National Guard Attacked, Retreat

No, not in Iraq,how about Arizona. Invaders "just looking for work" I guess. Unbelievable. I wonder if the Guard was issued live ammo,or blanks. Would'nt want to hurt someone for just "doing the job Americans wont". Wide Open

so they ran???

how nice.....but if we pull out of Iraq, that will send a clear message worldwide that we don't have the gall to protect our country.....

God, tell mexico that we see this as an act of war, if it happens again, we'll take over their flea bitten country and take all their oil!!


ahhh, what the heck, they probably didn't have any spare bullets to give the border patrol, so they couldn't fire a few shots over the gang's head...budget cuts and all....wait a minute, what budget cuts???

every day a little more evidence comes up that just reinforces the idea that the american people are being taken as fools!

very little description of the incident..
aren't we in iraq to 'protect' america??? sort of morbidly funny how the u.s. will spend billions in iraq but we can't even protect our own borders. this isn't the first time stuff like this as happened

On Friday, August 12, New Mexico governor Bill Richardson declared a state of emergency in four counties. The following Monday, Arizona governor Janet Napolitano did the same. And the federal government is less than pleased.

AZ NM declare state of emergency along mexican border

HARLINGEN, Texas -- Authorities were investigating Thursday whether Mexican gunmen who fired on deputies and Border Patrol agents from across the Rio Grande had crossed into the U.S.

Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino said 200 to 300 shots were fired from automatic weapons Wednesday night, but no one was injured on the U.S. side and police didn't fire back

TX investigates gunfire along border

You'd think frequent gun battles along the U.S.-Mexico border between federal agents and citizen border-monitoring groups on this side, and drug and people smugglers on the other side, would make the national headlines.

if you thought that, you would be mistaken
www.freenewmexican.com...http ://www.rense.com/general29/mex.htm

ok, one last link

Samaniego recalled another Mexican military incursion he said had taken place in Santa Teresa, N.M., located across the state line from El Paso. Mexican soldiers in two Humvees "chased after" a U.S. Border Patrol agent until backup arrived while another U.S. agent also came under gunfire, Samaniego told Cybercast News Service

www.cnsnews.com.../Nation/ar chive/200612/NAT20061221a.html

and we are protecting americas borders by being in iraq and searching airline passengers?????

Does anyone know what the NG's orders are relative to rules-of-engagement? Are they authorized to return fire? Just cause we have military units on the border doesn't mean they can fire back. And given that possibility, there is no other option but to retreat. This is a sticky problem. We have heavily armed drug runners who are crossing the same border as women and children. Had the guard wasted a dozen drug runners carrying SMG's everyone would be getting high fives. But what if they were fired-on and in the course of returning fire killed a half dozen women and children? That would play quite a bit differently on CNN.

from the articles i've read, it appears that the border patrol have been told not to return fire,at least when spotting what appears to be mexican military units..
i would imagine that the nat'l gaurd would be the same

"The U.S. Border Patrol is telling its agents to just lay low and report on what they see," he said. "They are instructed to determine the size of the [Mexican military] unit, the number of personnel, the direction of travel."

www.cnsnews.com.../Nation/archive/20 0612/NAT20061221a.html

What do you think that the Drug runners aren't #ing these whores and prostitutes to make babies ?? And when they do and when the babies die .. all the sudden the whores and prostitutes are Innocent woman and children ... BS .... Kill the problem where it starts !!!!!!!!

Originally posted by jtma508
Does anyone know what the NG's orders are relative to rules-of-engagement? Are they authorized to return fire? Just cause we have military units on the border doesn't mean they can fire back. And given that possibility, there is no other option but to retreat. This is a sticky problem. We have heavily armed drug runners who are crossing the same border as women and children. Had the guard wasted a dozen drug runners carrying SMG's everyone would be getting high fives. But what if they were fired-on and in the course of returning fire killed a half dozen women and children? That would play quite a bit differently on CNN.

If a Mod doesn't step in and respond to that last gem I will be utterly disappointed in the moral fabric of ATS. Holy crap.

Originally posted by dawnstar
so they ran???

how nice.....but if we pull out of Iraq, that will send a clear message worldwide that we don't have the gall to protect our country.....

God, tell mexico that we see this as an act of war, if it happens again, we'll take over their flea bitten country and take all their oil!!


ahhh, what the heck, they probably didn't have any spare bullets to give the border patrol, so they couldn't fire a few shots over the gang's head...budget cuts and all....wait a minute, what budget cuts???

every day a little more evidence comes up that just reinforces the idea that the american people are being taken as fools!

What does this have to do with the Mexican government?? Do you expect them to be culpable for the actions of all their citizens? If so should America be culpable for any crims commited in other countries by our citizens??

There is no evidence that this has any Mexican government involvement. They are not responsible for securing our borders ... we are. When you leave the US our border gaurd doesn't stop and inspect you ... whether you're driving into Mexico or Canada ... it's the country that your entering that stops and questions you.

If there's a problem here it's the fact that our current federal administration has put National Guard on the border to do a job that is supposed to be performed by the Border Guard. In doing so they are not allowing them to be armed or giving them extremely limited engagement orders. Why are we wasting our resources in this manner? If we need more border guards then hire more ... it is not the job of the National Guard to fight in ongoing wars or to patrol a border during normal events.

this incident may have nothing to do with the mexican govt but they are invovled are at least turning the other way..

More than 200 incursions by the Mexican military of the U.S. southern border have been documented since the late 1990s, Rep. Ted Poe (R-Texas) said in an interview.

"Our federal government denied it occurred until the Texas sheriffs took photos," he said. "There is no nation in the world that would allow this invasion to occur except for the United States."

mexian army helping drug smuglers?

the u.s. govt turns a blind eye also 'cause they don't want to derail NAFT/CAFTA, super highway and the NAU.

In an article published in Investor's Business Daily (see [1]), Fox was quoted saying that "an aging U.S. population would be well served by allowing more free-flowing immigration of a decidedly younger Mexican population into the United States."

link
so we ahve two govts saying one thing and doing nothing.

just do a quick search on 'fox nafta nau'
aren't we iraq to 'protect america'? so much for the United States of America.............

so bush is gunna send how many troops to iraq to help secure iraq and to protect america.....yet this happens on OUR OWN BORDER

The Guardsmen, through an Arizona Border Patrol official, confirmed that the incident appeared to be an intelligence-gathering exercise designed to ascertain what the National Guard’s response would be to certain tactics. It is not an isolated incident, and many such probes have been reported by the Guardsmen assigned to the area. Though no shots were fired during this particular incident, shots have been fired near and in the vicinity of the soldiers at the EIT site in other situations, though not at the soldiers themselves. It is not clear from the uniforms if the Mexican soldiers were official Mexican federales or mercenaries hired by the drug cartels.

Since then, follow-on news reports have included statements from the Border Patrol that no shots were fired. This was confirmed today by Major Paul Aguirre, a Public Affairs Officer (PAO) for the Arizona National Guard. Rumors have circulated that the Guardsmen were not armed, and thus unable to defend themselves - and that is not the case. Both Major Aguirre and Rob Daniels, a Public Information Officer (PIO) for the Arizona Border Patrol, state that all Guardsmen assigned to EITs are armed, specifically with M16s and sometimes a sidearm. As well, there have been some contradictory news reports that stated the gunmen came “within yards” of the Guardsmen, while other reports state that the gunmen were approximately 100 yards away. Mr. Daniels clarified that the gunmen came as close as 100 yards to the Guardsmen. He also stated that the Guardsmen did not “retreat” but tactically repositioned themselves to maintain surveillance of the group of armed men while simultaneously radioing for Border Patrol agents. He asserted that the Guardsmen had followed their protocols perfectly, and that their services were invaluable to the Border Patrol agents.

(sorry about the big quote, but few actually read the links....)
link
i suppose, america has been in iraq 4 years and as spent $400 BILLION,yes that is BILLION with a 'B', i guess the u.s. doesn't have anymore money to spend on something as frivolous as stopping ARMED incursions on to american soil...........

If this keeps up, watch for some sort of incident between these forces or groups crossing the border, and the volunteer citizen militia's. They are reporting and backing off too, but I bet they would defend themselves, and in Texas that would be plain old self defense. They are not really bound by "rules of engagement".