US troops using Russian WWII guns?

A weapon that withstood the test of time and is partly responsible for the victory in WWII. Heck I wouldn't mind having one of those if I was in combat.
CLICKY


[edit on 1-7-2007 by Lecter]

US troops used the old MP38/MP40's in WWII when they could capture them and it's not uncommon for Specops to use local weapons such as AK's and FAL's.

Originally posted by Bitdust
Is this a hoax?

this

or

this

I mean, shown on photos are WWII Russian PPSha machine gun in hands of US brave solders in Iraq. Probably confiscated during raids on the streets of Baghdad. But...what the @#%$ are these doing in hands of the braviest and the best? Some kind of a joke?

It's not a hoax. They are captured weapons, but rest assured the troops over there aren't using those in battle. We had all sorts of captured weapons when we were over there.

Originally posted by BitDust
...yeah and for that sole reason he mounted aiming unit just for fun..You know, spent hours of his talent and imagination, and shove the gun aside first combat episode!

You are assuming that the insurgents weren't the ones that mounted that sight.

its true, i have a picture of me with an ak while i was over there, not that i ever kept one, it was just for the making of a good picture for the family back home.

Originally posted by BitDust
Just interesting...that's what I said. Not like the braviest have nothing better to fight with...I'd expect relaxed laught, and still am..just look at the pics..ain't those hilarious?? I mean, you find a pictures of russian solders in...hmmm..let's see...where....ah!..Afganistan and Chechnia, trying M16, superior in every respect rifle, instead of whatever piece of rubbish they are useing these days.

man u are really dumb. And I dont mean it as offence. I really say it from heart: You are dumb!

You say M16 is good and AK is rubbish? This is a bigger lie than saying US-Americans are not fat...

No joke in this picture;

img510.imageshack.us...

PPSh rigged with a setup from an M4? Vertical grip, open sight and a SureFire with a laser?

The patch does say Airborne, and that PPSh sure looks like a perfect house clearing weapon.

Why? Here it is.

Iraqis are not likely to wear body armor, so 7.62X25 is just right considering its high 900 round per minute rof, and its huge drum of 71 rounds.

5.56X45 ricochets like crazy, breaking up into small peaces which bounce all over the place, while 7.62 just pegs what ever it hits.

PPSh will also have much greater killing power at short ranges when compared to M4s short barrel 5.56.

Higher rate of fully auto fire, larger/safer caliber, much larger ammo capacity of the drum, all equal to a much better solution for house clearing then a M4.

I have no doubt that our troops bring modified PPSh with them on house clearing runs, it just makes sense.

If only what happened in combat was a direct reflection of the statistics of the weapon.

And Iskander it is even wise to use them because the enemy themselfes are using these weapons and might think that a rival millitia is shooting them and storm the place encountering far better trained US soldiers.

And if they dont use those weapons it is then just a personal prize to show off and just to make fun with it.

Originally posted by xmotex
Troops in Iraq have been using a variety of weapons for close quarter battles with insurgents, including trophy weapons obtained in the field. I've heard of the PPSh being used before, apparently it's very well-suited to the urban combat environment in Iraq.

I can agree to that. In 1945 when the Red Army stormed Berlin their was an order issued that no soldier could enter Berlin unless he (or she in rare cases) had a PPSh or their Mosin Nagant with fixed bayonet (Russian soldiers in WW2 had another general order stating that bayonets must be fixed at all times in combat).

Originally posted by cavscout



You know, we had this room FULL of all sorts of weapons that we confiscated. We found Garands, m-14s, lots of AKs and Makarovs, mausers, just about every weapon you could imagine. I can post 10 pictures here of us posing with foreign weapons, we all did it. I even have one of me in a Santa outfit holding an AK.

Do you think they would be left on the street for further use?

We actually often carried pistols that we found as not every soldier gets issued a pistol. Except for MPs, most units have just enough pistols for officers and senior NCOs although that is not how the distribution is done.

Hell, we even kept a couple AKs in the truck. If an M-4 fails, it is easier to pick up an AK then to apply SPORTS to your weapon. And it had nothing to with the AK being more reliable (it is.) Any rifle would do, even an extra M-4, but the military doesn’t give out "extras." One soldier, one rifle.

Please post your photos. I would love to see some of the weapons that you confiscated.

Hell, use whatever you must.
If you have to use WWII weapons use them.
Either way they still kill the soldier's enemy.

NATO making rules for war is just idiotic.
If I am trying to kill you, than I should be able to by any means, not by underpowered FMJs.

Originally posted by Ford Farmer
Hell, use whatever you must.
If you have to use WWII weapons use them.
Either way they still kill the soldier's enemy.

NATO making rules for war is just idiotic.
If I am trying to kill you, than I should be able to by any means, not by underpowered FMJs.

I agree here, the other issue that the .223 is designed to wound rather then kill under the logic that the wounded guys buddies will then attempt to take him to the aid post and by doing so removes 3 or 4 enemy soldiers from the battlefield plus another guy to carry everyone elses rifles. Thats great when your fighting someone who cares about the guy next to you but what happens when the enemy is so riled up that they dont care?

We are fighting a different kind of war against a different kind of enemy and like in the Philippines 100 years ago we adopted more efficient weapons to stop the Moros after it was found they would often take multiple shots to critical areas before they would drop well we will have to do the same today in Iraq.

They certainly captured them from Iraqi fighters who have the worst guns in the world. But i'm surprised they still use those, usually all you see are AK-47's, Dragunovs, and RPG's. If I captured one of those historical firearms, I would pose with it too.

They certainly captured them from Iraqi fighters who have the worst guns in the world. But i'm surprised they still use those, usually all you see are AK-47's, Dragunovs, and RPG's.

That’s an oxymoron. Let’s put it together;

Iraqis use the worst guns in the world, such as AK-47, SVD and RGP.

AK-47 holds the prize as the best assault rifle of all times, SVD is the best front-line sniper rifle, and to this day a basic RPG can burn down a modern tank.

Let’s not forget PK/PKM.

If I captured one of those historical firearms, I would pose with it too.

Modified PPSh IS used by our troops to clear houses, run a search for your self and you’ll find all about it.

Originally posted by Bitdust
But...what the @#%$ are these doing in hands of the braviest and the best?

I'm sorry, but...why are you Americans so far up their own arses?

Ok anyway. The weapons are obviously captured from an Insurgent cache.

IMO these pics must have been taken during a break on patrol, and the guys found an old ppsh in a cellar or something. They play a little with it and stick their aiming device on it just for fun.
End of story

The people I know in Iraq have told me about all kind of interesting crap they have found floating around.
They've found swords, old Russian guns, odd helmets, whatever.
Normally they just use them for trophies or maybe plinking at cans or something. Nothing really significant about it. Don't worry about them being forced to use them due to lack of good armament.

I am not understanding why the OP thinks that american troops should be "FORCED" to use only issue weapons. Keep in mind the military "FORCES" it's troops to continue wearing the interceptor system combat armor, which has been busted for severe quality control issues once already, as well as being vastly inferior to dragonskin. Even if someone were to spend their own money to procure dragonskin they can now be PUNISHED for wearing it as well as losing their death benefits if they die with it on.
Warzones prove out tactics weapons and equipment in ways that no amount of exhaustive trials can in peace time... The fact that the ppsh 41 is being used sporadically for house clearing operations, and is being upgraded with current tech is really not surprising. The submachine gun really hasn't changed that much since world war 2, and the ppsh was a superb weapon then it stands to reason it would be the same superb weapon now.
Ironically enough just last week I put in my order for a reciever and parts kit to build myself a semi auto ppsh. I'd like to thank the original poster for giving me some food for thought as to the mods I will be doing on mine when it arrives.

Originally posted by xmotex
Troops in Iraq have been using a variety of weapons for close quarter battles with insurgents, including trophy weapons obtained in the field. I've heard of the PPSh being used before, apparently it's very well-suited to the urban combat environment in Iraq.

Smart guys. A bullet is a bullet, and they all kill the same. if the gun is suited to the situation, use it.