Some americans need to get a grip on reality!

US citizens have been asking "Why do they hate us so much?". For most US citizens, this is a rhetorical question. They don't really want to know why. They just want to voice their belief that they are the best country in the world and have never done anything wrong. On the contrary, so they believe, they have been the most generous and helpful country in the world. Unfortunately, the facts are quite different. The USA is very good at media manipulation. Their propaganda techniques would have made Goebbels faint with delight. US foreign policy is openly based completely on national self-interest, not international cooperation. The only kind of cooperation the USA understands is ONE-WAY COOPERATION where other countries cooperate with the USA. Other countries must do what the USA requires or be punished by what is euphemistically called linkage, which means punishment for disobeying orders.

When asked to pick one "main reason why those who attacked us and their supporters hate the United States," the reasons given most often were..

1. "our democracy and freedom" (26%) and
2. "our support for Israel" (22%)
However, almost as many believe the main reason is
3. "our values and way of life" (20%), and
4. "our influence on the economy and lives of Middle Eastern countries"(17%).
5. Only 11% believe our economic and military power is the main reason."

And I just do not believe for one single moment the 26% of Americans who answered this poll in the top category have a grip on reality!
Naive: America does not know the reasons for why it is hated...

1. Oil, Bush(temporarily), Kyoto
2. Spends a major portion of world's savings(through treasury bonds), and spends it irresponsibly.
3. Patriotism & Self Righteousness
4. Short term strategies & long term suffering
5. You have supported, trained and armed dictators, illegitimate governments and racist and brutal regimes. You have largely ignored the pain and suffering this has caused.

America, as a self-identified military big brother, has been harassing much of the developing world for multiple decades. Strongly anti-communist sentiments have seen a departure from Democracy in American foreign politics and an embrace of political fascism... if you are not democratic, or trying to be so, historically the chances are the American government has been funding attempts to take your government out!

The amount of self loving literature in American culture is assumed by many to be an indication that America's population deep down feel bad about their country.

Most of the societies in the non-Western world (very much including China, India, much of Africa and Latin America, and nearly all of the Islamic world) maintain a commitment to highly traditional family values that would rank as outrageously restrictive, even “puritanical” in US terms.

TOXIC POPULAR CULTURE ---

Made-in-America movies, TV shows, popular music, fast food and fashion trends remain this nation’s most successful exports to the rest of humanity. Instead of inspiring affection for the USA (as did the Hollywood products of the 1930’s and ‘40’s, for instance), the current entertainment offerings deliver a dark, dysfunctional view of life in North America.

Perhaps I should mention that the murder rate by guns in the USA is about 110 per million per annum, or about 30,000 per annum for the whole country. So the deaths on 2001-9-11 equalled a typical 5 weeks of murders in the USA.

HELLO WAKE UP!.....The USA has killed about 190,000 people in Afghanistan and Iraq since 2001-9-11.

As the saying goes, "whoever discovered water wasn't a fish". It is impossible for most US residents to be aware of what is going on at a global scale. You have to get out of the pond to see the water. You have to get out of the palace to understand the feelings on the street.

Just as it seems, most Americans reading this post will guess that this thread creator is a " d!ck from UK, moron from france, Nazi from Hitlerland, islamo fascist, anit-american jihadi, freedom hater from China, loather of richest nation from Africa, scum in Latin America, stinky sh!t from Russia, leftist from Cuba "...the list is endless...!!!

im an american, well lets word it like this "i live in america". this country has fallen , fallen far from what the makers wanted it to be. i believe this country died about 4 generations after its conception, all the ppl and families that fought to make this country have died, and in their absence corruption took root. this country was not suppose to be a capitalist country. unfortunatly the beast was allowed to be born and grow to its maturity, and now it feeds on the world.

before i get any flak from a "true patriot" ill ask you this do you have faith in this country becuase you believe its good or becuase you were told it was good. for me i had to learn that america is full of filth from top to bottom, and that goes against every form of (mainstream)data you come across within these borders.

dont get me wrong i know their are some good ppl in this country, but its becuase corruption cant have a monopoly or it would collapse"you cant cheat a cheater", "nice guys finish last".

Originally posted by silencer
TOXIC POPULAR CULTURE ---

Made-in-America movies, TV shows, popular music, fast food and fashion trends remain this nation’s most successful exports to the rest of humanity. Instead of inspiring affection for the USA (as did the Hollywood products of the 1930’s and ‘40’s, for instance), the current entertainment offerings deliver a dark, dysfunctional view of life in North America.

Which when coupled with your ignorance produces an equally disfunctional view of our country. I am arguing that your facts are based on perceptions from our movies and popular culture. Granted, it can be somewhat negative, I do not believe it is a fair view of the US. I also believe that the politics of the US is typically disliked by europe and other countrys since they tend to lean towards the left.

Perhaps I should mention that the murder rate by guns in the USA is about 110 per million per annum, or about 30,000 per annum for the whole country. So the deaths on 2001-9-11 equalled a typical 5 weeks of murders in the USA.

and? what is your point? liberal gun laws?

Our country is gigantic compared to the UK or any other single european country. When you take this into account, it may explain the high crime rate.

Why do these arguements always come down to our gun laws? We dont want gun laws like those in europe!!!!

WE ARE NOT EUROPE!!!!

If you like strict gun control, good for you!!!! Im glad, but please stop trying to act like YOUR model of society is the only one that holds up to scrutiny. you want to talk about arrogance?

So, I have a question for you. Why does this concern you exactly? does liberal gun laws in a country that is across the ocean from you somehow threaten your security? You and I both know there is a far simpler explantaion, yet I will be called an "arrogant" american if I came out and said it.

double post. Sorry.

[edit on 20-12-2006 by XphilesPhan]

Originally posted by Glyph_D
im an american, well lets word it like this "i live in america". this country has fallen , fallen far from what the makers wanted it to be. i believe this country died about 4 generations after its conception, all the ppl and families that fought to make this country have died.

And how exactly do you know this? Or were you told this like you claim us "true patriots" were in your next paragraph?

before i get any flak from a "true patriot" ill ask you this do you have faith in this country becuase you believe its good or becuase you were told it was good. for me i had to learn that america is full of filth from top to bottom, and that goes against every form of (mainstream)data you come across within these borders.

And what country isn't? Compared to some south american countrys, we are pretty damn decent.

dont get me wrong i know their are some good ppl in this country, but its becuase corruption cant have a monopoly or it would collapse"you cant cheat a cheater", "nice guys finish last".

Oh! I see! we aren't socialists! This is your complaint? get real.

If socialism was the shining model of society it is supposed to be, why is germany and france in such dire straits? Their unemployment is sky high and civil unrest in france is rampant. Im sure britain wont be far behind.

[edit on 20-12-2006 by XphilesPhan]

[edit on 20-12-2006 by XphilesPhan]

[edit on 20-12-2006 by XphilesPhan]

You are absolutely correct.

We, as Americans, have a right to our own national identity, our own culture and our own laws. We have a right to determine what is in our own best interests as a nation. This is the reality that many non-Americans need to get a grip on. There is a total lack of respect for the sovereignty, laws, culture, ideals, and values of the United States that is both irritating and disturbing. We do not have to pattern ourselves after you, nor do we have to cater to your every whim. We have the right to disagree with you.

This is not to say that the United States is perfect. It is not. I am simply stating what many foreigners don't want to hear: the United States is also not obligated to conform to your beliefs and laws. And before someone inevitably whines, yes, I know that's a two-way street.

Originally posted by XphilesPhan

And how exactly do you know this? Or were you told this like you claim us "true patriots" were in your next paragraph?

And what country isn't?

Compared to some south american countrys, we are pretty damn decent.

Oh! I see! we aren't socialists! This is your complaint?

get real.

If socialism was the shining model of society it is supposed to be, why is germany and france in such dire straits? Their unemployment is sky high and civil unrest in france is rampant. Im sure britain wont be far behind.

i have no proof becuase of the time that has passed, however if you take into considerations of all th reasons we separated from england. taxes , banks, richVSpoor.

in the begin the constitution and bill of rights were designed in a specific way to prevent any govt from takeing or change that here in. however as time went by it became clear that ppl no longer observed the constitution or bill of right as such, instead understood that these are things they were allowed to do. as if they were rules to regulate the ppl , and not rules to regulate any future govt.

at some point the true perspective was high-jacked and the amendment clause was the loop hole that these ppl used.

we (AMERICA) started as a country against forms of govt, its not like that any more.

just because were not as bad as other countries makes no excuse. it was NEVER to be like this, which is why i said we did indeed fall.

the constitution and bill of rights are some beautiful pieces of work(if you get a chance to read them i suggest you do so) before the amendments started piling up that is.


ill close with this all forms of govt are bad there is no good govt, the above was created with this knowledge in mind and tried to set preventions against a govt from getting to bad. their error was with the allowance of amendments. i argue with my bro about this a least once a month he says " they put the allowance for amendments becuase they knew they didnt know everything". ok i comend that, however they failed to realise or was infiltrated and the evidence was suppressed, that if you give a liar and a cheat an inch theyll take and turn it into a mile.

Originally posted by silencer

And I just do not believe for one single moment the 26% of Americans who answered this poll in the top category have a grip on reality!
Naive: America does not know the reasons for why it is hated...

1. Oil, Bush(temporarily), Kyoto
2. Spends a major portion of world's savings(through treasury bonds), and spends it irresponsibly.
3. Patriotism & Self Righteousness
4. Short term strategies & long term suffering
5. You have supported, trained and armed dictators, illegitimate governments and racist and brutal regimes. You have largely ignored the pain and suffering this has caused.

Look at that list for a second. Other than bush and treasury bonds (which are voluntary, the world, particularly the EU loves american treasuries), what of that DOESN'T apply to say, Iran?

-Iran is a massive polluter, but that's o.k., as long as they aren't american whitemen, Kyoto doesn't apply.

-Patriotism and self-righteousness? Yeah, buddy. Contrast and compare with Iran, NKorea, or hell, even FRANCE. Have you ever listened the lyrics of "La Marseillaise"?? It's dripping with machismo and gore about the "impure blood" of our enemies, the "sacred love of france," and slitting each others throats! If you've ever dealt with a french bureaucrat, you know that America is harldy a world contender for Patriotism and self righteousness.

-Short term strategies and long-term suffering? you mean like, launching katyusha rockets into suburbs, or do you mean sending guns, but not jobs, to the Gaza strip? Or maybe you meant beating prisoners to death in "interrogations" in the Cote D'Ivoire (France again), or maybe you meant fighting a war over a few thousand sheep on a couple of rocks in the south atlantic (England), or the Refusal to allow former soviet nations to join the EU because they are "too poor," and might drive down wages i your own state? (The whole EU). Again, America hardly has a monopoly on short-term-ism.

5. blah blah blah, dictators, racist, brutal regimes.
Like China fostering Kim Jung Il, or Russia fostering Cuba, the "Shining Path" or the ever-popular robert mugabe? Or maybe they're O.K., as long as they are marxist? What about Iran funding Hezbollah and Hamas?

yes, yes, let's focus on the evils of the USA; it'll take our minds off the likes of Chavez and Amen-adinajad.

all the best.

Originally posted by silencer
When asked to pick one "main reason why those who attacked us and their supporters hate the United States," the reasons given most often were..

1. "our democracy and freedom" (26%) and
2. "our support for Israel" (22%)
However, almost as many believe the main reason is
3. "our values and way of life" (20%), and
4. "our influence on the economy and lives of Middle Eastern countries"(17%).
5. Only 11% believe our economic and military power is the main reason."

And I just do not believe for one single moment the 26% of Americans who answered this poll in the top category have a grip on reality!
Naive: America does not know the reasons for why it is hated...

Maybe an examination of the poll that you reference:

THE HARRIS POLL #48, September 27, 2001

www.harrisinteractive.com...

Would provide some.

Originally posted by silencer
US citizens have been asking "Why do they hate us so much?".

WRONG. If we are hated .... we don't care. We don't ask why. We know why. Because sniveling anti-american socialists and/or islamofacists are JEALOUS of America and our way of life. You hate that which you can't have or that you don't understand.

the reasons given most often were..

Oh please! You are posting alleged information and stats with no links. No backup. You could have made all that up. Even if you didn't make it up, you have no link to show the source or the credibility of the source.

I just do not believe ... the 26% of Americans who answered this poll .... have a grip on reality!

I'm starting to get the same feeling about the person who authored this thread.

HELLO WAKE UP!.....The USA has killed about 190,000 people in Afghanistan and Iraq since 2001-9-11.

HELLO WAKE UP! ... That's crap. No credible back up stats to go with that? Nope.

Originally posted by silencer



And I just do not believe for one single moment the 26% of Americans who answered this poll in the top category have a grip on reality!
Naive: America does not know the reasons for why it is hated...

1. Oil, Bush(temporarily), Kyoto
2. Spends a major portion of world's savings(through treasury bonds), and spends it irresponsibly.
3. Patriotism & Self Righteousness
4. Short term strategies & long term suffering
5. You have supported, trained and armed dictators, illegitimate governments and racist and brutal regimes. You have largely ignored the pain and suffering this has caused.

And of course, YOUR opinion is the one we should be listening too.
YOU are more advanced and knowledgeable than we are.
YOU have an opinion that is obviously more correct than mine or anyone that may disagree with you.
YOU are of course ALWAYS right.


Does your ego allow you to consider that you could possibly be wrong? Or is it only the United States and those that love Her that could ever be wrong?

Perhaps you should take into consideration how little most of us here in the United State care what you think.

I looked and I'm sure the machine has not been invented that can measure an amount small enough to accurately portray how little those "other countries" opinions matter.

And one other thing...

If you hate us so much, why do you continue to accept our handouts? Why do you cry so loudly to the international community when we suggest cutting out our foreign aid?
You whine and squirm anytime we raise tariffs...


Oh you hypocrites talk a big talk, but instead of walking the walk, you slink around in the shadows using us and all of our "Horrible" success at every opportunity.

You don't like us? Cut us off completely... See who comes crawling back first...

Maybe this time we will just let you all be conquered and not "lend a hand" after you throw your unused rifles down in surrender.

Semper

Silencer

Please post the name of the country you are writing from. It is only fair.

Signed
A PATRIOTIC American.

Originally posted by silencer
America does not know the reasons for why it is hated...
3. Patriotism ...

We actually love our country and have something that we can be proud of. You hate us for our love of country. Translation = you have nothing to be proud of in your own country.

Originally posted by semperfortis
you should take into consideration how little most of us here in the United State care what you think.

Exactly. It's almost comical when they spout like this. Like we are supposed to care or something?

If you hate us so much, why do you continue to accept our handouts?

Because they are hypocrites! :bash:



[edit on 12/21/2006 by FlyersFan]

Originally posted by jsobecky
Please post the name of the country you are writing from. It is only fair.

He thinks patriotism is a bad thing so he's hiding where he lives. He's embarrassed. And now he's off on another RANT - complaining about people who post unflattering things about Islam.

Maybe I should start a RANT about people who post unflattering things about America and then who turn around and complain when people post unflattering things about segments of Islam. :shk:

There's a word that describes why some people hate America. I forgot what it was called but I know the definition, it means judging others based on your culture.

discrimination is the word your looking for. but just because you can label them as ppl who discriminate, doesnt make there point of veiw wrong.

americans discriminate other countries all the time, when they brag about this and that, or "at least were not as bad as *insert country here*"

americans discriminate against arabs just for the way they dress and their faith.

why would any other country be any different, it is human nature.

What jealousy? Nobody is jealous of the US, you just keep being told that.
And no, we don't really give a **** what you do with your local laws, it's what you do to other countries that makes un pissed off with your government.

This is why we call you blind and ignorant. Every time we answer your OWN question as to why you are hated by the rest of the world... you ignore what we are telling you, then turn around and say we're jealous... that we are angry about what you do within your own borders... WE DONT GIVE A FLYING F*** HOW YOU RUN YOUR LIVES WITHIN YOUR BORDERS, we care about the hundreds of thousands of innocent mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters who are being SLAUGHTERED around the world this very second because of how you play your cards outside your borders! We are not JEALOUS of that, it's disgusting, and certainly not something we would want our countries to be guilty of!

We are outside your country, we cannot change how you act towards other countries. The last and only resort we can take to make you wake up is to wage war... but war is something most of us are against. So the only people who can change the fact that you are responsible for millions of lives is yourselves!

Wake up! And use democracy for what it was designed for! Allowing the people to think for themselves, and alter the path of their country accordingly.

we care about the hundreds of thousands of innocent mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters who are being SLAUGHTERED around the world this very second

You are aware that out of the 100+ armed conflicts happening around the world, over 98% are Muslim vs _______, Insert Political entity here...

Yet all you postulate about is what the US is doing...

Sorry, but your propaganda rings hollow and uninformed..

Semper

I don't think the people of the US are in denial of why they are the most hated country in the world. Their political and military aspirations and how they govern their own country are probably the most controversial things in the world today, and every person seems to have a different opinion on it.

The US is a big country and they're always in the lime light. The focus is always on them. Hence why there is so much focus on what they do and how they govern things around the world. That's life, and it'll never change.

It's funny, because I dislike Americans for trivial stuff. I'm with them all the way when it comes down to liberating Iraq, but once they start showing their stupidity and ignorance, it gives me the #s! :bnghd: