The Problem with Russia's submarines.

A fascinating read for you who follow these things..

www.bellona.no...

Especially telling are the statements about lack of money to maintain them, problems with nuclear waste clean up and the fact that they are missing 18 submarines!!!

Bellona is a environmental watch group, and I believe they are Norwegian...

hrxll

[Edited on 2-12-03 by HerExcellency]

here is some good info about the russian Strategic Fleet

russianforces.org...

It is tiring hearing of the massive power of Russia when the bottom line is this:

how long can these people fight any kind of sustained battle when their economy and social infrastructure is so weak?

I think the Russians could build good subs but there would be two definite areas of concern, first the electronics and second the nuclear reactor or similar such power source.

Originally posted by THENEO
how long can these people fight any kind of sustained battle when their economy and social infrastructure is so weak?

The word "fan" comes from the word "fanatic".

Don't some of the americans have something that they root for year after year only to have their hopes dashed upon the hard rocks for reality? Didn't I read something about the Chicago Cubs? or the Boston Red Sox?

Perhaps SectorGaza is a fan?

hrxll

hey neo, russia can mobalize, often fighting a war can be done without an economy take poland in WWII or Somalia or Iraq or Afghanistan.

I dont blame you the neo,

but maybe in your sheltered american life,
you dont know that people will fight when there is no food or money or weapons.

Not every war is fought like the 1st world countries fight.

I usually agree with your veiws theneo but this time i need to disagree

Ok, I am also getting tired of all these Russia VS U.S. threads lol. Come on, if you REALLY want to see them go at it, get a WAR going? Would that make you happy? lol probably not

Anyways, Russia, at the present, could most likely not be able to defeat the U.S. I have a few reasons. The U.S. uses a strategical plan. Usually, they will use the massive technologically mobilized Airforce / Navy jets / bombers. Why? To wipe out most resistance. The U.S. Navy is also good, could be better, but its there for support. The infantry comes in after most danger is gone. But, if Russia is the most powerful, why doesn't the rest of the world agree? The U.S. is considered to be the only true superpower at this time, later on? Who can say? But I sure would not like to see these countries fight, it could end the world if it goes nuclear.

-wD

Originally posted by omega1
I dont blame you the neo,

but maybe in your sheltered american life,
you dont know that people will fight when there is no food or money or weapons.

Not every war is fought like the 1st world countries fight.

this is like the first time i agree with you!

Countries sometimes like Russia in WW2 fight cause thats their motherland and people are patriotic.

thanks russian
I knew one of my fellow europeans would agree with me

im not russian though

this is like the first time i agree with you!

Countries sometimes like Russia in WW2 fight cause thats their motherland and people are patriotic.

Originally posted by WeBDeviL
Ok, I am also getting tired of all these Russia VS U.S. threads lol. Come on, if you REALLY want to see them go at it, get a WAR going? Would that make you happy? lol probably not

Anyways, Russia, at the present, could most likely not be able to defeat the U.S. I have a few reasons. The U.S. uses a strategical plan. Usually, they will use the massive technologically mobilized Airforce / Navy jets / bombers. Why? To wipe out most resistance. The U.S. Navy is also good, could be better, but its there for support. The infantry comes in after most danger is gone. But, if Russia is the most powerful, why doesn't the rest of the world agree? The U.S. is considered to be the only true superpower at this time, later on? Who can say? But I sure would not like to see these countries fight, it could end the world if it goes nuclear.

-wD

WE never said that Russia is a SUPERPOWER!

Also we never said the Russia CAN DEFEAT US!

And if there will be a war it will not end in US favor!

Thats why US is scare for bulling China or the WEAK North Korea!

As I am looking right I could see US messing with the small none nuke, no power countries.

And they are scare to mess with ANYONE else!

They are a big bully on the block that kids every 3 year olds ASS!

But is scare of people that like him have bats(nukes)!

Originally posted by WeBDeviL
Ok, I am also getting tired of all these Russia VS U.S. threads lol. Come on, if you REALLY want to see them go at it, get a WAR going? Would that make you happy? lol probably not

-wD

Mea Culpa, or so it seems.

I actually wanted to post a source (non Anglo) that gave an unbiased view of the Russian subfleet and by extant the North Seas fleet.

Although if I were a sociologist/psychologist the patterns of these threads make a fascinating study in ego, territorialism, nationalism, and their manifestations in a virtual world. hmmph. Theme Paper anyone?

Look. I've seen war up close and personal. I really don't have any desire to see the world go up in a puff of radiated air.

But to hear "fans" drone mindlessly while ignoring the facts is ignorant and maddening.

That being said, this section of the board is about Weapondary, and the state of the Russian Fleet certainly fits within the perview of that section.

Devil, I hear you, and I concur.

hrxll

Originally posted by HerExcellency
A fascinating read for you who follow these things..

www.bellona.no...

Especially telling are the statements about lack of money to maintain them, problems with nuclear waste clean up and the fact that they are missing 18 submarines!!!

Bellona is a environmental watch group, and I believe they are Norwegian...

hrxll

[Edited on 2-12-03 by HerExcellency]

Screw the enivermentilsits!(spelling)

They are just money sucking bastards!

and I am not talking only in Russia.

I am talking about all the GREAT things that could he been invented and in production if it was not for these SCUMS!

Russia has also had a myriad of nuclear-related submarine accidents, while the U.S. has none. Goes to show you that safety is never really emphasized in Russia.

One example that sticks in my mind was that Alfa-class SSN. It had a liquid-bismuth cooled reactor. It has tons of advantages, but they learned when there is a problem, liquid metal-cooled reactors don't provide a back-up. Instead, it all spilled out and solidified in the reactor compartment. A pity.

Originally posted by Russian



And if there will be a war it will not end in US favor!

Thats why US is scare for bulling China or the WEAK North Korea!

As I am looking right I could see US messing with the small none nuke, no power countries.

And they are scare to mess with ANYONE else!

They are a big bully on the block that kids every 3 year olds ASS!

But is scare of people that like him have bats(nukes)!

If the US is afraid to pick on the countries who have nukes then I am glad.

It seems pretty lame to bash a country for not wanting to start nuclear war, and thus destroying the world.

Originally posted by greenkoolaid


If the US is afraid to pick on the countries who have nukes then I am glad.

It seems pretty lame to bash a country for not wanting to start nuclear war, and thus destroying the world.

What did Iraq do wrong comparing to China?

China threatened a country with nikes and US is scare to even say a word!

Originally posted by Russian

Originally posted by greenkoolaid


If the US is afraid to pick on the countries who have nukes then I am glad.

It seems pretty lame to bash a country for not wanting to start nuclear war, and thus destroying the world.

What did Iraq do wrong comparing to China?

China threatened a country with nikes and US is scare to even say a word!

Well I don't think they should have invaded Iraq either. I have said that Bush is a bully all along.

But you are the big Bush supporter, why don't you tell me why they invaded Iraq and not China.

Originally posted by greenkoolaid


Well I don't think they should have invaded Iraq either. I have said that Bush is a bully all along.

But you are the big Bush supporter, why don't you tell me why they invaded Iraq and not China.

They invaded Iraq cause they had a good reason to.

and also it was a non nuke power.

they didnt invade China cause there asses would be killed.

and it is because people in US cant even support one SMALL war.

So please dont talk about a MAJOR war.

Cause the US citzen will over throw the gpvernment for that!

A war between China and America might be the end of the world..........

so obviously both countries know to respect eachothers powers.

Originally posted by omega1
A war between China and America might be the end of the world..........

so obviously both countries know to respect eachothers powers.

Right, but Russian seems to think they are wusses for not wanting to attack China.