Vietnam or Baghdad? Bush is out of touch.

U.S. forces are battling insurgents in southern Baghdad, shaking the Iraqi capital into the early hours with some of the heaviest explosions and gunfire in weeks.

Witnesses reported hearing the blasts kilometres away and some residents said U.S bombers were in action. The U.S. military would only confirm its troops were involved in Operation Iron Justice(was hammer), part of the new tactics adopted to counter a relentless insurgency.

More than 200 U.S. soldiers have been killed since Washington declared major combat over on May 1 in attacks officials have blamed on loyalists of ousted President Saddam Hussein and foreign fighters.

rest is here
news.ft.com.../StoryFT/FullStory&c=StoryFT&cid=1071251765347&p=1012571727162

No matter what American Media lies they try to sell you. The truth is Saddams capture has changed nothing. There are no flowers for our troops like Rummy said there would be.
So if it makes you feel better to lie to yourself and believe the Iraqi people want us there look again. We are the invaders not the liberators we are occupiers plain and simple no different then Hitler�s soldiers spread across Europe. For all who support this war I hope your proud to see what Bush has done to our country in your name. I hope your proud we have spent over 100 billion on Iraq while our public schools are left to rot.


[Edited on 24-12-2003 by DiRtYDeViL]

Wake up, if the majority of the Iraqis were as you make them appear to be, we would not be able to maintain any presence there.
What, did you think that the capture of Hussein would cause a cessation of all hostilities against the attempts to rebuild the country and give it to the people of Iraq? Did you think bthat the numerous insurgents from other nations, working out there anti-democratic agendas would give up the fight? Nowhere has any media or public official said this, only that it would be a way of getting rid of the myth of Hussein, that he would some day come back and rain terror upon those who spoke out against him.
Nobody with any sense or comprehension would think this would be an easy mission, only that it is a necessary mission and one that has to be seen to the end.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Wake up,

My government lied to me about the reasons for this war you wake up.

if the majority of the Iraqis were as you make them appear to be, we would not be able to maintain any presence there.

Mass slaughters work well bombing civilian areas into submission does also. FEAR works here it works there!

What, did you think that the capture of Hussein would cause a cessation of all hostilities against the attempts to rebuild the country and give it to the people of Iraq?

Nope. But the media tried to sell it and isn't reporting about Iraq insurgents as much as they where.

Did you think bthat the numerous insurgents from other nations, working out there anti-democratic agendas would give up the fight? Nowhere has any media or public official said this, only that it would be a way of getting rid of the myth of Hussein, that he would some day come back and rain terror upon those who spoke out against him.
Nobody with any sense or comprehension would think this would be an easy mission, only that it is a necessary mission and one that has to be seen to the end.

It wasn't a necessary war period. The reason for this war where fabricated. It is now going to turn into a hot bed of American hatred no matter what happens. Generations of terrorist for our military defense contractors to make billions from all because people like you supported the big lie. You support the big lie and received nothing in return who needs to wake up!!

Are you Michael Moore?

There aren't mass bombings of populated areas, much less mass slaughters,

I've seen nowhere that the media has attempted to lead us as you assert, except a few pundits (not journalists) that said it could have a possitive affect,

and, no, the Iraqi portion of the War on Terror was not necessary. Unless you are actually trying to stop terror.

Your twists of fact and wild usage of inaccurate wording (such as slaughter) makes your writing appear as biased and unfactual as Moore's propaganda.

I am awake, sir, and I see from the past that this is not a war that we initiated, but one that we are finally fighting. I am receiving nothing? What do you expect me to receive from a situation where my government is doing as they are required; defending my homeland from foreign attack? Would you think it less conspiratorial if foreign nations were being hired to do what our domestic corporations are doing? You are seeing reality and trying fervently to attach a conspiratorial reason for it, but without any shred of evidence. Your writings and assertions are better left for the NWO forum, wouldn't it seem?

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Are you Michael Moore?

GOOD ONE!! Finally good humor that's not nasty!
I wish I had his money he is a Karl Rove plant. He pulls people away from the Democratic party and has them vote for greens or some other independent candidate. That�s why I found it strange he endorsed Clark then I saw Clinton endorse Clark and figured Clark must be the new anointed one to take over for the blood cult. Reason I say Moore is really a double agent rove plant. Bushs brother helped finance Roger and Me. Why would the Bush�s help out a know communist except to benefit themselves.

There aren't mass bombings of populated areas, much less mass slaughters,

Ok slaughter was a harsh word but they are bombing in civilian areas to get the bad Arabs. Innocent people die when that happens but I guess that�s just collateral damage isn�t it.

I've seen nowhere that the media has attempted to lead us as you assert, except a few pundits (not journalists) that said it could have a possitive affect,

They stopped reporting about hotel bombs and insurgent attacks after Saddam was captures that is why I brought it up.

and, no, the Iraqi portion of the War on Terror was not necessary. Unless you are actually trying to stop terror.

There is no evidence of Iraq being involved in terror. But since we invaded their country and #ed it all up that might change.

Your twists of fact and wild usage of inaccurate wording (such as slaughter) makes your writing appear as biased and unfactual as Moore's propaganda.

Well dah I am biased but I�m not a reporter you can tell by my sig I hate Bush. You think I should turn into another Michael Moore you keep bringing it up maybe I should go for it.

I am awake, sir, and I see from the past that this is not a war that we initiated, but one that we are finally fighting. I am receiving nothing? What do you expect me to receive from a situation where my government is doing as they are required; defending my homeland from foreign attack?

What was Iraq going to attack us with a big bad sling shot? They had no weapons of mass destructions or the missile technology required to send them within our borders. There a land locked country except for a little part of it. Anyone every heard about Iraq�s navy? I haven�t and all I do is read. This is why I really wish you would wake up from your delusional sleep you think some sanctioned to death country in the middle east was going to kill us. But please don�t get me wrong it�s our medias fault not yours for the sleep anyway.

Would you think it less conspiratorial if foreign nations were being hired to do what our domestic corporations are doing? You are seeing reality and trying fervently to attach a conspiratorial reason for it, but without any shred of evidence. Your writings and assertions are better left for the NWO forum, wouldn't it seem?

What? I don�t even understand this. The word slaughter? I admit is a bit harsh but not totally off base as I said. Everything I have said are facts. Iraq had no WMD or anyway to kill us they where not the boogie men. You want to catch the boogie men stop believing men in caves 2000 miles away can carry out highly sophisticated military strikes. Suicide bombers in the streets are terrorist that�s different then buildings falling down and some that fell down without even being touched.

Devil, that wasn't meant to be non-nasty humor, trust me!

There is no reason to continue. Your responses that fly in the face of logic and evidence is a waste of time. Your ignoring the plain and simple facts of Hussein connections to terror and WMD's, and of how Hussein, coupled with other haters of the West could hurt us with more than slingshots (Is that what you call airliners nowadays?) coupled with your calling bias nonsense "facts" is unarguable.

Try and work that atrophied imagination for a few minutes, to see how the "slingshot" would hurt us. Picture the next highjacked plane having a small nuclear device onboard, one maybe stolen or purchased after the Soviet Empire started its crumbling. Or a stolen truck carrying the same item, or maybe a stolen plane flying over your city depositing a particularly nasty virus, compliments of Sadam and delivered by his equally American-loathing terrorist friends? Think out of the box, dude, ICBM's are the least of our concerns today.
Of course, you are smart enough to know this, it just gets in the way of your political agenda. What a sad shame, no intellectual honesty here, huh? Except me, of course. Totally honest and objective. Follow me, Grasshopper, and I will teach you the way of clarity and truth.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Devil, that wasn't meant to be non-nasty humor, trust me!

There is no reason to continue. Your responses that fly in the face of logic and evidence is a waste of time. Your ignoring the plain and simple facts of Hussein connections to terror and WMD's, and of how Hussein, coupled with other haters of the West could hurt us with more than slingshots (Is that what you call airliners nowadays?) coupled with your calling bias nonsense "facts" is unarguable.

Try and work that atrophied imagination for a few minutes, to see how the "slingshot" would hurt us. Picture the next highjacked plane having a small nuclear device onboard, one maybe stolen or purchased after the Soviet Empire started its crumbling. Or a stolen truck carrying the same item, or maybe a stolen plane flying over your city depositing a particularly nasty virus, compliments of Sadam and delivered by his equally American-loathing terrorist friends? Think out of the box, dude, ICBM's are the least of our concerns today.
Of course, you are smart enough to know this, it just gets in the way of your political agenda. What a sad shame, no intellectual honesty here, huh? Except me, of course. Totally honest and objective. Follow me, Grasshopper, and I will teach you the way of clarity and truth.

Yawns Show me the weapons of mass destruction or the terrorist ties until you can please thomas
Break your keyboard
or wake up.

[Edited on 24-12-2003 by DiRtYDeViL]

I figured as a Holiday gift to you thomas I would set you straight. With your own trusted news networks stories of no links to Iraq and terrorism. Merry Christmas start the new year pissed that your money was wasted. Cause like Bush said it is your money!

www.foxnews.com...
WASHINGTON � Deposed Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein (search) may have not been involved in the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, but he definitely is linked to the terrorists who did commit those crimes, President Bush said Wednesday.

Problem is he still can't find the link he preaches about but hardly brings up anymore.

www.foxnews.com...
WASHINGTON � Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld (search) said Tuesday he had no reason to believe that Iraq's Saddam Hussein had a hand in the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks (search) on the United States.

There is a link on this address to buy an Ann Coulter doll thomas wonder if it's a blow up one.

www.usatoday.com...
Poll: 70% believe Saddam, 9-11 link
WASHINGTON (AP) � Nearly seven in 10 Americans believe it is likely that ousted Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein was personally involved in the Sept. 11 attacks, says a poll out almost two years after the terrorists' strike against this country.

Just to show you have support, there is a lot of uninformed Americans right now and your in that 70%.

So Thomas when you hear Bush talk about that nasty terrorist Saddam who is going to kill your children and steal your cake. Think of the yellow cake story your president tried to sell you. You know those 16 words as Condi Rice likes to call them. More like lies if you have half a brain. Crap you probably don't know that story either arg do a search on google.com 16 words Bush it should explain it. Then also do a search on Joe Wilson�s wife. Yea the CIA agent that the Bush administration ratted out to get back at Wilson for exposing the truth. Oh btw that was treason. So a vote for Bush is a vote for Treason.

Please, do you think I'm listening to you? You know that the links were made by foreign intel even, not our intel, and had you been awake and sober month and months ago, you'd remember that Hussein even had a passenger plane in the boondocks for training. Of course, you are going to brainwash yourself into thinking the plane was to train Iraqi women to be flight attendants, just like you told yourself that his weather balloon program was so advanced he needed to make it a mobile program, thereby keeping the Americans ignorant of the Iraqi Great Weather Balloon Gap!

And, may I remind you of the millions given by Hussein to homicide bombers? You do realize that the War on Terror is not just directed against the ones who flew the planes, right?
Oh yeah, you are still struggling with the concept of dealing a WMD blow without the use of ICBM's, aren't you? I'll have to slow down for you, you're having to digest some pretty big pieces, I understand. Better yet, wasn't I ignoring you as you have difficulty with untwisted fact and history? Stop reading those silly Moore books, throw away your Babs records, put down the bong and pay attention!! And another thing, quit drinking that cheap beer and get the good stuff. Remember, quality, not quantity.
Merry Christmas.

pesh' 'got him', 'they'
sedated the targets, and placed
them where to be found in
the spider-hole/farm

"pesh'got him, 'they'"

Huh?
Define "pesh", "got him", and "they".
More cryptic messages TC.
WITD reincarnation or wanna-be?




regards
seekerof

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Please, do you think I'm listening to you?

You keep reading it. What should I think?

You know that the links were made by foreign intel even, not our intel, and had you been awake and sober month and months ago, you'd remember that Hussein even had a passenger plane in the boondocks for training.

What? Our own intelligence services can find no link period. That�s why Bush used faked foreign Intel that the CIA disproved but he still used it.

Of course, you are going to brainwash yourself into thinking the plane was to train Iraqi women to be flight attendants,

Sounds like more fox news horse crap.

just like you told yourself that his weather balloon program was so advanced he needed to make it a mobile program, thereby keeping the Americans ignorant of the Iraqi Great Weather Balloon Gap!

You said it yourself weather balloons.
They could have been using those mobile balloons to run around the country and fill them up and check the weather or for ufos.

And, may I remind you of the millions given by Hussein to homicide bombers? You do realize that the War on Terror is not just directed against the ones who flew the planes, right?

Palestinians are not terrorist they are freedom fighters if Hussein gives the families money good for him. If he supports hamas fight against Israel with billions it just shows you he cares about there independence from the jews. Good for him.

Oh yeah, you are still struggling with the concept of dealing a WMD blow without the use of ICBM's, aren't you? I'll have to slow down for you, you're having to digest some pretty big pieces, I understand. Better yet, wasn't I ignoring you as you have difficulty with untwisted fact and history?

Yes I have a problem believing some third world sanctioned country could get wmd delivered to my front door. If they had icbm why waste them with something like chemical or biological weapons both hard to disperse. Especially bio on an icbm won�t work ever had microbiology? Kind of hard to keep that evil small pox virus alive coming thru the atmosphere. There is no way Iraq could have hit us with anything that moat they call an ocean works very well.

Stop reading those silly Moore books, throw away your Babs records, put down the bong and pay attention!! And another thing, quit drinking that cheap beer and get the good stuff. Remember, quality, not quantity.
Merry Christmas.

I don't drink or do drugs. I�m sorry I am so well read. It helps me think for myself.
Merry Christmas to you and your family also I hope you don't have to spend tons of time like I do assembling toys made in China. Today is a good day to thank god for our children and the very nice things we have. The children in Iraq don't have this luxury and haven�t since 1991. I pray that will change now that Saddam is gone forever.

It would serve you WELL to learn from Master Crowne the difference between Propaganda and FACTS. At least when Thomas finds it necessary to hurl a "propabomb" he is INTILLECTUALLY HONEST enough to acknowledge the fact.

Unfortunately your ilk NEVER does, and I fear you actually BELEIVE the tirpe! Additionally, your ilk NEVER admit BULL# after it is exposed in broad day light, flies and all...

MERRY CHRISTMAS!
m...

Originally posted by Springer
It would serve you WELL to learn from Master Crowne the difference between Propaganda and FACTS. At least when Thomas finds it necessary to hurl a "propabomb" he is INTILLECTUALLY HONEST enough to acknowledge the fact.

Unfortunately your ilk NEVER does, and I fear you actually BELEIVE the tirpe! Additionally, your ilk NEVER admit BULL# after it is exposed in broad day light, flies and all...

MERRY CHRISTMAS!
m...

I believe everything I said yes. If you could show me anything that I said that was false please do thanks. Since your ilk is always saying that it's propaganda but never showing us anything but Bush�s propaganda that has been proven false. Merry Christmas to you also.

[Edited on 25-12-2003 by DiRtYDeViL]

Where all all these weapons of mass destruction Bush claimed Sadaam had? WAIT!!!! That was a lie! I would also like to point out that I am sure our country has weapons of mass destruction. Why is it our country is allowed to have these, yet no other country can? It doesn't really sound right to me. Who are we to tell other countries what they can and can't do anyway?

Approximately how much money have we been wasting on this war? I am sure that money could have been used elsewhere, like in our own country.

They don't want us in thier country, it's all over the news that we aren't welcome there. If we are so welcome there why are our soldiers dying over there day after day?

I can't even begin to count how many ways we are wrong being in this war. What has bush done since he got in office? All he has done is killed people. He is picking fights with all these countries, and giving our country a bad name meanwhile our economy is going to hell. Look how many allies our country has been loosing ever since he got in office. It was never like this before. I am ashamed at what our country has become ever since Bush got in office.

Villiayth

Iraq has no weapons of mass destruction, that is a laugh. And even if they did, how could they use them on us?

Nice post Villiayth. But look we have had one good economic forecast that the wings nuts use as great news. While ignoring the previous 3 years of crappy economic reports and all of the lies. Also everyone knew the tax cuts would increase spending if you give a 16 year old a credit card with 5,000 dollars and tell them go spend you don�t have to pay me back they will spend. For the uneducated wing nuts the government represents the parent in this scenario giving you the child money to spend, the debut is still there but you spent the money.

Then they yell at me when I don't believe the economy is getting better yet. There are signs of good news but I'm just not convinced yet. That could change. But I still won�t forget the defect and waste this administration has caused.


[Edited on 25-12-2003 by DiRtYDeViL]

I NEVER spew propaganda. I live in the middel where LOGIC resides. I take no warrant form either of the illogical stone throwers.

The fact that I SUPPORT the war in Iraq for the SINGULAR purpose of removing Saddam Hussein (mission ACCOMPLISHED) does NOT make me a Shrubber...

I could not care LESS what petty little reasons the loons THINK they were lied to about, they are IRELLEVANT because the ONLY reason we went in was regime change PERIOD. All the rest is POLITICS and I am old enough amd smart enough to NEVER beleive politics.

PEACE...
m...

They should have said that then. I�m not mad they invaded a country or two I am mad that they lied about the reasons for it. Politics or not I don�t like being lied to. But even then of course I�d be mad my tax dollars where spent for such a stupid thing. I don't give a # about Arabs under oppression and neither does BUSH!!!


[Edited on 25-12-2003 by DiRtYDeViL]

Bring em' ON!!!

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Guerrillas detonated a powerful bomb in a busy Baghdad shopping district on Sunday, killing a U.S. soldier and two Iraqi children, and another U.S. soldier died in an attack on a convoy west of the capital.

The ambushes came a day after coordinated suicide bomb, mortar and machinegun attacks in the holy city of Kerbala killed 19 people -- five Bulgarian and two Thai soldiers and 12 Iraqis -- the deadliest strike on foreign troops since the capture of Saddam Hussein.

The Baghdad attack, which targeted U.S. vehicles driving through the Karada shopping area, wounded five American soldiers, eight members of the Iraqi Civil Defense Corps and an Iraqi translator.

"A soldier from the 2nd Armored Cavalry Regiment and two Iraqi children standing nearby were killed when the IED (improvised explosive device) detonated as a convoy was passing," military spokesman Captain Jason Beck said.

"At this stage we don't know how serious the injuries are."

Beck said the explosion occurred at around 10:15 a.m. (2:15 a.m. EST) when the streets of Karada, a bustling area of shops and stalls, would have been crammed with people.

Northeast of the flashpoint town of Falluja, another bomb attack on a convoy killed one soldier from the 82nd Airborne Division and wounded three, the U.S. Army said.

MOUNTING DEATH TOLL

The attacks raised to 212 the number of U.S. soldiers killed in action since Washington declared major combat over on May 1. Attacks appear to be continuing at a consistent pace despite the capture of former dictator Saddam Hussein on December 13.
more at
www.reuters.com...;jsessionid=BJMQLOVIZFR1YCRBAE0CFEY?type=topNews&storyID=4050411

A war Built on lies looking more and more like vietnam everyday. Well George I'd say the Arabs are still bringing it.
Just remember Bush supporters our soldier�s blood is not only on Bush�s hands but also yours! You support a man and a war built on lies and propaganda while you wrap yourself in patriotism and scream support the troops like pathetic sheep.