If the truth was known, would anything be done.

Where do I sign up? I have to work for a while but will be on later tonight.

HI RavenWolf.

Yes, just like that. See, most people have never even Heard of operation Northwoods!

The point was, we do not need new discovries, the truth is there for all to seek and find. They just don't and I have no idea how to get a mass publication about Operation Northwoods out, and even if ya did, many would just sit comfortably back and say, that was then, this is now. As my many forum conversations on the topic have proven.

I think we need to create a network of like minded people, and educate ourselves as much as possible.

On the one hand it's a great idea. On the other hand it's almost like shooting fish in a barrel.

Originally posted by RavenWolf
The thing is, MOST people think that we are too paranoid, and that there is no conspiricy, simply because it is easier to think that. Most people do not believe in what they cannot see.

The question is... for those of us who know the truth, what are we going to do about it? There comes a time when we can no longer waste time on the ignorent people who think we're a bunch of nuts howling at the moon. There IS a way to start to make changes. It doesn't have to be all death and destruction with no water and no food and no interenet connections. (since we'll rather need that to unite as a group and work for change)
Simply telling people The Truth, as Fox Mulder wanted to do, will change nothing. We have to take an active hand, and not sit back, waiting for a happy ending.

When I became involved in a "conspiracy"........of sorts, I was shamed, called all kinds of names, people looked at me like I was crazy when I tried to tell my story, I have been called paranoid more times than I can remember, the lawyers who took my case either helped with the cover-up or dropped any action after they found out who the players were. I have been taken out of my comfort zone in a way I never dreamed possible, my career was ruined, my personal reputation was ruined, my hard work and college degree trashed, I am now filing bankruptcy after fighting this for three years. Keep in mind I had malicious people who had something to hide who brought this into real life for me. They played their lame games, they used deception, they all thought they were so clever. These people aren't smart........quite the contrary.
When I was set up three years ago, I set out on a quest for the truth, for justice.........not for financial gain like everyone thinks because that would be their motive.......not mine. I stood up to my government, my elected officials, the judicial system and was smacked down every time I challenged them but I kept on digging, collecting, researching, finding more and more evidence, busting out more and more people. It has been hard on me emotionally/physically...........I have been driven to menial, hard labor to try and survive. I have gone days without food, I would sleep so that I wouldn't have to think about it. I watched my dogs go hungry............this really bothered me but it also kept the fire in me to keep pushing for Justice. It has taken a big toll on my health I have had set back after setback, I have had NO help, I have been ridiculed and called every psychiatric term out there, people who are close to me have turned their backs on me. I have grown weary in my battle because I see nothing is going to be done and now I am losing the last thing I have........my home. The fight in my case may have been lost, the tyrants may have won for now..........but in the end they will fall. I truly believe this will all my heart and soul. One thing I will NEVER do is sell my soul for greed and corruption.........I won't. They can take all of my worldly possessions, but they will never take my heart and passion for what I know to be right/wrong, good vs evil. I have no regrets, I would do it again because it has always been a matter of principle for me.

People will have to be taken out of their comfort zones the way I was before they truly wake up to what is going out there, what is going on with their government, banks, the media, corporations. Even at that, most people won't have the will to fight.........they will go on to commit suicide, become criminals or succumb to drugs/alcohol.

I have never been a follower, I don't plan on becoming one at my age.

[edit on 22-5-2007 by Jillian_Bacardi]

The commitment you described is admirable. I believe every altruistic person has this kind of strength inside them. They will always triumph over those driven by greed given half a chance. What truth were you trying to uncover?

Originally posted by wingman77
A good organization to examine as a potential model for a workable structure is the "Sons of Liberty" circa 1770s. They are the group that had a big role in sparking the American Revolution. They had no real formal structure, anybody who sought to end British rule and was taking action was considered part of the group. These people met up at homes, taverns, and print shops; they called these meeting places liberty poles.

I think what we need, is what we are presently lacking, a government. We need a governing body in place that can plot the course, and when the time comes, step in and take the reins. Or does this exist presently? If not, the numbers of semi awake people can be tallied and from that poll, elect our leader in exile. Should Ron Paul be considered as a possible?

Yes, I know this presents a target for our opponents, But after everyone is enlightened in the truth they will need a structure to make it all happen. Without structure you will end up with chaos with everyone pulling their own way and as hard as they want.

Stage one: Enlighten
Stage two: Enlist
Stage three: Execute

My main problem with conspiracy theories about 9/11 and the war in Iraq and what not, is a good why. Why would the US govt. want to start a war in afghanistan or Iraq? I mean wouldnt you say that a man, Osama Bin Laden, and a group of radical islamists who feel offended that the Saudis chose the Americans over the Mouljahaldeen to fight back the Iraqis in Gulf War I would have a good motive. AS well as Khalid Shaikh Mohammed who became angry with America after being repeatedly picked on at College. (look what happened at VT, all because a kid grew angry at the students around him)

I mean some of the conspiracy ideas are based on things that happened over 30 years ago. Maybe its coincdence. I mean we're talking about a conspiracy spanning 30 yrs. And what... 5 different administrations. It seems more of trying to explain something because you dont like the history given to you.

I mean it just seems that some of these conspiracies become so intricate as to seem very very fake. Of course now im a brainwashed drone. Cant complain about the NWO then say everyone who dont agree with you is obviously govt controlled.


sorry kinda started to drift

All Seeing Eye, that's a great idea. It would be very difficult to accomplish but it is very possible. We don't even need to design a structure, it already exists, you simply follow the Constitution. A few changes could be implemented in the organizing structure to prevent the corruption that exists in the current government.

Originally posted by wingman77
All Seeing Eye, that's a great idea. It would be very difficult to accomplish but it is very possible. We don't even need to design a structure, it already exists, you simply follow the Constitution. A few changes could be implemented in the organizing structure to prevent the corruption that exists in the current government.

Do to my last post, I lost a yellow star oh well, the sacrifices we make.

Yes, based on our very own hemp paper constitution. Just as difficult as it was the first time we took this country, from the very same forces. The changes would be most fundamental. Anyone who servers can serve but one master, or they need not apply. The oath is to our country, and constitution, and no other! Good Ol Boy networks are done.

There is no place for profit in the fields of medical care or education, they should be free to all US citizens.

All "Judges", Federal, state and local, are to be elected not appointed. Polling will take place in public, and the tallies counted, in public, and monitored by CCTV with a public channel until a foolproof system can be put into place. All candidates will have a though background check done, and made public. Admiralty law is out, and Common Law in! No political organizations. Media will be nationalized until the crisis is over, then balanced between private and public interests.

The Federal Reserve and IRS and all other unconstitutional organizations within the Gov are out and to be replaced by a monetary system based on precious metals. Funding for the new gov will be provided by the assets of the federal reserve members and and other criminal enterprises.
Social Security will be liquidated and the proceeds returned to the American people.

Foreign policy will be discontinued! And replaced by a "Good Neighbor" policy that is based on mutual interests. No foreign aid! All military will be brought home and based for defense of our country. Humanitarian aid will be considered by poll.

Any company doing business outside of the country will be given a choice to cease and desist or be expelled. Our manufacture capabilities must be reconstituted and jobs made plentiful once again, and a 10 year moratorium be put in place for accepting any new "citizens" from other countries. And of course illegals will be shown the door!

Ill continue if anyone is interested in reading more.

I personally was attacked in a very open and direct attack that completely went against my constitutional rights, I sought help from our government through the only channels that I knew, being a naive, happy to be an american, patriot, only to be ignored. I wrote letters to my congressman in the area of the attack and I wrote the aclu and eventually found this place. The only response I got was here. Thanks for listening. I care, I would like to help, I wish you all the greatest of blessings. I forgive my oppressors and I thank the creator for this oppurtunity to exist. I have no regrets. At least I know this letter will be read.

The answer lies with the Gulf of Tonkin incident.

The truth came out, even major newspapers allowed it to reach the general public. Why, because the elitist bankers know that folks simply dont care anymore.

Goverment documents from classified NSA files showed that there never were any american bodies floating in the water like Johnson claimed when he demanded war. There werent any north vietnamese boats attacking our ships. It proved the entire stain of the vietnam war was started on a complete lie.

Where there any newscasts protesting outrage ? Did the Vietnam Vets take to the streets to exclaim their outrage ? Did anyone make a single complaint at all ?

Its over folks, the game is rigged and 99% dont care. And I am one of them. I gave up caring years ago. People are ignorant and deserve their fate, whether it be death or concentration camps. To hell with them. I'll ride out WW3 on my self-suficient ranch with well water, wind power, chickens, vegtable garden, and food stockpiles.

Well I’d have to agree with many folks here, that something needs to be done. Whether something will, well I’d be something wouldn‘t it, yeah someday. Most people don’t want to know the true regardless of how many ways you can convince them, they will still deny it. I truly want something to happen. A better and brighter future for everyone; but the truth is its not going to happen shy of a gigantic catastrophe where our so called leaders will be caught red handed. But truth be told they always ware gloves to cover there tracks. How do you persuade people with a truth or path. You’ll always have opposition no matter what the cause and we are anything but united. Who ever has controls of the fundamentals of life are nothing more then cow herders. I’d like to think that I’m not part of the herd but I am, we all are.
But what make us so different from the rest. Our are we simply not cows, but a different species all together.

O.k. Lets say everyone knew the truth and still did nothing about it. I tell you the suicide rate would sky rocket, people would simply lose interest in life its self. Not to many people are on a self proclaimed path of reason and understanding. They simply live to consume and reproduce and thus is the world we live in. I honestly think that many people do know or suspect the truth one way or another but still waddle around like penguins in a think forest of despair, never knowing or questioning the big picture. Yeah you’re a small ant amongst ants but you do matter, everyone does.

I’ve learned this, there are many reasons but only one truth, once you’ve learned this truth you better stand your ground firmly because there’s a wall of debris a billion people wide cascading right around you called the opposition, the oppressors, the controllers with their manipulative skims ready to take you down with all its might. Even though you stand alone know that there are
many others who share the same ideas with you, who are ready to reinforce the righteous cause.

Where are the heroes amongst us who fight for the greater good.

Originally posted by SmokeyTheBear
My main problem with conspiracy theories about 9/11 and the war in Iraq and what not, is a good why. Why would the US govt. want to start a war in afghanistan or Iraq? I mean wouldnt you say that a man, Osama Bin Laden, and a group of radical islamists who feel offended that the Saudis chose the Americans over the Mouljahaldeen to fight back the Iraqis in Gulf War I would have a good motive. AS well as Khalid Shaikh Mohammed who became angry with America after being repeatedly picked on at College. (look what happened at VT, all because a kid grew angry at the students around him)

I mean some of the conspiracy ideas are based on things that happened over 30 years ago. Maybe its coincdence. I mean we're talking about a conspiracy spanning 30 yrs. And what... 5 different administrations. It seems more of trying to explain something because you dont like the history given to you.

I mean it just seems that some of these conspiracies become so intricate as to seem very very fake. Of course now im a brainwashed drone. Cant complain about the NWO then say everyone who dont agree with you is obviously govt controlled.


sorry kinda started to drift

The why is very simple...MONEY.

The taliban may have been backward and evil but America didnt stop them from conquering Afghanistan. However given the excuse we gladly stepped in, why well simply because the taliban had stopped poppy fields from flourishing. The best heroin and opium in the world is grown in Afghanistan and has been for centuries. And as soon as the taliban were booted from power, the poppy fields once again were allowed to grow.

Iraq is another simple answer. The restrictions were set to be lifted soon. Iraq was complying with the Un requirements. There were contracts in place for Iraqi oil and those contracts werent going to Haliburton or Mobil. They were going to France and Russia.

What happened when war broke out in Iraq, the USA announced only american companies and the allies who supportd them (ie not france) would get new contracts. All previous contracts and agreements are null and void as that govt no longer exists.

If you do some research, you'll find that America has been nothing but a military arm for corporations for about a hundred years now.

In the 1930's Niguaraga nationalized their nations' lands because United Fruit owned most of it and was exploiting it while their people starved. What happened, the USA steps in for "american interests" and kicks out a DEMOCRATICALLY ellected leader and replaces him with a dictator that gives United Fruit its land control back.

In the 1950's Mexico nationalized its lands because the rockefellers were exploiting the loil reserves. What happens, the CIA funnels money and guns to social dissidents who overthrow the mexican elected leader in favor of one who gives back the oil land to rockefeller.

Its happening over and over all around the world. Corporations use America's military might whenever a country decides to fight back

It's clear that many people don't care, but they are the ones who are ignorant of history. The vast majority of people who are aware of what is going on are taking action in some form, many of them are desperately seeking organization.

Once someone knows the truth the apathy disappears. It happened to me.

Originally posted by pweagle
Well I’d have to agree with many folks here, that something needs to be done. Whether something will, well I’d be something wouldn‘t it, yeah someday. Most people don’t want to know the true regardless of how many ways you can convince them, they will still deny it. I truly want something to happen. A better and brighter future for everyone; but the truth is its not going to happen shy of a gigantic catastrophe where our so called leaders will be caught red handed. But truth be told they always ware gloves to cover there tracks. How do you persuade people with a truth or path. You’ll always have opposition no matter what the cause and we are anything but united. Who ever has controls of the fundamentals of life are nothing more then cow herders. I’d like to think that I’m not part of the herd but I am, we all are.
But what make us so different from the rest. Our are we simply not cows, but a different species all together.

O.k. Lets say everyone knew the truth and still did nothing about it. I tell you the suicide rate would sky rocket, people would simply lose interest in life its self. Not to many people are on a self proclaimed path of reason and understanding. They simply live to consume and reproduce and thus is the world we live in. I honestly think that many people do know or suspect the truth one way or another but still waddle around like penguins in a think forest of despair, never knowing or questioning the big picture. Yeah you’re a small ant amongst ants but you do matter, everyone does.

I’ve learned this, there are many reasons but only one truth, once you’ve learned this truth you better stand your ground firmly because there’s a wall of debris a billion people wide cascading right around you called the opposition, the oppressors, the controllers with their manipulative skims ready to take you down with all its might. Even though you stand alone know that there are
many others who share the same ideas with you, who are ready to reinforce the righteous cause.

Where are the heroes amongst us who fight for the greater good.

As disturbing as this is... You're right. As was shown in The Matrix, most people just aren't ready to "Wake Up" and take that red pill. We few who are AWAKE must still not give up. If we submit, and allow this to go on without saying anything or TRYING to make a difference, we are as bad as those who are oppressing/destroying us and denying the Truth.

Ok now I am not going to support what anyone has said here but I will rather post something to respond to the original post of this thread.

Now what the question was that needs to be answered is: “If the truth was known, would anything be done.” My answer – NO! Nothing will be done. And why I say this is very simple; when something happens we all jump up and down and our representatives demand answers. Once they have the answers they basically sit back and think “WHAT NOW” because we have never been in a position do really do anything nor did we ever have the power to do anything. I mean really, if we were given all the facts in black and white which could not be disputed SOMEONE would say, “well that is all lies and is a conspiracy” or “my uncle has a brother who works with this woman whose mother is friends with the head of the CIA who has clearance and he stole this hard drive which had info on and gave it to his aunt’s sister’s cat who pee’d on it and now the truth is gone.” We really are not a world full of people who actually care what is going on if it does not affect us directly. If it affects indirectly we will “live with it” till SOMEONE ELSE fixes it for us. I mean really, it’s as it was said, people are just too busy watching American Idol or seeing what the celebs are up to to even give a second glance after watching the 8 o’clock news. Hell, the world could explode around us and we would still wake up in the morning, get in our car and off to the office we go not really giving a damn that the dude in the car next to us lost a loved one in 9/11 – it just doesn’t matter. So, what would we do? Nothing. And if we tried we would get shot, or worse, interrogated in a hell hole and fed bread and water and / or disposed of and no one would be the wiser because our security forces are the puppets to this corrupt world and the people that run it ON THEIR TERMS and we would have just climbed in our car one day and were never seen or heard of again. AND if we did, somehow, reappear and were to relate our story to others we would be lying and talking the biggest load of BS and it would be “proven” that we had an accident and were in a coma for the last while and people like YOU and I will buy the governments BS because that’s what we are meant to do!!

[edit on 24/5/2007 by shearder]

^^^ Agreed. I am not from the USA. I am from Trinidad, but I believe the whole 9/11 conspiracy is too big to ignore. & it affects everyone throughout the world. In Trinidad, we've got our own problems to deal with. And if it comes to a war between the truth and the lies, no matter the subject...I'm 100% with the truth. Always have been.

But, I think some of you mentioned what will really happen, but still do not see it. Nothing will happen. We are few....the truth seekers & truth knowers. Few against many, but that's not the problem. It's the few who care, against many who don't & never will. What can happen there?

We won't change anything...because people prefer to live in their nice little world than leave it for a nanosecond. Life is too nice for some people to put down the niceness & fight for a truth that no one really cares about.

I'm sure if Neo knew exactly what the red pill entails...he'd pop that blue one. He was given a choice...but a vague choice. The truth. He did not know what the truth was...he just knew that he had an opportunity to get to the truth. If he knew what the truth was & how the truth lived...he would not have taken that pill. And most people won't. They may know the truth exists...but if they know it will affect their perfect little lies...they'd hate the truth in a heartbeat...& basically, do nothing about it.

We can bring the truth to the table...but we cannot control who eats it & how they eat it. We cannot control their minds. We cannot change the way they think. This is where ones natural self comes into play. There are people who naturally gravitate to the truth...no matter how tough it may seem. But most people are not like that. Some change...yes, but most do not.

This is what we're faced with. It's a mare question of what the masses prefer. Perfect lies or nasty truths. It's us against the world...and I can assure you, we won't stand a chance.

But this does not mean we give up...because, even if I knew nothing would change...I'd feel like an a$$hole doing nothing about it. I'd still try...for my own self worth.

"Things are only impossible until they're not."
-Captain Picard

Shearder,

While I agree with much if not ALL of what you said, I disagree with the attitude. Now, please, don't misunderstand me. I mean you no ill will. I think you're VERY right in your assessment of how apathetic most people are. All I have to say that is not in total agreement is.... Can we actually just give up then? I mean, "If this is the truth you've been looking for, what else is there to find?" (Scully quote) Are we all to just say *Bleep* it and sit on our buts watching tv and eating cookies from now on, because nothing we do matters?

Originally posted by shearder
Ok now I am not going to support what anyone has said here but I will rather post something to respond to the original post of this thread.

Now what the question was that needs to be answered is: “If the truth was known, would anything be done.” My answer – NO! Nothing will be done. And why I say this is very simple; when something happens we all jump up and down and our representatives demand answers. Once they have the answers they basically sit back and think “WHAT NOW” because we have never been in a position do really do anything nor did we ever have the power to do anything. I mean really, if we were given all the facts in black and white which could not be disputed SOMEONE would say, “well that is all lies and is a conspiracy” or “my uncle has a brother who works with this woman whose mother is friends with the head of the CIA who has clearance and he stole this hard drive which had info on and gave it to his aunt’s sister’s cat who pee’d on it and now the truth is gone.” We really are not a world full of people who actually care what is going on if it does not affect us directly. If it affects indirectly we will “live with it” till SOMEONE ELSE fixes it for us. I mean really, it’s as it was said, people are just too busy watching American Idol or seeing what the celebs are up to to even give a second glance after watching the 8 o’clock news. Hell, the world could explode around us and we would still wake up in the morning, get in our car and off to the office we go not really giving a damn that the dude in the car next to us lost a loved one in 9/11 – it just doesn’t matter. So, what would we do? Nothing. And if we tried we would get shot, or worse, interrogated in a hell hole and fed bread and water and / or disposed of and no one would be the wiser because our security forces are the puppets to this corrupt world and the people that run it ON THEIR TERMS and we would have just climbed in our car one day and were never seen or heard of again. AND if we did, somehow, reappear and were to relate our story to others we would be lying and talking the biggest load of BS and it would be “proven” that we had an accident and were in a coma for the last while and people like YOU and I will buy the governments BS because that’s what we are meant to do!!

[edit on 24/5/2007 by shearder]

Change is possible, we just have to continue to pursue a line of thinking, using others to sharpen our view and ride it out till truly inspired solutions present themselves giving us the necessary ammunition in our daily conversations with the people around us and create change by changing a persons veiwpoint.

I was never trying to suggest that we all give up and stop fighting the good fight, never. Even if I knew a movememnt was destined to fail I would still back it out of sheer loyalty, sort of a moral imparative.
I just wanted everybody to take a very sobering look at what "may" be the aweful truth. I don't want to kill anyones ambition here, just sort of playing the devils advocate. Thank you all for your replys.