Some aliens might be Evil! They have harmed us in the past.

Originally posted by The Coward
What is it with you guys? What is this last comment supposed to mean? You have no clue why I chose the user name The Coward! That is another story! Nor you or anyone can say why I decided to pick something.

Hmmm, bit testy are we? Well, you are called the coward, you're mood was "freaked out" and you post a thread that aliens might be hurting us and that some stories are scary. If you think there is zero psychology behind all that then I can't help you understand. Why you chose the name has nothing to do with the comment I made. You react emotionally to a small part of the post and do not address the question I asked you... but then you came back...

Originally posted by The Coward
Prote wrote
* Paraphrase* That it does not matter whether the aliens are good or bad. All that maters is that he has to live.

You can't say "Prote wrote" and then paraphrase with your own misunderstandings, it's not a true reflection of what I said, it's your interpretation of something else I said.

Originally posted by The Coward
So my answer is... you should care. It's like a guy pointing a gun at your head, and one saying... I don't care if that gun goes off, I have to live life anyway...WTF?

It is nothing like that. A completely useless analogy. You are comparing evil aliens to a human holding a gun, two completely different situations. Does a human with a gun have the ability to paralyze you? To zip in and out of dimensions? To wipe your memory? Have advanced technology? have telepathic abilities? You are so far off, how can you have a reasonable discussion when you are not able to process any of this information objectively.

Originally posted by The Coward
First off, if there are aliens, which their is a super high chance that there are, I would like to know.

So knowing they are evil does what? Other than confirm your fears, what then? How does this knowledge help you?

Originally posted by The Coward
And secondly, I would like to know of their intentions. Knowing so could save my family or any other person on this planet from an evil ET being.

So your second point is the same as the first! Please explain how you would save your family or any other person with your knowledge that ET was evil?

Originally posted by The Coward
And that makes more sense than just "LIVING" life. Geese, humans are so self-centered sometimes.

Sure it does. I won't bite on the self centredness comment as you generalized it. I will refrain from offering my opinion of humans but these "discussions" simply reinforce that opinion that we, as a species, have no clue and aren't close to getting one.

So, Mr Coward, remain frightened of these aliens if you like. Allow fear to control you when the rest of the world don't even think they exist and the small portion that do, either think they aren't evil or are also asking for proof.

[edit on 25/3/07 by Prote]

"Civilisations gone the wrong way, wouldn't exist. Just like us, we on the verge of self-destructing, so it's a self eliminating process..."
I can see your point tock. Kinda K-Pax.

Personally, I'm wondering if the human life span isn't based on limited years to gain limited knowledge? That--that was the intention of EBE/Godly human design.

Dallas

Reports of missing persons have increased sixfold in the past 25 years, from roughly 150,000 in 1980 to about 900,000 this year.

www.crimelibrary.com...

Originally posted by tock
Civilisations gone the wrong way, wouldn't exist. Just like us, we on the verge of self-destructing, so it's a self eliminating process.
So, any civilisations out there, have gone through what we are experiencing, and survived it. So, I believe that the various races out there are benevolent to most extent....

I agree but for other reasons too. Do you realise how difficult it would be foran aggressive species to emerge into a galactic society? They would be nothing but a small part of something much greater. Any attempts they make at hostile takeovers would be quickly curtailed by any number of other races, each of which would have similar or greater technological capabilities.

Imagine if America was on its own in the world, and every other country had become peaceful. Then America suddenly decides they want to enslave everyone else. As soon as it was realised, every other country in the world would threaten, barricade and become passive aggressive to America, to the point where the country couldn't do anything without risking an even greater reaction.

As humanity is in its infancy of being a space fairing race, we are also on the brink of destruction at our own hands. We know the secret of the atom, and we are discovering the vastness of quantum mechanics. How many other races in the universe have gone our route? I would feel that the majority would have to as it is part of Darwin’s selective process of evolution - but on a universal/galactic scale. Some of those races could have also destroyed themselves in the process.

You also have to figure into mix of evolution about the ‘cultural’ background of ‘said’ alien race. Did this alien race divide itself into territories and split its people politically and culturally like humanity did? Or were they ‘one’ from the beginning of there primal infancy?
Saying a culture would 'breed' out its ignorance, or even be benevolent because its scientific status is just so contradictory to scientific evolutionary theory.
Those cultural questions could be a major factor in being Good or Bad aliens. IF these creatures never had to fight amongst themselves – then they wouldn’t know the meaning of killing each other. This factor of not fighting amongst themselves could factor in numerous scenarios based on good/bad. If they have not fought amongst themselves would they have some ‘pent up’ hostility towards other races from a primal age? Would they not know how to fight (unlikely – they would have never survived evolution)?

Those that make it without destroying themselves can now take several paths:
Benevolent Enlightenment,
Malevolent Influence,
Scientific Discovery (Benevolent or Malevolent – either or),
Malevolent colonization
Benevolent colonization

Yes, there can be several more scenarios for these races who make it out of their being destroyed by themselves, but lets use the above as reference for now.

Aliens acting in the mode of Benevolent Enlightenment would be operating to assist another culture in development (spiritually?). These creatures would be seen as angelic or even godly – but in a good way.

Aliens acting in the mode of Malevolent Influence would be operating to assist another culture with its own destruction, and corrupt development of a society. These creatures would be seen as evil, or ‘satanic’ in nature.

Aliens acting in the mode of Scientific Discovery (Benevolent) would be operating to catalog planetary activities without directly influencing the inhabitance or societies. The would try to stay out of the way of their development – and only be there to observe the societies growth/development without interaction. Influencing the lower tech species being observed could accidentally create their unintentional destruction.

Aliens acting in the mode of Scientific Discovery (Malevolent) would be operating to conduct scientific experiments within a planetary ecosystem that would be harmful to the life forms of that planet. No consideration for cultural development or religious ideologies would be taken into account. The various species being experimented on would only be seen as ‘animals’ and lower life forms – such as humans see insects or even cattle.

Malevolent Colonization – Aliens forcefully taking control of a planetary body and destroying opposition either by changing the environment of that planet of by using advanced weaponry.

Benevolent Colonization – Aliens inhabiting a planetary body with only peaceful intentions. These aliens set up diplomatic dialogs with predominant planetary species and try not to influence them technologically, religiously, or culturally.

How will humanity evolve once we take to the stars? The path we are on right now would be a Malevolent one... (we would dissect, mutilate, colonize and even war with lesser species at this point) So, to say that no Malevolent aliens exist - is to say we don't exist. I am sure there has to be many other races that have taken the same path as we have - and are space-fairing. Its only evolutionarily science to assume as much. We must also remember - culture and religion play a big part in how species react to other species.

Then you have the psychological factors and attributes of each of the species at play...

[edit on 3/25/2007 by kroms33]

TheCoward,

Could you please explain to me why you are believing this?? That may help in providing some background so that some of us may be able to understand where your beliefs of this hostile action is coming from?

Thanks, Peace..Mondo

[edit on 25-3-2007 by Mondogiwa]

Tell me - who on this thread has a doctorate in Psychology? I sure don't but I have taken Psych in college... and I can tell you - this person (the Coward) does not display any characteristics of how some are portraying him.

kroms33

General understanding between Mondo and I EDIT

[edit on 3/25/2007 by kroms33]

Originally posted by kroms33


I am sorry, but you are really insulting this person.

You make great sense and after reading my post I both apologize and edit the post..changing it to be more appropriate!
Thanks, Mondo



[edit on 25-3-2007 by Mondogiwa]

To all of you who actually believe that I am so "SCARED" and that “THE COWARD” reflects me as a person, you guys are totally mislead.

Most of you should take psych or something. The reason I picked the User name "The Coward" is cause of a Movie I really liked when I was a kid. "Chen Chi The Coward" is a character from a Kung Fu movie I watched as a child. It is a funny Kung Fu movie about a band of guys, including a grave digger who is LABELED a Coward. He rises up and becomes a champion. Here read about the movie here.

This motley band of "heroes" includes a coffin maker who's labeled a coward and bad luck,

Now that you understand why I picked the name, don't bother me with nonsense comments about me being "SCARED". Oh... and I am not gonna change it, so don't even think about it.

And as for my MOOD: Freaked Out. I put that because it fits the name. You have no idea where I have been or what kind of courage I posses. With that said, quit the silliness. I don't need a shrink; I am not getting a mental break down, and am certainly not "SCARED" of anything like that.


I have had this username for a while now. I did not just put it up for this thread. So I suggest that you guys keep with the topic on hand and quit being foolish. It will not make you sound any smarter.


[edit on 25-3-2007 by The Coward]

Coward,

Thanks, it just seemed coincidental is all, but you are right...people such as myself should have asked you about the username and not assumed! I still think the thread topic is not probable but there's no reason to attack you or your name..for that you are totally right!

Peace to you sir, Mondo

Originally posted by ArMaP
If there are aliens here on Earth or near it (and that is yet to be proved), what is the problem with them being hostile?

If you did not noticed, you were born in a world full of hostility.

Lets see some statistics.

People killed in wars started in the 20th century with over at least 1,000,000 deaths
World War 1 (1914-1918) - 15,000,000
Russian Civil War (1917–1921) - 5,000,000
Chinese Civil War (1928–1949) - 3,500,000
Second Sino-Japanese War (1931–1945) - 25,000,000
World War 2 (1939-1945) - 62,000,000
Korean War (1950–1953) - 3,000,000
Vietnam War (1945–1975) - 3,000,000
Biafran War (1967–1970) - 1,000,000
Khmer Rouge (1975–1979) - 2,000,000
Mozambique Civil War (1976–1993) - 1,000,000
Afghanistan (1979–2001) - 1,500,000
Iran-Iraq War (1980–1988) - 1,000,000
Sudanese Civil War (1983–2002) - 1,000,000
Second Congo War (1998–2004) - 3,800,000

Total deaths - 127,800,000

Confirmed number of people killed by extraterrestrial beings in the since the beginning of time
0

So, statistically, I don't think it's a problem.

While we don't *know* that aliens are among us (doesn't that sound like a 1950's movie title? ), in order to discuss their hostility, we pretty much have to assume that there are. Having made that assumption, there's still a problem with your analysis. We don't know what the alien agenda is, or what their time table is for carrying it out. They may be *very* hostile, and simply not be ready (for whatever reason) to begin Operation Serve Mankind. Your list of war casualties vs alien casualties doesn't mean much, for exactly that reason. After all, had you compiled that list in 1933, in response to a (hypothetical) internet thread "Is the National Socialist Workers' Party dangerous or hostile?", you could've closed your post with "Total confirmed human-caused deaths: 20,000,000. Total confirmed deaths caused by the Nazi party: 0. So statistically, I don't think it's much of an issue"

And, just to get my own position on this question on record, I'm not convinced that there are aliens among us, but if there are, I don't see any reason to assume that they would all be happy New-Age fluffy-bunny creatures with large heads, large eyes, and large hearts bursting with compasion for the poor, backward Earthlings. If evidence supporting alien life is a bit slim / questionable, then evidence that technological advancement creates pacifism is down-right nonexistent.

Originally posted by kroms33
Why couldn't some EBEs be hostile? Take our history into account as a factual basis for this, and other races....

If you believe in evolution you believe we are animals and we evolved to be what we are today (Homo sapiens sapiens). From the ashes of the cave fire long ago to the cinders of burnt cities of the modern world, here we remain - technology and all. To say some species way out there in the cosmos could only evolve in to peaceful creatures is just scientifically implausible.

Humanity has evolved according to Darwin's theory of evolution because of "Survival of the Fittest." Why wouldn't that apply on other worlds?

Now if I were to agree, it would have to be with this theory.

This to me makes lots of sense! Why do people believe that we are the only hostile animals around? I mean, sometimes smarter does not mean better. Meaning, some smart people are meaner that some "dumb" people.
Not to mean that dumb people are mean at all. Actually I believe that there is no such thing as “dumb”. All humans have the capability of achieving great things. Even those who are labeled as mentally ill.

It makes sense to take our evolution as an example of others in the universe. To be were they are today; they must have had to take advantage of certain situations. This includes killing. The thing is, have they stopped? What if they are a locust like species that in reality want something more from this planet? If it's true that we are being visited, why secrectly enter our planet for 60 years or more. What could they be planning?

I am not saying that ALL aliens are EVIL, I wonder if any are? And if they are, it would be good to know in order to prepare for anything.


Thanks, Kroms33. This is what I am talking about, a good intellectual conversation on different views of the topic. No harassing, no name calling, and certainly an honest answer!


P.S. I enjoyed the read



[edit on 25-3-2007 by The Coward]

Originally posted by Brother Stormhammer
If evidence supporting alien life is a bit slim / questionable, then evidence that technological advancement creates pacifism is down-right nonexistent.

Right, and as I have stated with my posts - it all depends on the evolutionary, psychological, and cultural backgrounds of 'supposed' race. If an alien race had to go through nearly the same evolutionary process that humans had to (Survival of the Fittest - top of food chain), they could range from being either hostile to pacifistic (and whatever is in between) - it all comes down to their psychology and culture. Making claims that aliens are all benevolent and pacifists goes against the nature of the universe as a whole: Chaos/Order representation.

There can be no order without chaos, and there can be no chaos without order.
Yin-yang, good/evil, positive/negative - can't have one without the other.

Originally posted by JackofBlades

Originally posted by tock
Civilisations gone the wrong way, wouldn't exist. Just like us, we on the verge of self-destructing, so it's a self eliminating process.
So, any civilisations out there, have gone through what we are experiencing, and survived it. So, I believe that the various races out there are benevolent to most extent....

I agree but for other reasons too. Do you realise how difficult it would be foran aggressive species to emerge into a galactic society? They would be nothing but a small part of something much greater. Any attempts they make at hostile takeovers would be quickly curtailed by any number of other races, each of which would have similar or greater technological capabilities.

Imagine if America was on its own in the world, and every other country had become peaceful. Then America suddenly decides they want to enslave everyone else. As soon as it was realised, every other country in the world would threaten, barricade and become passive aggressive to America, to the point where the country couldn't do anything without risking an even greater reaction.

Umm, Yeah, that makes a whole lot of sense.

Unfortunately, the MIC is world wide, and has no frontier .

But human are still under quaranteen.

Originally posted by Brother Stormhammer
If evidence supporting alien life is a bit slim / questionable, then evidence that technological advancement creates pacifism is down-right nonexistent.

True - but don't you think if there were a hostile race visiting us would they be secretly abducting people for 40 years and not have already instigated some sort of takeover? Especially at the rate which we are destroying a planet that may potentially be a new home for this supposed conquering alien race? These guys are far, far more advanced than we can imagine and a takeover would be instant if they wanted it. As i have stated on this thread even though at this point it's merely my opinion, there are no such thing as hostile aliens... it's impossible. There is a galactic police race which some may refer to as angels but really they are just highly advanced race of astral beings who limit and regulate interaction between intergalactic travelers and civilizations who are less advanced. Evil does not exist at the highest levels because of the law of karma... it's pure mathematics.

Its easy and probably even human nature to fear that which we know little or nothing about....... (especially when it is also rumored to be mega powerful.)

But it is my assertion that prohibition with respect to knowlege relating to ET envolvement is terestrial affairs is basically the main culprit here.

Because if all the available evidence could be available for thourogh and unbiassed evaluation free from disinformation.....
I'm quite sure that a few things would become quickly apparent:

1)dozens if not hundreds of E.T. races exist and know of our presence and some have even had dealing with us in the past on a planetary level and that this is happening today and has been ongoing for probably the history of the planet.

2) that the current civilization (ours) is not the first here on earth and that there was several others before the current one and that some of these other civilizations were more advanced technologically in many ways than we currently are and may have even been interplanetary in nature......

3) and that most likely we distroyed ourselves with bull# squabbles.

So the picture i am painting is that of a startrek type world where we were once a partisipant in trans world interactions with many ET races ETc....
And perhaps there were even members of many off world races visiting here for various reasons (akin to tourism today)....

But our world is like now like a once great nation that nuked them selves and are now a bananna republic which other nations watch with interest.
As we scratch around like ants in the ruins of what were once great empires.
But were on the rise once again.... hopefully history wont repeat itself.....

They are not the biggest threat to us.....we are.....

I just opened a thread on science "Island of Dr. Moreau" !? Scientists create a sheep that's 15% human . My position is that it : *' violates integrity of species and* denigrates human dignity'!

First replay was "Am I against 'progress?'

So my point would be ( and a question): if aliens can come here - they areno doubt very, very advanced in knowledge. What if they have a same notion on 'progress'? What if we humans are for them - as these poor sheeps are for us -'research' material, something not worth of including in ethics of highly 'progressed' species, as we do to animals?

Would you call them evil or advanced?

I am not so fast on statement : oh, sure they must be benevolent!

Originally posted by blue bird

So my point would be ( and a question): if aliens can come here - they areno doubt very, very advanced in knowledge. What if they have a same notion on 'progress'? What if we humans are for them - as these poor sheeps are for us -'research' material, something not worth of including in ethics of highly 'progressed' species, as we do to animals?

Would you call them evil or advanced?

I am not so fast on statement : oh, sure they must be benevolent!

This falls under my Scientific Discovery (Benevolent or Malevolent – either or) category.

This all depends on how we will view the aliens, and how they view us psychologically. There are many factors involved within determining if a race is intentional in harming humanity (mentally or physically). They could be thinking that they are helping us along, and be proud of our progress as they replant genes and probe our bodies, steal our babies from the womb, or even manipulate our thoughts... while WE on the the other hand find it to be a horrible experience - and something from a nightmare come true.

Since we do not know the psychology of an alien being (malevolent or benevolent) then the only way to determine what intentions they bring is to use our culture and psychology to describe what is evil and good to the majority of our race.

The Psychology at play...
To a human, a superior species is a threat. In our ecosystem we reside at the very top of the food chain because of technology and ingenuity. If something extra terrestrial lands and makes itself known, humanity now knows in its primal heart that it is no longer the king of earths food chain because some aliens just traveled across countless light years with a higher technological status then humanity.

While humans do not like being kidnapped or probed - we follow the exact guidelines perhaps some alien species follows - scientific 'progress'. We abduct various species of animals and tag them, and even in some cases clone them - or even better mess with their genetic makeup. Why? For the betterment of humanity. Right.
This is why I supposed in another post in this thread that if we were able to transverse the Galaxy - we would be malevolent.
That technological breakthrough is right around the corner... give it 100 years - do you think man will change that much in that amount of time?
I sure don't.

I would think that the aliens doing this genetic manipulation can be viewed as a threat to humanity - because they keep their secrets hidden. Are they abducting people to better themselves or to help us out?
There are many more questions that are raised then any singular answer to your question. I would say, they are just as malevolent as humanity is.

Originally posted by kronos11

True - but don't you think if there were a hostile race visiting us would they be secretly abducting people for 40 years and not have already instigated some sort of takeover?
Evil does not exist at the highest levels because of the law of karma... it's pure mathematics.

Hmmm, what people keep forgetting about is a higher evil that does exist. There can be no good without evil - for it would nullify itself out. How can you have good without something to compare it to?

What IF (and this is an IF just for arguments sake) Satan/Lucifer WAS a malevolent ET species that has visited earth - not bent on control or colonization but bent on some kind of emotional energy (like hate) it feeds off of?

Millions (perhaps billions) believe there is some kind of entity behind what is defined as 'the devil'.

SO if you believe there is a devil - then you believe in a non-terrestrial malevolent force that is an alien.

Originally posted by kroms33
Hmmm, what people keep forgetting about is a higher evil that does exist. There can be no good without evil - for it would nullify itself out. How can you have good without something to compare it to?

What IF (and this is an IF just for arguments sake) Satan/Lucifer WAS a malevolent ET species that has visited earth - not bent on control or colonization but bent on some kind of emotional energy (like hate) it feeds off of?

SO if you believe there is a devil - then you believe in a non-terrestrial malevolent force that is an alien.

Actually the concept of Satan/Lucifer was invented by modern Christianity to control a population as well as keep them away from the "magic"... if you look back into the older root religions(zoroastrianism, hinduism, buddhism, judaism) as well as ALL native religions this is not so. For ALL of them good and evil are one in the same and they refer to it all as an emanation of GOD; they see the presence of sin to be a result of free-will and a crucial element of the "human condition". These are the established laws for a "base" race still trying to come to grips with self-awareness - sin is a means by which they learn how to evolve with free will. As I mentioned before, the only way an ET could be hostile is if they were native to this planet or one of the planet's in our system. If this is the case then they would still be operating under our law of karma and are therefore still evolving with us, i.e. Satan or the Devil would have to be native to our experience - wether or not they are astral or physical or both.

One of the most basic laws in these higher levels is that evildoers do not evolve - they may appear to prosper or get more money and power on this planet but to an alien race who can travel light years in seconds this means absolutely nothing. What does money and power serve when the palaces are being built on a rotting ship about to sink? The barometer of evolution in a species is quite evident by the societies they create and the health and intelligience of its people. Success in these areas can only be accomplished by our leaders and at this moment insanity and hi-tech barbarism is the accepted norm by which they operate.

IMO we will never, ever be crossing the bounds of space without first cleaning up the house thoroughly. A feat this great would usher in some sort of massive spiritual revolution - this would likely be the only event that would allow us permission to play with the "magic".


[edit on 25-3-2007 by kronos11]