G Forces and the Raptor??

Good day Y'all,

The F 22 can pull some ridiculous maneuvers, no question about that! Now, here's my idea........with the advent of newer pressurized suits for the pilots, can they sustain more G's than thought of before?? 9 or so G's seems to be the universal limit to be sustained for any length of time and although this may vary a little here or there, that's pretty much it.

Certain events can make it possible to handle super G's for very brief periods of time, but often results in tearing retinas and so on, but does the Raptor with it's abilities make it harder on its pilots than other front line aircraft....and if so, can they take it??

Also, studies have shown that women can handle G's more than men on occasion but the difference has been proven to be situational and personal in each and every pilot so that need not be taken into account here.

Anyway, love to hear your thoughts.....I have had the luxury (if you call it that) of being subject to about 7 G's in my flight career but these new 5th generation fighters are a totally different ballgame!!

Peace and looking forward to your thoughts..........Mondo

[edit on 29-4-2007 by Mondogiwa]

They've developed a new G suit for the Raptor pilots that lets them handle a higher G load. I remember reading about it, but I don't remember where, or what the limits for it are. I'll see what I can dig up on it before I head to Atlanta tomorrow.

Even with the new suits, there will always be certain limits IMHO. Most airframes are capable of much more than 9g's but the pilot is the limiting factor.

The only way I see other than hard limits is to have some sort of computer intervention to fly the plane in the even of GLOC like hitting the deck or heading away from the combat zone at high speed till the pilot recovers. You could tie it in to the countermeasurs suite and even make some manuvers in the event of missile lock on during this.

a couple of years ago i read something about a swiss suit that enabled pilots to go to G12 or something.

There is a physical limit to what a human body can take, but I don't think we've reached that point quite yet. As far as new G-suit designs, the lastest types (from what I here) are a so-called full body G and pressure suit. They have one prototype that I saw years ago that uses a liquid filled suit instead of air bladders like the traditional ones.

Water-Filled G-Suit

While the link doesn't have a lot of detail, it does provide some basic background on the subject of water G-suits.

Tim

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
...with the advent of newer pressurized suits for the pilots, can they sustain more G's than thought of before??

To answer your question, not necessarily, maybe slightly more but the difference is insignificant.

Raptor pilots use a modified version of the standard USAF flight set up, a Combat Edge vest with an ATAGS (Advanced Technology Anti-G Suit) and a modified helmet. Currently this combination of Combat Edge plus ATAGS is only used by F-22 pilots in the USAF. From what I've read the Raptor and the new pressurized suit were designed to allow pilots not to necessity pull more Gs but to sustain high G loads for longer periods of time. Here is what one F-22 pilot had to say about it...

"I think we're pretty happy with our current setup at this point, combat edge, slightly re-designed helmet and the ATAGS g suit. It's definitely not quite as hard to 'sustain' g in the Raptor as it was in the Eagle (from a physiological aspect)." (Lt. Col. "Dozer")

ATAGS
Next Merrell dons the CSU-23/P Advanced Technology Anti-G Suit, or ATAGS. Like the Combat Edge vest, ATAGS (currently only worn by F/A-22 pilots) provides increased protection from the effects of prolonged high-g environments. As a stand-alone garment, ATAGS provides a sixty percent increase in aircrew endurance. Combined with Combat Edge, it increases aircrew endurance by 350 percent over the current g-suit

F-22 G Suit

Future F-35 pilots will use a modified version of the Raptor flight suit, here is some info about it's development.

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
...but does the Raptor with it's abilities make it harder on its pilots than other front line aircraft....and if so, can they take it??

Not really, the F-22 from the design stand point makes it easier for pilots to sustain Gs. Even though it is a very high performance aircraft so are the pilots who fly it. Currently only former F-16 and F-15 drivers are allowed to fly the F-22. The reason for this is that the air force wants to make sure that a pilot getting into a single seat F-22 will not black out and lose one of only a few very expensive jets. So all pilots currently flying the F-22 have real experience with high performance jets and have proven that they can tolerate Gs. Combine this with the new G suit set up and they (the pilots) should be just fine.

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
Also, studies have shown that women can handle G's more than men on occasion...

As far as I’m am aware only one woman has ever flown or been qualified on the F-22, Lt. Col. Dawn M. Dunlop. She was one of only a few pilots originally selected for the F-22 back during IOT&E.

As for the Libelle liquid G suit, well, from what I've heard it is designed to allow pilots to again sustain high G loads for long periods of time, not to necessarily pull more Gs. And it is supposed to be a very good suit but it has one draw back, the way it works. The USAF has tested it around but given that it requires pilots to act in a different manner than before (ie. grunting, straining etc...) it was hard for already trained pilots to transition into to. Considering that all Raptor pilots are already trained it would be too dangerous and not worth the risk to transition into to. Currently only the Luftwaffe uses the Libelle suit for it's Typhoon pilots, the UK uses the Raptor set up for it's Typhoon pilots.

Here is what the same F-22 driver quoted above had to say about the liquid G suit...

"I know a number of guys that tested the new liquid g suit, there were a few neutral comments on it and a lot of very negative comments. Its 180 degrees different from how we currently train ourselves to deal with g forces. I've heard guys say it might work on a new pilot who's never been trained in the "old" way, but lots of guys grayed or blacked out with it, I get the feeling it would be extremely dangerous for us to transition into it." (Lt. Col. "Dozer")