ARMAGGEDON

according to the bible they describe armaggedon as the end of the world and in it they say that it would be horrible and that the moon would turn red from blood and then that the dead will rise and that then HE would pick the actual people to come with him and the people to go to hell
so actually there are really no people in hell or heaven right now! it's empty!
also i heard that there is some place named the pulgatory and that's were the people who miss heaven by a little go and that there is a big stairs that every day they have to climb by praying
and i hear the old people of my church praying for them i just want to know is that place true? and why are them people praying for them ? there is no one day yet the final day hasn't come yet? i just want to clear these things from my mind
if any one knows the answers to my questions feel free to reply

Purgatory is some idea from the Catholic church which doesn't exist. Nowhere in the bible is there "purgatory".

I think only Catholics belive in Purgatory. But i can be wrong. In Purgatory you must stay as long as you lived on Earth. They pray so they can go to heaven quickly. But I think Heaven and Hell are not empty. Jesus will judge them the living and the dead for good.

Mal, I think you should ask your pastor if he can recommend a site that offers basic answers for questioning Christians.

Some of us are non-Christians and don't believe in the Armageddon scenario (many Christians (mainstream ones) also don't believe in it). Some other religions have the concept of a purgatory (in the ones that believe in reincarnation, one comes back to redeem oneself from the sins by being reincarnated in a less fortunate position.)

It sounds as though you're Catholic.

Try www.catholic.com...

This place has some boards listed as well as some chats:
www.geocities.com...

There's a Catholic chat room here (slow loading, annoying nonstop playing of Ave Maria):
www.ecatholic2000.com...


I'd recommend you start there -- find out what your Church has to say about these issues... and then use THAT basis to weigh other things against.

Byrd, us Catholics have evry right to post here. You cannot stop us from turning away from our faith. And if u are not Catholic, then do not post in Catholic related threads.

Now I know why your being a dick, Jedi.... Your catholic...

I lived down the road from Armegedon.

Its in the middle of Israel and called Ha-Megiddo, a famous fortress. There were so amny bloody battles there that is it considered to be the place where the last battle will be fought.

BTW no, pergatory does not exist... there is no reference in the bible to it ANYWHERE, just another non christian concept that slides into christianity ... like reincarnation.

Once your are dead you place is fixed, you cannot change it ....

Here is what Jesus said ... and he has more authority and any priests...

Luke 16 19-31
Jesus said, "There was a certain rich man who was splendidly clothed and who lived each day in luxury. At his door lay a diseased beggar named Lazarus. As Lazarus lay there longing for scraps from the rich man's table, the dogs would come and lick his open sores.

Finally, the beggar died and was carried by the angels to be with Abraham. The rich man also died and was buried, and his soul went to the place of the dead.

There, in torment, he saw Lazarus in the far distance with Abraham. "The rich man shouted, `Father Abraham, have some pity! Send Lazarus over here to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in anguish in these flames.

"But Abraham said to him, `Son, remember that during your lifetime you had everything you wanted, and Lazarus had nothing. So now he is here being comforted, and you are in anguish. And besides, there is a great chasm separating us.

Anyone who wanted to cross over to you from here is stopped at its edge, and no one there can cross over to us.

"Then the rich man said, `Please, Father Abraham, send him to my father's home.

For I have five brothers, and I want him to warn them about this place of torment so they won't have to come here when they die. But Abraham said, `Moses and the prophets have warned them. Your brothers can read their writings anytime they want to.

The rich man replied, `No, Father Abraham! But if someone is sent to them from the dead, then they will turn from their sins.

But Abraham said, `If they won't listen to Moses and the prophets, they won't listen even if someone rises from the dead.'

[Edited on 16-11-2002 by Netchicken]

The word trinity is not in the bible and yet do you believe it?

God does not put the exact word in the bible.

Purgatory is a state of cleansing from sins we still have on our soul.

God talks about how nothing defiled will enter it.

if we happen to die in a state of minor sins we will be cleansed and "purified" after earth.

Pryaing for the dead is not wrong, read 2 machabees.

again, our church has the ability to creat doctrines by men led by the holy spirit.

"" whatever you bound here on earth shall also be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall also be loosed in heaven ""

God literally istituted purgatory for our cleansing.

of course you dont have to believe, but dont, dont, say its some kind of a pagan idea
when you literally have no clue who created it.

Gods church cannot teach false doctrines. god said the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And so
if this doctrine is wrong than the gates of hell surely prevailed against it.

peace.

Bluegrl89 and others,I don't think Byrd was trying to insult catholics in his post.Bluegrl please do not think that I am in anyway dismissing your inquiries but is the 89 the year of your birth?That would make you 13?I think that Byrd is suggesting that you talk to the Elders of you're church or your parents and ask them questions concerning your faith.Church Elders are not intolerant and will respect you for asking these questions rather than just worshipping without understanding.
As you have guessed on this board there are as many opinions as there are different posters and rather than making things clearer we could all just make things cloudier.
If for some reason you feel you can not talk to the people of your church then I feel sure that someone of your faith can help you here.
I hope you won't take this the wrong way and I look forward to reading your future posts.

no bull i was not born in 89 it was born in 1978 and no im not 13 im 24
it's just happens that my favorite number in 89

and byrd i have all the right i want to post here even if i am catholic or not and so do you

So u hate us Catholics James?!? I can see where u are going on judgement day. Hell. How the f*ck am I a dick for being Catholic?!?

You just blow out a lotta hot air, and bull. James u r very very sad. I have every right to be a Catholic.

Sorry Bluegrl.glad you didn't take that the wrong way.89huh?funny favourate number.

Hello BLUEGRL89

So much happens in the Book of revelations, so i thought I would go and do some more research on it to know the exact events in order.

Firstly, it is not at Armageddon when the moon shall turn as blood red also there will have been resurrections before this battle. I who go by a pentecostal teaching do not believe in the place purgatory. But there are people in hell now. There is more than one place of torment, i.e "Hades" "Abbousos". But after the Armageddon all these hells will combine the souls and they will then be put into the Lake of Fire.

A normal sinner who died but did not repent goes to a hell, this hell is the same hell as in the example of a hell which Netchicken gave earlier. Those people who do repent then decide to turn away and are known as Backsliders go to a place which is known as Outer Darkness. This is the place where Jesus mentioned that there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

I would like to tell how we know there is more than one hell by a quick example. In the story that Jesus told in the Book of Luke about the rich men in hell. We see that the rich man was able to talk and see. Well Jesus mentions of a place where as I said there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, Jesus also mentions a place called outer darkness. Bluegrl, Grind your teeth, and then see if you can say what the rich man said in the book of Luke. Also turn off the lights in your room, and see if you would have been able to see what the same rich man saw. Also was the rich man weeping?, Well the place where Jesus mentioned where people were weeping could not have been the same place.

Bye for now Blue grl89


Netchicken that was a good example
I was thinking of putting that in too.

[Edited on 17-11-2002 by stewards]

Gee a rich man could be someone who thinks themselves so pure they are saved??? This despite that they feel the earth will be destroyed and other will have to burn books to keep warm.

Jedi, Bluegrl -- I wasn't bashing Catholics.

Instead, I was trying to gently point out that we are only laypeople here and not as well versed in the faith as folks who have gone to the seminary.

You're asking some fairly basic questions that can BEST be answered by people who have spent years studying the Bible in seminaries. And that's why I was referring you to those sites.

They were recommended to me by a very good friend, who happens to be Catholic.

Oh... and Jedi, the links I posted were for Catholics BY Catholics. Not sites that try to convert Catholics.

I'm Wiccan. To try to lead someone into a different religion violates our First Tenet: "An thou harm none, do what thou wilt." Show the seeker how their own religion answers these questions...then, if they're not satisfied, THEY can look elsewhere.

Originally posted by JediMaster
So u hate us Catholics James?!? I can see where u are going on judgement day. Hell. How the f*ck am I a dick for being Catholic?!?

You just blow out a lotta hot air, and bull. James u r very very sad. I have every right to be a Catholic.

Now now...as the Lords Prayer says : "...forgive us our tresspasses, as we forgive those who tresspass against us..."


Peace,
ALIEN

again, our church has the ability to create doctrines by men led by the holy spirit.

Gods church cannot teach false doctrines.

Aaaah truth.... who said we need any more "doctrines"? The bible is the Word of God. If a doctrine goes against what is written in the bible should it be believed or followed? No. The bible is more than just a book, it is a standard, ruler, or measure to use against any other beliefs, ideas, or doctrines. It's something to compare anything else to.
About the church not teaching false doctrines that could be a post in of itself. After all you know what the pope is up to.... For example, praying to Mary, a person who is now dead. Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Mary can't hear you any more than Joseph can.
Once again I bring up the point of "upon this rock I shall build my church." Do you think Jesus would base His church on a person? He was talking about Himself. Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith, not Peter.

Originally posted by JediMaster
So u hate us Catholics James?!? I can see where u are going on judgement day. Hell. How the f*ck am I a dick for being Catholic?!?

Ooooo! The 'ol fire-n-brimstone approach to salvation...I am sooooo scared...NOT!

So you're seeing yourself fit to make judgments that are reserved for God alone to make? I wish you luck...