Submarines In The North Pole!

Some amazing pictures of sub's in the North Pole. Whilst these pics are great to look at, I can only wonder what damage they are causing that fragile enviroment.




For more go HERE.





[edit on 10/12/06 by Mcphisto]

Great pictures.
However, how does the submarine (like in the first picture) move? Won't the ice stop it? How did it even get there? It just pops up and breaks through, it it's on the surface the whole time?

They move underneath the ice, where it's just water.

The submarines can only surface through ice that's
5ft or less in thickness.



I really don't think the submarines are doing any damage
to the arctic environment, just by surfacing a few times in
thin parts of the ice sheet.

Some amazing pictures of sub's in the North Pole. Whilst these pics are great to look at, I can only wonder what damage they are causing that fragile enviroment.

Why do you think they are causing any damage? There just popping up through the ice.

Originally posted by stumason...
Why do you think they are causing any damage? There just popping up through the ice.

True.

The polar ice pack is about as barren a biological desert as anywhere on the planet.

Originally posted by dave_54

Originally posted by stumason...
Why do you think they are causing any damage? There just popping up through the ice.

True.

The polar ice pack is about as barren a biological desert as anywhere on the planet.

Barren a place yes, but not barren biologically or ecologically for that matter! I know the ice just re-freezes over but we dont know if they dump anything there, empty sump tanks etc etc.

Oh I know the US Navy wouldnt do things like that without telling us. Of course they wouldnt!

Would they?

I would think the ice must be getting awfully thin for a sub to do that.. I wouldn't doubt it, but wow... Folks, I think the situation with the environment is even much worse than we are being told if the ice is getting this thin at the poles.

[edit on 11-12-2006 by SpeakerofTruth]

Them bears must have thought they were going to have a winters supply of food when they popped thru.


mikell

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
I would think the ice must be getting awfully thin for a sub to do that.. I wouldn't doubt it, but wow...

Folks, I think the situation with the environment is even much worse than we are being told if the ice is getting this thin at the poles.

Submarines have been able to do this for along time, it's not
that because of Global Warming submarined can suddenly
pop up through the ice like this.

There are naturally areas where the ice is thinner, the arctic
ice sheet is'nt a large piece of evenly thick ice.

Originally posted by iori_komei
the arctic
ice sheet is'nt a large piece of evenly thick ice.

I wouldn't think so, but still, 5 to 6 feet thick? Ummm, I find that somewhat amazingly thin..for an area that is as frigid as the artic..

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

Originally posted by iori_komei
the arctic
ice sheet is'nt a large piece of evenly thick ice.

I wouldn't think so, but still, 5 to 6 feet thick? Ummm, I find that somewhat amazingly thin..for an area that is as frigid as the arctic..

Well, if you think about it, that's about as thick as a normal
person is tall.

Submarine captains have to plot courses and go to the exact
coordinates where the ice is knwn to be thin enough to surface,
they don't just pop out of some randommly found thin spot
every time.

It's not alarming that they surface, it IS alarming how much more available thin ice there is compared to 20-50 years ago. Gore touched on this in his movie, the Navy has detailed maps of 'surfacing zones' and they were reluctant to release them for interests of national security..............

@ Dangermouse

I wonder how much it had to do with "national security" rather than not wanting to cause a panic.. Although,I can see why they might not want to release such info for security reasons,I just wonder if that was the primary cause for them not wanting to release it.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
@ Dangermouse

I wonder how much it had to do with "national security" rather than not wanting to cause a panic.. Although,I can see why they might not want to release such info for security reasons,I just wonder if that was the primary cause for them not wanting to release it.

Exactly what I was implying

Originally posted by iori_komei

Well, if you think about it, that's about as thick as a normal
person is tall.

Well, stop and think about it...The average height for a man is what? 5'9", maybe 5'10".... 6' is not all that tall.. Let's say that ice is only 6' thick in certain spots... What was it 50-80 years ago? 10 maybe 15 feet think? That is quite a difference... I think we have some reason for real concern here.

[edit on 11-12-2006 by SpeakerofTruth]

This is mostly Boomer class submarines that do this. They are this nations "ace in the hole" each one is among the most armed nuclear arsenal in the world. No country can track them or knows where they are. They dont even need to be told to attack, they listen for the daily "We are ok" ELF signal the antenna is burried in the upper penisula of Michigan. No signal and they surface and launch. We are the only country that can competently have a full retaliation even when wiped off the face of the earth.

These submarines alone keep us safe. We need only those, our geographic location and a competent Navy to keep an armada from crossing the ocean to get us. Everything else we have is for offence pursposes only. WE dont need big military spending like we do for defence, that is a lie.

Yes they are a hazard to that envioroment, they stay out for months at a time and get rid of lots of waste, both industrial and human under that ice. To think otherwise is delusional.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Well, stop and think about it...The average height for a man is what? 5'9", maybe 5'10".... 6' is not all that tall.. Let's say that ice is only 6' thick in certain spots... What was it 50-80 years ago? 10 maybe 15 feet think? That is quite a difference... I think we have some reason for real concern here.

[edit on 11-12-2006 by SpeakerofTruth]

How about someone posts some links with some data about the actual height and number of thin ice spots in the poles before we jump to conclusions about global warming or anything else.

As of now I have not found any detailed information that states that there are more spots of 5-6 ft ice at the poles than in decades past, or that there used to be less of them. This thread is about the SUBS impacting the environment, not a Datsun or can of AquaNet.

Anyways, back on topic, I would think that they would only break through in designated areas or if they were in an emergency situation (considering any significant depth of ice would likely harm the sub). That is just an educated guess though ... I haven't seen many photos of subs breaking through ice, much less known to be doing so at the poles.

Originally posted by Fiverz


Anyways, back on topic, I would think that they would only break through in designated areas or if they were in an emergency situation (considering any significant depth of ice would likely harm the sub). That is just an educated guess though ... I haven't seen many photos of subs breaking through ice, much less known to be doing so at the poles.

You mean an un-educated guess. It is not for emergencies that they surfece, they do it for training. See my above post.

posted on 12/11/06 at 22:17


Submarines have been going to the north pole for close to 50 years now, with the Nautilus being the first in 1958. The first sub to surface there was in March 1959 when the USS Skate went through a thin spot descibed as several feet.

www.ssn583.com...

Acording to this, the polar icepack has reduced by about 40% since then, from an aveage thickness of about 10 feet to a thickness of 6 feet.

archive.greenpeace.org...

www.physorg.com...

They use those subs to measure the icepack, and track it's movement from year to year.

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
You mean an un-educated guess. It is not for emergencies that they surfece, they do it for training. See my above post.

Easy there ... I was doing research while I was posting mine and didn't see you had slipped a post in before I hit reply. My connection was sloooooooow today

Training for what? Launching missles? Not trying to be condescending, just curious what types of missions they do.

Berglion: thanks for the interesting info. I did not mention in my other post, but I would have to agree that they are affecting the environment negatively due to their waste and underwater disturbances alone. How much so depends on how often they frequent the area. Any ideas on that LoneGunMan?