Everything/(one) banned so quickly?

Ive been here for a little while and seem to notice that when someone here comes with a wild claim they are almost instantly banned.

Like this recent CIA guy with all the answers to ufo's and area 51.

Seems like the members here "think" they are experts on one level or another, but that leads to arrogance!

What if that guy was the real deal?? And all of us in our errogance and supreme knowledge banned him!

I have yet to see a "clear" ufo pic, or a person who makes wild claims not get beat down at every opprertunity!

We all seem to want the truth, yet it seems we are bashing each other over the head to who can scream fraud the first!!

This guy from the CIA (supposedly) didnt even get a word out edgewise before you were all yelling fraud from the roof tops!!

What would you all have done if Bob lazar decided to use ATS as his outlet?? Even those of us who dont believe him.

This is getting a little like a popularity contest "who can shout fake first"!

This isnt about who finds the truth, its just one big platform for those of you who spout out the loudest, kinda like the 9/11 stuff!!

I see your point and agree to a certain extent but ofcource people will call bs when they go throught the same # on a different day..It makes me wonder if the some organization is doing it on purpose to condition us to call BS

People here get banned for breaching the site's Terms & Conditions. Not for posting a wild or unpopular theory.

Originally posted by redseal
Ive been here for a little while and seem to notice that when someone here comes with a wild claim they are almost instantly banned.

Like this recent CIA guy with all the answers to ufo's and area 51.

Seems like the members here "think" they are experts on one level or another, but that leads to arrogance!

What if that guy was the real deal?? And all of us in our errogance and supreme knowledge banned him!

I have yet to see a "clear" ufo pic, or a person who makes wild claims not get beat down at every opprertunity!

We all seem to want the truth, yet it seems we are bashing each other over the head to who can scream fraud the first!!

This guy from the CIA (supposedly) didnt even get a word out edgewise before you were all yelling fraud from the roof tops!!

What would you all have done if Bob lazar decided to use ATS as his outlet?? Even those of us who dont believe him.

This is getting a little like a popularity contest "who can shout fake first"!

This isnt about who finds the truth, its just one big platform for those of you who spout out the loudest, kinda like the 9/11 stuff!!

If people are 'INSTANTLY BANNED' It's because of a number of reasons:

We at ATS seek the truth about a number of subjects and want to discuss these subjects at large.

There are plenty of persons who decide to portray 'one truth or another' within the ATS site, and want to pass this knowledge unto others.

Think about it? There are a lot of 'truths' out there, waiting to be presented?

We, at the ATS Community have to 'sift' through the info that types by our way, and need to know 'which' valid 'truths' - should convey to our readers.

"Are YOU telling us ACTUAL truth?". This is a BIG topic amongst our readers!

With the recent wave of wild-claims that have been proven to be hoaxes, you cannot blame the staff for being wary of any new comers.

In saying that, i always read what they have to say and reserve judgment. You never know when the next crackpot could be telling the truth.

Originally posted by redseal
What if that guy was the real deal?? And all of us in our errogance and supreme knowledge banned him!

Trust me, after more than five years of running a very popular board, we're getting good at spotting hoaxes. Not to mention that we really do have access to people that would know if something like "unknown_user" is using the correct terminology and/or passing information that makes sense.

1). Posting: You will not post any material that is knowingly false, misleading, or inaccurate.

From Here.

Rather easy to understand.

Enjoy,
Lex

I dunno djohn,

I think I may have broke a few rules here and their, but im still alive and kickin!!

Im was just wondering maybe this guy was the real deal, and ats has such a strict enforcemnt, that we are sometimes to quick to pull the trigger??!!

I understand we cant have every tom, dick, and harry spouting off such stuff. But what if a fellow does come forth? he may be scared or whatever, has some outstanding claims/stories (which we are all here for) and gets shot down the moment he/she opens their mouth!!??

Everything and anything we as ATS's are looking for is "out their, far fetched". But every time something like this comes around, we seem to be pushing the thing away from us that we are here for in the first place!!

What are we truth seekers, or bubble busters?

Im begining to think this is a place for those who can boast the loudest why stuff cant happen, rather than why it could!!!!!

Its a good thing that people who make wild claims and pretend to be experts, yet have the vernacular of a 12 year old, get banned. Its why this site is what it is. And I personally have never been involved in an internet forum, but because of the high standards of ATS i decided to join after lurking for almost a year.

I'm willing to bet that people who get banned are the ones are the :

TROUBLE MAKERS: - Those who come into ATS community and start a thread for the purpose of 'riling' up other members. TROLLS Those whose soul purpose is to 'rile' up other members for the sake of 'exhibiting a disturbing thought'. THEY LEAVE, then mabey come back under other names to view the 'damage' they have porveyed. These people don't stay around long.

DRIVE BY SHOOTERS: Those who enlist within the ATS forum - specificallly to 'thrust' a specific topic with the soul purpose of stirring up a thread. These peoples stay longer... They may wait around for a specific purpose. They come and go.

Absolute TROLLS - These are those who have enlisted within ATS and strike upon threads with absolute certainty. PROVOKING others.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Trust me, after more than five years of running a very popular board, we're getting good at spotting hoaxes. Not to mention that we really do have access to people that would know if something like "unknown_user" is using the correct terminology and/or passing information that makes sense.

Ah yes habit, the feeling one has after performing a task day in and day out, becomes rather routine doesnt it?

Well, Im an electrician, thats what I do for a living. I respect electricity, and have been shocked by it many times!

I am a MASTER ELECTRICIAN and I know that I will get shocked agian, but yet I am a Cetified "MASTER"

You may be "good" at spotting hoaxes, but no one is a "true master"
And even they get bit once in awhile!!

Well put...some amount of arrogence on their part for sure, but its their place and absolute power corrupts absolutely....
shocking....

ok that sounded like bashing, it wasnt!!! sorry!

Just this, lets not all get to routine in our every day jobs!!

Espically you three amigos, dont let this web site become a day to day thing for you!!

Ya its your job, but thats your job, dont let it become that!!

Once its your job you dont really care!!!!

Sorry, just ramblin

Well this is just my opinion, but I would think anyone coming in from the cold would at lest speak with Admin first to verify they where who they say are.
But other than that the members usually bust a hoaxer in 2 or 3 pages and this fellow today I gather was easy pickings from reading his reply to the members in that thread.

well... to be honest I get the feeling that a lot of people here would like to be called experts on the shere fact that they read some books on the ufo subject. That hardly makes an expert... neither does having sifting through wild claims for several years, with all due respect.
If you encounter 1000 people who claim to be Elvis, you still have 0,1 % that one of them is telling the truth...

So are all you experts now saying that you hold the ability to be objective having witnessed 999 false claims and judging that guy number 1000 is another hoaxer? I seriously doubt it... no respect intended here.

The disclosure business or the business of debunking... which ever you like, has in my view become very franchised. It seems that it is now more about the number of conclusions achieved rather than the quality of these conclusions.
Ofcourse if the massive wild claims indeed are manufactured to desensitize us to believe everything is BS it's EVEN MORE necessary to deal with those claims with care.

Also trying to treat every claim as the very first you encounter, would ease our minds and start becoming sensitive to finding the truth again.

Imagine a situation where a new face arrives... he makes wild claims, but we brush him off, shouting "hoaxer" "He's a fake burn him, burn him!" "we heard that one before.
But in this case the poor guy is someone whose immense moral issues turned him against his own employer.
In an attempt to prove himself to us the guy steals documents from his office, the records department where he works or takes pictures and intends to upload them.
However just as he has put the disc-o-incredible-info in his computer some of his somewhat more coldhearted colleagues comes up from behind and strangles/slits/shoots him. Ofcourse the same outcome could occur if the did manage to get the info to us, but then we would probably call em well manufactured fakes and the thread will die along with a poor guy, mid-30s, no kids or girlfriend, though he often spends time with his elderly mother who is in a retirement home.

What Im saying is that one day, you are gonna be met by one of these selfsacrifising martyrs, and how will you know who not to brush off... given all this self-righteous expertise?

Another thing... seeing what threads that are allowed to move on in other subjects I can hardly give this site the title of being a supplyer of the ultimate truth. A lot of BS is floating around here... so, now we are back to subjectivity, ay? So a good question could be:

- Why is some bs allowed to move on and some killed on sight? Who makes that call? It can't be democracy, cause that doesn't exist right?

[edit on 22/6/07 by flice]

I don't see how this fits into Aliens & UFO's, as it seems to be a questioning of website policies, but I'll give my opinion anyway.

There's two ways for these people to avoid being banned:

1) Provide proof that you are who you say you are. Wild claims require tons of information and proof. If you don't want that burden of proof, then don't make wild claims. In the end, it's those people who decide they're going to post. If they're genuine, then they won't have a problem posting proof. If they truly do work for the CIA or something like that, then they can easily send all their information to the Admins, who I feel are trustworthy, and the Admins can give a simple yes or no response to this person being genuine and accurate. If they cannot provide this information, then there really is no other choice than to believe they are a hoaxer.

2) Follow the terms and conditions. We don't pay to use this website. The costs fall upon the ones who run the website and/or their affiliates. Hosting costs money. Then to host a major message board with tons of posts costs even more money. Then to have a nice design like this website costs even MORE money. Then you throw on how many people are registered here and continue to register everyday, that's more money you have to spend on databases. Not to mention bandwidth. So since we don't pay for it, we really have no right to say how things should and shouldn't be on this website. You may think it's unfair for this or that, but it's the Admins' call, not ours. If you contribute to the overall cost of this website, then you can have some say. But outside of that, we're really at the mercy of their policies, and we just have to deal with it.

[edit on 6/22/07 by NovusOrdoMundi]

On one hand, I can see what the OP is saying. If admins, mods, and members become too "used" to "spotting hoaxes," then anything matching the hallmarks of a hoax that they have acclimated themselves to will be viewed as a hoax, and perhaps erroneously. Likewise, just because someone uses "incorrect terminology" does not necessarily mean what they say is untrue. For instance, there could be groups or agencies hidden behind walls of compartmentalization great enough that their terminology and "lingo" differ considerably from the norms of other agencies that one would assume are responsible for a given issue. In such cases, banning for terminology inaccuracies would be based purely on assumption (though, granted, it would be assumption founded in what most would regard as common sense.) We shouldn't allow this to become the norm.

I don't think that's the case though, because on the other hand, I have come to trust the judgment of the moderators here. If they say someone violated the TOS, then in all but very exceptional cases (and in those cases, I'd like to think they would be the first to admit a mistake on their part,) that person did just that. I think they are intelligent and experienced enough to notice when and if a member says they are part of Agency A, B, C, or D and to check with the appropriate members to confirm or deny the authenticity of their institutional vernacular.

Now, if someone claimed to be part of a secret or undocumented agency, organization, or group, and they were banned solely on the basis of their terminology and without other causes (such as blatant inconsistencies and retractions,) I would have to take issue with that. However, in my reasonably short time here, I have yet to see that occur.

I saw on TV about a year ago, some guy (don't remember who he is or what his job was) who had been maimed while doing his job...After the accident that forced him out of his profession, he decided to wander the country & lecture on safety. One of the most emphasized points he made in his lecture tour is that even a "Master" can get so self-confident in his skills that he starts to get "comfortable" while doing his job.

You may have guessed at this point, that this was the main cause of the accident that maimed him...His years of experience & utter confidence in his skills made him feel "comfortable" doing his job & he got careless of safety.

An excellent lesson to learn, that. How many accidents could be completely avoided if personal safety is foremost in mind, no matter how skilled you are?

Personally, I don't really see how the Three Amigos can really ever get "comfortable" with running ATS...As long as they remember that there really are experts that enter ATS & that the "pool" of experts is drawn from a manpower pool literally worldwide, I think that serious mistakes are (for the most part) avoided.

The Three Amigos also have another advantage that the lecturer I spoke of never had...They have each other to keep honest & sharp (Unless, of course, they may be collaborating & conspiring with their power on ATS--After all, What is the whole theme of ATS anyway...Conspiriacies! )

Ok, you caught me...That last bit was "humor in an ironic vein."

Originally posted by NovusOrdoMundi

2) Follow the terms and conditions. We don't pay to use this website. The costs fall upon the ones who run the website and/or their affiliates. Hosting costs money. Then to host a major message board with tons of posts costs even more money. Then to have a nice design like this website costs even MORE money. Then you throw on how many people are registered here and continue to register everyday, that's more money you have to spend on databases. Not to mention bandwidth. So since we don't pay for it, we really have no right to say how things should and shouldn't be on this website. You may think it's unfair for this or that, but it's the Admins' call, not ours. If you contribute to the overall cost of this website, then you can have some say. But outside of that, we're really at the mercy of their policies, and we just have to deal with it.

[edit on 6/22/07 by NovusOrdoMundi]

With respect but that is also bs... Last I checked I was a free man in a free world (or so I like to believe) and I can at any time question the way any kind of service provided to the public is being handled, wether it has costs or is free. If we can't question services provided then we are the mercy of it just like we would be if we couldn't question our own government and its leaders...

If you were hungry and I offered you a burger full of mold, would you question my intentions or would you eat without thought?

While I haven't been here for very long, it seems that this time of year this site gets swamped with fanciful tales, by school kids with too much time on their hands.

As stated, the staff here (as well as some of the seasoned members) have become very adept at spotting these hoaxters, sometimes from the very first post.

And to redseal

originally posted by redseal
I think I may have broke a few rules here and their, but im still alive and kickin!!

Everyone makes mistakes. The staff here knows this. It is the blatant violation of the simple rules set forth in the terms and conditions that get some of these members banned. The members that were banned can still contact the staff here, if they feel that they have been wrongfully banned. If they approach the staff in the proper manner AND provide proof that they have indeed been wrongfully banned, they MAY be allowed to return, but it ALSO depends on their conduct while communicating with the staff to resolve their issues.



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3 cents.


edit for emphasis "blatant violation"

[edit on 6/22/2007 by Mechanic 32]