughter, love, or the human need to paint, dance, or sing and I'll kiss your quantum butt.

But that is precisely where science will, in the end, cease to exist as science, and simple be known as the truth/spirit once again. It is the inevitable process of self-realization, the return path back to God. Civilization rises and falls, but not without the points inbetween, where it either finds unity or destruction, the zero point. Consciousness is no different, in either the collective human experience study known as "science", or as an individual experiencing itself/reality/creation.

Science is merely concerned with the pursuit of knowledge, not wisdom. Wisdom is knowledge AND experience. We are STILL trying to split matter even further and further, in the hopes we will find something concrete, but at the same time there is quantum physics which has already stated that at such a low level the observer and the observed cease to exist, and become one, at the same time.

The truth has always been right infront of us, but we continue to see the world through the male perspective, the logical route of perceptions, instead of uniting the two halves and taking into account the experience as it happens.

The question is, how much longer will it take for all mainstream science to accept defeat, and realise the relationship between reality and the observer, the interconnectedness, which can only be at harmony when WE are at harmony with it/nature. The simple truth that most people are now beginning to realise on their own, that we can no longer continue to fight against nature/earth, and must realign ourselves with it.

Originally posted by twitchy
There's your quantum leap, right into the unchartered territories of the profound introspection that can only come from the realization and the fruition of your own mortality and inner experiences of the world around you.

Well said

Originally posted by enjoies05

Originally posted by The Phantom
Does anyone think that someday, maybe in the near future, maybe in the distant future, that scientists could possibly find out what happens to us when we pass over?

Why would you want scientists to find out what happens? The fact is everyone is going to find out sooner or later what really happens. And I believe until they you shouldn't try to find out, because it is one mystery that we all will find the answer too.

Well if you dont live on, we wont be conciouce to even know we are dead. lol just a point

George Rodonaia a athiest dead for 3 days. How can someone be dead for three days and a NDE just be a chemical reaction? Sorry but someone being dead 3 freaking days and coming back has to make you wonder. Dude wasnt dead 5 minutes, 15, minutes, a hour, DUDE WAS DEAD 3 days!

Rev. George Rodonaia underwent one of the most extended cases of a near-death experience ever recorded. Pronounced dead immediately after he was hit by a car in 1976, he was left for three days in the morgue. He did not "return to life" until a doctor began to make an incision in his abdomen as part of an autopsy procedure. Prior to his NDE he worked as a neuropathologist. He was also an avowed atheist. Yet after the experience, he devoted himself exclusively to the study of spirituality, taking a second doctorate in the psychology of religion. He then became an ordained priest in the Eastern Orthodox Church. He served as a pastor at St. Paul United Methodist Church in Baytown, Texas.


Lets no forget Pam Reynolds. body temperature was lowered to 60 degrees, her heartbeat and breathing stopped, her brain waves flattened, and the blood drained from her head. In everyday terms, she was put to death.

She had a nde.


Blind people have had NDEs.

Sorry chemical reactions cant explain this stuff esp the guy who was dead for 3 WHOLE DAYS!


[edit on 16-7-2007 by ncuncfan2006]

Nobody dead for three days comes back. System breakdown is permanent by then. Either he wasn't dead and was just in a coma, or he lied, or you're making it up. Where is your link?

And when I say nobody dead for three days comes back, that includes Lazarus.

[edit to add link] www.deathonline.net...

This site shows exactly what happens when a body begins to rot, and at three days, there's no turning back.

[edit on 16-7-2007 by MajorMalfunction]

www.near-death.com...

Do a google search.

ok oK the guys heart was not beating when they put him in the morgue.
When he was took out of the morgue after 3 days to have a autopsy done his heart wasnt beating either. Not until he started getting cut into did he come back.


So i guess what your saying is his heart stopped beating, then once they had mistaken him for dead and put him in the morgue it started beating again and beat for 3 days. Right before the doctor took him out to perform a autopsy it stopped beating once again. Then when he started getting cut into it started beating once again lol. Hmmmm what timing.


[edit on 16-7-2007 by ncuncfan2006]

Originally posted by malakiem
More people lately are losing faith in the afterlife and god, but at least you can be creative with the afterlife.

Really? What is your source for this tidbit? "Atheists international?"

Really, where do you come to that conclusion? Is it because the majority of the posters here at ATS don't believe in anything? That is hardly an accurate portrayal of society.

Here's a list of what happens when you die according to the Victor Zammit website (have your saltshaker handy of course):

www.victorzammit.com...

Although I have to be skeptical of what's posted there on that list, some of it rings true to me and to what I have experienced (my OOBE's, and two relatives visiting me in my dreams and trying to prove to me that the were in fact alive, days after they passed away).

Edit:

a FAQ about what happens:

www.euro-tongil.org...

[edit on 16-7-2007 by TheBandit795]

Originally posted by UnholyP
Hate to rain on the afterlife-parade, but even the Bible says there is NO afterlife whatsoever...

Ecclesiastes 9:5,6
5 For the living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten.
6 Also, their love and their hate and their jealousy have already perished, and they have no portion anymore to time indefinite in anything that has to be done under the sun.

Psalms 146:4
His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground;
In that day his thoughts do perish.

Genesis 2:17
16 And God also laid this command upon the man: “From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction.
17 But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will surely die.”

Genesis 3:4
4 At this the _serpent_ said to the woman: “YOU surely will not die".

Firstly, Ecclesiastes is speaking of your "soulic" body, not your spirit. Your "soul" or earthly emotions do indeed die with the body.

As is actually stated right here in your own rebuttal

Psalms 146:4
His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground;
In that day his thoughts do perish.

You physical thoughts do perish at death, but the spirit vacates the body. Don't fight fire with fire because all you are left with is a whole lot of ashes.



[edit on 16-7-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]