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Originally posted by CameronFox
You may say...well it was chaos...etc...but in reality...there were I believe hundreds of firefighters standing around waiting...to see if 7 goes down. The search and rescue efforts for that area were suspended for the fear of WTC7 collapsing. Good thing though..not one person died during the collapse.
Originally posted by CameronFox
Good thing though..not one person died during the collapse.
Originally posted by Griff
That makes sense. Also, I was thinking about it after I posted that. You've said before that your brother was part of the cleanup. I guess I'd be a little more interested in this stuff myself if I had a family member involved. Sorry if it sounded like I was accussing you of anything. It was really just a question.
And I could've sworn that all those images of WTC7 on fire showed absolutely no raging infernos, and even those have never brought steel buildings down. Steel doesn't break from heat; it sags. And all the impact damages were on the back facade, yet the whole building all starts falling at once. Unless you count the penthouse, which was on the completely opposite side of the impact damage. But like I said, the firefighters never reported that either so I guess it never happened.
Originally posted by Griff
Originally posted by CameronFox
Good thing though..not one person died during the collapse.
Do they really know this for a fact? How can they be absolutely sure of this with all the chaos of the day? If the search and rescue was abandoned some time before the collapse, how do they know that someone wasn't trapped in the collapse zone when it came down?
Originally posted by CameronFox
I will look for anything in regards to the penthouse sag. The firefighters were backed up to stay safe....but was it back far enough to see the penthouse of an alomst 50 story building? Think about how far back you have to be from a skyscraper to see the roof.
Originally posted by CameronFox
I did however found an interview where the firefighters became aware the building was coming down becasue they saw the marble popping off the side of the building.
So we go there and on the north and east side of 7 it didn’t look like there was any damage at all, but then you looked on the south side of 7 there had to be a hole 20 stories tall in the building, with fire on several
floors. Debris was falling down on the building and it didn’t look good. But they had a hose line operating. Like I said, it was hitting the sidewalk across the street, but eventually they pulled back too. Then we received an order from Fellini, we’re going to make a move on 7. That was the first time really my stomach tightened up because the building didn’t look good. I was figuring probably the standpipe systems were shot. There was no hydrant pressure. I wasn’t really keen on the idea. Then this other officer I’m standing next to said, that building doesn’t look straight. So I’m standing there. I’m looking at the building. It didn’t look right, but, well, we’ll go in, we’ll see. So we gathered up rollups and most of us had masks at that time. We headed toward 7. And just around we were about a hundred yards away and Butch Brandeis came running up. He said forget it, nobody’s going into 7, there’s creaking, there are noises coming out of there, so we just stopped. And probably about 10 minutes after that, Visconti, he was on West Street, and I guess he had another report of further damage either in some basements and things like that, so Visconti said nobody goes into 7, so that was the final thing and that was abandoned.
Firehouse Magazine: When you looked at the south side, how close were you to the base of that side?
Boyle: I was standing right next to the building, probably right next to it.
Firehouse: When you had fire on the 20 floors, was it in one window or many?
There was a huge gaping hole and it was scattered through there. It was a huge hole. I would say it was
probably a third of it, right in the middle of it. And so after Visconti came down and said nobody goes in 7,
we said all right, we’ll head back to the command post. – Capt. Chris Boyle /e7bzp
I know this isn't what you asked for...i just though you would find it interesting.
During that time a couple of the members felt like we were being useless just standing around. We wanted to do something. So we started trying to walk down, trying to get into the pile. We kept on being turned around from chiefs, because they didn't want us near Seven. As we were walking, we had to actually get a little closer to Seven. So we turned and looked at Seven, and that's when all the marble siding started popping off the side because it was starting togo down.
–Firefighter Thomas Donato
graphics8.nytimes.com...
Originally posted by Griff
Thanks CameronFox. One question I have though. I thought the WTC 7 was clad in granite panels, not marble? I could be wrong, I've been trying to find out, but with anything related to the construction of the WTC complex, it's hard to find.
I know it's semantics but just want to be sure.
Edit: Also, the quote says that the marble was falling because the building was starting to collapse. Going by what you were saying, I thought it was suppossed to be the other way around? That they knew the building was going to collapse because of the marble cladding falling?
Thanks Griff... I don't want to spend too much time on specualting the view point of the firefighters had. I did however found an interview where the firefighters became aware the building was coming down becasue they saw the marble popping off the side of the building.
Originally posted by CameronFox
Of ALL of them that I read, I could not find ONE that stated that the fires were minimal just prior to collapse.
I will look for anything in regards to the penthouse sag. The firefighters were backed up to stay safe....but was it back far enough to see the penthouse of an alomst 50 story building?
Your one of the smarter people in here Bsbray, but your sarcastic comments don't help your argument.
Originally posted by CameronFox
Granite / Marble.. not sure this particular firefighter knew the difference at the time.
not sure what you mean though?